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Here is a question that has bothered me for some time.

If you were a modern day soldier facing a SM in terminator armor, which of our modern weapons would be able to pierce the ceramite plating of your opponent where it is the thickest (like the chest plate)? In other words, how much can a terminator armor take?

Please forget about the training and mental conditions of SM and modern day soldiers, this is not the point of this poll.

I know that the list I gave above is not perfect, but I tried to give a concise, yet as complete as possible list of all our different types of weapons in the 21st century.

I chose not to include missiles and the like because:

a) I don't know much about them, I would not have been able to list different types of missiles used by our modern day armies;

b) the list would have become far too complicated.

So what do you guys think? Which of our modern toys would bring a terminator to its knees?

If they don't wear a helm then David with his sling and a pebble from a stream ought do the job.

Well its rare you'll ever see a SM terminator with a big gaping hole in his chest, so I'd say any regular infantry weapon wouldn't do it. Even explosive rounds such as those in a grenade launcher.

They'd probably be effective hitting in a joint where the force could work against opposing plates, but the chest?

30mm would probably be the lowest end calibre to "effectively" drop a termie, as in, before it drops you. I have the impression ceramite is more solid than giving, so multiple rapid hits to chip away it would probably be better than a big "crack and pause" such as what some modern artillery could offer with a slower rate of fire.

So a bushmaster M242 would probably do it, or a GAU8 haha.

Where is the option for "None Of The Above"

I don't believe any heavy artillery we poses currently is more powerful than an Earthshaker Battle Cannon and Termi's get their full save against it.

Futuristic armor composed of materials that are harder than anything we currently can create need futuristic weapons to penetrate them.

I belive it would take a direct hit from a 105mm cannon or above to do anything.


small arms fire does have a small chance because he could get hit in the eye lense, but that is pretty low chance and even smaller chance that it will kill the terminator.


any kind of fragmentation would be useless against the TDA so indirect hits from ordinance would do anything.



a shaped charge would probably stand a good chance of penetrating.

Savo rounds too.

Penetrating Tank round would approximately do something

someone have said before that space marine power armor is essentially wearing a TANK

Retrias wrote:Penetrating Tank round would approximately do something

someone have said before that space marine power armor is essentially wearing a TANK

I voted 105mm (a few of them), i reckon that is the only thing capable of stopping a TDA. But it would have to impact directly on the armor and not beside the termy.
Yea wearing a tank, with all its guns included, ON the arm. (shows how much I know about tanks)

Anti-tank and anti-aircraft guns effectiveness depends on the ammo used. So 20-30mm with a high rate of fire may do. MBT main guns would
penetrate for sure. Artillery in a direct Hit to the front plate again depends on ammo used.

If the ammo was meant to directly damage vehicles, it would most likely hurt termies.

Enough dudes with steel bayonets ought to do the trick

I don't think any of the rounds would do much to the suit. But then, you're being a bit vague as to the types of rounds in those calibers.

A 120mm depleted uranium tungsten dart moving at 1750 meters per second would do something I'm sure. That much mass moving at that speed will make its point (sorry) felt.

It's hard to say whether it would penetrate a suit of armor as celebrated in the fiction as a termie suit considering what it was designed for in the first place. I am fairly confident that a round of 120 DU APFSDS if it hit at the right angle would rip off an appendage. Some rounds of sufficient caliber moving at extreme velocity might impact and overcome the suits leg or arm motive units. Perhaps cause the legs to buckle at the impact.

Any HE rounds would do relatively nothing to the suit at the calibers you mention other than build a nice trench for the termie to fall into.

Solid shot rounds would be the way to go. You would try and fracture the suit or turn the occupant to jelly by pummelling it over a period of time with a barrage of rounds. Remembering the rules of physics, you could knock the termie suit around the battlefield like a toy with the mass of some rounds, but never crack it open.

Considering the nature of the weapons required to fire the rounds you'd mention I'd doubt you'd be able to keep a termie suit on target long enough even though they are relatively slow moving.

If a mass of solid rounds turning a termie into jelly is a way to take a TDA down, the amounts of rounds would probably be enough to destroy an army, assuming you mean small caliber rounds. Not to mention the occupant having undergone genetic engineering and has a solid piece of bone for a ribcage, which is not really a ribcage. It would take way too much time and people to take one down. Its worse when Termies come in squads and have more shooty weapons than you do.

Dicelowly wrote:Well its rare you'll ever see a SM terminator with a big gaping hole in his chest, so I'd say any regular infantry weapon wouldn't do it. Even explosive rounds such as those in a grenade launcher.

They'd probably be effective hitting in a joint where the force could work against opposing plates, but the chest?

30mm would probably be the lowest end calibre to "effectively" drop a termie, as in, before it drops you. I have the impression ceramite is more solid than giving, so multiple rapid hits to chip away it would probably be better than a big "crack and pause" such as what some modern artillery could offer with a slower rate of fire.

So a bushmaster M242 would probably do it, or a GAU8 haha.

A direct hit from an artillery shell would do the trick. Concussive wave would kill, more like obliterate, the operator inside, even with the armor. Plus, the mass of the suit cannot possibly weigh more then 1200 kilos. A tank shell or Gau-8 would give more then enough force to penetrate.

