Love.

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**AnomanderRake**

There was a joke supplement for Inquisitor released on Valentines Day a long time ago on this topic; it was mostly advice on working romantic plots/subplots into a plot-driven Inquisitor campaign. As a general rule love/romance are perfectly fine in 40k so long as they remain plausible (Eldar/human is just silly (very close to bestiality in the Eldar mind), Tau women don't actually have breasts, Assassins are probably castrated to avoid trouble, Orks don't have a sex drive; you're probably limited to human/human or Eldar/Eldar for most things), and try to keep in mind the GRIMDARK nature of things when writing these plots. Betrayal, pain, one side using the other, change of circumstances to make the relationship not work, death, star-crossed-ness, that sort of thing fits a lot better than anything to which 'happily ever after' could be applied; Dan Abnett's Inquisition books are a pretty good example of effective 40k treatment of romance.

**Harriticus**

GW is afraid of love/sex and doesn't address it in their books, figuring the nerdy fans of such material don't care about such things.

However a few BL books have handled romance, and surprisingly have handled it right. The Eisenhorn trilogy with Eisenhorn and Bequin and Septimus/the Navigator's relationship in the Night Lords trilogy comes to mind.

**el_groovatore**

Harriticus wrote:
GW is afraid of love/sex and doesn't address it in their books, figuring the nerdy fans of such material don't care about such things.

However a few BL books have handled romance, and surprisingly have handled it right. The Eisenhorn trilogy with Eisenhorn and Bequin and Septimus/the Navigator's relationship in the Night Lords trilogy comes to mind.

AD-B seems to get it right - Andrej's unrequited love/feelings for that other stormtrooper (can't remember her name right now) in Helsreach is another example of love being done really rather well in 40k.

**Arcsquad12**

Definition: Love is making a shot to the knees at 120 Kilometers using an Aratech Sniper Rifle with a Tri-Light Scope! Love is knowing your target, placing them in your reticule, and achieving a singular purpose, against statistically long odds!

**coolbrobunny**

Admiral Valerian wrote:
Roadkill Zombie wrote:
One of the few canon examples I have found is from old Epic Space Marine literature.

When the second battle for Armageddon was going on the Grand Master of the Legio Metalica (Iron Skulls) Titan Legion died (thought by all to be an assassination, and Princeps Senioris Kurt Mannheim held temporary command of the legion. By Imperial Law it was his duty to obey the Overlord (which was the traitorous Herman Von Strab. Von Strab refused to listen to Mannheims advice on how to defeat the massive ork invasion.

So, unable to betray his oath of Loyalty to the Emperor, he put on his best dress uniform, said goodbye to his wife and children, and climbed into his Titan Steel Hammer to lead his battle groups to certain destruction.

The Legion fought hard and the steel hammer accounted for three Ork Gargants before it was crippled. Even then Mannheim steered his machine right into the center of the Ork forces before it's reactor melted down....

The titan legion was almost completely destroyed that day and took no further part in the second battle for Armageddon.

To me, the fact that he knew he was going to die, yet faced it with courage, knowing that he had to protect his family and his fellow man at any cost, shows the greatest love a person can have for another.

+1 to you, good sir

I think agape is the greatest form of love. Just my opinion

**CthuluIsSpy**

Melissia wrote:

And of course, Slaanesh represents the "eros" and "ludus" concepts of love. Keep in mind that there's many concepts of love.

wikipedia wrote:Eros – a passionate physical and emotional love based on aesthetic enjoyment; stereotype of romantic love
Ludus – a love that is played as a game or sport; conquest; may have multiple partners at once
Storge – an affectionate love that slowly develops from friendship, based on similarity (kindred to Philia)
Pragma – love that is driven by the head, not the heart; undemonstrative
Mania – obsessive love; experience great emotional highs and lows; very possessive and often jealous lovers
Agape – selfless altruistic love

Eros also refers to appreciation of the arts, I take it? That's what "aesthetic enjoyment" seems to mean.

