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Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut







To the OP, complaining about made up foreign language terms:

Remind me again what the difference between a Maulerfiend, Forgefiend, and Helldrake is? Or the difference between a Terminator, Obliterator, Havoc, Raptor, ...

   
Made in gb
Regular Dakkanaut




 solkan wrote:
To the OP, complaining about made up foreign language terms:

Remind me again what the difference between a Maulerfiend, Forgefiend, and Helldrake is? Or the difference between a Terminator, Obliterator, Havoc, Raptor, ...
Maulerfiend = Mauler (Close Combat) + Fiend (Daemon)
Forgefiend = Forge (Machine) + Fiend (Daemon)
Helldrake = Hell (Daemon) + Drake (Dragon)

Bork'an = Bork (Gibberish) + 'an (Gibberish)
XV109 Y'vahra = XV109 (alphanumeric identifier, so I guess it's a vehicle?) + Y'vahra (Gibberish)
Novokh = Novokh (Gibberish, vaguely Egyptian?)

I'm not sure why you think it's a good counterexample. Terminator and Obliterator are better arguments, but a) are actually English words, b) do have appropriate connotations, c) have enough history behind them that they'd get a pass – just like the one I give to the much, much less comprehensible Eldar Craftworlds who have been around since the 80s and 90s.

 Tyranid Horde wrote:
If you actually bothered to do a bit of research, the majority of Eldar Craftworld names stem from Irish (Gaeilge) and other Celtic derivatives which genre ripped for Elvish and in turn was put into 40k. Biel-Tan, Saim-hann, Lugganath all stem from Celtic festivals and you have other Craftworlds like Ibraesil named after a mythological island of the coast of Ireland. So they aren't just invented to sound quirky.
My dude, I've celebrated Samhain and Beltane and Luhnasad with my Scottish cousins. The origins of the names are not a secret, or especially relevant.

And hey, Nihilakh is clearly named for Nihilism, the philosophy that life is without objective value, and Mephrit is clearly named for Mephits, the D&D elementals who first showed up back in White Dwarf.

This doesn't make those names any catchier. The Nightbringer and Void Dragon remain memorable even after being retconned into irrelevance.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2019/05/02 09:30:28


 
   
Made in nz
Angry Blood Angel Assault marine



New Zealand

Do we need more NATO Imperium call signs for Xenos units.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/05/02 09:47:03


 
   
Made in gb
Tunneling Trygon






Carrickfergus, Northern Ireland

I'm just annoyed about the change of Tau to T'au and Eldar to Aeldari (and elves to aelves, though I don't care about Fantasy/AOS). Those aren't as bad as Astra Militarum, though.

Anyway, the vast majority of actual units and wargear are English words. The Y'vahra and R'varna are rare individual models and also edge cases; the standard unit is just called a Riptide Battlesuit. Everything from vehicles (Wave Serpent, Wraithlord, Crisis Battlesuit, Hammerhead) to Aspect Warriors (Striking Scorpions, etc) to their individual bits of equipment (deathspinners, pulse rifles, adrenal glands, etc). They're Tau Fire Warriors, not Tau V'ha'r'ohg'ghorii or whatever.

It's really just the proper names of things like factions and individual characters that matter, and most of them are quite memorable. It's not like the things with English names are always that descriptive; I think most of us know who Biel-Tan are, but how would you know what the White Scars are like from their name? Marneus Calgar as a name is no more descriptive than Jain Zar. It's only the rare names like the Swarmlord, or the awful Canis Wolfborn, that give an impression of who they are without any outside knowledge. Aside from having a name beginning with "kh", how would you know Khârn the Betrayer is a Khorne Chaos Marine and not, say, an Eldar mythological figure or a Word Bearer?

That said, the faux Egyptian of the Necrons is certainly overbearing, but that rot runs far deeper than just their names.

EDIT: Meanwhile, there's Mierce Miniatures, whose keyboard-smashing names are a huge barrier to me even browsing their catalogue.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/05/02 10:06:35


Sieg Zeon!

Selling TGG2! 
   
