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@HAZZER: Thanks! Here you go - Infinity vs Orks size comparison:


"Hoilster bird"? She has the Ariadna symbol on her top if that is what you mean. See here: Ariadna

@Gitsplitta: Thanks! Did you realise it was so intricate? (see above). Ulterior motivations/inspirations? Not sure I follow...

Nah... I just meant that the's a babe so there'd be some psychological good vibes for painting her well.

Ah, well, probably Nothing to do with the painting competition at all, or my desire to improve, no - none at all .

So long as everyone enjoys the eye candy

Sorry mate... I'm quite shallow today. Nothing meaningful from the Gitsplitta.

Internet hides humour/sarcasm too - no harm done. Tell you what - you can bump my Da Dark Angelz blog for penance if you like - I have a new pic to put up (the last one appended... - I thought they were doing away with that?)

Done!

Awesome little journey you took us on there, mate. One day i'll paint like you! One day!

I can't believe i'm going to be without your sweet updates for like, 3 months!

Great looking stuff keep up the great work!

love the camo pattern, not to forget the model

Cant wait to see more

@Gitsplitta, ghostmaker, marmaduke: Thanks!

@Casey's Law: Practise makes progress! I'll try to get a few updates in before 3 months, just unlikely to be painting related (perhaps we can do a battle report )

EndTransmission dropped off my Infinity haul this weekend - doesn't look like much:


Sneak peek:


Sorted vaguely into factions:


Nomads:


ALEPH:


PanOceania:


Haqqislam:


Ariadna:


Yu Jing:


Odds and ends:


I was only after Ariadna, and perhaps Haqqislam, but now I can branch out into pretty much everything (and corrupt my brother when I get back to Oz )

And I have plenty of models to choose from for any future painting competitions

Stay connected!

I'm feeling my willpower weaken daily...

Must resist Yu-Jing...

I'm surprised you don't have Yu-Jing already - don't you have everything? (and I'm not just limiting that to Infinity!)

I've got a lot of everything Infinity-wise - lots of options for every faction except Haqqislam and no Yu-Jing at all!

I should be able to resist them.

I think!

Right now I'm concentrating on building my own table/terrain for the game.

Should keep me busy for a while...!

Arakasi wrote:@Casey's Law: Practise makes progress! I'll try to get a few updates in before 3 months, just unlikely to be painting related (perhaps we can do a battle report )

We should definitely do that man. It'll have to be after the weekend though if that's okay? It's Gala Day in little Strathaven which means the entire town will be out on the street and i'll be staggering about drinking enough to take down a rugby team.

Sweet haul btw! I'm planning on finish my Infinimunda Gang and starting my Nomads this month. Fingers crossed! I'm struggling with these Servo arms though, if anyone has any ideas please pm me or fire a post up on my blog.

I've also come to terms with you leaving this awesome country because at the same time my cousin and her husband are coming back from Oz. That's a trade i can't say no to!

Damn that's a lot of loot. You're gonna have a sweet collection when you paint it. Now, stop buying and start painting!!!!

But - that was only *one* (£200) purchase Yeah, yeah, painting counting down in approximately 9 weeks... (bah! slow international shipping...)

Thread - ARISE!

The Dakka Painting Challenge: Two Tickets to Paradiso has just completed. My entry (original below) significantly under performed - scoring a measly 16 votes, placing it 15th of 19 in the public voting.

Entry 16 - Arakasi - Yu Jing Aragato Senkenbutai


I've been blessed with an overwhelming amount of constructive feedback on the entry itself over here: [url=http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/539549.page]
Arakasi's Dakka Painting Challenge Entry - What went wrong?[/url], where I posted this alternative picture:

Entry 16 - Arakasi - Touring Paradiso


For completeness - here are the models from the Infinity web site:

Infinity - Yu Jing Aragato Senkenbutai


Now, the fun begins to show you my progress, trials and tribulations - for anyone who cares I've included quotes from my feedback thread where I've considered it appropriate.

Model Selection & Theme

finnan wrote:The theme was specifically to show off the dangers of the environment, and given that, the models were never going to be the main focus point... which is a bit of a paradox in a model painting competition.

