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ranger1977 wrote:Most modern Nukes don't have the "dirty effect" of fall out if used properly as air burst.
or the neutron type weapon system that kills all living things but don't harm structures.
so in theory the imperium could use nuclear ect weapons and probably dose in space battles.

Who cares about irradiating space? It's already pretty irradiated. And why would the IoM bother with nukes if not for the radiation or as a last resort? They have mh better weapons to use for simple explosions.

Are atomic weaponds band by the imperium, if so why?

Band? Seriously? That is a great idea for the name of a band, The Atomic Weapons Band. I like it.

But seriously, folks, nuclear weapons banned in the Imperium!? They exterminate whole planets, so my rhetorical question is, why is this even a question?

Well, first off I dont think the Imperium really bans the use of any weapon, it's not like they have hippies protesting about how inhumane something is..

But, I'd also asume they either have more effective weapons. But, while i know it's not true, i like to consider Plasma weapons as mini-nuke launcher guns.

1hadhq wrote:You can go there, but you should not stay....

Dude, Hiroshima is a fully populated city, with perfectly normal people born, raised, working, retiring and dying there, without ill effect.

I visited the city whilst living in Japan, and my girlfriend was from there.

Fifty wrote:

1hadhq wrote:You can go there, but you should not stay....

Dude, Hiroshima is a fully populated city, with perfectly normal people born, raised, working, retiring and dying there, without ill effect.

I visited the city whilst living in Japan, and my girlfriend was from there.

So those attending the "drop" had no "ill effect" ?
Actually, some of the first nukes should not be compared with anything the 40k-verse can come up.

The Burning of Prospero is a good example of the "creativity" in destruction dished out by the IoM. Atomic Weapons needed?

Didn't you have to set of a nuclear weapon when you played in one of the DoW expansions? I could swear the IG or something had to set off nuclear weapons within the necron tomb to destroy the necrons in dark crusade.

But yeah, nukes are still allowed.

purplefood wrote:

Kilkrazy wrote:I take it you've never visited Hiroshima.

Take it from me, it isn't uninhabited.

The nukes we have now would be far more effective at making a place uninhabitable, 38000 years in the future? Probably even more effective.

That's why they're using WW2 tanks in the future?

amirite

Only the IG, but that's because the emperor doesn't like them.

Amaya wrote:

purplefood wrote:

Kilkrazy wrote:I take it you've never visited Hiroshima.

Take it from me, it isn't uninhabited.

The nukes we have now would be far more effective at making a place uninhabitable, 38000 years in the future? Probably even more effective.

That's why they're using WW2 tanks in the future?

amirite

Where do you get that from?

SoloFalcon1138 wrote: That's right! Shoulda had a V8!

Hahaha!!! Nice!

1hadhq wrote:

Fifty wrote:

1hadhq wrote:You can go there, but you should not stay....

Dude, Hiroshima is a fully populated city, with perfectly normal people born, raised, working, retiring and dying there, without ill effect.

I visited the city whilst living in Japan, and my girlfriend was from there.

So those attending the "drop" had no "ill effect" ?

Of course they did, that is obvious. Both short term and and long term. But that is not remotely the same thing as visiting or inhabiting the place where the bombs were dropped after the event.

Still needs some quarantine depending what type of nuclear fallout happened.
Bombs lead to rain carrying the fallout.
Powerplant accidents still prevent local wildlife from beiing eaten without negative effects.


@halonachos: the Emperor loves ALL is children, the IG so much he usually calls them often to take their place at his side sooner than others.

No. There was no quarantine of Hiroshima. There may have been an elevated risk in the first few hours, maybe even a few days, but as such there was no serious effect on the region. Your first post says that people can go to Hiroshima, but should not stay there. That is not a defensible position.

Hiroshima is now a city inhabited by over a million people. That is more than double the population when the bomb was dropped. There is not valid medical reason to not live in Hiroshima. It is a normal city.

Something bad happened there, but the city was never evacuated, and rebuilding began only shortly (a few months) after the war ended. People who were present at the time of the blast suffered serious ill effects, both in the short and long term due to the bomb, but this was due to the blast itself, not lingering contaminants. The area itself did not become significantly irradiated and visitors did not become ill in the aftermath.

This was due to only a small number of radionuclides contaminating the surrouding area, which in turn was partly due to the blast being several hundred metres above ground level, so radionuclides were mostly carried away in the mushroom cloud and spread over a wide area and both of the bombs exploding being quite "clean" anyway. Yes, there was a cloud of contaminants, but a quarantine of the area will not help deal with that at all.

On the other hand, if a few hundred such bombs had been dropped, the overall increase of harmful radionuclides in the air would have been a serious problem for life around the whole planet. Of course, so would the nuclear winter, probably moreso.

If you want to talk about a region harmed by nuclear fallout, look no further than Chernobyl, which was a reactor meltdown, not a bomb. The effects of Chernobyl, still an uninhabitable hell-hole, and the effects on Nagasaki and Hiroshima are completely different, and you should get your facts straight before entering into an argument about something you do not have knowledge of. Saying something wrong is one thing, but digging yourself a deeper and deeper hole from a position of ignorance is bad.

Fifty wrote:
If you want to talk about a region harmed by nuclear fallout, look no further than Chernobyl, which was a reactor meltdown, not a bomb.

