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 ScootyPuffJunior wrote:
He's no less important than any other famous person that has given commencement speeches.

I never said no entertainer has given a commencement speech, but from talking to students over the years they tend to want someone who has done more. Can't ay about Andy Samberg, but Patton Oswalt and Amy Poehler are both very involved in other issues such as Amy Peohler's Smart Girls. Maher's mainly known for being a smug donkey-cave to people of faith and those that have animal companions.

The entire concept of commencement speakers is utterly stupid to being with. Have the President/Dean give a 5 minute speech, the valedictorian give a stupid 10 minute speech and PASS OUT THE SHEEPSKINS!

 Frazzled wrote:
The entire concept of commencement speakers is utterly stupid to being with. Have the President/Dean give a 5 minute speech, the valedictorian give a stupid 10 minute speech and PASS OUT THE SHEEPSKINS!

I kinda agree. I don't even remember who gave the commencement speech at my undergrad ceremony. What I do remember was the fellow was long winded and that the June sun was murder while wearing a black cap and gown.

 Shadow Captain Edithae wrote:

 Da Boss wrote:
Well, there's the argument to be made that many islamic countries were undergoing a sort of liberalisation in the 20th century, but the failure of especially Arab states to deal effectively with Israel lead to the rise of extremism.

Define "deal with" ? My impression is that the Islamic world pretty unanimously wishes Israel did not exist and wants the land to revert to Muslim control. (and thats putting it politely).

I would also nitpick your "Irish terrorism" to "british/irish terrorism" because I'm a bollocks.

If by British terrorism you mean the Ulster Unionist paramilitary groups, then yes.

Yeah, that's what I mean by "deal with". I mean, I don't agree with wiping out Israel, but neither do I think Israel should have been created. It's there now, and the effect on the region is obvious, and the people in the surrounding nations certainly weren't happy with their more secular leaning leader's attempts to deal with the situation. Creating a nation state out of thin air and importing a whole lot of people to live there tends to cause problems- see aforementioned Irish Troubles (arguable minus the "nation state" bit, as it wasn't as popular back then).

As for Ulster Unionist paramilitary groups, well, of course I meant them. I'll leave it there though, since I'm just being a bit of a prick about it

 Da Boss wrote:

 Shadow Captain Edithae wrote:

 Da Boss wrote:
Well, there's the argument to be made that many islamic countries were undergoing a sort of liberalisation in the 20th century, but the failure of especially Arab states to deal effectively with Israel lead to the rise of extremism.

Define "deal with" ? My impression is that the Islamic world pretty unanimously wishes Israel did not exist and wants the land to revert to Muslim control. (and thats putting it politely).

I would also nitpick your "Irish terrorism" to "british/irish terrorism" because I'm a bollocks.

If by British terrorism you mean the Ulster Unionist paramilitary groups, then yes.

Yeah, that's what I mean by "deal with". I mean, I don't agree with wiping out Israel, but neither do I think Israel should have been created.

Well, I do. The creation of Israel was hardly ideal and could have been handled better, and its actions over the last 6 decades have been far from innocent (though the surrounding Muslim nations behaved far worse).

But when the British Mandate ended, the region erupted into civil war. Jews and Muslims were at each others throats. As I understand it, partitioning the region into Jewish and Muslim states was the only fair compromise to prevent further bloodshed. And the land the Jews got was dwarfed by the land the various Muslim people's of the region got.

Palestine was partitioned because these people were unwilling to peacefully coexist in one nation. The Jewish communities accepted the partition, but the Arabs did not, which led to yet more war.

It's there now, and the effect on the region is obvious, and the people in the surrounding nations certainly weren't happy with their more secular leaning leader's attempts to deal with the situation.

Meaning, their failure to destroy Israel and reconquer the land?

Creating a nation state out of thin air and importing a whole lot of people to live there tends to cause problems- see aforementioned Irish Troubles (arguable minus the "nation state" bit, as it wasn't as popular back then).

So does 2000 years of persecution worldwide, a campaign of genocide throughout the supposedly civilized European continent, and having no Jewish national state and homeland anywhere in the world to act as a safe refuge.

Ultimately I think the root cause of the Israel-Islam conflict is Islam's intolerance towards Judaism, and the desire of Muslims to "own" the Holy Land. (which, lets face it, is extremely important to all three Abrahamic religions and has been a nexus of religious conflict for 2000 years). Ideally the region should be one big secular country run for the benefit of all, but thats not possible because...Islam. And sometimes Jewish extremism. But mostly Islam.


Anyway, thats my position, and I respect your position, so lets leave it at that and not derail the thread further.

As for Ulster Unionist paramilitary groups, well, of course I meant them. I'll leave it there though, since I'm just being a bit of a prick about it

Of all your remarks, I'd say that was the most innocuous.