Made in us
Painting Within the Lines






Charlotte, NC

 Frozen Ocean wrote:
I'm just annoyed about the change of Tau to T'au and Eldar to Aeldari (and elves to aelves, though I don't care about Fantasy/AOS). Those aren't as bad as Astra Militarum, though.

Anyway, the vast majority of actual units and wargear are English words. The Y'vahra and R'varna are rare individual models and also edge cases; the standard unit is just called a Riptide Battlesuit. Everything from vehicles (Wave Serpent, Wraithlord, Crisis Battlesuit, Hammerhead) to Aspect Warriors (Striking Scorpions, etc) to their individual bits of equipment (deathspinners, pulse rifles, adrenal glands, etc). They're Tau Fire Warriors, not Tau V'ha'r'ohg'ghorii or whatever.

It's really just the proper names of things like factions and individual characters that matter, and most of them are quite memorable. It's not like the things with English names are always that descriptive; I think most of us know who Biel-Tan are, but how would you know what the White Scars are like from their name? Marneus Calgar as a name is no more descriptive than Jain Zar. It's only the rare names like the Swarmlord, or the awful Canis Wolfborn, that give an impression of who they are without any outside knowledge. Aside from having a name beginning with "kh", how would you know Khârn the Betrayer is a Khorne Chaos Marine and not, say, an Eldar mythological figure or a Word Bearer?

That said, the faux Egyptian of the Necrons is certainly overbearing, but that rot runs far deeper than just their names.

EDIT: Meanwhile, there's Mierce Miniatures, whose keyboard-smashing names are a huge barrier to me even browsing their catalogue.


My feeling is that the faction names changed due to the fifth Chaos God Khopiewrythe. Eldar, IG, and Dark Eldar arent within his purview, being names coined by someone else or combinations of common words.
Aeldari, Astra Militarum and Drukhari however are nice and original, and as such are smiled upon by his IPness.
As far as in faction naming conventions go, the named characters rarely all show up in one place, so 1 or 2 at a time should be relatively easy to remember, if not to pronounce.

For Commission information, PM or contact me at cataclysmstudio78@gmail.com
 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




Tygre wrote:
Do we need more NATO Imperium call signs for Xenos units.


Nah, we just need players who dont demand that everyone else adhere to an exquisitely lazy and colonialist attitude regarding differing languages and cultures.
   
Made in us
Stalwart Veteran Guard Sergeant





I don't think it's just made-up alien words or lack of appellations that's at fault here. Ork klans aren't very descriptive, either. Speed Freaks, yes. But what's a Goff? How is Death Skulls descriptive of what they do?

The only real difference between the Ork klans or Craftworlds and the new Tau septs or Necron dynasties is that the former category has been around for long enough that the various sub-factions have had things to do, while the new factions have not. We have countless examples of story elements small and large where Biel-tan or Flash Gitz have fought in their particular style. The Nihilakh dynasty, for example, just doesn't have the critical mass of familiarity.

It also doesn't help that both Tau and Necrons have relatively small player bases compared to the more established factions, so dividing them up into sub-factions means you see even fewer particular examples on the tabletop.

   
Made in gb
Regular Dakkanaut







 Ghaz wrote:
 Da-Rock wrote:
I think many are missing the OP's point....

It's a game for humans.....naming something that doesn't stick in any way is stupid for a gaming company....

"Hey Billy, what's that thing called?"....."It's a T'au R'varna with Shas'o Av'cado of the Bordorken Seepage clan or tribe er something.....I just call it Neil and Bob because that's what it does."

Being realistic with naming conventions follows political correctness in the, "Dumbass ideas for $800 Alex"

Which is the equivalent of saying Sauron from the Lord of the Rings should have been named Bob...


But it isn't because Sauron's name was told enough in the books and films, and is pronounceable whereas lots of the tau and necron names aren't. Now I'm not saying all English names for everything at all but if you make up a name then make it easy enough to pronounce and mention the name enough times AND STOP WITH THE RANDOM APOSTROPHES TO MAKE IT SOUND ALIEN.

I mean every one knows what all the main guard regiments look like as every time you see them their name looks like. But the only 2 tau colour schemes I know the name of are the farsight enclaves being red and the tau(original sect) being that weird brown camo. but the white colour schemes I bet almost no-one reading this can say what sect they came from, or what colour the Bor'kan's have (see how one apostrophe was necessary but having two in one word then makes the word look stupid). And this is because you simply are never told their names.