**Tyranid Horde**

There was some love in Dead Men Walking aswell IIRC, but I may be mixing that up with Helsreach.

**Kaldor**

Well, I'm sure love and passion and all those other human emotions still exist in the 41st Millennium. However, we only read about love, passion and those other human emotions in character driven stories. Or rather, stories which feature realistic and complex characters, and focus on their own personal conflicts and trials.

40K literature almost exclusively eschews character driven narratives, instead focusing on bolter-porn and world/setting building, and the characters that we are presented with are usually poorly constructed and extremely flat. There's no room for passion and love in a one dimensional character, and barring a few notable exceptions, that's all we get from the Black Library.

It's kind of a shame. I really think some love in the setting would highlight the ugly grimdark nature of it very well.

**ENOZONE**

coolbrobunny wrote:

I think agape is the greatest form of love. Just my opinion

For your children and comrades perhaps.

Anyway, is there an example of a Romantic War? One like Helen of Troy?

**Compel**

I wouldn't imagine so. I mean, sure one imperial governor could declare war on another imperial governor over a woman.

But I'm pretty sure what would happen next. The Adeptus Arbites would knock down the doors to both palaces, declare both governors to 'be found wanting' then execute them and their immediate families just to make sure it doesn't happen again.

**Jayo'r**

The nids love us

**Admiral Valerian**

AnomanderRake wrote:
Eldar/human is just silly (very close to bestiality in the Eldar mind)

Personally, I would think that Humans might find Eldar handsome/beautiful, in an alien, forbidden, manner. Likewise, Eldar may find Humans handsome/beautiful, but in a primitive, unrefined, way. I don't think they actually consider Humans as animals, more like very immature and ignorant children. 'cept the Emperor - best not to challenge him directly, and show the appropriate respect.

EDIT: Oh, and Dark Eldar. They're crazy enough to try Human-Eldar, though I doubt love of any kind is involved. And considering the nightmare conditions of Commoragh, distraught Human and Eldar slaves might just hope to find comfort in each other...

**Veteran Sergeant**

There is love. But you can't make it. Because there is only war.

**Nevie**

Admiral Valerian wrote:
Melissia wrote:
Admiral Valerian wrote:
Melissia wrote:
There have been many humans who have successfully written characters with inhuman mindsets.

Oh? Care to elaborate? The only one I know of is H.P. Lovecraft, and his non-Human characters are less inscrutable and more mind-screwing.
The webcomic Flaky Pastry (the goblins, biologically, do not feel a conscience like we do, amongst other mental differences; one goblin has a conscience magically forced upon her, and becomes emotionally crippled as a result) comes to mind, same with Freefall (Sam Starfall thinks on a level quite different from ours, having evolved from a scavenger species). As does the game Kingdoms of Amalur (the fae) or Sheogorath from the Elder Scrolls. White Wolf tried its best to instill this in the Old World of Darkness setting for any supernatural creatures, although many players ignored it.

Hell, even 40k did it right a few times. The Ork comic is a great example of inhuman thinking, and certainly the Tau books have tried to describe them this way as well.

Come to think of it, the Reapers from Mass Effect come close; while you can understand the reasons behind the Cycle of Extinction, the logic behind it is inhuman in its own way.

EDIT: And the Gravemind - everyone thinks its bad, and from our point of view its goals are undesirable, but as far as its concerned, everything and everyone it infects simply becomes part of a greater whole.

Goblin Corps. It follows the mindset of an Evil hitsquad. Only thing that bothers me is the Troll is described as a DnD Gnoll. Good book though.

**Spacecat**

I'd like to mention the Ciaphas Cain novels. Not only are they a tongue-in-cheek look at the 40k universe. But there is definite love between Cain and inquisitor Amberlee Vail, t'was almost love at first sight on the commissar's part, in fact.
Admittedly, they both keep a thick veneer of professionalism and 'duty' so from our point of view they act more like 'friends with benefits'. But there's much more to it than that, really. Fun books.