 DarkTraveler777 wrote:

 Frazzled wrote:
The entire concept of commencement speakers is utterly stupid to being with. Have the President/Dean give a 5 minute speech, the valedictorian give a stupid 10 minute speech and PASS OUT THE SHEEPSKINS!

I kinda agree. I don't even remember who gave the commencement speech at my undergrad ceremony. What I do remember was the fellow was long winded and that the June sun was murder while wearing a black cap and gown.

Should of tryed it at mine..... omg it was -27 half the class was male... by the end of the speech there was only females and males that went through reverse puberty

 Shadow Captain Edithae wrote:

So does 2000 years of persecution worldwide, a campaign of genocide throughout the supposedly civilized European continent, and having no Jewish national state and homeland anywhere in the world to act as a safe refuge.

Ultimately I think the root cause of the Israel-Islam conflict is Islam's intolerance towards Judaism, and the desire of Muslims to "own" the Holy Land. (which, lets face it, is extremely important to all three Abrahamic religions and has been a nexus of religious conflict for 2000 years). Ideally the region should be one big secular country run for the benefit of all, but thats not possible because...Islam.

Point 1.... So, when are we going to carve Kurdistan out of whatever it's gonna come from?


Point 2, I agree with you.... Although, Israel has shown itself more and more militarily capable, I mean, look at the 6 days war or whatever it was... When Israel took on Egypt, Syria and Jordan, with backing from other countries such as Saudi Arabia and Iraq (based on info from the ever reliable Wikipedia), and whooped the gak out of them in less than a week. Really, I'm agreeing with you in that there are certain religions that are far, far less tolerant of others' religions, and it's mainstream to hold those beliefs, even if certain "leaders" will publicly say this isn't the case.

 Ensis Ferrae wrote:

 Shadow Captain Edithae wrote:

So does 2000 years of persecution worldwide, a campaign of genocide throughout the supposedly civilized European continent, and having no Jewish national state and homeland anywhere in the world to act as a safe refuge.

Ultimately I think the root cause of the Israel-Islam conflict is Islam's intolerance towards Judaism, and the desire of Muslims to "own" the Holy Land. (which, lets face it, is extremely important to all three Abrahamic religions and has been a nexus of religious conflict for 2000 years). Ideally the region should be one big secular country run for the benefit of all, but thats not possible because...Islam.

Point 1.... So, when are we going to carve Kurdistan out of whatever it's gonna come from?

What, they haven't already done it? My impression is that its already a semi autonomous region, albeit unrecognized.

Point 2, I agree with you.... Although, Israel has shown itself more and more militarily capable, I mean, look at the 6 days war or whatever it was... When Israel took on Egypt, Syria and Jordan, with backing from other countries such as Saudi Arabia and Iraq (based on info from the ever reliable Wikipedia), and whooped the gak out of them in less than a week. Really, I'm agreeing with you in that there are certain religions that are far, far less tolerant of others' religions, and it's mainstream to hold those beliefs, even if certain "leaders" will publicly say this isn't the case.

You just need to watch Palestinian and other Arab national childrens' TV shows to gauge their attitude towards Judaism...It ain't pretty.

 Frazzled wrote:
The entire concept of commencement speakers is utterly stupid to being with. Have the President/Dean give a 5 minute speech, the valedictorian give a stupid 10 minute speech and PASS OUT THE SHEEPSKINS!

Yeah, I have to agree. No one's going to remember what was said, and even if they did it's surely been said before, and better, by someone else anyway.

Bill Maher is the only man brave enough to speak the truth.
Well him and Jon Stewart.

 Pyeatt wrote:
Bill Maher is the only man brave enough to speak the truth.
Well him and Jon Stewart.

The difference is all in delivery... And that one of them is "brave" enough to take on, and prove someone like Bill O'Reilly wrong

Oh man... epic interview. Not sure if I'm even misusing "Epic". And then the debate? BS Mountain? Priceless.

Someone just need to tell them the reality of going out in the world now
No sugar coating
No tap dancing
No pep talk
No feel good talk

Just blunt reality check for that individual competition is sitting in front, behind, left and right of him/her.

 Jihadin wrote:
Someone just need to tell them the reality of going out in the world now
No sugar coating
No tap dancing
No pep talk
No feel good talk

Just blunt reality check for that individual competition is sitting in front, behind, left and right of him/her.

Which is basically Bill Maher, in a nutshell

 Ensis Ferrae wrote:

 Jihadin wrote:
Someone just need to tell them the reality of going out in the world now
No sugar coating
No tap dancing
No pep talk
No feel good talk

Just blunt reality check for that individual competition is sitting in front, behind, left and right of him/her.

Which is basically Bill Maher, in a nutshell

Let me do it. I have my own professional style of making them fear for their career before it even begin.

 cincydooley wrote:

 whembly wrote:
Don't these Berkeley student's know they're proving Maher's point?

But Whembly!

Diversity! Equality! Things!