I'm dyslexic and thus am bad at spelling and grammar please don't remind me in comments to my posts.


The flesh tearers really like killing so much. They love doing it to people face's just they like doing it to their buddies as well. 
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




Halandri

Nihilakh seems close to Greek suffix 'laki' -little, as in souvlaki. A lot of languages designate an 'I' sound with the 'h' character. This leaves us with 'nihil' as in 'nihilism'. In combination 'little nothing'; quite fitting for anything tau 'empire'!


Edit: wait, or were they necrons? Oops

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/05/03 02:48:02


 
   
Made in ca
Stalwart Veteran Guard Sergeant




Necron is egyptian. All of the subfactions are based off real words

As for the Tau, who cares? Aliens shouldnt be understandable to us. You want aliens living on the other side of the galaxy to have names like "black dragon" or something?

123ply: Dataslate- 4/4/3/3/1/3/1/8/6+
Autopistol, Steel Extendo, Puma Hoodie
USRs: "Preferred Enemy: Xenos"
"Hatred: Xenos"
"Racist and Proud of it" - Gains fleshbane, rending, rage, counter-attack, and X2 strength and toughness when locked in combat with units not in the "Imperium of Man" faction.

Collection:
AM/IG - 122nd Terrax Guard: 2094/3000pts
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Made in gb
Freaky Flayed One





"All the alien factions have alien sounding names, which is completely different to all of the human factions and human-described factions, which have human names or human-assigned names..."
...yeah...
"...and that's terrible!"
??????
   
Made in us
Focused Fire Warrior




Sacratomato

 Phaeron Gukk wrote:
"All the alien factions have alien sounding names, which is completely different to all of the human factions and human-described factions, which have human names or human-assigned names..."
...yeah...
"...and that's terrible!"
??????


Well, I guess if we have aliens playing this game it would make sense to have alien sounding names made up by humans so that human players playing said game can feel alieny about human made up alien names..........

70% of all statistics are made up on the spot by 64% of the people that produce false statistics 54% of the time that they produce them. 
   
Made in au
Ork Boy Hangin' off a Trukk





Though somewhat lost the plot with the new buggies? ‘Boomdakka Snazzwagon’? Really?


Seems like the Ork Meks have branched off into a marketing department, making sure everything has a copyright-able name just in case those imperial boyz want to nick their stuff.
   
Made in jp
Longtime Dakkanaut





RevlidRas wrote:
 solkan wrote:
To the OP, complaining about made up foreign language terms:

Remind me again what the difference between a Maulerfiend, Forgefiend, and Helldrake is? Or the difference between a Terminator, Obliterator, Havoc, Raptor, ...
Maulerfiend = Mauler (Close Combat) + Fiend (Daemon)
Forgefiend = Forge (Machine) + Fiend (Daemon)
Helldrake = Hell (Daemon) + Drake (Dragon)

Bork'an = Bork (Gibberish) + 'an (Gibberish)
XV109 Y'vahra = XV109 (alphanumeric identifier, so I guess it's a vehicle?) + Y'vahra (Gibberish)
Novokh = Novokh (Gibberish, vaguely Egyptian?)

I'm not sure why you think it's a good counterexample. Terminator and Obliterator are better arguments, but a) are actually English words, b) do have appropriate connotations, c) have enough history behind them that they'd get a pass – just like the one I give to the much, much less comprehensible Eldar Craftworlds who have been around since the 80s and 90s.

 Tyranid Horde wrote:
If you actually bothered to do a bit of research, the majority of Eldar Craftworld names stem from Irish (Gaeilge) and other Celtic derivatives which genre ripped for Elvish and in turn was put into 40k. Biel-Tan, Saim-hann, Lugganath all stem from Celtic festivals and you have other Craftworlds like Ibraesil named after a mythological island of the coast of Ireland. So they aren't just invented to sound quirky.
My dude, I've celebrated Samhain and Beltane and Luhnasad with my Scottish cousins. The origins of the names are not a secret, or especially relevant.

