Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

 wuestenfux wrote:
As not everybody has the codex yet, a short summary of the mono-god armies would be nice.

Define a mono-God army. Essentially any army with only one mark in it is Mono-God, which usually doesn't rule out much, so that summary is pretty much already in the first 3 posts.

 Godless-Mimicry wrote:

 wuestenfux wrote:
As not everybody has the codex yet, a short summary of the mono-god armies would be nice.

Define a mono-God army. Essentially any army with only one mark in it is Mono-God, which usually doesn't rule out much, so that summary is pretty much already in the first 3 posts.

I particularly mean the cult legions: Khorne, Nurgle, Slannesh, Tzeentch.

GubbinsGob wrote:
I am glad that they converted the Warriors of Chaos fantasy flavor of all challenges all the time to Chaos Marines. I see a lot of cool models, and a codex balanced for the edition. Which is *better* for everyone. This is a versatile codex. There is something for everyone. Hopefully the trend continues.

Agreed, if this is how they are doing things now, Im pretty excited for my next Ork dex!

Ummm correct me if I'm wrong but isn't a Daemon Prince a daemon. And doesn't the daemon USR give it a 5+ invuln and eternal warrior?

noise marine army with lucius and a horde of cultists

kungfujew wrote:
Ummm correct me if I'm wrong but isn't a Daemon Prince a daemon. And doesn't the daemon USR give it a 5+ invuln and eternal warrior?

Nope, it's 5+ invuln and Fear. EW is only if it comes from the Daemon codex.

ShadarLogoth wrote:
Something everybody seems to miss about the DP is it's WS 9 now. That means most units in the game are going to need a 5+/6+ and for him to fail a 3+ (if you gave him armor) just to wound him in CC. That's pretty damn boss. It's Lilith with S/T7 and wings (and less attacks of course).

It's not the same DP as it was before, but it's still a CC monster that can move 24" turn one.

WS 9 is a good thing, but not nearly enough to keep him alive if he's facing anything with a decent number of attacks. I've fielded Daemon Princes extensively and even with the old (good) Warptime they had a delicate survival balance; I've lost them to Guardian blobs in CC despite them needing 5's to hit and 6's to wound. And at a T5 that cannot be changed, he is immensely vulnerable to GK CC (and just massed bolter fire in general). Lilith has a much beter save than he does and she stays mostly on the shelf. And unlkie the Prince, she has a unit to hide in.

If anything, they now remind me of the Greater Daemon in the 4th edition codex with extra attack and WS. except the Greater Daemon was cheap, had a better save and Leadership and Eternal Warrior.

Guess GW decided too many people had the model and it was time to sell the Termi Lord kit.

 wearelegion wrote:
My biggest gripe is the softening of the DP, losing Eternal warrior hurts bad. It kind of seems that they were just an after thought,
They can take chaos rewards and artefacts but most of those are useless and redundant due to Daemon and MC.


The only reward of any worth is GOM, HOWEVER Imagine A DP with axe of blind fury.

Except that Daemon Princes can be a Daemon of Khorne, which is not technically a Mark of Khorne, thus they can't take the Axe of Blind Fury.

However - they can take the Black Mace. You know, the uber-killy Daemon Weapon whose only downside is that it is AP4? Except that when a Daemon Prince wield's it, it becomes AP2. Similarly, if they take a combat familiar, who normally offers 2 free attacks at S4, AP-? Those become S4, AP2 when he's working for a Daemon Prince.

Finally, they can get several psyker levels, and while the first one has to be a roll on their god's table, the other(s) can come from Biomancy, which offers some possible answers to Instant Death. And while they are only LD9, they can get a spell familiar for rerolls.

Now, the main problem at this point is that you are looking at over 300 points for the guy, and can still get hosed if you get the wrong psychic powers or run into Eldar, etc. But if everything does go right, you are a stupidly fast model that can wreck just about anything in the game.

 wuestenfux wrote:

 Godless-Mimicry wrote:

 wuestenfux wrote:
As not everybody has the codex yet, a short summary of the mono-god armies would be nice.

