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What are they?


I keep reading Bat Reps and Army builds that refer to Alpha strike army, but I fail to understand what they are exactly. Can someone care to explain a little and give some general guidelines to alpha strike lists

Thanks a lot

It's an army that isn't concerned with its own safety, and is single minded in its pursuit of firepower. It is most common with Imperial Guard, which use the lightly armored artillery and Mech Vets to inflict as much damage as possible as fast as possible. If the enemy survives he will probably shred the Alpha Strike list, so it relies heavily on getting the first turn.

Alpha Strikes usually rely on shooting, but there are some Space Marine builds that can get Scouts in close combat on the first turn.

Drop podding high impact units (like a kitted Dreadnaught) into enemy lines is a form of alpha striking.

Alpha denotes, generally, something pre-emptive.

I have played a couple of games with a guy who uses all drop-pods. This gives him a sure charge on turn 2, but left me at least one turn to shoot at him or try to reposition before he gets into assaulting me. I don't know if this is Alpha Strike. I have heard that there's a way for some armies to get immediately into close combat on their first turn using special characters but I don't know any other codex abilities until I play against them. Ghazkill and his special Waagh, Speed Freaks, Land Raiders, Dark Elfs on those skimmers, all close the gap pretty fast from what I have seen, but I have watched more games than I have played so I don't know, I always thought that it was that kind of approach that people said were Alpha Strike. I don't understand why anyone would not just keep their army in reserve against an enemy like that and take away that first turn kill possibility. I have a lot to learn though.

Ghaz's special Waaagh can't get a turn 1 charge. It can't even be used at all in the first turn. The only way Orks can truly Alpha strike (since Snikrot can't come in turn 1) is with Stormboyz, deepstriking as Vulcha Boyz - if they get within charge range, they are allowed to assault that turn.

But they're terrible units in general and overcosted. There are a few things that can immediately assault, but it's usually only one unit every three armies or so.

The Space Wolf thing you're talking about is Loganwing - if you take Logan, you can use special rules that allow you to shoot even though you arrive in a drop-pod via "cruising speed" (which would normally prevent you from shooting heavy weapons).

I saw a list somewhere that used a bunch of ironclads (at least four, maybe six?) with dual hunter-killer missiles on each one, plus more HK missiles on other vehicles. Massed hunter-killer missiles are one way to get alpha-strike firepower into an army. Sentinels can take them too I think. The idea is to cripple your opponent's vehicles in turn 1 with massed krak, then just mop up.

One army that can get a turn 1 charge is a space marine army led by Shrike, who gives them the fleet rule. Infiltrating units can deploy close enough to move-fleet-assault in turn 1 (Scouts deploy 18" away, then use their scout move to get 6" closer before turn 1, and a unit of assault marines that infitrates with Shrike using his special ability can get a turn 1 charge from 18" away in the first turn.) But it's not worthwhile to get a turn 1 charge if you don't have followup units to sustain the attack.

yeenoghu wrote:I don't understand why anyone would not just keep their army in reserve against an enemy like that and take away that first turn kill possibility. I have a lot to learn though.

That is a standard tactic when going against an alpha strike force that gets first turn. But, your army has to be mobile enough to be able to come in from reserves and capture objectives. Not every army list can do that.

Grakmar wrote:

yeenoghu wrote:I don't understand why anyone would not just keep their army in reserve against an enemy like that and take away that first turn kill possibility.

That is a standard tactic when going against an alpha strike force that gets first turn. But, your army has to be mobile enough to be able to come in from reserves and capture objectives.

And also have reserve modifiers so that the units are not coming on two at a time and being blown right back off the table piece-meal.

Dark Eldar have always been able to get turn 1 assaults if some one foolishly deploys too close. The archon or wyches with 12" charge + 12 raider move + 2 deployment +1-6 fleet = 27-32" charge range. With pitched battle and deploying on the 12" line - you can almost charge the enite width of the board.