And hey, Nihilakh is clearly named for Nihilism, the philosophy that life is without objective value, and Mephrit is clearly named for Mephits, the D&D elementals who first showed up back in White Dwarf.

This doesn't make those names any catchier. The Nightbringer and Void Dragon remain memorable even after being retconned into irrelevance.


What's a Beijing?

How discriptive is London, or Paris?

How about a Tokyo, or a Harare?

Let's look at vehicles. How descriptive of the intended job is an Abrams? Why say Samurai when you could say Japanese Fighty Guy? Or Onna-Bushi instead of lady fighting guy? My FLGS is called Off the Wall, and it certainly isn't.

But calling a city Iyanden, a squad leader a Shas'o (or whatever), or a mini-mech suit a Centurion doesn't do it for you?

Edit: Just reread my post and I want to be clear: I'm not accusing you of being racist or anything.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/05/03 05:11:24


 
   
Made in ca
Longtime Dakkanaut




@Mmmpi

The irony is that Onna-Bushi quite literally translate to warrior-wife or lady of war. As for samurai, if I'm not mistaken, would translate to servant or duty-bound. Knight would translate to rider, etc. Names can be very stupid or very elaborate. It's logical that Tau names should be in Tau and that their translation are bit clunky like storm surge (I guess a better translation would be sudden storm while riptide would probably translate to rogue wave). It's the same thing for all other alien.
   
Made in jp
Longtime Dakkanaut





But it doesn't in English, which is my point.
   
Made in gb
Regular Dakkanaut




 Mmmpi wrote:

Edit: Just reread my post and I want to be clear: I'm not accusing you of being racist or anything.
That's fine, but it actually brings up a good point that I'll run with.

Warhammer Fantasy was a world based on our own, with its own languages and cultures that we know for a fact existed and in most cases were near-identical to our own. Yet despite this The Empire's army book featured Knights, Riflemen, and Halberdiers, not Ritter, Schütze, and Hellebardier. Bretonnia fielded Grail Knights and Peasants, not Le Chevalier Graal and Paysans. Lizardmen had Saurus Warriors, not Cuetzpali Nahuatl. Even within wholly fictional languages, Dwarfs had Longbeards, not Gnol-Tromm, and High Elves had Silver Helms, not Ithiltaen.

Why do you suppose that was?
   
Made in jp
Longtime Dakkanaut





@RevlidRas

Because Warhammer Fantasy was based on 1980's fiction, and never got the same several fluff revisions. AoS does however do just what you suggest.

Furthermore, in the fluff for many of the non-human units do call their units by non-human names.
   
Made in gb
Tunneling Trygon






Carrickfergus, Northern Ireland

RevlidRas wrote:
 Mmmpi wrote:

Edit: Just reread my post and I want to be clear: I'm not accusing you of being racist or anything.
That's fine, but it actually brings up a good point that I'll run with.

Warhammer Fantasy was a world based on our own, with its own languages and cultures that we know for a fact existed and in most cases were near-identical to our own. Yet despite this The Empire's army book featured Knights, Riflemen, and Halberdiers, not Ritter, Schütze, and Hellebardier. Bretonnia fielded Grail Knights and Peasants, not Le Chevalier Graal and Paysans. Lizardmen had Saurus Warriors, not Cuetzpali Nahuatl. Even within wholly fictional languages, Dwarfs had Longbeards, not Gnol-Tromm, and High Elves had Silver Helms, not Ithiltaen.

Why do you suppose that was?


But again, the vast, vast majority of units in 40k have English names, alien or not. The only reason nobody knows who Bor'kan is is because they're so minor. Tau and Necron subfactions are often nothing more than a paint scheme with a very small bit of history attached. Regardless if they were called Bor'kan or "White Fighters" or something, you'd have no idea who or what they were based on the name, just the same as how nobody would know who the White Scars were if all they had was the name. As far as the depth of their lore goes, Bor'kan are basically just "Tau, but white". There's very little reason for you to know who they are anyway, just like there's very little reason for you to know who the Brimlock Dragoons or the Gate Keepers are, though note that the Brimlock Dragoons follow the Imperial Guard tradition of having their planet's name (a made-up word) in their name. Most Tau Septs have no distinguishing features aside from their colour scheme and name.
   
