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Is there anything else I need to watch (40k related) released on the last decade, while I was out of the hobby?
Man, you are in for a treat, getting to see two great animations at once! There should be a 4k compilation of all parts of the "Astartes" project on youtube. Just search for it, should pop up right away. Enjoy!
Ah, GW going with the ole "put some Tzangors in there, people will love it!". Well, the glowing blood/gore stuff was cool visually, but James Workshop- break the 40k Tzangor moulds and call it a loss already!
But, once again great to see a realistic view of what Space marines and their weapons can do to "normie" humans. Essentially a bolt is a small rocket, so the "blink and you mist the cultist" was peak. Now Superman needs to light a fire under Amazon studios collective butts and get them working!
"Cold is the Emperor's way of telling us to burn more heretics."
Great little short. I think interesting enough for people who don't know Warhammer to be intrigued. The mystery was just tantalising enough.
I think my issue for the eventual show is that Space Marines are just too dull for a television series. You want a couple of them in there but not the whole thing.
They run around in massive suits of armour fighting literal demons; hellish xenos; vile witches; monsters from the warp AND they get to do so with guns that fire rocks for bullets.
They run around in massive suits of armour fighting literal demons; hellish xenos; vile witches; monsters from the warp AND they get to do so with guns that fire rocks for bullets.
Which is fun for a few minutes a but a whole movie/tv show of that is going to be boring to the average viewer (and plenty of 40k fans). 40k will fail if it tries to make its film ventures act like the wargame. No shows about war have been solely about the battles, and the space marines are specifically 95% just battles, it's all they do. They don't really do character development and there is no struggle especially if you're going down the bolter porn route where they're just ganking mobs in endless waves.
even when looking at the 40k novels that are called bolter porn, the proportion of them that are just pages of killing monsters in cool ways isn't as big as it might appear. It's just the filler between the battles is pretty thin so the porn part is really all anyone remembers.
On the Surface of the Sun aka Florida in the Summer.
That's why I think people enjoy the tales of Witchhunters and Inquisitors so much. You have the power fantasy of "everyone has to listen to me," without being superman.
BorderCountess wrote: Just because you're doing something right doesn't necessarily mean you know what you're doing...
Yep, Hellebore answered that perfectly. The eventual 40k show cannot be just an extension of that short for 12 episodes or it will be dreadful.
What makes good television? Character, plot, human interest. Space Marines don't really have character or human interest.
Space Marines will look their best as inhuman angels of death. But to do so, the regular action has to be from a human perspective to better show off their might.
Is Band of Brothers just about E Company dropping on D Day and their subsequent battles until the end of the war? Or is it about a group of men from all walks of life held together by bonds of brotherhood forged by the carnage of war that changed them for the rest of their lives?
Lathe Biosas wrote: That's why I think people enjoy the tales of Witchhunters and Inquisitors so much. You have the power fantasy of "everyone has to listen to me," without being superman.
Also, plots, mysteries, character development, and stuff like that. Not everything is power fantasy. Witchhunters and inquisitors are good with figuring out the who/what/when/whys, and interacting with other characters with some level of subtly. They make for more interesting protagonists. Marines are great at solving problems with extreme violence. And look cool doing it.
For longer works you need more to hold it together. For short bits you can just have a few cool action sequences and roll with that.
Olthannon wrote: Yep, Hellebore answered that perfectly. The eventual 40k show cannot be just an extension of that short for 12 episodes or it will be dreadful.
What makes good television? Character, plot, human interest. Space Marines don't really have character or human interest.
Space Marines will look their best as inhuman angels of death. But to do so, the regular action has to be from a human perspective to better show off their might.
Is Band of Brothers just about E Company dropping on D Day and their subsequent battles until the end of the war? Or is it about a group of men from all walks of life held together by bonds of brotherhood forged by the carnage of war that changed them for the rest of their lives?
This exactly, I was thinking of BoB when I was replying actually. But it goes for Game of Thrones, and every other war movie/tv show.
The 3rd person view point of a space marine is exactly the best way to show their OP awesomeness, at first person you lose the sense of wonder. You need to be seeing them through the eyes of the guardsman in the SP2 trailer that said 'his angels' as they walked past.
Eisenhorn is one of the few novels where they did this well, as the marines only come in at the end and we see them through Eisenhorn's eyes. the story never becomes a space marine story, it remains Eisenhorn's and we see the size and power of a marine that way.
What makes good television? Character, plot, human interest. Space Marines don't really have character or human interest.
Space Marines will look their best as inhuman angels of death. But to do so, the regular action has to be from a human perspective to better show off their might.
I’d have to rewatch it to maybe quibble over swapping a few, but I broadly agree with this ranking. Maybe bump Pac-Man up for the sheer WTF nature of it. But I enjoyed even the ones at the bottom of the list. Some were better, but nothing was bad IMHO. Worth the watch all around.
