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Longtime Dakkanaut




Not sure where it came from, but got sent part of a picture last night in regards to the DG codex.

Essentially it says that Disgustingly Resilient is nerfed to a 6+ and only affects Infantry.


MASSIVE with this though as it has a huge potential to be fake.

First rumour/supposed leak i've seen though.
   
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Kdash wrote:
Not sure where it came from, but got sent part of a picture last night in regards to the DG codex.

Essentially it says that Disgustingly Resilient is nerfed to a 6+ and only affects Infantry.


MASSIVE with this though as it has a huge potential to be fake.

First rumour/supposed leak i've seen though.


Ouch. Then again, it would stop plague marines being 23-25ppm or anything daft.
   
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The old rumor that DG were getting -1 to wound across the board could fit with that.

Makes the vehicles more killable and the infantry just about the same as before.

Wonder if they’d go the Necron route and have Plague Marines getting to add one to that result natively or something.
   
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Saw that picture. It does refer to daemons, but it did nerf DR. Hope it is fake as DG will require some big boosts to counter the loss of 5+++ DR.

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Automatically Appended Next Post:
this is the photo,

as was said above it's specific to demons, but (If real)are they going to want 2 rules with identical names but different effects?, probably not

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/11/17 13:56:33


 
   
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Dudeface wrote:
Then again, it would stop plague marines being 23-25ppm or anything daft.
It really wouldn't.

Remember that GW is excellent at over-balancing things.

   
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 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Dudeface wrote:
Then again, it would stop plague marines being 23-25ppm or anything daft.
It really wouldn't.

Remember that GW is excellent at over-balancing things.


GW over-costing the codex because of the powers of Nurgle daemon soup would be fairly typical of them.

How much do we think Blighthaulers are going up by? The invader ATV is, as a reference, 85 points.
   
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 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Dudeface wrote:
Then again, it would stop plague marines being 23-25ppm or anything daft.
It really wouldn't.

Remember that GW is excellent at over-balancing things.


Pretty much this. They've already removed Contemptors and Leviathans from the DG repertoire so who knows what will happen next.

I just finished painting 3000 points of Death Guard this year and I dread what will happen to them in the upcoming codex. The rumor of removing shared units does make me sad as I kitbashed my own versions of a few Death Guard CSM units.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/11/17 14:39:08


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Looks like a fake to me; rule describes Daemons yet the art above features DG fighting Tau, numerous spelling mistakes (e.g. indured), etc.

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That looks extremely fake, the fonts are all wonky and it's got a spelling error in it...

"I can't believe all these tryhard WAACs out there just care about winning all the time when it's supposed to be a game for fun!!!!!!! Also here's my 27 page essay on why marines are OP and Orkz should get a bunch of OP rules so I can win more games

-the_scotsman"

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 Marshal Loss wrote:
Looks like a fake to me; rule describes Daemons yet the art above features DG fighting Tau, numerous spelling mistakes (e.g. indured), etc.


Daemons feature in the codex however so it's not impossible it's from the rules for the daemons. Indured is about right for a GW typo but the art at the top could be from a page of generic faction special rules.

It's not enough to be conclusive one or the other for me still.
   
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the_scotsman wrote:
That looks extremely fake, the fonts are all wonky and it's got a spelling error in it...


Nothing new for GW, i reccomend read a german or any translation of GW for the matter of quality

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GW books often have some hilarious typos. The Necron codex describes Necron Immortals as "Shook Troops", not Shock Troops.

For me Shook Troops is canon now.

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 Jidmah wrote:
Justyn wrote:
Are you guys not aware that everything but possessed and cultists already can have DR?


Are you not aware that things might not be the same in your new Codex? Because GW has never taken anything away from any army.


I apparently also wasn't aware that you were just here for the negativity and not for discussion. Keep going, don't mind me.

A Strat =/= This unit has FNP, since it didn't have it to begin with.

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 jy2 wrote:
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 vipoid wrote:
Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?

 MarsNZ wrote:
ITT: SoB players upset that they're receiving the same condescending treatment that they've doled out in every CSM thread ever.
 
   
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Longtime Dakkanaut




Wouldn't be shocked if DG lost the 5+++, because it would be easier to balance offense/defence on a 6+++. As people have said, 2 wound plague marines with a 5++ would need to be quite expensive and it might have ended up being silly. (Can a 25 point unit really just have a boltgun for instance? Probably not.)
   