Define a mono-God army. Essentially any army with only one mark in it is Mono-God, which usually doesn't rule out much, so that summary is pretty much already in the first 3 posts.

I particularly mean the cult legions: Khorne, Nurgle, Slannesh, Tzeentch.

The only units specific to an chaos god are the troops from the old codex and the special characters. Pretty much every other unit either has customizable marks or is a vehicle. Making a mono-god list is quite easy and other than tzeentch doesn't even gimp your army that much.

As others have mentioned, I'm also much more impressed with Chaos Spawn than they are given credit for here. Lack of a save still hurts, but a ton of fast moving wounds can be real handy. They do have to combat with bikers in the FA slot, though, and Bikers are now fantastic.

I'm also apparently one of the only ones who is a fan of the Tzeentch psychic list. The Primaris Power is great as a horde-killer, though not of much use elsewhere. I think Doombolt is really strong - especially on something mobile, like a Tzeentch Biker Sorcerer or Tzeentch Daemon Prince. Drawing S8 AP1 beams through the enemy lines is always a good thing. Breath of Chaos remains strong, though being Warp Change 2 seems a bit silly. Boon of Mutation is the only real clunker, and I can still see some use for it in the right armies.

I'm less impressed with Nurgle. The Primaris Power... I'm doing around 2 wounds at AP5 to all units within 6"... and I can't be locked in combat. That's terrible. Giving an enemy unit 'Get's Hot' weaponry... Good against a guard blob squad, I guess, but I can't see much use for it elsewhere. Gift of Contagion... if you drop something's toughness, that's nice. The others really only matter if you will be engaging them in combat. One of them has the potential to help the enemy unit. Meh. Plague Wind is strong, but also Warp Charge 2.

Slaanesh is pretty nice across the board. Nothing too strong, but almost everything is useful one way or another.

Myth wrote:


I'm also apparently one of the only ones who is a fan of the Tzeentch psychic list. The Primaris Power is great as a horde-killer, though not of much use elsewhere.

I'd be a fan of Firestorm (the primaris) if it was a large blast. As a small blast, it'll catch 3 models at the most, is subject to a random Strength that can make it never wound anything, allows saves...too many ways for it to go wrong for something that requires a casting roll, can be shut down by hoods and runes, allows a Deny the witch save AND regular saves.

Doombolt is amazing, though. I don't get how it was not the one requiring 2 charges.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Myth wrote:

Except that Daemon Princes can be a Daemon of Khorne, which is not technically a Mark of Khorne, thus they can't take the Axe of Blind Fury.

However - they can take the Black Mace. You know, the uber-killy Daemon Weapon whose only downside is that it is AP4? Except that when a Daemon Prince wield's it, it becomes AP2. Similarly, if they take a combat familiar, who normally offers 2 free attacks at S4, AP-? Those become S4, AP2 when he's working for a Daemon Prince.

This sounds wrong. A weapon's AP does not change based on who wields it...I think. We should fire some questions for GW's FAQ section to make sure, as MC1s now having a choice of CC weapon is a new (old) thing.

The combat familiar, however, I am pretty sure remain AP - no matter who his owner is.

According to the BRB MC's get AP2 regardless of the weapon they are using(via the smash rules)

Bikers have been boosted if I read correctly. As an EC player with 12 CSM Bikes on my shelf, what's the deal with Bikes + Mark/Icon of Slaneesh?

Bikes with mark and icon of Slaanesh will get you I5 + FNP bikes!!!

 wuestenfux wrote:
Bikers have been boosted if I read correctly. As an EC player with 12 CSM Bikes on my shelf, what's the deal with Bikes + Mark/Icon of Slaneesh?

Lets just say 10 T5 FNP bikers w/ 3 plasma guns for ~250 points. A whole lot better than what they were before..

Give them a Lord on a Steed and you will be laughing.

 Godless-Mimicry wrote:
Give them a Lord on a Steed and you will be laughing.

Thats pretty much what I was going to try in 5th ed back when it still sucked, so yeah, I'm pretty happy.

Lost the Blissgiver on the lord, but now he gets the Murder Sword instead.