Made in us
Been Around the Block




 Frozen Ocean wrote:
RevlidRas wrote:
 Mmmpi wrote:

Edit: Just reread my post and I want to be clear: I'm not accusing you of being racist or anything.
That's fine, but it actually brings up a good point that I'll run with.

Warhammer Fantasy was a world based on our own, with its own languages and cultures that we know for a fact existed and in most cases were near-identical to our own. Yet despite this The Empire's army book featured Knights, Riflemen, and Halberdiers, not Ritter, Schütze, and Hellebardier. Bretonnia fielded Grail Knights and Peasants, not Le Chevalier Graal and Paysans. Lizardmen had Saurus Warriors, not Cuetzpali Nahuatl. Even within wholly fictional languages, Dwarfs had Longbeards, not Gnol-Tromm, and High Elves had Silver Helms, not Ithiltaen.

Why do you suppose that was?


But again, the vast, vast majority of units in 40k have English names, alien or not. The only reason nobody knows who Bor'kan is is because they're so minor. Tau and Necron subfactions are often nothing more than a paint scheme with a very small bit of history attached. Regardless if they were called Bor'kan or "White Fighters" or something, you'd have no idea who or what they were based on the name, just the same as how nobody would know who the White Scars were if all they had was the name. As far as the depth of their lore goes, Bor'kan are basically just "Tau, but white". There's very little reason for you to know who they are anyway, just like there's very little reason for you to know who the Brimlock Dragoons or the Gate Keepers are, though note that the Brimlock Dragoons follow the Imperial Guard tradition of having their planet's name (a made-up word) in their name. Most Tau Septs have no distinguishing features aside from their colour scheme and name.


You just proved his point though, Brimlock Dragoons gives off at least a certain connotation. I would have thought skitarii at first, with arquebus, but the point still stands. It evokes an imagine.

Bor'kan, Lisodan, Ovokotoh, whatever are just made up words that sound vaguely foreign, and evoke no real meaning or message to the player.

Say what you will about a slippery bilepiper, but it gives a much better description than a Y'havra.

Battle Sister - nun who fights
Space Marine - Marine in space
Black Templar - Unholy Holy Warrior
White Scars - Bright Battledamage, evoking a feeling of warriors and toughness
Fire Warrior - what's on the tin
Phoenix Lord, Succubus, Medusa, Harlequins, Aspect Warrior, etc all are names that evoke some kind of meaning or description or feeling

Y'havra or Mephrit/Novokh/etc don't and are basically gibberish for gibberish sake.

It's fine, good in fact, if the aliens refer to eachother by their own names, but as someone who doesn't speak T'au, it's absolutely worthless to me if they are all named in T'au. I don't know what a Shavo:'si is or a Shav'osa, but I do know what a Tau Firewarrior Squad Leader or a Fire Warrior Sargeant would be.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/05/03 11:25:45


 
   
Made in ie
Norn Queen






Dublin, Ireland

I'm just annoyed about the change of Tau to T'au


I literally did not notice this until now

Dman137 wrote:
goobs is all you guys will ever be

By 1-irt: Still as long as Hissy keeps showing up this is one of the most entertaining threads ever.

"Feelin' goods, good enough". 
   
Made in ca
Cog in the Machine




Ottawa, Canada

I feel like this is a solution looking for a problem.

The T'au Septs and Necron Dynasties are proper nouns, so are not exactly directly translatable.

This is a game where we need to remember a large variety of rules and statlines. Remembering a few extra names shouldn't be this big of an issue.

- 2500 | - 5000 | Krieg - 2000 | - 1250 | - 2000
30k: Alpha Legion - 3000 | - 2500 | Blackshields: - 1000 
   
Made in gb
Tunneling Trygon






Carrickfergus, Northern Ireland

Pleasestop wrote:

You just proved his point though, Brimlock Dragoons gives off at least a certain connotation. I would have thought skitarii at first, with arquebus, but the point still stands. It evokes an imagine.

Bor'kan, Lisodan, Ovokotoh, whatever are just made up words that sound vaguely foreign, and evoke no real meaning or message to the player.

Say what you will about a slippery bilepiper, but it gives a much better description than a Y'havra.