Also, another novel by the same author, 'Scourge the Heretic', happens to follow a diverse group of inquisitors, including a very sexy assassin of redemptionist faith (views lust as a sin) who gets a crush on one of the inquisitor's aides - and has trouble realizing and handling it. That's a definite character-driven novel, for those who like to get out of 'bolter-porn'

**Unyielding Hunger**

CthuluIsSpy wrote:
Melissia wrote:

And of course, Slaanesh represents the "eros" and "ludus" concepts of love. Keep in mind that there's many concepts of love.

wikipedia wrote:Eros – a passionate physical and emotional love based on aesthetic enjoyment; stereotype of romantic love
Ludus – a love that is played as a game or sport; conquest; may have multiple partners at once
Storge – an affectionate love that slowly develops from friendship, based on similarity (kindred to Philia)
Pragma – love that is driven by the head, not the heart; undemonstrative
Mania – obsessive love; experience great emotional highs and lows; very possessive and often jealous lovers
Agape – selfless altruistic love

Eros also refers to appreciation of the arts, I take it? That's what "aesthetic enjoyment" seems to mean.

Actually, I think you may be off on this. Think skin deep...or the general obsession of Noise Marines or the Emperor's Children. Remember the first noise marines with their beautiful garish paint jobs and guit...I mean sonic blasters of ro...I mean just sonic blasters? Those guys loved their own aescthetic look.

**DarkCorsair**

Mechanicum features a relationship between Dalia and that dude who's name starts with a C.

**Warp Angels**

Melissia wrote:

Come to think of it, the Reapers from Mass Effect come close; while you can understand the reasons behind the Cycle of Extinction, the logic behind it is inhuman in its own way.

EDIT: And the Gravemind - everyone thinks its bad, and from our point of view its goals are undesirable, but as far as its concerned, everything and everyone it infects simply becomes part of a greater whole.

Mass effect and Halo = Awesome games

**Niiai**

The Tau loves all citicents!

Tyranids wanne hug you.

Slanesh has some love to share.

Dark Eldars love to mutch.

Eldar don't dare to love.

Ork love makes fungus in your lokal comunaty.

Space Marines could have some Greek brother love (if GW dared go gay i supose)

Dan Abnet has some love in some of his books.

Also, the necron - IG book has a love triangel that is a bit rubbish.

**AegisGrimm**

Well, I'm sure love and passion and all those other human emotions still exist in the 41st Millennium. However, we only read about love, passion and those other human emotions in character driven stories. Or rather, stories which feature realistic and complex characters, and focus on their own personal conflicts and trials.

40K literature almost exclusively eschews character driven narratives, instead focusing on bolter-porn and world/setting building, and the characters that we are presented with are usually poorly constructed and extremely flat. There's no room for passion and love in a one dimensional character, and barring a few notable exceptions, that's all we get from the Black Library.

It's kind of a shame. I really think some love in the setting would highlight the ugly grimdark nature of it very well.

That's precisely why I like it in the Eisenhorn books, where I think it's very clear that Eisenhorn and Bequin love each other as best they can.

**Manchu**

Melissia wrote:
Sisters of Battle are meant to be driven by Agape for the Emperor and the Imperium, while many of the more tyrannical rulers of 40k are driven by manic feelings, for example.

Excellent point! One might also note that SM are largely driven by the concept of storge. In fact, the most crucial event of the 40k setting is all about storge. As for romantic love, it comes up from time to time. In Dead Men Walking the protagonist is in love with the Planetary Governor's daughter and his feelings play a significant role in his story if not necessarily the fate of that planet.

I always wondered why none of the Primarchs ever managed to find a significant other in their formative years.

**Harriticus**

Manchu wrote:

I always wondered why none of the Primarchs ever managed to find a significant other in their formative years.

First Heretic addresses this somewhat from Lorgar's perspective at least. That the Emepror basically forced them to be nothing but tools of war and never allowed for them to develop into anything else that wasn't a death machine. My guess is if any of the Primarchs got a significant other the Emperor would have had Guilliman/Custodes show up to put a bolt in their head, or at least had them have an "accident" while in transit to the Warp.