 Sephyr wrote:

Myth wrote:


I'm also apparently one of the only ones who is a fan of the Tzeentch psychic list. The Primaris Power is great as a horde-killer, though not of much use elsewhere.

I'd be a fan of Firestorm (the primaris) if it was a large blast. As a small blast, it'll catch 3 models at the most, is subject to a random Strength that can make it never wound anything, allows saves...too many ways for it to go wrong for something that requires a casting roll, can be shut down by hoods and runes, allows a Deny the witch save AND regular saves.

Doombolt is amazing, though. I don't get how it was not the one requiring 2 charges.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Myth wrote:

Except that Daemon Princes can be a Daemon of Khorne, which is not technically a Mark of Khorne, thus they can't take the Axe of Blind Fury.

However - they can take the Black Mace. You know, the uber-killy Daemon Weapon whose only downside is that it is AP4? Except that when a Daemon Prince wield's it, it becomes AP2. Similarly, if they take a combat familiar, who normally offers 2 free attacks at S4, AP-? Those become S4, AP2 when he's working for a Daemon Prince.

This sounds wrong. A weapon's AP does not change based on who wields it...I think. We should fire some questions for GW's FAQ section to make sure, as MC1s now having a choice of CC weapon is a new (old) thing.

The combat familiar, however, I am pretty sure remain AP - no matter who his owner is.

Under the rules for Smash

All of the close combat aftacks, except
Hammer of Wrath Attacks, of a model
with this special rule are resolved at AP 2
(unless it's attacking with an AP 1 weapon).

So yes GW did plan for MC's having a choice of weapons in 6E.

I'm looking through the codex and I am not sold on spawn at all. I get their boosts but I would be using bikers before spawn. I'm thinking Nurgle bikers and I am not thinking of taking any special weapons. I also think that an HQ joining the squad does not need any mark. There are two choices and both seem pretty decent. An unmarked lord on a bike with clawsand gift or a sorceror on a bike (lvl2 minimum) and maybe sigil. Seems this would be a very good anvil unit. I'm even debating including them with a squad of cultists in my daemon army. They would replace my screamers and a squad of horrors. Adds a nice durable fast attack squad with hammer of wrath to my list. Maybe put some meltabombs on the HQ.

Spawn just have so many wounds. With mark of nurgle I just cant see many units having the number of attacks/strength to get through their wounds. Combined with fearless and the potential number of attacks back. Also rage, rage is really good. All the random abilities are really quite useful for the unit.

Hell they may not be able to claim an objective but they are sure as hell gonna keep it safe.

not bad on the price front either with two per box.

 SilverMK2 wrote:
I guess I have to leave my DP's at home now... which is a shame

Never leave them at home. When you aspiring champion ends up killing a nob in a challenge (take that nob!), he rolls the ol' 6 6 and BLAMO, DAEMON PRINCE IN THE CENTER OF THE BOAARDDDD KILLING yOUR GUySSS!!!1!
Maybe not quite like that, but don't leave them at home in case something similar occurs.

 Godless-Mimicry wrote:

 tyrannosaurus wrote:
Mono-god lists just got a LOT pricier. Just made up a list with full sonics for my Emperor's Children and for 2000 points I'm getting the same as I got in the old codex at 1500 points [plus a Hellturkey but minus a DP which I swapped out for Lucius].

Then your calculations are wrong because they got significantly cheaper. Other things to note is that those points are being made up of other stuff not just the Noise Marines, so this post is misguided.

Also note that making mono-God doesn't force you to kit every unit out with all the weapons and all the icons, that's your choice. So no, mono-God didn't get expensive, your taste in a list did.

My lash Daemon Prince that used to cost 155 points is now 240. Take two and it's an extra 180 points. Noise Marine units are cheaper but the cost of my defiler has increased by 45 points. True if I don't include icons and marks [isn't that what a mono-god list should have though?] it gets the cost down but it's still about 140 points more to get the same list I had before.

And if I want to take the cool new stuff [like icon of excess] it jacks the Noise Marines back up to where they were before [ok they now have FNP and ignores cover but on the other hand they are gimped by salvo on the blasters].

