Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

My (unplayed) CSM list for the local tourney scene looks like most. It looks like the one that won last November, with a minor change or two. It looks like the usual 2 DPs, some PM/CSM/Khonre in rhinos and Oblit spam.

I was thinking about alternate builds for a couple reasons:

1. I'm not going to be doing well. I'm really rusty and it'll be a while until I'm up to speed the other guys smashing around currently.
2. Thus, why not aim for ... Comp scores
Lastly,
3. Stupid Pride. I have almost always avoided the cookie cutter top builds.

So, lookin' at the CSM 'dex and I go over the elite & FA sections for alternatives. Since Chosen CSM can load up on many lovely toys like meltaguns, why am I not seeing this on posted lists, and not at all on the game tables? Chosen aren't that much more in cost (20%) of regular CSM, but it's a low 20%, like a few points. The Asp Champion is actually cheaper by 2 points. And you can hog up on 5 MGs!

Besides 'not scoring', why are these not being used?

Point cost, but if I were running C:CSM I'd run Chosen.

They are genuinely a pain in the ass to get to the enemy. You pay 3 points more a model for Infiltrate, but if you do so you'll have to slog your expensive Marines the last 13" into Meltagun range. Outflanking is cool, but when your weapon has a range of 12", coming on the wrong side of the board means they'll never contribute.

How about plasma guns and outflank them? That way they can threaten light armour and elite infantry at a longer range and are more effective if they come in the wrong board edge (you could also infiltrate and use them to prevent enemy elites getting too close to a certain area)

Outflanking in a Rhino is the most common way to run them, so as to extend their threat range and give them a chance to get somewhere useful in the event they come in on the wrong side.

That being said, in Seize Ground and Capture & Control there should rarely be a wrong side, if you're placing objectives carefully.

We also just had another thread about Chosen:




Automatically Appended Next Post:
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/334170.page

Mannahnin, thanks for the link and the thread ... 7 inches down the page (yeah, I shoulda saw it before starting this thread ).

As I was reading it, I was floored with the possibilities. Outflank a daemon bomb or two, in a rhino! Outflank a couple of rhinos.

Do you think anyone will be expecting the tactic, given how seldom Chosen seem to be used? Of course savvy players will quickly put it together and deploy defensively to counter it, , though as I *really* don't think anyone in the local scene has been using them.

Mannahnin, you use them. Does anyone else in your LGS?

I've seen them used at my LGS, but they're uncommon. I used them heavily in my 2008 GT list, but am not making a lot of use of them at present. The KP weakness is part of that.

The big issue with the idea of Outflanking them & using them as a summoning platform is the fact that they both roll for Reserve at the same time. If you field just one unit of each, you've only got around a 1 in 4 chance of them arriving in the order that you want. So you need to field multiple squads of each to make it at all reliable; and that becomes a fairly substantial investment.

Mannahnin wrote:The big issue with the idea of Outflanking them & using them as a summoning platform is the fact that they both roll for Reserve at the same time. If you field just one unit of each, you've only got around a 1 in 4 chance of them arriving in the order that you want. So you need to field multiple squads of each to make it at all reliable; and that becomes a fairly substantial investment.

Agreed.

The idea of a GD in someone's back field is quite tantalizing, innit?

'Course, why not simply have the rhino deploy as usual on Turn 1? Rhino rush into enemy lines (assuming that's smart for that game) and the daemons utilize the icons as normal?

At 2k, this seems like a viable split as opposed to Oblit spam. There's still enough points for troops.

I just need to buy another rhino or two. And the bitz.

I always thought they'd be great for spamming daemons in a Word Bearers army. Just pop them up somewhere close to an objective/the soft underbelly of your foe and keep em well hidden. If you pop a GD out, even better.

Chosen can outflank in a rhino with 3 melta guns and a pfist.

Pm/vanilla can be in a rhino with 2 melta guns and a pfist, count as a scoring unit, and cost less.

The problem with chosen is the basic csm troops are just too good.

They are an awesome unit that I see run quite a bit.

5 in a Rhino with 4 meltas and you have a 27" threat range off either flank. They are great for the points.

Try running 3 units of those and three units of Havocs with 4 special weapons in Rhinos. 6 mobile units packing 24 special weapons on the cheap.

Chosen are great.

Reecius wrote:They are an awesome unit that I see run quite a bit.

5 in a Rhino with 4 meltas and you have a 27" threat range off either flank. They are great for the points.

Try running 3 units of those and three units of Havocs with 4 special weapons in Rhinos. 6 mobile units packing 24 special weapons on the cheap.

Chosen are great.

In fact, an army with 3 Chosen squads in Rhinos, 3 Havocs units in Rhinos, and several CSM units in Rhinos, led by one or two Slanneshi Sorcerers, can be a tough army to beat.

Absolutely, my friends runs just the army you describe and he does very well with it. He also puts Havok laucnhers on each Rhino to cover anti-horde, and it is a nasty army to face. It looks cool, too.