Life Beyond Earth...

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**Cane**

generalgrog wrote:
Cane wrote:An oldie but a goldie, Carl Sagan ftw:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MlikCebQSlY

Sorry but how dies that "win" anything?

He used a bunch of "MAYBE's", "POSSIBLE's" as well. He may as well have used a lotto machine to get his numbers.

GG

"For The Win
Commonly used among geeks to express their enthusiasm for something, especially in IRC. "
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=ftw

**Lord-Loss**

Im sure gonna read up on this subject and will post a proper reply then.

But I do think that there is life on other planets.

**Albatross**

Why did someone have to bring God into this thread? We were talking about aliens.

P.S - If anyone has any ideas about what else could create large methane clouds on mars, I'm all ears.

**Orkeosaurus**

Possibly the same thing that resulted in methane existing on Jupiter, Neptune, Uranus, Titan, and abiogenically on Earth in small amounts. Accidentally transported bacteria from Earth could also produce it. CO2 + 4(H2) + Ni + Heat = CH4 + 2(H2O) + Ni, so that's one way it can be produced non-biologically.

It's interesting, but saying that we've discovered alien life is a little premature.

**Albatross**

@Orkeosaurus

Ok, cool. That was a serious question, I wasn't being sarcastic in my last post!
Still, though - it's pretty encouraging evidence, if not conclusive proof by any stretch.

**Orkeosaurus**

Ah, didn't mean to get snippy. But yeah, I'd say it's something that should be looked into. It might give us a better idea how life first came to Earth (and give us a better idea of the probability of it developing in other places).

**Albatross**

Apparently there are the right mineral conditions on Mars to grow Asparagus. Yay!

**Orkeosaurus**

Ew. I'd rather eat me some tasty alien cows.

**Albatross**

Pah! THEY won't turn your pee green...

**Mad Monk's Mekshop**

So it's me again...some nice ideas and opinions in this thread...
sooo...
who rememberes this?

Scientists and professionals all over the world are still having a debate whether this alien autopsy in the late 40s was a real or a unbelievably good hoax.
The video for this is all over Youtube as well, if you want to have a closer look...

I peronally think its a fake, but you never know...stay tuned, i'll be back soon.

R3n3g8b0y

**GoFenris**

I remember this being proven (or admitted) as a hoax (but who really knows). I know Stan Winston (being primarily a monster FX guy and not so much make-up effects) was the wrong expert to ask as many of those wet tissue effects can be recreated with gelatin, KY and/or Vaseline.

**Mad Monk's Mekshop**

SilverMK2 wrote:With such huge amounts of mass and energy to play with in the universe, the odds of life existing elsewhere is almost a certainty.

I would refute the odds posted above on the chances of life forming, and suggest that they are actually far higher.

That's true...so let's assume that there is life outside of our green(or more like grey if this continues)planet. Lets say planet x in galaxy y has microbes and bacterias on it. THAT IS A FORM OF LIFE. So what do bacterias need to survive? I'm not a scientist but it's certainlt heat, water and food(well, pretty small food but still...)Heat is ever present in the Universe. Every galaxy has stars and planets close enough to them to support life, of this we can be certain, as we live on one of them...So now there's the tricky part...Water. Water consists of two Hydrogen and 2 oxygen atoms(blah,blah, blah)and is therefore a relatively simple atomic bond. So if a planet has a heat source(and as i said earlier, many, many planets do)and hydrogen and oxygen atoms are present on it, water can be formed. Food...i don't exactly know what bacterias eat, but as soon as water exists on a planet, life forms will follow. This is as sure as night follows the day(or the other way around?). So summing up, how many planets have a heat source? Nearly every single one. How many have hydrogen and oxygen in their athmosphere? We don't know(officialy)but we can assume, many planets do. So Lets just say 2 other planets in the universe have all these factors present(allthough many more certainly do)...that means that LIFE EXISTS IN SOME WAY...we're not something special in the Universe, and allthough they might still be amoebes and bacterias, hey we once started as bacterias too...all we need to know now is...are there INTELLIGENT LIFEFORMS OUT THERE?Because, life...exists...

**SilverMK2**

r3n3g8b0y wrote:all we need to know now is...are there INTELLIGENT LIFEFORMS OUT THERE?Because, life...exists...

I am going to say yes. Again, with such a vast number of planets out there, and with the relative ease that life can spring into existance, combined with its ability to survive and adapt (just look at some of the extremophile bacteria around, as well as the creatures living on the bottom of the sea, the sulphur based life forms on deep sea vents, etc).

