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Since I've yet to be told to not post pics and other do post pics so will I. This is from FFG's Dark Heresy rpg: Ascension pg 182.


I'm sure anyone who has read 'Love Can Bloom' can get the joke .

I'd like to re-iterate my point that humans are as sexually compatible with eldar as we are with, say, trees.

Joey wrote:I'd like to re-iterate my point that humans are as sexually compatible with eldar as we are with, say, trees.

There's little reason to claim this, the fluff is ambiguous. I at least assume that humans and eldar are physically compatible.

Opposition to human-eldar hybrids is just people hating, for their own reasons. I don't mind opposition to the idea, but making claims about how genetics should work on fictitious alien species is a bit silly.

Corporal_Reznov wrote:Since I've yet to be told to not post pics and other do post pics so will I. This is from FFG's Dark Heresy rpg: Ascension pg 182.

And in doing so they prove they are more in touch with the fan base than GW proper.

Howard A Treesong wrote:

There's little reason to claim this, the fluff is ambiguous. I at least assume that humans and eldar are physically compatible.

Well, no. Genetics is a set of specific data. For the eldar to be sexually compatable they'd have to be closer than chimps (which are not sexually compatable) who split a few hundred generations ago (IIRC).
The chances of both races evolving to be genetically compatable purely by chance (still allowing for mischeif of the gods, of course) would be like finding another planet the exact size of earth, with the exact same mineral make-up and the exact same land/sea borders. i.e. it's so small that you can discount it.

Yes but why assume there is no relation at all? Both were 'created' by the old ones, evolution and genetics don't follow the rules of the real world.

Howard A Treesong wrote:Yes but why assume there is no relation at all? Both were 'created' by the old ones, evolution and genetics don't follow the rules of the real world.

Because an entity creates two things...they MUST be compatible? Riiight.

Joey wrote:

Howard A Treesong wrote:Yes but why assume there is no relation at all? Both were 'created' by the old ones, evolution and genetics don't follow the rules of the real world.

Because an entity creates two things...they MUST be compatible? Riiight.

I merely suggest that when artificially creating two things that look very alike, there's a strong possibility that they are based on a similar design. There's no reason not to suppose this as indicated by a hybrid character in the old fluff. Sure it's old, but it's there.

Howard A Treesong wrote:

Joey wrote:

Howard A Treesong wrote:Yes but why assume there is no relation at all? Both were 'created' by the old ones, evolution and genetics don't follow the rules of the real world.

Because an entity creates two things...they MUST be compatible? Riiight.

I merely suggest that when artificially creating two things that look very alike, there's a strong possibility that they are based on a similar design. There's no reason not to suppose this as indicated by a hybrid character in the old fluff. Sure it's old, but it's there.

The Old ones died out a very long time before the ancestors of mankind climbed from their trees.

Howard A Treesong wrote:
And in doing so they prove they are more in touch with the fan base than GW proper.

Yeah, hot female Eldar for everyone .

Old fluff, was simply left to die never to be spoken of it again.

One thing is for sure, such individual would have NO place at either the Imperium or Eldar society.

Dakkadood wrote:Old fluff, was simply left to die never to be spoken of it again.

Seems likely.

One thing is for sure, such individual would have NO place at either the Imperium or Eldar society.

Well it would probably "look" human, since pure eldar pretty much look human anyway.
It'd also probably be capable of using the warp without blowing itself up, which would make a nice change.

Joey wrote:Cross-breeding is impossible unless the eldar were related to humans biologically and split about 50,000 years ago.
Just because species look the same, doesn't mean they're similar in any way.
Just look at dolphins and sharks-both big fishy things, but actually completely, totally different.

Keep in mind the fluff about Human and Eldar ancestors being created using similar designs by the Old Ones. If the two races are custom-built, then normal genetic science might not apply.

Tadashi wrote:

Joey wrote:Cross-breeding is impossible unless the eldar were related to humans biologically and split about 50,000 years ago.
Just because species look the same, doesn't mean they're similar in any way.
Just look at dolphins and sharks-both big fishy things, but actually completely, totally different.

Keep in mind the fluff about Human and Eldar ancestors being created using similar designs by the Old Ones. If the two races are custom-built, then normal genetic science might not apply.

I think that may have been his point.
In any case, other races were bio-engineered by the Old Ones. Does that mean Orks are compatible with humans? Orks and Eldar? No, I dont think so. Just because two races stem from the same beginnings does not make them biologically compatible in producing offspring. Physically compatible, maybe, but we're entering NSFW territory there

Let's not talk about NSFW. We might get into trouble with the Administratum. But Humans and Eldar are much more similar with each other than other races, including Orks. Besides, Orks lack several organs that both Humans and Eldar have. Considering Orks reproduce using spores, I doubt they have a reproductive system, and apparently some of their systems are superior or inferior to those of Humans and Eldar.

Let me put it simple.

The Eldar were created by the Old Ones ( that fluff is still valid because it was mentioned in new Necron codex ).

Old Ones were then attacked by Necrons and thought all of them were wiped out. ( even if Necron codex stated that Old Ones were "utterly destroyed", that may refereed to just civilization but not all of the general populace. )

After some time ( around 60 million years, Dinosaurus were all killed because of the Necrons. Livingh our planet wipe clean of all life exept very small ones liek mamals ), Humans just "appear" on Earth.

Random Happeneing? Or is it maybe that Humanity is what was left of the Old Ones? ( Just my theory, but remember: Old Ones made Eldar in their own image, and what 2 races share almost the same look and anatomy? )

So you're saying that Mankind's ancestors weren't just created by the Old Ones, but are actually the Old Ones? I don't know, that's kinda hard to believe.