I haven't been able to see the new codex yet (silly FLGS hasn't gotten their black box yet) so I am unsure if this is still a viable option for DE.

For a fun list and one that's not very reliable - orks can take two warpheads - that gives pretty good odds of getting the fleet roll - load up the boys in trukks and battlewagons - possible 21-27 charge range.

Flavius Infernus wrote:One army that can get a turn 1 charge is a space marine army led by Shrike, who gives them the fleet rule. Infiltrating units can deploy close enough to move-fleet-assault in turn 1 (Scouts deploy 18" away, then use their scout move to get 6" closer before turn 1, and a unit of assault marines that infitrates with Shrike using his special ability can get a turn 1 charge from 18" away in the first turn.) But it's not worthwhile to get a turn 1 charge if you don't have followup units to sustain the attack.

Careful there. When infiltrating you have to deploy more than 18" away. When scouting you cannot move within 12" of an enemy unit. Looking in the front of the rulebook, it explains that within 12" includes 12", thus you have to stay more than 12" away.

ryan3740 wrote:

Flavius Infernus wrote:One army that can get a turn 1 charge is a space marine army led by Shrike, who gives them the fleet rule. Infiltrating units can deploy close enough to move-fleet-assault in turn 1 (Scouts deploy 18" away, then use their scout move to get 6" closer before turn 1, and a unit of assault marines that infitrates with Shrike using his special ability can get a turn 1 charge from 18" away in the first turn.) But it's not worthwhile to get a turn 1 charge if you don't have followup units to sustain the attack.

Careful there. When infiltrating you have to deploy more than 18" away. When scouting you cannot move within 12" of an enemy unit. Looking in the front of the rulebook, it explains that within 12" includes 12", thus you have to stay more than 12" away.

Yep, that's why only Shrike armies can do it:

Scouts infiltrate 18.1 inches away. They scout move to 12.1 inches away. Then they move 6, fleet at least 1 inch, and assault 6 (total 13 inches), thus making it with .9 inches to spare--more if the run roll is higher.

Assault marines infiltrate 18.1 inches away. Turn 1 they move 12 inches, winding up 6.1 inches away. They fleet at least 1 inch, assault 6", making it with 5 inches to spare--more if the run roll is higher.

Infiltrating regular infantry like terminators can't get close enough to pull it off, fleet or not. You need either the 12" movement of assault marines or the scout move to do it.

Though if you have Shrike on the table in the first place, you can attach him to any squad you like and let them Infiltrate. A full unit of Infiltrating, Fleet Assault Terminators might be fun, even if you only have one of them.

Land speeder storms can get scouts there first turn to, and can bring a nice heavy flamer to help out. It's fun when you want to suprise someone.

Magnalon wrote: The only way Orks can truly Alpha strike (since Snikrot can't come in turn 1) is with Stormboyz, deepstriking as Vulcha Boyz - if they get within charge range, they are allowed to assault that turn.

Not accurate.

Deffkoptas are scouts, they can start 12" away on the first turn. 12" move + 6" assault.

Wagon or Trukk can move 13" (red paint), puke out a big base for roughly 4 more inches, then assault 6". That's 23". Spearhead and Dawn of War don't start 24" away.

also, you don't have to attack turn 1 to be an alpha strike army (although many alpha strike armies do their damage starting turn 1). The criteria for an alpha strike means that you're doing a huge barrel of damage to them before they have the chance to seriously engage your forces in return.

In the case of guard artillery, this means putting the vehicles on the board and then nailing whatever is over there before over there becomes over here. In the case of mechdar, it can be 8 wave serpents, half with dragons, half with avengers with 2 autarchs keeping the entire army off the board until turn 3 when it suddenly shows up in mass, guns it forwards at insane skimmer speed, and then poops out a bunch of dragons and bladestorms wherever they want to. The key thing is that they can do this without you having had the ability to do much of anything to them first.