I'll open with this quote from finnan - as it pretty much exactly sums up the dilemma I faced at the beginning of this process, and the first of two paradoxes (the other comes in painting). There were several factors that led to my choice of models:

I have a large selection of older Infinity models across multiple factions due to a bulk lot purchase over a year ago. My choice would be from these models in order to not lose time on purchasing/shipping/delivery. (My entry was submitted with 12 minutes to spare…)

I wouldn't choose Ariadna - Ariadna being my chosen Infinity faction, I didn't want to limit my entry to my colours/basing, nor lose a model to the competition - a lesson learnt from the previous Dakka Infinity Painting Competition. I further justify this limitation by predicting this will be the "status quo" for the theme, and want something "different". (Ariadna accounted for 5 of 19 entries - Yu Jing accounted for 6 of 19 entries - doh! There was only one double up of PanOceania models - although there were 3 of the same "type" in Ariadna)

The rules allow up to two models, and I'm going all out - so two it is (Only 3 of 19 entries used two models. highest placed 9th of 19)

The bikes were the largest models I had, barring a single TAG. I thought the large flat surfaces of the bikes would provide room for freehand (ran out of time) and the riders allowed for more traditional Infinity models. I didn't expect anyone else to enter bikes, let alone two - so I was expecting an unique entry (success…) Interestingly in hindsight - I decided on a "status quo" jungle base for the theme (about half of the entries, depending on where you draw the line) but upscaled for effect. The aim was to allow the jungle to act as a background for the bikes, and to include the "hazardous" terrain part of the theme.

Jimsolo wrote:I think the right models as centerpieces could even make the whole thing work. A large, neutral object, like a Black Templar dreadnought or some other big figure composed mostly of black or white, would do really well on this base, since the huge difference between it and the base would naturally draw the eye to the central figure.

The TAG may have been a better option - it would have been more prominent due to its bulk and height. As one miniature, I actually would have needed less surrounding jungle to backdrop it - which would have also made it more prominent again. It may also have had a better chance of solving the second paradox in painting camouflage... In hindsight, two models, by their nature, split the focus of the piece - and in a diorama that ended up having focus issues, that would seem to be a hindrance rather than a positive.

lav25gunner wrote:To be honest those models were also out of place in the jungle setting. These Ariadna models would have been a better fit: 9th Wulver Grenadiers, Scouts

Primarily, my goal, for better or worse - was to be different/unique. This is always a risk. Unique should do better than safe - but will also be penalised more if it doesn't work. I thought the fluff supported all-terrain bikes, but on re-reading it, I may have just read what I wanted to - "Originally conceived as propulsion unit for the air force, the Tsurugi's motor has been mounted on a structure with maximum flexibility and all-terrain capabilities, but with a competition chassis designed for the race circuit, …".

Modelling
Anyway - I couldn't leave it exactly as is. I found some train scale nuts and rivets that I bought a long time ago for my Orks (that were *way* too small for them) and painstakingly converted the back tyres to knobbly ones:



And on to the base. First - go large or go home! Using a compass blade, I scored a large circle in 3mm plasticard, and then similarly the smaller holes for the bases. I actually rough cut with a jewellers saw around the outside and inside of the scoring (about 5mm in/outside), then cut up to the scored lines at right angles, and then "snapped" off the individual bits - worked much better than I had suspected!



I then planned out roughly the scene and elevations to match the models:



Cutting the first and second elevations:



All of the elevations and bike positioning:



Front view:



Left view:



I wanted to have a face - so the second conversion was to replace the head of the female rider - with the Haqqislam Ghulam Infantry head I believe...



Both riders in position:



Top view:



More to come!











Automatically Appended Next Post:
Not sure what changed here - probably just a slightly different angle, or closer shot:



Or I was looking for the angles I wanted to photograph in the end:



Here is the start of the green stuffing to smooth out the gradients. I seem to have collected a lot of the stuff over the years, and am always concerned it will "go off" - so using up my oldest batches was a non event. You can see the beginnings of the bike tracks through the mud. I used the front tyre of the model to make the front tyre tracks. I was concerned about losing by knobbly bits using the back tyres - so the back tyre tracks were made with the edge of a conical clay shaper - the point used to imitate the impressions of the knobbly bits. You should be able to make out the gap between the rear and front tyre tracks of the female biker at the back of the base - which was supposed to emphasise the turning/sliding out of the rear tyre. Both bikes are coming along the track which goes between the trees on the right. You can see the basis for the stream bed and rocks moving away to the left. Oh - and of course - the beginnings of the trees/stump. Their height was chosen to disappear above the photographed shots - there is no actual "top" to them. They were placed at the back so as to not obscure the bikes, and to provide a back drop for them.



A top down view better showing the tracks and what was meant to be a muddier area towards the back right. You may be able to make out the large creature footprints at the back near the stream - one of the 5 "hazardous terrain" theme elements. (Two others are currently visible as well - the rocky stream - preventing motorcycle travel in that direction, and the stump splitting the path and forcing "evasive action" for the female bike rider to avoid.) The stream and the impressions in the muddy track were meant to be filled with a thin layer of water effects at the end, but I ran out of time.



Tree roots and start to the trunks. I was attempting to put some texture on the trunks, but it didn't come out too well (I think I left it too late in the curing process...)



Bikes in place to test the scene as I progress:



Alternative angle - closer to final photography plans:


More of the trunks and planning out the track. The track, whilst necessary for the bikes, was also an attempt to not clutter the base too much and take focus off the bikes (completely reversed by poor colour selections later...)



