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I enjoyed the batrep. Well written and very exciting.

Beasts don't automatically get it, but swarms do along with stealth.

Beasts don't have move through cover USR, neither do swarms. Beasts double their charge distance and have fleet, swarms have stealth but thats it.

Skip has it right. Many codices have units that are beasts/cavalry with move through cover, or swarms with move through cover (tyranids are a prime example) but they have those rules as extras. The BRB only gives stealth to swarms (along with Vulnerability to Blasts/Templates) and fleet/12" charge to beasts.

Skip wrote:Beasts don't have move through cover USR, neither do swarms. Beasts double their charge distance and have fleet, swarms have stealth but thats it.

Reread the BRB and you are correct! Perhaps it was one of the units I used to use had it and I just got mixed up... good to know!

I made the same mistake with my Fiends for a bit too Zid. I am not sure why I thought they had it...

calypso2ts wrote:I made the same mistake with my Fiends for a bit too Zid. I am not sure why I thought they had it...

Most people think they do, and thats how many of my group play beasts. We all know they have fleet and 12" assault, but for some reason everyone here thinks they have MTC... had the same issue with many opponents thinking Dreads and MC's had MTC as well.

MC's do have MTC.

jy2 wrote:MC's do have MTC.

DOH!

Zid wrote:

jy2 wrote:MC's do have MTC.

DOH

Independent Characters also have MTC and Skilled Rider, while we're going over all the hidden USRs possessed by units. :-P

marines have and they shall have no fear... ... ... except grey knights


Automatically Appended Next Post:
But seriously, I imagine the end ruling on the scarabs is going to have to be a little more lenient (hopefully) than many want as frankly.. without a little bit of reach advantage the crons are compleley [censored].

Yes the full congo line is ridiculous but so is basically everything in the GK codex.

At the very least I think they could simple have the units do it in sets allowing for one set to build off the one before it. As you have all quite graciously pointed out they do NOT have MTC so there is already a great deal that slows them way way down and even more that simply and quickly annhilates them.

If they release an FQ nerfing the codex's ONLY dependable anti mech perhaps they'd be so kind as to get up off their arses and give relentless or twin-linked to the destroyers who currently cannot move and fire heavy Gauss cannons.

meh, that's enough belly aching on my part. Frankly. I doubt we'll see a FAQ for at least another 3-4 months.

Heavy gauss cannons are assault 1. No need for an Faq to move and fire with heavy d's.

How do you find the min Warrior units on foot? Aren't they easy to kill?

How are you liking the Wraiths and a single Scarab unit?

The Dragon wrote:marines have and they shall have no fear... ... ... except grey knights.

GK's have it as well.

mercer wrote:How do you find the min Warrior units on foot? Aren't they easy to kill?

How are you liking the Wraiths and a single Scarab unit?

Not if you design your list properly. I have yet to lose all my warriors (I run 5-man warrior squads also). Reserving and hiding helps!

mercer wrote:How do you find the min Warrior units on foot? Aren't they easy to kill?

How are you liking the Wraiths and a single Scarab unit?

JY hit the nail on the head.

After all this I'm actually going back through my BRB and brushing up on the stuff I had no idea on... hell, I've been playing my MC's not having MTC and beasts having MTC! lolz

I stand corrected on the Gauss.

whoops

I had only really theory-hammered the Nemesor's effect on the wraithwing, and it performed better than was supposed. I think i'm still sticking to Anrakyr for the moment, but wow, killer batrep and amazing performance from the 'crons.

I'd love to see your scarab farm list, my tesla list, and Jy2's new doom-scythe list in side by side battles against the same opponent.

junk wrote:I had only really theory-hammered the Nemesor's effect on the wraithwing, and it performed better than was supposed. I think i'm still sticking to Anrakyr for the moment, but wow, killer batrep and amazing performance from the 'crons.

I'd love to see your scarab farm list, my tesla list, and Jy2's new doom-scythe list in side by side battles against the same opponent.

That'd be interesting... I'll probably be getting a rematch against this same list (he said he was tweaking it) as well as facing Necrons vs Necrons in the near future as my buddy finished getting his stuff! Hes running a Command Barge/Ark Heavy list

jy2 wrote:
Not if you design your list properly. I have yet to lose all my warriors (I run 5-man warrior squads also). Reserving and hiding helps!

It doesn't matter how you design your list. 5 Necron Warriors aren't hard to kill. It's tactics keeping them alive what does the job. I don't suspect they are too hard to kill, tbh.

Zid wrote:

mercer wrote:How do you find the min Warrior units on foot? Aren't they easy to kill?

How are you liking the Wraiths and a single Scarab unit?

JY hit the nail on the head.

After all this I'm actually going back through my BRB and brushing up on the stuff I had no idea on... hell, I've been playing my MC's not having MTC and beasts having MTC! lolz

As I said to Jy, it's got nothing to do with the list, really. People will take care of the threats and deal with the Warriors if required.

Rules fail!

mercer wrote:

jy2 wrote:
Not if you design your list properly. I have yet to lose all my warriors (I run 5-man warrior squads also). Reserving and hiding helps!

It doesn't matter how you design your list. 5 Necron Warriors aren't hard to kill. It's tactics keeping them alive what does the job. I don't suspect they are too hard to kill, tbh.

With mine it does. Just check out my batreps and you will see why.

The question my list poses is this...do you kill the things that can win the game by taking objectives (or which offers up easy KP's), or do you kill the things that can kill your entire army?

