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purplefood wrote:

Hlaine Larkin mk2 wrote:A phobia is an irrational fear so the imperium isn't xenophobic either since they do have something to fear

Actually a phobia is an irrational fear or hatred of something.
The Imperium technically has a reason to hate Aliens so it isn't really Xenophobia...

I guess in some cases though there really arent reasons to hate Eldar and Tau. They could get along if they really wanted to.....

Hmm... so, female regiments exist. They are very important to the warmachine: make moar imperial guard!! (yes, im being sexist now)

Honestly a strict woman makes me more nervous than a strict man. Female commisars would make me **** my pants.

BluntmanDC wrote:Can you give an actual example of the IoM being sexist? probably not.

There aren't any men in the Sororitas! I cry sexism!




On a more serious note, women appear to be extremely underrepresented in the upper ranks (i.e. higher than Colonel) of the Imperial Guard. It's unknown whether this is evidence of bias when promotion time comes around, or something else - though the former seems more likely.

I guess in some cases though there really arent reasons to hate Eldar and Tau. They could get along if they really wanted to.....

Not true. The eldar will happily sacrifice your world and everyone on it if it means that a handful of their own kind survive. They'll also mercilessly lie to you and manipulate you without a moment of hesitation. The Tau, on the other hand, will attempt to cause you (by persuasion at first; the guns come out only if the persuasion doesn't work) to abandon your faith in the Emperor and follow their own creed instead.

Actually I mostly blame the lack of women in the upper ranks on GW's lore being written almost entirely by men.

Melissia wrote:Actually I mostly blame the lack of women in the upper ranks on GW's lore being written almost entirely by men.

That would do it. That, and the fact that most 40k players are male. Women being in positions of power scare males.

Either that or arouse them, it depends on the person.

thenoobbomb wrote:Hmm... so, female regiments exist. They are very important to the warmachine: make moar imperial guard!! (yes, im being sexist now)

Its not sexist to know the biological fact that women are needed to produce children (either in carrying them or in tithing eggs to be fertilised in artificial wombs), The IG die in massive numbers so having a good 'breeding stock' isn't sexist, its common sense.

Not true. The eldar will happily sacrifice your world and everyone on it if it means that a handful of their own kind survive. They'll also mercilessly lie to you and manipulate you without a moment of hesitation. The Tau, on the other hand, will attempt to cause you (by persuasion at first; the guns come out only if the persuasion doesn't work) to abandon your faith in the Emperor and follow their own creed instead.

True but the Imperium would do the same thing to an Eldar planet. It really isn't wrong to the Eldar for them to do that. Every race for itself and all. I see where your coming from saying that would piss off the Imperium and make them distrust them, however if they were allies they may not make that sacrifice....

BluntmanDC wrote:

thenoobbomb wrote:Hmm... so, female regiments exist. They are very important to the warmachine: make moar imperial guard!! (yes, im being sexist now)

Its not sexist to know the biological fact that women are needed to produce children (either in carrying them or in tithing eggs to be fertilised in artificial wombs), The IG die in massive numbers so having a good 'breeding stock' isn't sexist, its common sense.

It is sexist.

An army doesn't just need cannon fodder, it needs infrastructure. By the time the question of preserving your "breeding stock" comes up when deciding who should join the military, you have already lost.

Oooow things are heating up in ere. Both sides have equal points, all well made. Perhaps Forge World could easly make some female imp regements. Least that way everyone has a choice.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Oooow things are heating up in ere. Both sides have equal points, all well made. Perhaps Forge World could easly make some female imp regements. Least that way everyone has a choice.

BluntmanDC wrote:Can you give an actual example of the IoM being sexist? probably not.

Humanity in the IoM general isn't racist (the all serve the Emperor), although interaction between different worlds can be strained due to language problems, and different cultures.

Xenophobia is fairly common seeing as aliens exist and as a whole they all treat other species in the sme way, enemies. its perfectly fine to be xenophobic if their is actually something to fear.

Religion is completely different to the real world in 40k, because actual beings exist in the 40k universe that like to get worshipped and like to see humans tortured and killed. also most mutants represent either a clear and present danger to the stability of the human gene pool or are the direct work of the warp.

Xenopobia and religious hatred may be very wrong in the world we have now, but in the 40k universe it is common sence and fully justified.

AlexHolker wrote:

BluntmanDC wrote:

thenoobbomb wrote:Hmm... so, female regiments exist. They are very important to the warmachine: make moar imperial guard!! (yes, im being sexist now)

Its not sexist to know the biological fact that women are needed to produce children (either in carrying them or in tithing eggs to be fertilised in artificial wombs), The IG die in massive numbers so having a good 'breeding stock' isn't sexist, its common sense.

It is sexist.