That tickticks me off so much. This campus promotes free speech, but only if it is good free speech. I can't wait to go into the Racist Halloween seminar and point how but hurt they are, then get called racist

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
This campus promotes free speech, but only if it is good free speech.

That applies to a LOT of colleges/universities across the land.

The Hypocrisy though. The signs i see that say
"Report Hate speech"

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
The Hypocrisy though. The signs i see that say
"Report Hate speech"

There's nothing stopping you from speaking out against it if it bothers you.

Right? Wrong? I'm just happy to see Maher lose work.

Jihadin wrote:Let me do it. I have my own professional style of making them fear for their career before it even begin.

I would prefer you do it.

Jimsolo wrote:Right? Wrong? I'm just happy to see Maher lose work.

Yah. Honestly I'm with Frazzled that I don't think commencement speeches are needed, and this is really done more for attention, but we have to talk about something and I find him insufferable.

Can someone explain all the Bill Maher hate to me? I find the guy rather hilarious. Granted, I don't take his political views seriously, because I think taking advice from comedians is foolish, but I think he raises some funny points and is brash when some comedians shy away from these issues.

 Ouze wrote:
Bill Maher is an insufferable human being regardless of what the topic is, that seems adequate enough to drop him from any speaking engagement regardless of the topic.

Couldn't agree more. Just seeing his face gets on my nerves because i know he is going to say something that just rubs me the wrong way. Worst part is, he knows he does that and he does it on purpose. There's a jerk off that lives in my neighborhood that is just like that, as soon as the bar codes he drives around on his Harley and revs the crap out of it until the police shows up. Ugh, people like that can fall off the flat side of the planet.

 DarkTraveler777 wrote:

 Frazzled wrote:
The entire concept of commencement speakers is utterly stupid to being with. Have the President/Dean give a 5 minute speech, the valedictorian give a stupid 10 minute speech and PASS OUT THE SHEEPSKINS!

I kinda agree. I don't even remember who gave the commencement speech at my undergrad ceremony. What I do remember was the fellow was long winded and that the June sun was murder while wearing a black cap and gown.

Exactly. Now that I am a parent in the stands this is doubly stupid. No one remembers you guys. Just make it short and move on.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Pyeatt wrote:
Bill Maher is the only man brave enough to speak the truth.
Well him and Jon Stewart.

You're right. The Chinese guy with the briefcase who stood in front of the line of Chinese tanks (and was later executed) wasn't brave at all.
You really should expand your horizons a little.



Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Hordini wrote:

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
The Hypocrisy though. The signs i see that say
"Report Hate speech"

There's nothing stopping you from speaking out against it if it bothers you.

Well, not if he no longer wants to be there.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 jreilly89 wrote:
Can someone explain all the Bill Maher hate to me? I find the guy rather hilarious. Granted, I don't take his political views seriously, because I think taking advice from comedians is foolish, but I think he raises some funny points and is brash when some comedians shy away from these issues.

Well to be concise, he's what we call a Class One head.

 Frazzled wrote:

You're right. The Chinese guy with the briefcase who stood in front of the line of Chinese tanks (and was later executed) wasn't brave at all.
You really should expand your horizons a little.

Source? As far as I'm aware he's still unidentified.

 Frazzled wrote:

 Hordini wrote:

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
The Hypocrisy though. The signs i see that say
"Report Hate speech"

There's nothing stopping you from speaking out against it if it bothers you.

Well, not if he no longer wants to be there.

It takes a lot more to get kicked out of university than that.

Not kicked out, driven out. OK you're right more likely ostracized from the community.

Maybe put up on charges for "hate crimes" by the local disciplinary board for violating speech codes.

 Ahtman wrote:

I never said no entertainer has given a commencement speech, but from talking to students over the years they tend to want someone who has done more. Can't ay about Andy Samberg, but Patton Oswalt and Amy Poehler are both very involved in other issues such as Amy Peohler's Smart Girls. Maher's mainly known for being a smug donkey-cave to people of faith and those that have animal companions.

Additionally, Patton Oswalt is a famous, and successful alumnus of the high school where he gave the commencement speech; something is generally quite important at that level.

 jreilly89 wrote:
Can someone explain all the Bill Maher hate to me? I find the guy rather hilarious. Granted, I don't take his political views seriously, because I think taking advice from comedians is foolish, but I think he raises some funny points and is brash when some comedians shy away from these issues.

Some people don't like him because he does not respect a few dying taboos. In this case it's the taboo against criticizing people's religious ideas and beliefs. On top of that, he does so frequently through mockery, so alot of times his ideas don't get through due to the manner in which they are expressed.

 Ahtman wrote:
Maher's mainly known for being a smug donkey-cave to people of faith and those that have animal companions.

I am unfamiliar with his stance on animal companions. Any links or additional information you can provide? All I have been able to locate is Maher's support of PETA.