Start of the front vegetation, and attempting to make sure it didn't obscure vision to the bikes:



Alternative angle:



More to come!

so this is what you have been up too. interesting. I would have to say your model progression here even shows that this wont work. The bikes have a huge feel of not belonging.

You had an Idea a good one, but the model simply wont back it up. A bike with that frame, and that low to the ground looks like it will bottom out on every little thing in the dam woods. It brings a logically displeasing feel about it, couple that with the colorful scene it was, just to much was going on for the eye to do anything other than look around for the color.

Good to see the WIP of your entry - looks pretty cool and it is always interesting to see how you go about some of the detailing

Shame you are down under - would love to play you again at some point (though you would have to forgive my pants knowledge of the rules ).

It's nice to see how you went about this mate, I always enjoy your process. I'm trying to do a write up on the challenge with my feedback but it'll take a while and I don't really have the time to sit and do it right now. I'll get to it soon though. I don't imagine I'll have any more insight than you've already received but I do have a different vantage point.

cormadepanda wrote:so this is what you have been up too. interesting. I would have to say your model progression here even shows that this wont work. The bikes have a huge feel of not belonging.

You had an Idea a good one, but the model simply wont back it up. A bike with that frame, and that low to the ground looks like it will bottom out on every little thing in the dam woods. It brings a logically displeasing feel about it, couple that with the colorful scene it was, just to much was going on for the eye to do anything other than look around for the color.

It seems my model choice was going to hold out longest for my internal justification... and I guess this is why I need and appreciate having this point hammered home again, this time to finally knock my blinders off. I chose something I thought looked cool. I had a nagging feeling something wasn't right, but silenced it with extreme prejudice. And then I get all defensive about it when people point it out...

Okay - racing circuit bikes on a jungle dirt track was not a good idea... (and knobbly tyres were not going to save them!)

SilverMK2 wrote:Good to see the WIP of your entry - looks pretty cool and it is always interesting to see how you go about some of the detailing

Shame you are down under - would love to play you again at some point (though you would have to forgive my pants knowledge of the rules ).

Yeah. *I* would have been happy to stay in the UK... (but Da Boss had other plans...)

Casey's Law wrote:It's nice to see how you went about this mate, I always enjoy your process. I'm trying to do a write up on the challenge with my feedback but it'll take a while and I don't really have the time to sit and do it right now. I'll get to it soon though. I don't imagine I'll have any more insight than you've already received but I do have a different vantage point.

It is surprising the amount of effort a full feedback takes (I did all 40 last time!) - which is another reason I appreciate that people took the time to give me the feedback I needed.

Right - more pics!

Tracks completely covered, more vegetation:


Raised more central view:


Left view - probably the clearest so far of number 4 of 5 hazardous elements - the plant behind the female rider snapping at her as she goes past. You can see some "texture" I scratched into the closest tree on the right - but not really enough to be easily picked up in paint...


Top down view:


Photo shot:


Female rider close up (maybe even clearer the snapping plant):


Male rider close up:


Overview minus bikes and bases - you can see the back vegetation being prepared to be built up:


Bases in place, back left vegetation complete and sand added, defining the track:


Photo shot from the "front":


More to come!

... another problem with this composition is that the bikes lead you out, not into the scene. I want to see what's chasing them, or what they're after...
I do like the pre-painted shot though, all those greens look strong, but aren't taking too much attention away from the figures.

Hey finnan - I appreciate you stopping by this thread as well! I might start with one of your comments from the "what went wrong" thread:

finnan wrote:in terms of the competition, I don't think it's strong/dramatic enough. The scene just looks like a ride through a lane... a lane in a jungle, yes, but an established path nonetheless. The jungle doesn't look threatening or overwhelming. There's too much space, and it seems too... pleasant. I know why you've done what you've done, but there needs to be more - more threat from the plants, and more drama in the piece as a whole. I think the choice of model also has something to do with this - because of the internal logic of the bikes having to have something to drive on, there needs to be a track, and that immediately lessens the impact of the jungle.

This thread so far is my naive answer to the above - Look ! I've got five threatening elements (the snake is still to come...). Prior to your next comment, I could misguide myself into thinking I've just not got my point across (ie a presentation issue...) - and simply ask "what needs to be done?"...

 finnan wrote:
... another problem with this composition is that the bikes lead you out, not into the scene. I want to see what's chasing them, or what they're after...
I do like the pre-painted shot though, all those greens look strong, but aren't taking too much attention away from the figures.

...but this indicates my point was the wrong one to begin with... As I ponder this further, I can see how two models may split the focus, and having them moving in opposite directions just reinforces this - which got me to thinking, how would I need to present two models in order to *not* split the focus? I've only come up with a couple of ideas so far.