An army doesn't just need cannon fodder, it needs infrastructure. By the time the question of preserving your "breeding stock" comes up when deciding who should join the military, you have already lost.

Oh course it's sexist. As we've discussed there's hardly any female commissars, the women are kept in units in the inner planets for "breeding stock" while men are more commonly placed on the front line for cannon fodder.



Religious hatred and xenophobia are never justified. By definition they are irrational fears and prejudices.

Xenophobia isn't the fear/hate of tyranids but their automatic reaction to all species not like humanity - what of the various other species that are more benign? Most of these species are in the background fluff because the major threats like Necrons and Orks are given major armies. They used to have beastmen in the IG now they don't, they've always been dubious of various ab-humans even when they prove their loyalty time and again. They rarely if ever seem to extend the hand of friendship to a new alien race choosing instead to exterminate it. They hate mutants. Not all mutants are bad, that's pretty obvious isn't it? Not every mutant worships chaos, but that's the assumption they make. They don't like psykers either, unless they can imprison them or take them into the inquisition. Rogue psykers are forbidden.

They do hate other 'religions'. You have to follow the Emperor. They don't even like certain interpretations of the Emperor. Now the Emperor is a man, he's powerful but he's a man and people should respect he's the Emperor but why worship him as a god? What if you want to be an atheist? What if you believe in some other higher (not chaos) power? Not every body who rejects worshipping the emperor as a god is a chaos cultist, but the imperium don't seem to care.

Howard A Treesong: The Imperium DOES offer diplomats to xenos that are peaceful. The thing is, ninety nine percent of all xenos races are violent and the best thing you can hope for is that they want to eat you. Everything else they would use humanity for is something I'd call a fate worse than death. Such as one particular species feasting on hormones in the human brain-- so basically you're brutally killed, and the last thing you experience is having your brains sucked out so the creature could infiltrate your family, torment your loved ones, and brutally kill them only to suck THEIR brains out and continue the cycle throughout the rest of your society-- your friends, your coworkers, etc.

Melissia wrote:Howard A Treesong: The Imperium DOES offer diplomats to xenos that are peaceful. The thing is, ninety nine percent of all xenos races are violent and the best thing you can hope for is that they want to eat you. Everything else they would use humanity for is something I'd call a fate worse than death. Such as one particular species feasting on hormones in the human brain-- so basically you're brutally killed, and the last thing you experience is having your brains sucked out so the creature could infiltrate your family, torment your loved ones, and brutally kill them only to suck THEIR brains out and continue the cycle throughout the rest of your society-- your friends, your coworkers, etc.

What species is this?

Melissia wrote:Howard A Treesong: The Imperium DOES offer diplomats to xenos that are peaceful.

Which ones though? All the ab-humans are, well human to begin with. Could they not cooperate with the Tau? Weren't they just going to wipe the Tau out until their planet became inaccessible? Then when they came back to colonise the Tau were more advanced, they have a real reason to fear humanity.

Howard A Treesong wrote:

Melissia wrote:Howard A Treesong: The Imperium DOES offer diplomats to xenos that are peaceful.

Which ones though? All the ab-humans are, well human to begin with. Could they not cooperate with the Tau? Weren't they just going to wipe the Tau out until their planet became inaccessible? Then when they came back to colonise the Tau were more advanced, they have a real reason to fear humanity.

The Democles gulf crusade was an aggressive response to the absorption of a few Imperial worlds into the greater good. Had they not done this they may be our allies as of now.The Eldar and the Imperium were going to have peace talks until one of our representatives was possessed and slaughtered all the Eldar at the meeting, they are kinda sour at us about that still.......

So tha about ends the oh so long list of potential allies......

Howard A Treesong wrote:Oh course it's sexist. As we've discussed there's hardly any female commissars

Religious hatred and xenophobia are never justified. By definition they are irrational fears and prejudices.

1. All commissars, storm troopers and sisters of battle all come from the same place, most girls get sent to the sisters of battle who do fight on the front line (now it is sexist in the that women get preferential, i.e. they are only chosen) .

2. Your original point is now invalid by your new statement, the IoM is neither xenophobic or religio-phobic as they are fully justified and not irrational fears (in the 40k universe). It is not irrational to fear a tyranid, it is not irrational to fear a chaos worshipper, as they are trying to kill you. That is by its very definition a very rational fear.

Melissia wrote:The logic is that the women are needed to breed more cadians, while the men are rather expendable in comparison.

Essentially, sexist to both genders in a purely logical and non-biased away.

Not even remotely sexist, basic survivalist.

From a pure survival of the species mentality, you can have far more men die and still carry on as a society/civilization. Sending your women off to fight is simply bad survival strategy.

Nothing to do with sexism at all.

It is when you have the technology to produce artificial wombs which allow both genders to be on the battlefield. Which they do, as that's how DKoK cloning works basically.