I am just saying, Eldar and Humans being almost the same makes you think.
Old Ones did make Eldar in their own image, and since we don't have any of their picture - we may assume that they look similar as Eldar.
I say they were Humans, but a little different from ones today. ( something similar like "Battlestar Galactica" ending )

Brother Coa wrote:I am just saying, Eldar and Humans being almost the same makes you think.
Old Ones did make Eldar in their own image, and since we don't have any of their picture - we may assume that they look similar as Eldar.
I say they were Humans, but a little different from ones today. ( something similar like "Battlestar Galactica" ending )

AFAIK Humans were the trade-off between Orks and Eldar.
Eldar were too elite and Orks weren't disciplined enough.
Humans had an innate talent for both war and disciplined armies.
As it is cross-breeding Humans and Eldar is impossible.
There are a differne tumber of chromosomes in each.
I'm not saying it's unlikely. I'm saying it's impossible.

Hmmm...considering evolved Humans are supposed to have superior psychic abilities (the Emperor, Magnus the Red, Malcador the Sigilite), and the Old Ones did create the Eldar in their image...yes, maybe the Humans of 40k are devolved Old Ones, and the Emperor's vision of evolved Humans would probably just restore their ancestor's powers...kinda controversial...

Ronin wrote:In any case, other races were bio-engineered by the Old Ones. Does that mean Orks are compatible with humans? Orks and Eldar? No, I dont think so. Just because two races stem from the same beginnings does not make them biologically compatible in producing offspring. Physically compatible, maybe, but we're entering NSFW territory there

There's nothing to suggest that Orks are compatible with humans, we know specifically that they reproduce through spores and there's never been a hint of compatibility. Eldar do look like humans though, and there is previous examples of the possibilities for hybrids.

Although the shared origin of humans and eldar does not prove compatibility, it certainly allows for it. It cannot be dismissed with certainty and talk of their genetics and what is and isn't possible in the 40K universe is largely conjecture. One view is as valid as another given what is published. You don't need to be of the same species or have the same chromosome numbers to produce a hybrid, genetics is more complicated than that and it's very dependent on the specifics of any particular pairing. And anyway, we don't really know the genetic make up of eldar so claims as to their compatibility or lack of are speculative.

Howard A Treesong wrote:

Ronin wrote:In any case, other races were bio-engineered by the Old Ones. Does that mean Orks are compatible with humans? Orks and Eldar? No, I dont think so. Just because two races stem from the same beginnings does not make them biologically compatible in producing offspring. Physically compatible, maybe, but we're entering NSFW territory there

There's nothing to suggest that Orks are compatible with humans, we know specifically that they reproduce through spores and there's never been a hint of compatibility. Eldar do look like humans though, and there is previous examples of the possibilities for hybrids.

Although the shared origin of humans and eldar does not prove compatibility, it certainly allows for it. It cannot be dismissed with certainty and talk of their genetics and what is and isn't possible in the 40K universe is largely conjecture. One view is as valid as another given what is published. You don't need to be of the same species or have the same chromosome numbers to produce a hybrid, genetics is more complicated than that and it's very dependent on the specifics of any particular pairing. And anyway, we don't really know the genetic make up of eldar so claims as to their compatibility or lack of are speculative.

We do know Eldar have more chromosomes than us...
At any rate hybridism has only ever been observed by 2 members of a very close species e.g. Tigers and Lions
Eldar and Humans are too far from each other.
If you got samples of both species and with enough tinkering then yes. You would eventually make a hybrid. But cross-breeding in the traditional sense is impossible IMO.

Agreed. Case in point: tigers and lions are different species but can breed.

Tadashi wrote:Agreed. Case in point: tigers and lions are different species but can breed.

They are incredibly close though. They are a aprt of the same genus and they share the same amount of chromosomes.
Humans and Eldar do not.
This makes cross-breeding impossible.

But we don't know that. Humans and Eldar were both made by the Old Ones, apparently from the same genetic stock...

We do know that.
I'm not sure on the source but it said that Eldar have a great deal more chromosomes than Humans.
At any rate simply because they were made by the Old Ones doesn't mean they were from the same genetic stock. Orks were also made by the Old Ones and look how they turned out...

Xenobiology maybe?

Possibly...
I might have to dig around...
At any rate it's impossible.
Lets just leave it at that.

Who knows? Maybe once Codex: Alienhunters is released we may get some clues about the Orks and Eldar and their respective biologies.

purplefood wrote:Eldar and Humans are too far from each other.

You have no real grounds to say that.

purplefood wrote:

Tadashi wrote:Agreed. Case in point: tigers and lions are different species but can breed.

They are incredibly close though. They are a aprt of the same genus and they share the same amount of chromosomes.
Humans and Eldar do not.
This makes cross-breeding impossible.

Again you have no grounds. You're just repeatedly stating your opinion as a fact.

You simply don't know how their genetics work or what that make up is beyond the difference in chromosome numbers.

purplefood wrote:At any rate it's impossible.
Lets just leave it at that.

Great 'discussion'.

Maybe if you stamp your foot a bit harder some facts will appear.

purplefood wrote:
We do know Eldar have more chromosomes than us...

Does not prove anything expect that the child would resemble more its Eldar parent.

And even if it weren't possible by the traditional way....
Involve lots of booze and psychic powers and voila.

I wonder how they would react when they wake up in the same bed in some place they don't recognize and can't remember anything that happened during the last two weeks.


Yeah they probably try to kill each other at first...