Personally, I thought Helsreach was, and still is, the GOAT of all 40K movies.. and Marines were its main characters. Unlike this "game show" episode about a video game where you shoot at stuff, Helsreach managed to tell some sort of story even if it was basically just about fighting
And just in case you've never watched Helsreach.. It's mandatory watching in my book
This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2024/12/11 16:13:47
"The larger point though, is that as players, we have more control over what the game looks and feels like than most of us are willing to use in order to solve our own problems"
I think anyone who says that Marines are just Bolter Porn and nothing else has kind of only looked at marines on the battlefield. If you read the lore or look into some of the longer videos/animations there are loads of periods of deadtime between fights where they are talking; discussion or having revelations and progressions and developments of Character.
Just look at Space Marine and Dawn of War games - games that are very much 100% ALL action during the core gameplay. They still feature development, changes and talking. Heck Space Marine even has loads of neat background chatter.
Marines 100% can be central to the story; they are not all dreadnought which are only turned on for combat and then turned off at the end. Heck you can do a lot of silent storytelling with them too - monastic praying; suiting up and desuiting their armour and more can be big moments outside of battle.
Thinking of marines as only bolterporn is ignoring everything else of them and boiling them down to a very simplistic view.
It's a little like the whole "there's only 7 stories in the world" kind of arguments where stories are whittled down to their very simplistic core elements.
I watched the half of Secret Level for games I was excited for. Overall its all kind of grimdark, which kind of has a numbing effect that dilutes the stuff that is supposed to be grimdark. It's possible the ones I skipped break things up with more color, but judging by the thumbnails I doubt it. Anyway, on to the reviews in the order I watched them:
Space Marine
It's 40k and its well done. It doesn't offer anything fresh for existing fans, nor does it provide a hint of context for non fans, but its very well done and the art style of the series fits it well.
Armored Core
This is easily my favorite of the 4. Another setting that fits the style well and they really nailed the way the mechs move and fight. Had a story, though it'd be nice if there was a moment where he gets the job to hammer home the mercenary nature of it. Again, I fear if you don't know the games its all kind of obtuse, but it worked for me in a way not even Space Marine did.
Pac-Man
This was always going to be a mess but oh what a mess it is. Somehow its the most silly edgelord nonsense of the bunch and also the most corny and full of dumb references. All I could think of was Bomberman: Act Zero and every terrible dark reboot of the late 2000s. This was too cringy to laugh at.
D&D
This one had some color towards the end and overall was pretty solid. The opening had all the hallmarks of the others, hiding everything in shadows, probably for budget reasons. The end built to a pretty triumphant feeling hero moment and while I wasn't invested in the story it started capturing the setting well.
It was fun overall, some of these games I've never heard of but all in all, this first batch isn't all that bad.
Armoured Core was pretty good, not sure what was going on, but heh, Keanu Reeves being a strung out waste of a human being with a voice in his head was a nice call-back to cyberpunk alright.
And yes, the Space Marine short is amazing, the direction they went with, strong visuals, almost zero dialogue, amazing. Also great to see the influences of Astartes in style and combat flow, showing just how much power and restraint they have with their moves. Not sure if that little tap of the axe to reverse the grip or the post-auto pistol to the face head butt is the best part of it all.
edit.
Oh yeah, the Unreal Tournament one was also really good, maybe because just because of the announcer unlocking some core memory of a young me playing the OG Unreal Tournament aeons ago.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2024/12/11 20:03:47
The UT one is great if just because they went with the freaking UT Demo map AND the Facing maps and even have a "no camping" comment buried in there. It's one of those things that feels like its made by fans who understood the game and put some classic nostalgia in there.
Heck they even focus on THE BEST gun of the original game that never came back again - the Ripper!
BrookM wrote: Armoured Core was pretty good, not sure what was going on, but heh, Keanu Reeves being a strung out waste of a human being with a voice in his head was a nice call-back to cyberpunk alright.
Armored Core is a FromSoft franchise, so while there's a lot to the world, there's not a lot of story. For the most part, you are always a mercenary mech pilot taking jobs from rival MegaCorps. You pick the jobs you want to take, take out the targets you're ordered to and use the cash you earn on repairs and new parts for your mech. Happy to chat this one up if you're curious.
Overread wrote: I think anyone who says that Marines are just Bolter Porn and nothing else has kind of only looked at marines on the battlefield.
Great for games, just they will make a terrible terrible TV show. A TV show that will also be designed to grow an audience and hopefully get new people interested in the tabletop. Space Marines will look excellent as aloof side characters, but they can't be the central purpose.
BrookM wrote: Armoured Core was pretty good, not sure what was going on, but heh, Keanu Reeves being a strung out waste of a human being with a voice in his head was a nice call-back to cyberpunk alright.
Armored Core is a FromSoft franchise, so while there's a lot to the world, there's not a lot of story. For the most part, you are always a mercenary mech pilot taking jobs from rival MegaCorps. You pick the jobs you want to take, take out the targets you're ordered to and use the cash you earn on repairs and new parts for your mech. Happy to chat this one up if you're curious.
Heh, seems I was not far off from the joke I made when the Keanu trailer dropped: "Wake the feth up 621, we got money to make."