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Tyel wrote:
Wouldn't be shocked if DG lost the 5+++, because it would be easier to balance offense/defence on a 6+++. As people have said, 2 wound plague marines with a 5++ would need to be quite expensive and it might have ended up being silly. (Can a 25 point unit really just have a boltgun for instance? Probably not.)


If the Necron and Space Marine codexes are any indication, I'm betting it's 6+++ by default with a stratagem to take it back to 5+++ on one unit. They seem to be removing some of the more powerful generic rules from datasheets and moving them to targeted strats (see: repulsor field rule). In some cases it's a buff (smokescreen), in others it's a nerf (repulsor field).

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/11/17 15:49:14


 
   
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Tyel wrote:
Wouldn't be shocked if DG lost the 5+++, because it would be easier to balance offense/defence on a 6+++. As people have said, 2 wound plague marines with a 5++ would need to be quite expensive and it might have ended up being silly. (Can a 25 point unit really just have a boltgun for instance? Probably not.)


It's a good point, and with the removal of the 3++ Storm Shield it does feel like they are trying to reign in any weird mechanisms that have a negative effect on game enjoyment. I just hope that Death Guard get something nice in return, but we won't see until the end of the month/beginning og December.

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 Eldarsif wrote:
Tyel wrote:
Wouldn't be shocked if DG lost the 5+++, because it would be easier to balance offense/defence on a 6+++. As people have said, 2 wound plague marines with a 5++ would need to be quite expensive and it might have ended up being silly. (Can a 25 point unit really just have a boltgun for instance? Probably not.)


It's a good point, and with the removal of the 3++ Storm Shield it does feel like they are trying to reign in any weird mechanisms that have a negative effect on game enjoyment. I just hope that Death Guard get something nice in return, but we won't see until the end of the month/beginning og December.


TIL "any rule that might result in a thing I am targeting not immediately dying" = "weird mechanism that have a negative effect on game enjoyment."

Theres no reason why W2 plague marines with 5++ would be unbalanceable. DG termies are currently W2 models with 2+/5++/5+FNP. If they had to cost 24ppm and be extremely defensively oriented vs their offense, then...idk...great? Good? I'm glad there is a defensive army in 40k?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/11/17 15:53:46


"I can't believe all these tryhard WAACs out there just care about winning all the time when it's supposed to be a game for fun!!!!!!! Also here's my 27 page essay on why marines are OP and Orkz should get a bunch of OP rules so I can win more games

-the_scotsman"

-ERJAK 
   
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Longtime Dakkanaut






It's possible that DG get +1 to their Disgustingly Resilient roll if they are battlforged. Changing it up from their current Rapidfire at 18 rule.

Not saying its true, just spitballing.

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 Brutus_Apex wrote:
It's possible that DG get +1 to their Disgustingly Resilient roll if they are battlforged. Changing it up from their current Rapidfire at 18 rule.

Not saying its true, just spitballing.


"We heard you loud and clear that your chapter trait was almost worthless, so here's a chapter trait that's just 'the rules you used to have as a baseline' instead!"

.....meanwhile in loyalist-land we've still got like a half dozen concurrent army-wide special rules just blanket applied to everything for funsies.

"I can't believe all these tryhard WAACs out there just care about winning all the time when it's supposed to be a game for fun!!!!!!! Also here's my 27 page essay on why marines are OP and Orkz should get a bunch of OP rules so I can win more games

-the_scotsman"

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Sunny Side Up wrote:
Dudeface wrote:
There is no fluff reason a death guard chaos lord isn't some form of plague marine.[...]


Not really. Plague Marines are an old Elite-Slot Finecast selection from CSM, which they turned into a spin off with some Heresy-novels fluff. They are a sub-faction to CSM like Ultramarines are to Space Marines or Ulthwe are to Eldar or Novok are to Necrons.
What are you on about? Death Guard well predate finecast and HH novels. They had both metals and plastics in 2nd. By at least 3 they had a variant army list (I can't remember about 2nd).

By that logic of going with some arbitrary less developed version of them, Grey knights are just some terminator squad; Deathwatch are an upgrade sprue, Death Korps are just a Guard re-skin, Daemons are just a few units from CSM. Why should any of them have rules to represent them as armies when they're just spinoffs?


My painted armies (40k, WM/H, Malifaux, Infinity...) 
   
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"We heard you loud and clear that your chapter trait was almost worthless, so here's a chapter trait that's just 'the rules you used to have as a baseline' instead!"

.....meanwhile in loyalist-land we've still got like a half dozen concurrent army-wide special rules just blanket applied to everything for funsies.