Battle Sister - nun who fights
Space Marine - Marine in space
Black Templar - Unholy Holy Warrior
White Scars - Bright Battledamage, evoking a feeling of warriors and toughness
Fire Warrior - what's on the tin
Phoenix Lord, Succubus, Medusa, Harlequins, Aspect Warrior, etc all are names that evoke some kind of meaning or description or feeling

Y'havra or Mephrit/Novokh/etc don't and are basically gibberish for gibberish sake.

It's fine, good in fact, if the aliens refer to eachother by their own names, but as someone who doesn't speak T'au, it's absolutely worthless to me if they are all named in T'au. I don't know what a Shavo:'si is or a Shav'osa, but I do know what a Tau Firewarrior Squad Leader or a Fire Warrior Sargeant would be.


An arquebus is a real world thing. Anyway, "Bright Battledamage" tells you nothing about the identity of the White Scars that distinguishes them from other Space Marines. A "Fire Warrior" only tells you that they're a type of fighter, possibly with flamethrowers. Without existing knowledge, any of these could be literally anything. I don't know why "Brimlock Dragoons" is any different to "Bor'kan", aside from the made-up word sounding better. The full name is "Bor'kan Sept", as in the "Sept from Bor'kan", just as Brimlock Dragoons are "Dragoons from Brimlock". Why is "Shas'Ui" different to "Exarch"? Neither name tells you anything without already knowing what they are. The Y'vahra is exactly one thing, not a faction, not a rank, and regardless of how good a name it is or isn't, it's still just something's name; you either know what a Y'vahra is or you don't. It'd be different if every Tau vehicle/battlesuit/etc was named this way, but it's only a really tiny few. It's exactly the same as knowing what a Wave Serpent is (= sea snake?) or who Ahzek Ahriman (some Persian guy?) is.

It's one thing to think certain names are silly (such as most of the Necron ones), and another to say that all names that aren't immediately descriptive are bad.

EDIT: That's not to mention the trend of giving Latin names to Tyranids that are either religious (Haruspex, Hierophant) or insulting terms for women (Harridan, Harpy, Termagant, Crone - even Dominatrix).

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/05/03 13:50:25


 
   
Made in us
Da Head Honcho Boss Grot





Yeah, the fake latin gak is just as bad as the fake asian gak for me.

Bear in mind 90% of stuff in the necron and tau codex is named perfectly logically based on what it is

"Pulse Rifle" - Sounds like a basic rifle

"Fusion Blaster" - sounds like a scary anti tank gun

even like "Cyclic Ion Raker" - sounds like a laser machine gun. Hey, it is!

So your complaint is really with the subfactions, and the fact that their names don't evoke any particular description of what they do?

(morpheus meme) what if I told you...the only reason you know what any subfaction does is because you've been told, and the names aren't any more descriptive?

I did a random test with my wife last night, grabbing subfactions she didn't know and asking her to guess what their special schtick was. She knows what the main factions are in 40k and a couple sub-factions, so I avoided only those I knew she would know.

"World Eaters" - "They're the tyranids, and they have...lots of the big monsters."

"Bor'Kan" - "That sounds like eldar. I'm going to say they're eldar but I don't know what they do."

"Nihilakh" - "Definitely sounds egyptian so necrons. That is a nonsense word."

"Flesh Tearers" - "Chaos guys. They are crazy bezerkers."

"Rainbow Warriors" - *laughs* "you made that one up. Harlequins. Harlequins who are really colorful and that's their special power."

"White Scars" - "that's dark eldar. The ones with the frankensteins."

"Obsidian Rose" - "Sisters of battle with black armor. And..tanks."

"Ultramarines" - "BLUE! Blue space marines. Their power is blue."

"Alpha Legion" - "I'm gonna guess those are the normal human soldier guys. Legion sounds like there's a lot of them."
   
Made in gb
Assassin with Black Lotus Poison




Bristol

The ultramarines power is certainly blue.

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Made in us
Been Around the Block




 Frozen Ocean wrote:
Pleasestop wrote:

You just proved his point though, Brimlock Dragoons gives off at least a certain connotation. I would have thought skitarii at first, with arquebus, but the point still stands. It evokes an imagine.