It was estimated recently that if an intelligent species were to develop at roughly the same pace as human beings, they would only have a strong radio presence in the universe (ie be broadcasting radio waves into space strongly enough to be detected more than a certain distance away) for around 100-200 years (due to increases in tight beam transmissions, use of fibre optics, etc replacing traditional methods of broadcasting), which is not a great deal of time to detect anything in galactic terms.

Plus then you have to factor in that some planets life will have been going on longer than others, development rates, distance away from us, looking in the right place, etc.

So yes, we may never actually detect other sentient life (certainly not until we invent much faster methods of getting from A to B anyway and have a look around the universe first hand), but I am confident in predicting that it is there in relative abundance.

**reds8n**

There's some cool images from Mars available for your perusal here. Kind of cool (ish) to see the rover tracks in the snaps.

**Orkeosaurus**

r3n3g8b0y wrote:So if a planet has a heat source(and as i said earlier, many, many planets do)and hydrogen and oxygen atoms are present on it, water can be formed. Food...i don't exactly know what bacterias eat, but as soon as water exists on a planet, life forms will follow. This is as sure as night follows the day(or the other way around?).

Haven't you seen "peanut butter is an atheist's worst nightmare?"

You don't have new life forming whenever water is hot; bacteria (or archaea) aren't just made out of hot water. You need a lot of different factors for life to arise; amino acids have to created, DNA has to come into being, the early life form has to be able to metabolize chemicals dissolved in the water. There's a theory that life originated around underwater vents, which would certainly include heat and water, but would also include some less common sulfuric compounds that early life could have used as a "food" source. Even so, though, this would require the building blocks of life to slowly be created and come together until they form a simple cell. I would be surprised if there weren't places across the galaxy with similar conditions to thermal vents on prehistoric Earth, so from there I suppose it's a matter of how likely it is that the building blocks of life would be created and assembled correctly.

**Hawkins**

I cant say, i'd like to belive but i keep thinking of an old Calvin and Hobbs comic. where Hobbs tells Calvin: 'the most convincing proff that there is life out there is that it hasnt tried to contact us yet.'

**Lord-Loss**

Would planets with other life on them look like Earth?

How human would aliens looks? Could intelligent life evolve completey differently then we have?

Im certain aliens wont be green migits with large heads, but what would they look like?

Is it possible for there to be alien species that are similar to species found of earth?

**GoFenris**

Lord-Loss wrote:Would planets with other life on them look like Earth?

How human would aliens looks? Could intelligent life evolve completey differently then we have?

Im certain aliens wont be green migits with large heads, but what would they look like?

Is it possible for there to be alien species that are similar to species found of earth?

Science Fiction writers have speculated on this for over a century (as have scientists, although purely speculative since we have nothing to go from).

Is it safe to assume that since a humanoid shape is the most successful (intellectually) on our planet it would also be successful on others? Or is this purely pretentiousness?

Can another form be successful if it lacks the ability to make and use tools, like a Dolphin? Or is its current form a byproduct of evolution and its ability to no longer need tools?

Is it presumptuous to assume carbon-based life is the norm simply because it is our norm? Perhaps crystalline-based life is the universal norm?

A.E. Von Vogt (Voyage of the Space Beagle primarily, but some others) has some incredible and mind-blowing (if dated) science-based speculative fiction. There are many other writers and works as well but Voyage of the Space Beagle is directly asking those types of questions. Until we actually find life (intelligent or otherwise) out there, we just won't know.

**Lord-Loss**

Surely aliens have thumbs!

I mean who can function without thumbs.

I wouldnt be able to hold spoons, forks, knives, guns, nothin' :/

**GoFenris**

Lord-Loss wrote:Surely aliens have thumbs!

I mean who can function without thumbs.

I wouldnt be able to hold spoons, forks, knives, guns, nothin' :/

Pretentiousness!!!

Wouldn't tentacles serve a similar purpose? How about an evolved elephant trunk or even evolved telekinetic abilities?

**Lord-Loss**

Would there bodies function the same way as us?

Wouldnt aliens with telekinetics get fat?

Humans dont have telekinetics and were still pretty fat.

**GoFenris**

Lord-Loss wrote:Wouldnt aliens with telekinetics get fat?

Now that is an excellent question!

**Orkeosaurus**

GoFenris wrote:How about an evolved elephant trunk or even evolved telekinetic abilities?

Or maybe they evolved magic.

**GoFenris**

Orkeosaurus wrote:
GoFenris wrote:How about an evolved elephant trunk or even evolved telekinetic abilities?
Or maybe they evolved magic.