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coolyo294 wrote:

Melissia wrote:Howard A Treesong: The Imperium DOES offer diplomats to xenos that are peaceful. The thing is, ninety nine percent of all xenos races are violent and the best thing you can hope for is that they want to eat you. Everything else they would use humanity for is something I'd call a fate worse than death. Such as one particular species feasting on hormones in the human brain-- so basically you're brutally killed, and the last thing you experience is having your brains sucked out so the creature could infiltrate your family, torment your loved ones, and brutally kill them only to suck THEIR brains out and continue the cycle throughout the rest of your society-- your friends, your coworkers, etc.

What species is this?

The Simulacra.

I have always wondered if there are complications with artificial wombs. Maybe a higher percentage of birth-defects?

It's probably just the case of inconsistent writing.

Melissia wrote:That picture would be perfect, if it weren't for the disgusting amount of makeup. As it is, the makeup makes her look like some sort of whore cosplaying for a client.

Ha!!! Mellisa you always make me laugh!

What's terrible though is that you're right.

BluntmanDC wrote:

Howard A Treesong wrote:Oh course it's sexist. As we've discussed there's hardly any female commissars

Religious hatred and xenophobia are never justified. By definition they are irrational fears and prejudices.

2. Your original point is now invalid by your new statement, the IoM is neither xenophobic or religio-phobic as they are fully justified and not irrational fears (in the 40k universe). It is not irrational to fear a tyranid, it is not irrational to fear a chaos worshipper, as they are trying to kill you. That is by its very definition a very rational fear.

How is my original point invalidated? I never said that fearing/hating tyranids and chaos was a sign of xenophobia. It's their prejudice against almost all non-human species that makes them xenophobic. Not *all* species are tyranids and chaos worshippers, many will likely be neutral or friendly if you approach them in the right way. But the imperium don't. They seem to automatically take an aggressive stance against all aliens because they are suspicious of anything not like man. That's xenophobia, fear of the unalike. It's nothing to do with fearing the obviously threats like tyranids, it's the automatic fear and hostility towards everything that isn't human that indicates this.

It's not an irrational fear/hatred because they have a reason to hate them.
It would be irrational if they had never met aliens before but they have and in almost every case they have fought with them.
This view of "Everything different is bad, here we have proof" kinda makes the Imperium slow to change which in turn makes them slow to trust aliens or anything new.

Shayden wrote:
Oh, and GW needs to look good to feminists, and they aren't doing a very good job IMO

It's impossible to please feminists because they're all slightly insane. Fortunately they are a tiny minority of women and not worth trying to please because you'll never get any thanks or better understanding in return. Most females I know hate modern feminists who tend to be more anti-male than pro-female and I think I mentioned insane didn't I?

Agree with Melissia on the make-up comment, that was the first thing that I noticed, the second was the slightly opened mouth and I don't see that facial expression on a Kasrkin of either sex. It's like comparing 1980s action stars with actual pictures of soldiers. The stars with their big hair, perfect skin and gay facial expressions and the harder, I've seen real people killed, look of actual soldiers are poles apart.

cadbren wrote:It's impossible to please feminists because they're all slightly insane

That's one of the dumbest things I've read this week...

The belief that both genders should be treated equally-- IE feminism-- is neither caused by nor indicative of insanity.

Melissia wrote:

cadbren wrote:It's impossible to please feminists because they're all slightly insane

That's one of the dumbest things I've read this week...

The belief that both genders should be treated equally is neither caused by nor indicative of insanity.

I think he means the crazy feminists who just hate men rather than trying to advance women's rights... or try to take away men's rights as some kind of punishment. You know... crazy people...

purplefood wrote:

Melissia wrote:

cadbren wrote:It's impossible to please feminists because they're all slightly insane

That's one of the dumbest things I've read this week...

The belief that both genders should be treated equally is neither caused by nor indicative of insanity.

I think he means the crazy feminists who just hate men rather than trying to advance women's rights... or try to take away men's rights as some kind of punishment. You know... crazy people...

And yet, that is not what he said-- which was a blanket statement insulting all feminists. Because everyone knows you can't believe in equality without being nucking futs.

Melissia wrote:

purplefood wrote:

Melissia wrote:

cadbren wrote:It's impossible to please feminists because they're all slightly insane

That's one of the dumbest things I've read this week...

The belief that both genders should be treated equally is neither caused by nor indicative of insanity.

I think he means the crazy feminists who just hate men rather than trying to advance women's rights... or try to take away men's rights as some kind of punishment. You know... crazy people...

And yet, that is not what he said-- which was a blanket statement insulting all feminists. Because everyone knows you can't believe in equality without being nucking futs.

Hmm... Ironic.

No, that would be sarcasm