Bor'kan, Lisodan, Ovokotoh, whatever are just made up words that sound vaguely foreign, and evoke no real meaning or message to the player.

Say what you will about a slippery bilepiper, but it gives a much better description than a Y'havra.

Battle Sister - nun who fights
Space Marine - Marine in space
Black Templar - Unholy Holy Warrior
White Scars - Bright Battledamage, evoking a feeling of warriors and toughness
Fire Warrior - what's on the tin
Phoenix Lord, Succubus, Medusa, Harlequins, Aspect Warrior, etc all are names that evoke some kind of meaning or description or feeling

Y'havra or Mephrit/Novokh/etc don't and are basically gibberish for gibberish sake.

It's fine, good in fact, if the aliens refer to eachother by their own names, but as someone who doesn't speak T'au, it's absolutely worthless to me if they are all named in T'au. I don't know what a Shavo:'si is or a Shav'osa, but I do know what a Tau Firewarrior Squad Leader or a Fire Warrior Sargeant would be.


An arquebus is a real world thing. Anyway, "Bright Battledamage" tells you nothing about the identity of the White Scars that distinguishes them from other Space Marines. A "Fire Warrior" only tells you that they're a type of fighter, possibly with flamethrowers. Without existing knowledge, any of these could be literally anything. I don't know why "Brimlock Dragoons" is any different to "Bor'kan", aside from the made-up word sounding better. The full name is "Bor'kan Sept", as in the "Sept from Bor'kan", just as Brimlock Dragoons are "Dragoons from Brimlock". Why is "Shas'Ui" different to "Exarch"? Neither name tells you anything without already knowing what they are. The Y'vahra is exactly one thing, not a faction, not a rank, and regardless of how good a name it is or isn't, it's still just something's name; you either know what a Y'vahra is or you don't. It'd be different if every Tau vehicle/battlesuit/etc was named this way, but it's only a really tiny few. It's exactly the same as knowing what a Wave Serpent is (= sea snake?) or who Ahzek Ahriman (some Persian guy?) is.

It's one thing to think certain names are silly (such as most of the Necron ones), and another to say that all names that aren't immediately descriptive are bad.

EDIT: That's not to mention the trend of giving Latin names to Tyranids that are either religious (Haruspex, Hierophant) or insulting terms for women (Harridan, Harpy, Termagant's, Crone - even Dominatrix).


Right - I was saying that the name evoked the imagine of Skitarii with an Arquebus. Never did I say that wasn't a real thing?

And wave Serpent makes sense for a fast slippery vehicle, and exarch is a real word, bro.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
the_scotsman wrote:
Yeah, the fake latin gak is just as bad as the fake asian gak for me.

Bear in mind 90% of stuff in the necron and tau codex is named perfectly logically based on what it is

"Pulse Rifle" - Sounds like a basic rifle

"Fusion Blaster" - sounds like a scary anti tank gun

even like "Cyclic Ion Raker" - sounds like a laser machine gun. Hey, it is!

So your complaint is really with the subfactions, and the fact that their names don't evoke any particular description of what they do?

(morpheus meme) what if I told you...the only reason you know what any subfaction does is because you've been told, and the names aren't any more descriptive?

I did a random test with my wife last night, grabbing subfactions she didn't know and asking her to guess what their special schtick was. She knows what the main factions are in 40k and a couple sub-factions, so I avoided only those I knew she would know.

"World Eaters" - "They're the tyranids, and they have...lots of the big monsters."

"Bor'Kan" - "That sounds like eldar. I'm going to say they're eldar but I don't know what they do."

"Nihilakh" - "Definitely sounds egyptian so necrons. That is a nonsense word."

"Flesh Tearers" - "Chaos guys. They are crazy bezerkers."

"Rainbow Warriors" - *laughs* "you made that one up. Harlequins. Harlequins who are really colorful and that's their special power."

"White Scars" - "that's dark eldar. The ones with the frankensteins."

"Obsidian Rose" - "Sisters of battle with black armor. And..tanks."

"Ultramarines" - "BLUE! Blue space marines. Their power is blue."