Idea one: Effectively using one of the models as "scenery". Ie a TAG or other large model as a focal point, and a secondary smaller model - either an ally, moving with the primary model, or an enemy perhaps lying in ambush. This secondary smaller model would probably be the best model to camouflage - as it would help to *not* draw attention away from the primary model.

Idea two: Duel. Two enemies facing off in close proximity should draw the focus in towards them.

Idea three: Back to back. Two allies back to back might pull off the same focal point as the duel above - maybe?

Not sure how to show drama with two allied models though. The laying in ambush or duel of two enemies would achieve this much easier I think. I'm also wondering how I would do a chase scene on such a small base (I suspect a long narrow base, with jungle on the rear side....)

Am I starting to comprehend what needs to be done here - or am I still way off base?

Any other/better ideas? (these questions are directed at everyone - not just finnan )

I expect one day I might repaint the jungle to "tone" it down. I have a plan to create more "entries" here to test what I have learnt so far, broaden my experience and to get corrective feedback during the process from start to finish - but that's a project for the future...

Meanwhile - have more pics! (Even if most of them seem to be just different angled shots...)

More shots pre back tree:










More shots post back tree:










I was really feeling the jungle by this stage - but still a few more things to come/gaps to fill...

Did you GS all those leaves and everything??? Holy smokes!

what Gitsplitta said btw, I should have said how amazing all your sculpting is.

Leading in/out, the simple answer would be to just have the two bikes following each other, that would give a strong sense of direction... but that seems fairly obvious, so I'm a bit mistrustful of that myself! lol

Another idea might be to give the bikes a sense of speed - since you're so good at sculpting, would it be an easy enough job to sculpt some splashes of mud, like they're driving through a puddle? The bigger the splash would indicate a greater speed from the bikes...

Gitsplitta wrote:Did you GS all those leaves and everything??? Holy smokes!

Yup!

finnan wrote:what Gitsplitta said btw, I should have said how amazing all your sculpting is.

Leading in/out, the simple answer would be to just have the two bikes following each other, that would give a strong sense of direction... but that seems fairly obvious, so I'm a bit mistrustful of that myself! lol

Another idea might be to give the bikes a sense of speed - since you're so good at sculpting, would it be an easy enough job to sculpt some splashes of mud, like they're driving through a puddle? The bigger the splash would indicate a greater speed from the bikes...

Amazing might be stretching it - it was my first time at most of it (jungle/organic), and I'd rate elements of it on the spectrum of mediocre to good. I wasn't too worried though - it wasn't *supposed* to be the focus - and I was also relying on quantity having a quality of its own. I certainly got a *lot* of practise though!

You will see (hopefully) in the next pics that the female biker did have splashes of mud coming from behind and to the side where she was turning. This probably could have been emphasised more - though I've done a bit of a disservice to myself by having her turn a tight corner (which means a slower speed). Of course, the male biker is almost a total write-off in this respect - he has his foot down, and is therefore stationary - not really amenable to travelling at speed...

Anyway, back to the pics. The next two are just further angles I think:





The vines on the outside trees and the female biker's splashes of mud have been added (hard to see here):









If you haven't seen it before, the obvious cut off top is visible here:



And "hiding" it:



More angles (still not showing the splashes very well...):





Still more to come!

And the final WIP images...

From the set above - close up male biker:


Close up female biker - best view of the snapping plant/flower and kicked up mud:


Across shot from the female biker side:


Final vine and snake added - this would eventually become my WIP shot for the competition I believe:


Final close up of the male biker:


Final front shot of the female biker:


Final across shot of the female biker:


Final close up of the female biker:


A from behind/overhead shot:


Next - I need to upload my PIP... (don't worry - less of those...)

Very nice, I'm looking forward to your PIP. I hope my feedback was of some use but I probably just reiterated what others have already said.

 Casey's Law wrote:
Very nice, I'm looking forward to your PIP. I hope my feedback was of some use but I probably just reiterated what others have already said.

All feedback is of use - reiterated just means I have to pay closer attention to it

Ran out of bandwidth on holidays, and only just managed to upload the first pip pics before I ran out of time at the airport (Wifi and waiting) - but home now, so onwards!

Missed the pure undercoat shot (though that would be even more boring anyway...) - here is the first brown basecoats on the mud, highlighting the track, vegetation and river.



Same for the bases:



Start of (mechrite) red on the bikes:



Start of highlights I believe, in my usual red method:



Looks like the shading is in their too. Don't think I made enough of the large areas...



Here is with the Kommand Khaki - which a few people said clashed...



Both bikes:



Again. Both the red and khaki required multiple coats...



Here you can see the start of the blue metal work, leather seats and my "attempt" at camo over the khaki bits (which I ended up reversing)





More to come!

I think the bikes look really good, the problem is that they just get absorbed into the diorama. Too many warm earthy colours. The painting is great as always though, it really is!