This: Powerplant accidents still prevent local wildlife from beiing eaten without negative effects. was about the russian reactor but I didn't put a name on it
cause I was not sure of its english name. Still this fallout reaches as far as to mid-europe. Not a weapon on its own, so it may be irrelevant for this thread.

Fifty wrote:
and you should get your facts straight before entering into an argument about something you do not have knowledge of. Saying something wrong is one thing, but digging yourself a deeper and deeper hole from a position of ignorance is bad.

And I was so busy diggin

have to admit it wasn't a good comment, too focused on 40k terms of it than real life. Sorry.

Shall stick with 4ok nukes from now on

Nukes are used in the 40k universe.

They're used to destroy a hive in The Founding.

GazzyG wrote:Nukes are used in the 40k universe.

They're used to destroy a hive in The Founding.

I'm not sure they ever found out whether the hive detonated it's reactors causing the explosion or they were hit by a rocket/launcher/whatever.
In Dead Men Walking it is said they use nuclear weapons as mining charges. Although the area is irradiated they use servitors to mine the places. They then attempt to use the mines against the Neccrons.

By the way, despite everything I said about Hiroshima and the nuclear bomb that exploded there, it is absolutely possible to detonate a "dirty bomb" that would make a large area uninhabitable in the same way as Pripyat (Chernobyl). It is just the specific cases of Hiroshima and Nagasaki I am talking about.

tomjoad wrote:Dude, Atomic Weaponds are TOTALLY a band in the Imperium. Kinda like an Appetite for Destruction era Gun n Roses thing going on, with some sweet harmonies and effing gigantic pyrotechnics at the live shows! If you can catch them on the next tour, do it for sure, because their singer is kind of a nut. Might quit at any moment, you know? Then it'll be too late.

I'm picturing something like Disaster Area from Hitchhiker's Guide, with every concert effectively resulting in exterminatus.

Ask the Death Korps of Krieg if they are.

the length of radioactivity of an area that has been nuked depends on the element that was used in the core. The more radioactive the element and how long its half-life is.

Harriticus wrote:

Modern nukes are sometimes hundreds of times stronger then the one that hit Hiroshima,

Most modern nukes are still rather low yield (multi-kiloton range) compare to the yields use in the sci-figenre.

I asked something like this question: http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/302324.page

And man, that band Atomic Weapons by the Imperium is awsome! I love the way that they incoperate the killing of heretics into their songs!

Kilkrazy wrote:I take it you've never visited Hiroshima.

Take it from me, it isn't uninhabited.

Very weak nuclear explosion.

Fallout was gone in a month or two

ChocolateGork wrote:

Kilkrazy wrote:I take it you've never visited Hiroshima.

Take it from me, it isn't uninhabited.

Very weak nuclear explosion.

Fallout was gone in a month or two

Weak or not, Hiroshima was an air-burst detonation not a ground-burst detonation, which plays the largest role in the amount of fallout.

I don't think the Imperium is too worried about the effects of radioactive contamination
in 2nd ed you could get rad grenades (and missiles I think?)
when the grenade was thrown you marked the point of impact and it had a persistent radiation effect, like an invisible blast marker for the rest of the game

While considered "dirty" and primitive weapon compare to other more advance weapons, they are rather simple to make and use compared to plasma, anti-matter, and other IoM ordnance.

I could see IoM using both dirty nukes and clean nukes, for instance I would not be surprised if Krieg suffered dirty bombs, but in tactical situations cleaner nukes would do it

Atomics are a type of weapon not really used by the Imperium.

Into the Storm, Page 163 wrote:Atomics are ancient weapons of widespread destruction, terrible devices that haunted humanity long before it reached the stars. In the Dark Age of Technology and the Age of Strife, atomics turned many worlds into scoured, radioactive wastelands. They were some of humanity’s most powerful weapons of war. In the age of the Imperium, however, atomics have since fallen out of favour.

Simply put, the militant Adepta and the Imperial Inquisition have better ways to destroy worlds. Cyclonic torpedoes and virus bombs can slay whole planets in a matter of hours, or even minutes. On the other hand, even hundreds of atomic warheads will not destroy a world outright—instead polluting the biosphere and slowly choking life with palls of intensely radioactive soot.

Banned? No. Not really ever used? Yes.

One of the Dark Angels Horus Heresy books makes it seem like Magma Bombs have the same explosive power without all the radiation. Although I think the 'plasma' warheads on Imperial Naval Torpedoes are basically nuclear-yield warheads.




Automatically Appended Next Post:

Zefig wrote:

tomjoad wrote:Dude, Atomic Weaponds are TOTALLY a band in the Imperium. Kinda like an Appetite for Destruction era Gun n Roses thing going on, with some sweet harmonies and effing gigantic pyrotechnics at the live shows! If you can catch them on the next tour, do it for sure, because their singer is kind of a nut. Might quit at any moment, you know? Then it'll be too late.

I'm picturing something like Disaster Area from Hitchhiker's Guide, with every concert effectively resulting in exterminatus.

That's why the Emperor's Children do. They don't wage war anymore, they're the greatest touring heavy metal band in the galaxy. Think Dethklok but with Chaos Space Marines.

ChocolateGork wrote:

Kilkrazy wrote:I take it you've never visited Hiroshima.

Take it from me, it isn't uninhabited.

Very weak nuclear explosion.

Fallout was gone in a month or two

Even with this time-frame the deformations and other problems can still be seen today.