Is this your first time playing Chaos? lol

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the_scotsman wrote:
 Eldarsif wrote:
Tyel wrote:
Wouldn't be shocked if DG lost the 5+++, because it would be easier to balance offense/defence on a 6+++. As people have said, 2 wound plague marines with a 5++ would need to be quite expensive and it might have ended up being silly. (Can a 25 point unit really just have a boltgun for instance? Probably not.)


It's a good point, and with the removal of the 3++ Storm Shield it does feel like they are trying to reign in any weird mechanisms that have a negative effect on game enjoyment. I just hope that Death Guard get something nice in return, but we won't see until the end of the month/beginning og December.


TIL "any rule that might result in a thing I am targeting not immediately dying" = "weird mechanism that have a negative effect on game enjoyment."

Theres no reason why W2 plague marines with 5++ would be unbalanceable. DG termies are currently W2 models with 2+/5++/5+FNP. If they had to cost 24ppm and be extremely defensively oriented vs their offense, then...idk...great? Good? I'm glad there is a defensive army in 40k?


The way DG is implemented is unfun to play against a lot of the time. Roll an armys worth of shots and ping off a couple of wounds through 4-5 rounds of rolling dice, it's a massive time sink.

10 intercessors fire twice, reroll 1's to hit, wound rolls, reroll 1's to wound, saves, DR, DR rerolls (possibly) aaaaand you do 2-3 wounds for all that dice rolling.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/11/17 16:10:00


 
   
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Iceland

the_scotsman wrote:
 Eldarsif wrote:
Tyel wrote:
Wouldn't be shocked if DG lost the 5+++, because it would be easier to balance offense/defence on a 6+++. As people have said, 2 wound plague marines with a 5++ would need to be quite expensive and it might have ended up being silly. (Can a 25 point unit really just have a boltgun for instance? Probably not.)


It's a good point, and with the removal of the 3++ Storm Shield it does feel like they are trying to reign in any weird mechanisms that have a negative effect on game enjoyment. I just hope that Death Guard get something nice in return, but we won't see until the end of the month/beginning og December.


TIL "any rule that might result in a thing I am targeting not immediately dying" = "weird mechanism that have a negative effect on game enjoyment."

Theres no reason why W2 plague marines with 5++ would be unbalanceable. DG termies are currently W2 models with 2+/5++/5+FNP. If they had to cost 24ppm and be extremely defensively oriented vs their offense, then...idk...great? Good? I'm glad there is a defensive army in 40k?


TIL "if I don't understand the context/perspective of other people's post I'll just make my own and be snarky about it". I was thinking of actually writing a proper answer, but I fear you'll just do the same again. So goodbye.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
The way DG is implemented is unfun to play against a lot of the time. Roll an armys worth of shots and ping off a couple of wounds through 4-5 rounds of rolling dice, it's a massive time sink.


I do agree to a point. I do feel, however, that the 5++ has been mitigated somewhat with the changes to the damage output of some of the heavy weaponry for Marines.

I am thinking we might see the preorder for the Death Guard codex the Saturday after next, 28th of November.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/11/17 16:14:15


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Dudeface wrote:
Spoiler:
the_scotsman wrote:
 Eldarsif wrote:
Tyel wrote:
Wouldn't be shocked if DG lost the 5+++, because it would be easier to balance offense/defence on a 6+++. As people have said, 2 wound plague marines with a 5++ would need to be quite expensive and it might have ended up being silly. (Can a 25 point unit really just have a boltgun for instance? Probably not.)


It's a good point, and with the removal of the 3++ Storm Shield it does feel like they are trying to reign in any weird mechanisms that have a negative effect on game enjoyment. I just hope that Death Guard get something nice in return, but we won't see until the end of the month/beginning og December.


TIL "any rule that might result in a thing I am targeting not immediately dying" = "weird mechanism that have a negative effect on game enjoyment."

Theres no reason why W2 plague marines with 5++ would be unbalanceable. DG termies are currently W2 models with 2+/5++/5+FNP. If they had to cost 24ppm and be extremely defensively oriented vs their offense, then...idk...great? Good? I'm glad there is a defensive army in 40k?


The way DG is implemented is unfun to play against a lot of the time. Roll an armys worth of shots and ping off a couple of wounds through 4-5 rounds of rolling dice, it's a massive time sink.

10 intercessors fire twice, reroll 1's to hit, wound rolls, reroll 1's to wound, saves, DR, DR rerolls (possibly) aaaaand you do 2-3 wounds for all that dice rolling.

Going from a 5+++ to a 6+++ wouldn't cut down on any dice rolling. And they're no more aggravating to kill than Custodes IMO. And most of that rolling you're complaining about is loyalists.
   