As they do the damage first, thus the "alpha".

Add to the Shrike list a Librarian with Gate of Infinity. It will mainly depend on the deployment and size of the board, but in most boards I've played, gating a 10-man unit then running towards them and assaulting can be done on Turn 1. Well, assuming your deep strike did well.

Can you assault after deep striking? I don't think that's allowed.

cortez wrote:Can you assault after deep striking? I don't think that's allowed.

2 Units can (and 1 FW)

Chaos Marine Generic Daemons (but they must have a chaos icon) and Vanguard Marines (heroic intervention)

for FW you can take a more expensive drop pod that is a dreadnought specific one. great for ironclads

alanedomain wrote:Though if you have Shrike on the table in the first place, you can attach him to any squad you like and let them Infiltrate. A full unit of Infiltrating, Fleet Assault Terminators might be fun, even if you only have one of them.

Right, but terminators can't infiltrate close enough for a turn 1 charge. Starting from 18", even if they roll a 6 on their run roll, they're still a fraction of an inch short.

Although one time I was able to infiltrate a whole unit of terminators into a building (out of LoS, so just over 12" away). But then they botched their dangerous terrain roll on the assault, came up with double 1s, and weren't able to pull it off.


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starsdawn wrote:Add to the Shrike list a Librarian with Gate of Infinity. It will mainly depend on the deployment and size of the board, but in most boards I've played, gating a 10-man unit then running towards them and assaulting can be done on Turn 1. Well, assuming your deep strike did well.

Nope, Gate of Infinity counts as deepstriking and you can't assault after deepstriking, even if you do have the "fleet" rule.

Besides, gating a 10-man unit into assault range of enemy models is really risky. I do use gate with my Shrike army, but I've lost whole units often enough in the early days that now I'd rather have a locator beacon to gate off of. But, again, that can't happen turn 1 since the beacon has to be on the table at the start of the turn in order to be used.

Flavius Infernus wrote:
Right, but terminators can't infiltrate close enough for a turn 1 charge. Starting from 18", even if they roll a 6 on their run roll, they're still a fraction of an inch short.

Ahh... I see what you mean. It's still a neat trick, just not quite a Turn 1 charge. Now if you attached Shrike to a CC Bike Squad... haha

Flavius Infernus wrote:Nope, Gate of Infinity counts as deepstriking and you can't assault after deepstriking, even if you do have the "fleet" rule.

Besides, gating a 10-man unit into assault range of enemy models is really risky. I do use gate with my Shrike army, but I've lost whole units often enough in the early days that now I'd rather have a locator beacon to gate off of. But, again, that can't happen turn 1 since the beacon has to be on the table at the start of the turn in order to be used.

I plan to use Gate with Shrike in my list, but will do so using Tactical Terminators so I can throw massive piles of shooting and a Vortex of Doom anywhere I want to each turn. It's gimmicky, sure, and won't be a mainstay of my list, but it sounds fun and is thematic for my army. Plus I use a lot of Scouts and Pods so I'll have locators and teleport homers galore.

Flavius Infernus wrote:I saw a list somewhere that used a bunch of ironclads (at least four, maybe six?) with dual hunter-killer missiles on each one, plus more HK missiles on other vehicles. Massed hunter-killer missiles are one way to get alpha-strike firepower into an army. Sentinels can take them too I think. The idea is to cripple your opponent's vehicles in turn 1 with massed krak, then just mop up.

One army that can get a turn 1 charge is a space marine army led by Shrike, who gives them the fleet rule. Infiltrating units can deploy close enough to move-fleet-assault in turn 1 (Scouts deploy 18" away, then use their scout move to get 6" closer before turn 1, and a unit of assault marines that infitrates with Shrike using his special ability can get a turn 1 charge from 18" away in the first turn.) But it's not worthwhile to get a turn 1 charge if you don't have followup units to sustain the attack.