So no slaanesh lash princes and no slaanesh icons [and no blastmasters because I run units of 6] and I'm good to go with my mono-god list.

 Godless-Mimicry wrote:
Give them a Lord on a Steed and you will be laughing.

Thats pretty much what I was going to try in 5th ed back when it still sucked, so yeah, I'm pretty happy.

Lost the Blissgiver on the lord, but now he gets the Murder Sword instead.

I now have reason to Chaos Lords instead of Princes, that makes me very happy

All's I have to do now is wait for my holiday trip home up North to break out my crudely painted marine horde and figure out how to make them work

(Bikes being cheaper is also a nice thing)

tyrannosaurus wrote:My lash Daemon Prince that used to cost 155 points is now 240. Take two and it's an extra 180 points. Noise Marine units are cheaper but the cost of my defiler has increased by 45 points.

But that's exactly my point; your statement was that mono-God armies got more expensive, and then you went onto say things like the above. Since when are two Daemon Princes and a Defiler a requirement for a mono-Slaanesh army? They aren't. My point simply was that your mono-God list got more expensive because of your choices, not mono-God armies in general.

Ah i overlooked the mark of khorne only, Still a black mace will give d6 more attacks, plus weak splash damage plus ap2 due to smash. I def still like that!

FallenAfh wrote:

 Sephyr wrote:

Myth wrote:


I'm also apparently one of the only ones who is a fan of the Tzeentch psychic list. The Primaris Power is great as a horde-killer, though not of much use elsewhere.

I'd be a fan of Firestorm (the primaris) if it was a large blast. As a small blast, it'll catch 3 models at the most, is subject to a random Strength that can make it never wound anything, allows saves...too many ways for it to go wrong for something that requires a casting roll, can be shut down by hoods and runes, allows a Deny the witch save AND regular saves.

Doombolt is amazing, though. I don't get how it was not the one requiring 2 charges.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Myth wrote:

Except that Daemon Princes can be a Daemon of Khorne, which is not technically a Mark of Khorne, thus they can't take the Axe of Blind Fury.

However - they can take the Black Mace. You know, the uber-killy Daemon Weapon whose only downside is that it is AP4? Except that when a Daemon Prince wield's it, it becomes AP2. Similarly, if they take a combat familiar, who normally offers 2 free attacks at S4, AP-? Those become S4, AP2 when he's working for a Daemon Prince.

This sounds wrong. A weapon's AP does not change based on who wields it...I think. We should fire some questions for GW's FAQ section to make sure, as MC1s now having a choice of CC weapon is a new (old) thing.

The combat familiar, however, I am pretty sure remain AP - no matter who his owner is.

Under the rules for Smash

All of the close combat aftacks, except
Hammer of Wrath Attacks, of a model
with this special rule are resolved at AP 2
(unless it's attacking with an AP 1 weapon).

So yes GW did plan for MC's having a choice of weapons in 6E.

I don't see the hate for the Daemon Prince in this edition. Make him a Flyer, fly to where you want shooting stuff and than Glide next turn and assault. Sounds like a damn good unit to me, even at it's price.

 tyrannosaurus wrote:
So no slaanesh lash princes and no slaanesh icons [and no blastmasters because I run units of 6] and I'm good to go with my mono-god list.

You could instead do squads of 12 (or have just one like that). I know it's not the same but still.

 Farseer Mael Dannan wrote:
I don't see the hate for the Daemon Prince in this edition. Make him a Flyer, fly to where you want shooting stuff and than Glide next turn and assault. Sounds like a damn good unit to me, even at it's price.

And what is he going to shoot with? So he assaults, and kills one unit, and then dies. Not really worth it for a near 300pts investment.

Well I was running a Chaos Biker Lord w/ DW, Plague Marines, MoN Bikers and MoN Havocs + Eppy. Welllll now I'm doing the same thing except possibly with Oblits or mixing in Typhus and cultists for an Obj sitter. Papa Nurgle loves this codex and 6th ed I don't think the dex by itself is super powerful like 'crons or GK, but with allies it is a contender and I even think that plenty of smart generals will take tourneys with it.