I've seen you list, well one of them, the one with the Doom Scythes? Like I said, it's tactics. Target priority first then onto the whatever needs to be done i.e small units for kill points or troops for objectives.

mercer wrote:I've seen you list, well one of them, the one with the Doom Scythes? Like I said, it's tactics. Target priority first then onto the whatever needs to be done i.e small units for kill points or troops for objectives.

Most of the time in KP missions you'll hide the warriors. If they want to try and target those 4 KP's, I welcome it normally. If they don't kill the wraiths, scarabs, and spyders, I'll be able to get the KP's anyway. Tactics is what wins most games anyway, not the list. Just check out some of the crazy lists players like Reece plays and what he wins with it.

The MTO Necron list works on the same grounds as MSU armies. It has lots of targets that you have to contend with so other armies that have KP missions as their weakness are actually great to deal with his list. You won't have trouble with target priority, well in theory. The key is how you target his stuff. He has paper airplane fliers but he also has three tarpits. Those three fast attack units aren't the greatest at killing though IMO. Better then most will expect but with out pig piling they can't dig out of other fearless units with any real urgency.

His list also is geared toward the meta. I myself don't play meta armies any more as they lack flavor and do poorly in soft scores generally. Against people who bring outflankers I think he is in a world of hurt in certain scenarios. Genestealers for example with the doom/ ygmarils like my bro plays will tear those small units up. Ironically I think the Doom tears Crons up and will make a come back in nid lists. Nids are a bad match up for Crons anyways though. It's always been rock paper scissors. Wolves, DE and Nids will do very well in this case.

yeah no doubt that Doom is the antichrist to necron lists.

Still, I like to tell myself that GK is a nice big can of raid that will keep spraying nids off the tables and leaving behind a protective chemical barrier which prevents them from showing up at tourneys in anything but the smallest numbers. lol.

Zid wrote:

mercer wrote:I've seen you list, well one of them, the one with the Doom Scythes? Like I said, it's tactics. Target priority first then onto the whatever needs to be done i.e small units for kill points or troops for objectives.

Most of the time in KP missions you'll hide the warriors. If they want to try and target those 4 KP's, I welcome it normally. If they don't kill the wraiths, scarabs, and spyders, I'll be able to get the KP's anyway. Tactics is what wins most games anyway, not the list. Just check out some of the crazy lists players like Reece plays and what he wins with it.

4 easy kill points is a no brainer to go for, once you've dealt with the threats first. Kill the Spyders first so they cannot spawn any Scarabs, then the Scarabs themselves and assault the Wraiths - the Wraiths will probably tie up your own unit, but at least the Wraiths are not running rampant.

Crazy lists are one thing, who you play against is another. I could run crazy lists and still win many games

mercer wrote:

Zid wrote:

mercer wrote:I've seen you list, well one of them, the one with the Doom Scythes? Like I said, it's tactics. Target priority first then onto the whatever needs to be done i.e small units for kill points or troops for objectives.

Most of the time in KP missions you'll hide the warriors. If they want to try and target those 4 KP's, I welcome it normally. If they don't kill the wraiths, scarabs, and spyders, I'll be able to get the KP's anyway. Tactics is what wins most games anyway, not the list. Just check out some of the crazy lists players like Reece plays and what he wins with it.

4 easy kill points is a no brainer to go for, once you've dealt with the threats first. Kill the Spyders first so they cannot spawn any Scarabs, then the Scarabs themselves and assault the Wraiths - the Wraiths will probably tie up your own unit, but at least the Wraiths are not running rampant.

Crazy lists are one thing, who you play against is another. I could run crazy lists and still win many games

Then do it; still comes down to tactics. My point is, a skilled opponent with a unique list is just as good as an OK player with a good list. Yes, those 4 KP is a no brainer... if they can get them. Point is to not ALLOW them to get them. Your 5 man warrior squads and marine squads are easy to kill, as are any dark eldar vehicle, but do you stop using them? no. A units as good as the person using it. Just cuz a 5 man warrior squads easy to kill doesn't mean its not effective at doing what I use them for, same as JY, same as others

nice rep, and man do I wish I had that many Valkyries

one of the main reasons to post BR's is to get help with rules mixups

Zid wrote:

Then do it; still comes down to tactics. My point is, a skilled opponent with a unique list is just as good as an OK player with a good list. Yes, those 4 KP is a no brainer... if they can get them. Point is to not ALLOW them to get them. Your 5 man warrior squads and marine squads are easy to kill, as are any dark eldar vehicle, but do you stop using them? no. A units as good as the person using it. Just cuz a 5 man warrior squads easy to kill doesn't mean its not effective at doing what I use them for, same as JY, same as others

I don't think you're getting the point dude. Those Dark Eldar Warriors and Space Marines are inside a vehicle, they also have mobility. Those Warriors on foot don't. Unless you're playing on a really terrain heavy board, then you will get LOS on them most times. If it works for you then great, I can only see the use for a single unit and that's in capture and control games.

I think the main premise is not that they would die if shot, but that you have no choice but to deal with the faster necron threats. Because of this you are not shooting at the warriors, if you did then the necron threats would tear through your lines. I think it is a fairly decent build but the issue I have with it is that armies like mech eldar or land raider templars and even battle wagon orks will tear through the crons simply because they are more mobile and have super resilient vehicles. Those wraiths actually aren't that good at AT and the scarabs can only do so much.

Every army has it's weakness though. I think 6th will alter the meta drastically any how. I don't think I would build a unique build before an edition change. With cover saves getting nerfed from what I hear those scarabs and warriors are gonna be all the squishier.

Yes, I know that, that's why I said earlier deal with the threats and then onto the easy peasy Warriors .