Can we put more than one hunter killer missile on a vehicle? I thought it was just 1. If so, I imagine a Rhino rolling around sporting 10 of them and scaring everybody away for a turn before becoming useless and not worth shooting at.

Ironclads specify that they can have up to 2 HK missles added.

alanedomain wrote:
Ahh... I see what you mean. It's still a neat trick, just not quite a Turn 1 charge. Now if you attached Shrike to a CC Bike Squad... haha

Aha, but bikes can't run. So again, they can't cover more than 18" with a move and assault.



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kirsanth wrote:Ironclads specify that they can have up to 2 HK missles added.

...and because they're walkers, they can move at full speed in the movement phase and still fire both missiles together in the same shooting phase.

Flavius Infernus wrote:

kirsanth wrote:Ironclads specify that they can have up to 2 HK missles added.

...and because they're walkers, they can move at full speed in the movement phase and still fire both missiles together in the same shooting phase.

I should have quoted him, I was responding to this:

yeenoghu wrote:Can we put more than one hunter killer missile on a vehicle? I thought it was just 1.

You are correct about firing them though.

kirsanth wrote:

Flavius Infernus wrote:

kirsanth wrote:Ironclads specify that they can have up to 2 HK missles added.

...and because they're walkers, they can move at full speed in the movement phase and still fire both missiles together in the same shooting phase.

I should have quoted him, I was responding to this:

yeenoghu wrote:Can we put more than one hunter killer missile on a vehicle? I thought it was just 1.

You are correct about firing them though.

Yeah, I was adding to what you said, Kirsanth. Not only are they allowed to have the 2 missiles, they can also fire them both together.

So does all this talk of HK Missiles on Ironclads mean that Ironclads are the one situation where HKs are actually worth taking? I can see how it would be nice to step out of a Pod and fire three S8 shots at some back armor or something, but is it cost-effective? Can't deny that the rocket launchers look awesome on top of the Dread like that...

alanedomain wrote:So does all this talk of HK Missiles on Ironclads mean that Ironclads are the one situation where HKs are actually worth taking? I can see how it would be nice to step out of a Pod and fire three S8 shots at some back armor or something, but is it cost-effective? Can't deny that the rocket launchers look awesome on top of the Dread like that...

You can allocate 60 or 80 points of your army to taking HK missiles on all your tanks and get a lot more turn 1 firepower than you would otherwise be able to get for those points and that can be worthwhile. They're especially useful on things like rhinos that don't otherwise get a shot the turn they roll onto the table.

Also an important part of the alpha-strike theory is that destroying something in turn 1 nets you an overall bigger advantage than destroying something in later turns. It increases the survivability of your own units throughout the game and weakens your opponent's ability to pursue his objectives right from the start. So an expenditure on alpha strike weaponry, assuming it's enough to work, nets you a bigger effectiveness bonus in the course of a whole game, even if they are single-shot weapons.

HK's have the ability to be worth it on any vehicle that compliments the HK that you don't intend on moving all that often (or are walkers). This includes things like hydras, plas or lascannon sentinels, or predators.

Of course, you still need to think that HKs are worthwhile at all in order for you to take them on these vehicles in the first place.

alanedomain wrote:So does all this talk of HK Missiles on Ironclads mean that Ironclads are the one situation where HKs are actually worth taking? I can see how it would be nice to step out of a Pod and fire three S8 shots at some back armor or something, but is it cost-effective? Can't deny that the rocket launchers look awesome on top of the Dread like that...

Walkers can only shoot 2 weapons. Each HK missile counts as a weapon. So you can fire both HK missiles, a HK missile and one normal weapon, or both normal weapons. I personally don't recommend podding HK missile dreds. Walking HK ICs? Sure, can be decent.

Another platform I like HK missiles on is scout sentinals. Outflank some with auto cannon and HK missile, and you have a very effective throw away method to crack side armor. Besides, what else do your really need to use FA slots in guard?

Walkers can only shoot 2 weapons? What rule was that?