**Manchu**

That seems likely (especially given Angron's situation) but I am talking about before the Primarchs were reunited with the Emperor. Many of them ruled as kings of their adoptive homeworlds yet none seem to have had queens or consorts.

**Kaldor**

Manchu wrote:
That seems likely (especially given Angron's situation) but I am talking about before the Primarchs were reunited with the Emperor. Many of them ruled as kings of their adoptive homeworlds yet none seem to have had queens or consorts.

Because girls are icky.

**Kovnik Obama**

Unyielding Hunger wrote:
CthuluIsSpy wrote:
Melissia wrote:

And of course, Slaanesh represents the "eros" and "ludus" concepts of love. Keep in mind that there's many concepts of love.

wikipedia wrote:Eros – a passionate physical and emotional love based on aesthetic enjoyment; stereotype of romantic love
Ludus – a love that is played as a game or sport; conquest; may have multiple partners at once
Storge – an affectionate love that slowly develops from friendship, based on similarity (kindred to Philia)
Pragma – love that is driven by the head, not the heart; undemonstrative
Mania – obsessive love; experience great emotional highs and lows; very possessive and often jealous lovers
Agape – selfless altruistic love

Eros also refers to appreciation of the arts, I take it? That's what "aesthetic enjoyment" seems to mean.

Actually, I think you may be off on this. Think skin deep...or the general obsession of Noise Marines or the Emperor's Children. Remember the first noise marines with their beautiful garish paint jobs and guit...I mean sonic blasters of ro...I mean just sonic blasters? Those guys loved their own aescthetic look.

He is actually right.

Aesthetics (also spelled æsthetics) is a branch of philosophy dealing with the nature of art, beauty, and taste, with the creation and appreciation of beauty.[1][2] It is more scientifically defined as the study of sensory or sensori-emotional values, sometimes called judgments of sentiment and taste.

**Harriticus**

Manchu wrote:
That seems likely (especially given Angron's situation) but I am talking about before the Primarchs were reunited with the Emperor. Many of them ruled as kings of their adoptive homeworlds yet none seem to have had queens or consorts.

Yeah, that's just GW being stupid and written by game designers. Had guys like ADB or even Abnett written the Primarchs backgrounds we would have seem love interests in there. Especially from the likes of ones with more human emotion like Fulgrim, Lorgar, Sanguinius, Russ, even Horus, and so on. Though suffice to say I think maniacs like Kurze and Angron wouldn't have cared about love even if they got a real writing team at GW.....

And since Jaghatai's past is a ripoff of Genghis Khan's I imagine he would have gotten in bed with quite a few ladies and 25% of the current inhabitants of Mundus Planus can trace their genetic lineage to him.

GW's treatment on love is pretty much how Gulliman would have reacted to a Primarch with a wife in any regard.

**amudkipz**

It may seem strange but I really thought Patience Kys and Sholto Unwerth would have stuck up a relationship. Abnett does a good job on the topic in his books. I couldn't imagine the primarchs being capable of romantic love even Fulgrim, they are so different from the average human.

**Admiral Valerian**

Manchu wrote:

I always wondered why none of the Primarchs ever managed to find a significant other in their formative years.

What makes you think they didn't? For all we know, they did. Russ in particular springs to mind

**Pilau Rice**

Perhaps a reason why Asartes themselves don't seem to be attracted to the ladies, maybe it's just ingrained in their psyches? A warrior should not have the distraction of worrying about whether the dishes have been done or if her in doors is still sulking after you forgot your anniversary and held a meeting on battle tactics.

I would say that Slaanesh itself is very mania. He will have you love no other and demand that you love him and woe betide the day that you turn from his light. He is indulgent but can be wrathful like no other.

**Admiral Valerian**

Pilau Rice wrote:
Perhaps a reason why Asartes themselves don't seem to be attracted to the ladies, maybe it's just ingrained in their psyches?

The Space Wolves are once again jump to my mind as an exception, for some reason...