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A friend surrendered on the second turn because I destroyed his Stormraven and Tycho. I was on a team with him once when him and I were playing against another two perople. He thought he won. The game still hadn't finished and he removes his army from the table just so he can say that he "won" the battle

My Biggest Pet Peeve are just flat out asshats.

One day right before I quit 40k 8 months ago, I was having a game with an old friend, my Tau VS his nids.

Some assjack comes out of nowhere and says "Tau fething suck. You need to just throw away all your models!" And he just hovered over the board the whole game, making comments like that. I Ignored him for the most part, save the times I got a smug look on my face when he said my crisis suits were going to die in CC against the Genestealers and my Crisis Suits wiped them out in CC.

But towards the end he just cranked the asshat meter to 11 (instead of making 10 louder) and just started moving my models. My friend finally snapped and yelled at him for trying to interrupt our game all day. The guy was kicked out by the store manager, who had watched the whole thing and was surprised I didn't yell at the Ass earlier. The Ass was like 25.


After that, I packed up my models, figuring it's not worth dealing with. Since I came back to 40k, I haven't made it out to the FLGS yet, mostly just playing on Vassal or at the friend's house when we both get days off. Going to try and make it up there around Christmas when my army is painted and based.

I'm not a fan of cheaters either. And There is only one reason you should not bathe, you play Mono-Nurgle. if you smell like rotten sewage, you better be breaking out Death Guard or Plague Bearers. I will allow that based on the fact that you are being true to your army.

You had crisis suits beat stealers in CC?

yamgrenade wrote:I play with good friends mostly, and don't really have problems with them, gameplay-wise. What does FRUSTRATE the feth outta me is when ever his turn is over he go's to look at the bits bin, which is in another room at the other side of the store we play at. I have to go collect him after movement because I don't want him to think I am cheating with my shooting.

Seriously, every time he does this, slap him in the face. Every time. Eventually it'll get drilled into him to not walk away when playing a game.

Vaktathi - seems like you need oppponets to check seize ground; you place objectives before knowing who has what side. So if they place them in impossible locations that could really backfire if you win the roll off....

Peeve: people who are ranked very highly in the UK really trying to suggest that a tank that has pivoted counts as moving combat speed in asssault. Sigh.

People who complain about how they always roll badly. Thats not how maths works.

Eeps wrote:People who complain about how they always roll badly. Thats not how maths works.

actually that is how maths works, the probability pool for dice includes all dice not just the ones you roll, therefore it is entirely probable for one player to roll badly for a whole game and for the other player to roll well. Overall in the giant galactic dice pool probability will even out however there will be freak distributions within the pool. I know this for a fact having spent a six month period recording my dice rolls and found that my marines only hit approx 40% of the time and i only passed about 50% of power armour saves. i have also had the occassion where in playing two games in one day I rolled obscenely well (rare for me) so I know full well the vagaries of the dice. Even dice manufacturers know that dice are biased, it has to do with where the dice was attached to the sprue and how it was tumbled to clean it up. So some batches of dice will roll more ones and some will roll more sixes (something the baddice podcast dice are famous for) so find a good batch and hang on to them.

I CANNOT STAND IT when other people start jumping into the game.
I am coming up with little strategies and tactics and I get 1-2 sometimes 3 people who butt into the game and start telling my opponent what to do and not to forget about this objective and to move this and move that and start rule battles with me. and they start saying things like OH NO YOU DON'T GET COVER!

Thankfully I just ignore them and focus on 1 thing! and that is if I win I just destroyed 2 minds against 1 and I almost never lose a game when this happens so it gives me relief lol.

but oh man still so freaking annoying! talk about complete and utter disrespect for a game they are not involved in!!!

When I watch a game and see someone making a bad move or forgetting something I don't say a thing I just let them learn from their own mistakes.
instead of taking a victory away from another player because I interrupted a game and revealed things I had no business in.

Downers. I loathe downers with a passion. When I say downer, I mean the guy who just doesn't even care about playing after a particular string of bad rolls or losses.

When I take a heavy thrashing, I still make good sport of it. "Tank out my tanks will you??? Well then prepare to face death in the form of lasguns and bayonets!". If you think defeat is certain, just make up secret objective to make the game still be somewhat fun. "You didn't beat me, I just retreated after killing your terminator squad with my conscripts mwahaha!"