I've been sitting on AC6 for a long time now haha, still need to beat that fluffing chopper in the first mission. 😅
Overread wrote: I think anyone who says that Marines are just Bolter Porn and nothing else has kind of only looked at marines on the battlefield.
Great for games, just they will make a terrible terrible TV show. A TV show that will also be designed to grow an audience and hopefully get new people interested in the tabletop. Space Marines will look excellent as aloof side characters, but they can't be the central purpose.
A book like Brothers of the Snake would beg to differ, but YMMV.
In general, I feel anything would go for 40k media, as long as it is cool enough, because that's what's been going on for a long time now: tell a story and let the audience figure it out for their selves what all that weird gak is. I've been watching a fair share of people not familiar with the hobby reacting to the games and the shows and when it catches their interest, they will do these amazing deepdives, via chat or lore videos. The cherubs in Space Marine 2 in particular have been great catalysts haha!
Unreal Tournament was a Very close second after Space Marines. I think it told the best story out of all the shows, and the visuals and references were great. It only loses out because of the insanely awesome Marines Vs Cultists scene.
BrookM wrote: Armoured Core was pretty good, not sure what was going on, but heh, Keanu Reeves being a strung out waste of a human being with a voice in his head was a nice call-back to cyberpunk alright.
Armored Core is a FromSoft franchise, so while there's a lot to the world, there's not a lot of story. For the most part, you are always a mercenary mech pilot taking jobs from rival MegaCorps. You pick the jobs you want to take, take out the targets you're ordered to and use the cash you earn on repairs and new parts for your mech. Happy to chat this one up if you're curious.
Heh, seems I was not far off from the joke I made when the Keanu trailer dropped: "Wake the feth up 621, we got money to make."
I've been sitting on AC6 for a long time now haha, still need to beat that fluffing chopper in the first mission. 😅
Yeah, that thing is mean as a tutorial boss. The worst part about it is that after you lose the first time, your natural instinct is to play it safe and keep your distance, but that's where its strongest and you will be severely punished for it. It leads to this odd loop where you feel like you did better on your first try and aren't getting any better on following attempts. Later bosses you can build your mech to counter, but you're stuck with the stock model for the chopper.
The main trick is to use the overboost to stay close to it. Whenever it tries to get away from you, boost to give chase. You also need to learn how the stagger works because it doesn't take any real damage until you break its poise. You can't really chip it down which is also why it feels harder when you try to hide from it. You need to dump as much damage as you can in bursts.
Flinty wrote: It did its job. As you say the animation and art style was great. Everything appropriately lore accurate, but it was all a bit too cliched for me. Now the Pac Man episode. That was some original nightmare fodder right there!
Yeah that Pac-Man episode was really creative and dark.
I liked the 40k story for what it was, a great intro to 40k if you are still unaware of 40k.
Glad to see Pederson (If I remember his name correctly) was a part of this. His influence can be seen throughout the entire episode and that's not a bad thing.
The 40k episode sure is pretty to look at. I like the part about the guy walking his pet box the most. Not sure about the story. Less sure about the end.
Not that I'm complaining. There's only so much you can do in fifteen minutes.
I watched the half of Secret Level for games I was excited for. Overall its all kind of grimdark, which kind of has a numbing effect that dilutes the stuff that is supposed to be grimdark. It's possible the ones I skipped break things up with more color, but judging by the thumbnails I doubt it. Anyway, on to the reviews in the order I watched them:
Space Marine
It's 40k and its well done. It doesn't offer anything fresh for existing fans, nor does it provide a hint of context for non fans, but its very well done and the art style of the series fits it well.
Armored Core
This is easily my favorite of the 4. Another setting that fits the style well and they really nailed the way the mechs move and fight. Had a story, though it'd be nice if there was a moment where he gets the job to hammer home the mercenary nature of it. Again, I fear if you don't know the games its all kind of obtuse, but it worked for me in a way not even Space Marine did.
Pac-Man
This was always going to be a mess but oh what a mess it is. Somehow its the most silly edgelord nonsense of the bunch and also the most corny and full of dumb references. All I could think of was Bomberman: Act Zero and every terrible dark reboot of the late 2000s. This was too cringy to laugh at.
D&D
This one had some color towards the end and overall was pretty solid. The opening had all the hallmarks of the others, hiding everything in shadows, probably for budget reasons. The end built to a pretty triumphant feeling hero moment and while I wasn't invested in the story it started capturing the setting well.
I liked the New World one best, not the least because it was funny and brighter than the others. It definitely stands out from the rest of this batch and if the dreary dark and somberly serious nature of the others doesn't agree with you, New World just might.
With regard to the edgelordiest of them all, I didn't even know Pacman has a story, let alone something like this. I guess I missed several decades of development.
Nehekhara lives! Sort of!
Why is the rum always gone?
Ultramarines, 3rd Co. and friends, 16k+ 
4k 
4k Points
Competition Index
There should be a 4k compilation of all parts of the "Astartes" project on youtube. Just search for it, should pop up right away. Enjoy!