Um, any sufficiently advanced technology in the eyes of a lesser advanced race appears to be magic. So yes, you may be correct in the same way dolphins and chimps probably assume we are magical creatures.

**Albatross**

There's a very good chance that other forms of life would be beyond our comprehension. We can't think of them in our terms - they might not need thumbs. They might not even use tools. Tools are a human concept.
Think of how different we are to a spider, for example.

Now times that by a hundred.

**Orkeosaurus**

GoFenris wrote:Um, any sufficiently advanced technology in the eyes of a lesser advanced race appears to be magic. So yes, you may be correct in the same way dolphins and chimps probably assume we are magical creatures.

You said "evolve telekinesis", not "invent a technological means to move objects that is too advanced for humans to understand, with their mouths".

Not that aliens couldn't have magic, if we're going to go all out with the "completely unknowable" idea. But they could be made out of bananas, and ride around in flying shoes, and be smaller than a flea, and be able to kill you with beams of sadness. That's not really science fiction though, that's just normal fiction. Speculating the KrAzY abilities they could have and handwaving away how they would get them doesn't sound like very much fun to me, just like a lot of saying "you don't know anything about aliens! It could happen!"

**Mad Monk's Mekshop**

Lord-Loss wrote:Would planets with other life on them look like Earth?

How human would aliens looks? Could intelligent life evolve completey differently then we have?

Im certain aliens wont be green migits with large heads, but what would they look like?

Is it possible for there to be alien species that are similar to species found of earth?

Hey guys, thanks for all the thoughts. Nice stuff.
As said in the quoted post, that's a really interesting topic, but before i will talk about it, a shout to orkeosaurus.
That's true, there's more to life than warm water(no gak!)and many factors play a role, but what i was trying to say, was that this is the foundation for all life, and as soon as it exists, other important factor will soon follow....
so anyways, WHAT WOULD aliens look like???

Maybe like this guy here?

probably not but sightings all over the world show that when an alien was found, cought or whatever(real or hoax)that was whatmost of them look like...now, the Universe is a HUGE place, and the chances that another developed and most possibly intelligent life form from galxy x looks so much like us, is kinda unlikely...

Stay tuned, boys and gals...

**Orkeosaurus**

If we're talking intelligent species, I would guess it would have dexterous hands or mandibles of some sort; something that allows them to manipulate their environment to such a degree where intelligence is helpful. It would have a fairly large brain compared to its body weight. It's probably more likely to be a carnivore or omnivore than a herbivore, assuming there's a difference on this planet. It's likely to be warm blooded. Probably deals with others of its species socially to a fair degree, but not "hive based". It would probably weigh at least 100lbs adult. Probably would reproduce "sexually", although they may not have set sexes.

This wouldn't need to look anything like a human, though, in fact I think it would pretty unlikely that it would look like a human. Scales, hair, feathers, skin? Number of limbs? Exoskeletal, endoskeletal? Primary senses? Method of communication? No idea.

**Mad Monk's Mekshop**

Orkeosaurus wrote:If we're talking intelligent species, I would guess it would have dexterous hands or mandibles of some sort; something that allows them to manipulate their environment to such a degree where intelligence is helpful. It would have a fairly large brain compared to its body weight. It's probably more likely to be a carnivore or omnivore than a herbivore, assuming there's a difference on this planet. It's likely to be warm blooded. Probably deals with others of its species socially to a fair degree, but not "hive based". It would probably weigh at least 100lbs adult. Probably would reproduce "sexually", although they may not have set sexes.

This wouldn't need to look anything like a human, though, in fact I think it would pretty unlikely that it would look like a human. Scales, hair, feathers, skin? Number of limbs? Exoskeletal, endoskeletal? Primary senses? Method of communication? No idea.

hmm that's some good points
and of course they would adapt to the environment they're living in...not that we do that anymoar lol.

Also, it just came to my mind...what kinda music would they be listening to???lllalright let's stay focused, man

**SilverMK2**

There are theories of convergent evolution. For example, sharks and whales look kind of similar, despite the fact that they are from different branches of the tree of evolution because they both have to cope with the same environments. They are both simmilar shapes, move in similar ways, etc. All these things are determined by the environment.

But then again there are other, stranger creatures in the ocean (such as rays - another branch of the shark family I believe), which just goes to show that if you give it the chance, life will evolve in any way that gives it an advantage for the environment it is in. At least until it changes (see all the mass extinctions we have had in the past).