"Alpha Legion" - "I'm gonna guess those are the normal human soldier guys. Legion sounds like there's a lot of them."


Real words convey meaning -- gibberish doesn't.

A bor'kan isn't anything.

My complaint also goes to Tyranid weapons - most of them are so nonuseful they might as well not have names. At least Tau and necron weapons naming conventions explain what they are.

If someone says I have a Tesla weapon, you get the jist. If it was called like, I dunno, Ankh Blaster to keep int eh line of Tyranids Biomorphic weapons, it would be pointless as well.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/05/03 14:33:37


 
   
Made in us
Krazed Killa Kan






Pleasestop wrote:


Real words convey meaning -- gibberish doesn't.

A bor'kan isn't anything.

My complaint also goes to Tyranid weapons - most of them are so nonuseful they might as well not have names. At least Tau and necron weapons naming conventions explain what they are.

If someone says I have a Tesla weapon, you get the jist. If it was called like, I dunno, Ankh Blaster to keep int eh line of Tyranids Biomorphic weapons, it would be pointless as well.


Ulaanbaatar. What does this mean? I haven't the foggiest idea but it's apparently the captial city of Mongolia. Alien names are going to be even more impossible to understand.
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut







The original poster's evil twin: "How come all of the Aliens are named using English, a language that doesn't exist in the setting? Don't they have their own languages and cultures?"

There are games like Corvus Belli's Infinity where every faction names their units in their own language, according to their own customs. And the naming of the "bad guy aliens" is a bit of a random mix between "What does it call itself?" and "What name caught on with the first people to encounter it?", like you expect to happen in real life.

   
Made in us
Da Head Honcho Boss Grot





Yeah, real words convey meaning, but at least in terms of subfactions, almost none of that meaning is translated through the words.

the ONLY REASON you know that the "white scars" are fast, biker space marines is because that's been jammed into your head.

The ONLY REASON you know the "Emperor's Children" are pink, flamboyant, perfection-obsessed followers of the god of excess is because that's been jammed into your head.

You read the fluff background, you digest it, and you associate it with the sub-faction.

In all instance where you're not supposed to read the fluff and associate it with the name, descriptive conventions prevail in all the factions you're pissing and moaning about.

Pulse: Carbine, Rifle, Blaster, Bomb, Cannon.

You have these guns set out in front of you, I'll bet you 9/10 people can correctly identify which one is which based on the name.

That's because all these names are meant to evoke associations, and quickly allow for identification.

Iron Warrior, Word Bearer, Emperor's Children, Death Guard, Thousand Sons, Alpha Legion.

All these names are meant to BE ASSOCIATED with a color scheme and fluff. The fluff and color scheme comes FIRST, the name association comes SECOND. That means you don't need to convey any meaning with the name, and you can freely allow it to exist in the context of the background. Not every single subfaction needs to be called "The Green Sneakies!" because that's not the direction the association needs to work, and honestly, it makes the setting feel flatter. After all, everyone loves it now that the "Space Wolves" are a bunch of yiffing hairy dogmen instead of what they used to be, a viking-coded space marine chapter with associations to the fenris iconography of the norse apocalypse myth, right?

You can convey some small meanings, as a bonus, like Hive Fleet Kraken having many tendrils, or Hive Fleet Hydra having a mutation where if you kill a tendril it splits off, but those meanings are primarily going to be again where you first read the background, then go back to the name and think "oh, that's clever".

After all, show of hands, who just, oooh, just GRINDS THEIR GEARS that this pretentious donkey-cave JRR tolkien made all these MEANINGLESS, POINTLESS languages that add NOTHING to the story of Lord of the Rings, like, what even is the POINT of calling it "lothlorien" instead of "The Forest of the Tall and Magic Tree Folk" - what, am I going to go make up a fake dictionary with fake language and read a book about fake culture to find out what the heck that word means? NO! Words need to mean things to ME, specifically an english speaking white person! Invented languages never add depth to a literary world!
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut





RevlidRas wrote:
sound reasoning


This times about a quadrillion. It’s the same problem amateur authors run into trying to use weird unpronounceable names in their fiction in the name of just being different. Nothing takes me out of a setting more than a word that I literally cannot imagine how to pronounce.
   
 
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