Coolyo294 wrote:

purplefood wrote:When they beat me.

This. Those damn people, who do they think they are?

I know right.

Necroshea wrote:Downers. I loathe downers with a passion. When I say downer, I mean the guy who just doesn't even care about playing after a particular string of bad rolls or losses.

I find this very annoying to. or people who use the old "if I had rolled better I prob would have easily won"

So I reply with "if I had millions of dollars I would probably be rich"

UNCLEBADTOUCH wrote:

Eeps wrote:People who complain about how they always roll badly. Thats not how maths works.

actually that is how maths works, the probability pool for dice includes all dice not just the ones you roll, therefore it is entirely probable for one player to roll badly for a whole game and for the other player to roll well. Overall in the giant galactic dice pool probability will even out however there will be freak distributions within the pool. I know this for a fact having spent a six month period recording my dice rolls and found that my marines only hit approx 40% of the time and i only passed about 50% of power armour saves. i have also had the occassion where in playing two games in one day I rolled obscenely well (rare for me) so I know full well the vagaries of the dice. Even dice manufacturers know that dice are biased, it has to do with where the dice was attached to the sprue and how it was tumbled to clean it up. So some batches of dice will roll more ones and some will roll more sixes (something the baddice podcast dice are famous for) so find a good batch and hang on to them.

You are that person, congratulations.

Oh look an attempt to insult me on a forum "urk" *dies*

Actually quite the opposite in fact, makes you better at gaming rather than math hammering. Also makes the games a lot more fun overcoming poor luck to win. Playing with bad luck makes you focus a lot more on achieving one or two big wins every turn in certain fashion rather than math hammering and spraying and praying. This means I get a good win record in spite of bad luck and when the dice gods show me some kindness I can pull off some stupendous wins.

Makes things lots of fun as you never really know which way things will go and there's always time for some comedy voices from my inept troops.

Guys who math hammer are the ones who are that guy, they don't focus properly, and complain when they don't get there mathematical turn of win. Math hammering also slows the game down immeasurably as they take ages working out every tiny odd before committing to it. Also they tend not to get great results as they have a fear of gambling or taking risk which can be hugely exploited.

The other thing that irritates me is people who when proved wrong on a forum choose not to engage in debate or rebuttal but simply try to post a snide attempt at an insult ;-p

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gambler%27s_fallacy
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Standard_deviation

Not flaming or anything, but you are falling into a trap of misunderstanding. If you play enough games in your life, you will on average roll the same as anyone else, its how it works basically.

Your belief that you are "unlucky" with dice, is something that bugs be about other players and is my pet peeve in the gamin community. Its just my answer to the the thread basically.

"If you play enough games in your life, you will on average roll the same as anyone else, its how it works basically"

This is the Gambler's Fallacy, as detailed in your second link.

htj wrote:"If you play enough games in your life, you will on average roll the same as anyone else, its how it works basically"

This is the Gambler's Fallacy, as detailed in your second link.

Not really, its about dependence versus independence of probabalistic events. Over the lifetime of a wargamer, their distribution of dice rolls will very likely be 1/6th of the time rolling each of the numbers. Anything otherwise is not because you are inherently unlucky, its just a random deviation and is likely to be pretty insignificant if you roll enough dice.

Oh dear you resulted to wikipedia you do realize showing graphs of standard deviation actually proves my point. In any distribution group there are always those that fit ouside the mean. These in an even distribution such as probability will generally balance each other so people who roll poorly a lot are balanced by those that roll well a lot.

However there are also many other factors than can result in a distribution being skewed. Like I said before mass manufactured dice are biased, this is why casino dice are made to such high specifications and are discarded when edges get damaged. That is one factor. Another factor is how people roll the dice, there are plenty of well known street hustlers ways of predetermining a role but aside from this, if you introduce the behavior you impart on a dice, which will differ from person to person, combined with a bias in the dice will result in a fairly complex interaction.

Give the same set of dice to two different people and you will see slightly different behaviors from the results. This is because rolling a six isn't a one in six as there are other environmental bias being placed upon the subject.

Your analogy that everything evens out falls down horribly under scrutiny. Everyone has the same odds of winning the lottery so everyone who plays it should win the same amount of times? I'm pretty sure there are plenty of non-winners out there and there are certainly plenty of multiple winners.

You need to look at chaos theory and probability within complex systems rather than high school maths.