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 Gadzilla666 wrote:
Dudeface wrote:
Spoiler:
the_scotsman wrote:
 Eldarsif wrote:
Tyel wrote:
Wouldn't be shocked if DG lost the 5+++, because it would be easier to balance offense/defence on a 6+++. As people have said, 2 wound plague marines with a 5++ would need to be quite expensive and it might have ended up being silly. (Can a 25 point unit really just have a boltgun for instance? Probably not.)


It's a good point, and with the removal of the 3++ Storm Shield it does feel like they are trying to reign in any weird mechanisms that have a negative effect on game enjoyment. I just hope that Death Guard get something nice in return, but we won't see until the end of the month/beginning og December.


TIL "any rule that might result in a thing I am targeting not immediately dying" = "weird mechanism that have a negative effect on game enjoyment."

Theres no reason why W2 plague marines with 5++ would be unbalanceable. DG termies are currently W2 models with 2+/5++/5+FNP. If they had to cost 24ppm and be extremely defensively oriented vs their offense, then...idk...great? Good? I'm glad there is a defensive army in 40k?


The way DG is implemented is unfun to play against a lot of the time. Roll an armys worth of shots and ping off a couple of wounds through 4-5 rounds of rolling dice, it's a massive time sink.

10 intercessors fire twice, reroll 1's to hit, wound rolls, reroll 1's to wound, saves, DR, DR rerolls (possibly) aaaaand you do 2-3 wounds for all that dice rolling.

Going from a 5+++ to a 6+++ wouldn't cut down on any dice rolling. And they're no more aggravating to kill than Custodes IMO. And most of that rolling you're complaining about is loyalists.


In part, but it's still mentally deflating to know that 3/4 of whatever you shoot is just wasted rolling most of the time. Powering up your havocs with stacking buffs and spending resources to then chip 4-5 wounds off a vehicle doesn't feel great
   
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That's kind of the whole point of DG, isn't it? High durability, low damage output. If you change that, it's just a another flavor of marines.

I any case 6+++ would be really annoying. Nothing is more fun that rolling for models one at a time with almost no chance of a positive result. Might as well just have removed it completely.

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 Brutus_Apex wrote:
It's possible that DG get +1 to their Disgustingly Resilient roll if they are battlforged.

Getting +1 to something that only works on a natural 6 doesn't actually do anything.

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Dudeface wrote:
 Gadzilla666 wrote:
Dudeface wrote:
Spoiler:
the_scotsman wrote:
 Eldarsif wrote:
Tyel wrote:
Wouldn't be shocked if DG lost the 5+++, because it would be easier to balance offense/defence on a 6+++. As people have said, 2 wound plague marines with a 5++ would need to be quite expensive and it might have ended up being silly. (Can a 25 point unit really just have a boltgun for instance? Probably not.)


It's a good point, and with the removal of the 3++ Storm Shield it does feel like they are trying to reign in any weird mechanisms that have a negative effect on game enjoyment. I just hope that Death Guard get something nice in return, but we won't see until the end of the month/beginning og December.


TIL "any rule that might result in a thing I am targeting not immediately dying" = "weird mechanism that have a negative effect on game enjoyment."

Theres no reason why W2 plague marines with 5++ would be unbalanceable. DG termies are currently W2 models with 2+/5++/5+FNP. If they had to cost 24ppm and be extremely defensively oriented vs their offense, then...idk...great? Good? I'm glad there is a defensive army in 40k?


The way DG is implemented is unfun to play against a lot of the time. Roll an armys worth of shots and ping off a couple of wounds through 4-5 rounds of rolling dice, it's a massive time sink.

10 intercessors fire twice, reroll 1's to hit, wound rolls, reroll 1's to wound, saves, DR, DR rerolls (possibly) aaaaand you do 2-3 wounds for all that dice rolling.

Going from a 5+++ to a 6+++ wouldn't cut down on any dice rolling. And they're no more aggravating to kill than Custodes IMO. And most of that rolling you're complaining about is loyalists.


In part, but it's still mentally deflating to know that 3/4 of whatever you shoot is just wasted rolling most of the time. Powering up your havocs with stacking buffs and spending resources to then chip 4-5 wounds off a vehicle doesn't feel great

Perhaps, but it also doesn't feel good to have a 300+ PPM vehicle blown off the table in a single round of shooting from six eradicators that cost less than the vehicle in question. One would think gw could find a balance between the two. I'm not sure we should be complaining about an army that's actually durable with how killy most things in 40k currently are.
   
 
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