I'm not contending that luck has anything to do with it, but if you consistently roll badly, your next roll is just as likely to be bad. A string of bad rolling does not have to balance out because it is statistically unlikely, that is the Gambler's Fallacy right there. In most cases, if your recorded all a players rolls, they would probably bear out to the statistical average, but rolling badly does not promise better rolling in the future.

You gents are heading widely off topic. Can we return to horror stories about TFG's, ADHD children and adults throwing temper tantrums?

htj wrote:I'm not contending that luck has anything to do with it, but if you consistently roll badly, your next roll is just as likely to be bad. A string of bad rolling does not have to balance out because it is statistically unlikely, that is the Gambler's Fallacy right there. In most cases, if your recorded all a players rolls, they would probably bear out to the statistical average, but rolling badly does not promise better rolling in the future.

exactly, nor does rolling badly impy rolling badly in the future, and that right there is what bugs me about my fellow wargamers.

zedmeister wrote:You gents are heading widely off topic. Can we return to horror stories about TFG's, ADHD children and adults throwing temper tantrums?

A good call, as I am beginning to suspect this discussion is caused by a misleading comment in Eeps' original post. Namely 'that's not how math works' when the annoyance seems to be more 'there is no such thing as bad luck.'

Actually if all the external factors remain the same its more likely the outcome will remain the same as it is external factors such as the bias of the die of the dice rolling mechanic influencing the erroneous behaviour are still influencing the outcome. You would have to have a completely unbiased system for the standard mathematical model of probability to fit.

.

htj wrote:

zedmeister wrote:You gents are heading widely off topic. Can we return to horror stories about TFG's, ADHD children and adults throwing temper tantrums?

Namely 'that's not how math works'

with an "S" dear heart, I'm not American

nosferatu1001 wrote:Peeve: people who are ranked very highly in the UK really trying to suggest that a tank that has pivoted counts as moving combat speed in asssault. Sigh.

For the purposes of getting a unit out of a transport vehicle and assaulting with them, it does. But if you're talking about charging the vehicle, during his movement phase say: "Just so you know, if you want to count pivoting as moving combat speed, then you cant fire more than 1 gun unless you're fast"

htj wrote:'there is no such thing as bad luck.'

There can however be a grouping of undesirable results that do not fit the standard probability model that affects a particular subject ;-p

I also hate leaners, just move round the table so you squash or knock stuff over.

Eeps wrote:

htj wrote:

zedmeister wrote:You gents are heading widely off topic. Can we return to horror stories about TFG's, ADHD children and adults throwing temper tantrums?

Namely 'that's not how math works'

with an "S" dear heart, I'm not American

My apologies, I did not mean to imply as such. I merely mis-typed.

Peaple who play every game WAAC with Cheese List when you just want to practice you new squad

Players who refuse to play you at the LGS, becouse you are not part of thier Click

Players who call you WAAC and Cheese, just becouse you like to play Space Wolves

Players who say your list suck, just becouse you went with a theme the sounded fun.

Players who can't play for fun.

People who don't like me calling my Space Wolves, Space Puppies when I am using it as both a term of endierment and trying to keep the discusion light

I hate it when I click on a 2-page thread on a forum and find that an entire page is full of an argument that's gone completely off-topic...

What's starting to bug me is people who tell me I should put my Wolf Lords (who are on Thunderwolves) on the tournament-legal 60mm bases, instead of the cavalry ones I use now. I gladly will, as soon as I join a tournament, which is never (for various reasons, mostly modeling). In a casual setting, I'm going to use the base that makes the most sense.

Pick up games where your opponent asks "What are you playing?" and then pulls out a list tailored specifically to beat that army.

That gamer that always calls the measurement right at the edge out for your shots or assaults, but in for his/hers.

People that don't have their codex, don't have their list, don't have their rulebook, and insist on everything being OK because they are working "from memory".

The "move the tape measure with the vehicle/model" move.

I would have to say when people put their dice away and always have to take them back out.

Another is when people roll one die at a time when they have about over 10 to roll

another is when people touch your models when they are dead. its kind of like just let me take them off unless i ask you too please.

the final would have to be people that complain the a codex is OP when they loose to it, yes I do play IG but I dont run a tourny list when playing friends. ive got friends that call my nids OP and its one of those moments where you just look at them and wonder what they are thinking.