It's a suit of armor designed to operate inside of a FUNCTIONING NUCLEAR REACTOR! I don't think anything we have now could go through it, and even if you hit it with a sabot round, there's still that 5+ from whatever force field protects it.

As a culture that doesn't even posses las-locks, we're still more primitive than most societies within the fluff.

An0maly1 wrote:

Dicelowly wrote:Well its rare you'll ever see a SM terminator with a big gaping hole in his chest, so I'd say any regular infantry weapon wouldn't do it. Even explosive rounds such as those in a grenade launcher.

They'd probably be effective hitting in a joint where the force could work against opposing plates, but the chest?

30mm would probably be the lowest end calibre to "effectively" drop a termie, as in, before it drops you. I have the impression ceramite is more solid than giving, so multiple rapid hits to chip away it would probably be better than a big "crack and pause" such as what some modern artillery could offer with a slower rate of fire.

So a bushmaster M242 would probably do it, or a GAU8 haha.

A direct hit from an artillery shell would do the trick. Concussive wave would kill, more like obliterate, the operator inside, even with the armor. Plus, the mass of the suit cannot possibly weigh more then 1200 kilos. A tank shell or Gau-8 would give more then enough force to penetrate.

If this were true than Termi's would get instakilled with no save by the IG all day long. But they don't.

Arguing our current tech level VS science fiction armor created 20,000 years from now is moot. I do not believe anything we have currently can come close to hurting a Terminator... at least any more so than any gun has a chance of getting a lucky shot in.

But consider that a Las gun shot, a round from a Hydra Platform, an Earth Shaker round, and a Lemun Russ Cattle Cannon all have the same chance of armor penetration. I do not believe that there currently exists a weapon that would be considered AP 2 in the year 40,000 and especially not AP1.

Well, if we just think of physics any round of sufficient density moving at sufficient speed fired at the suit in an atmosphere with sufficient gravity will overcome the armor of a sufficiently limited density, but that wasn't the question and we aren't dealing with infinitely scalable variables.

Hell, why not fire a 120mm caliber neutron star round at 99% the speed of light at the suit?

I definitely think that an anti tank shell from a modern tank should at least wound the Terminator, take out some of its systems, etc.,

Now thats not to say that any one tank is going to be able to one shot a terminator but given enough shots I'm sure it would take out a termie

I do remember that there is a round that US. military tanks use called the Sabbot round and I'm sure it would be efficient.

Terminators armor, and the marine inside, is designed to withstand concussive forces.


the reason a Battle cannon doesn't penetrate TDA is because it is a fragmentation round.

against vehicle, it takes a direct hit to get the Str8 hit.

the fragmentation is Str8 to infantry(TDA), but the shell will 99% of the time never get a direct hit.

that represents the chance that a terminator would actually die to a Battlecannon.



i belive that only artillery and tank shells could penetrate TDA, and then only with a direct hit.




Now, multiple rounds hitting indirectly might eventually crack through the TDA through the sheer concussive force, but that would take a while and by then the terminator has killed your tank.

Read in Horus Rising when they talk about the first time the terminators are used to take the mountain fortress.

Son 0f Dorn wrote:Read in Horus Rising when they talk about the first time the terminators are used to take the mountain fortress.

Oh yeah, I forgot about that... lol.

Wait a minute

S1, armed with a pocket knife can kill a Terminator (at worst) 1 out of 111 times.

So a simple .22 round can kill a termie.

not often.. but it'll do the trick.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
this is with the understanding that a real life human punches at str 3, and a .22 calibre rifle hits much, much harder than that.

Ragnar4 wrote:Wait a minute

S1, armed with a pocket knife can kill a Terminator (at worst) 1 out of 111 times.

So a simple .22 round can kill a termie.

not often.. but it'll do the trick.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
this is with the understanding that a real life human punches at str 3, and a .22 calibre rifle hits much, much harder than that.

I was thinking of asking for 'maglite' to be added as an option as my guards massed lasguns can sure put the crimp on a unit of termies.

Uhlan wrote:

Son 0f Dorn wrote:Read in Horus Rising when they talk about the first time the terminators are used to take the mountain fortress.

Oh yeah, I forgot about that... lol.

Yeah. We can debate it all day, but we're comparing 3 different standards associated with something that doesn't exist in the first place. So to be able to know if a bullet could possibly get through hyper mega armor is on par with speculating how much food a unicorn eats.

Psst, umm, how much does a unicorn eat anyway?

You'd have to ask Voldemort. I hear he's got some experience.

Son 0f Dorn wrote:

Uhlan wrote:

Son 0f Dorn wrote:Read in Horus Rising when they talk about the first time the terminators are used to take the mountain fortress.

Oh yeah, I forgot about that... lol.

Yeah. We can debate it all day, but we're comparing 3 different standards associated with something that doesn't exist in the first place. So to be able to know if a bullet could possibly get through hyper mega armor is on par with speculating how much food a unicorn eats.

Asking how much a Unicorn eats is a valid question in the Warhammer Fantasy Forums. It would probably get the same amount of debate as well.

"We're past the year 2000! Where are all the flying cars and sky cities?"
The generation tasked with designing them is bickering about nonsense on the interweb.

high-penetration multi-sage 105mm warhead like the RPG-29 could do it imo.

In fluff such as the siege of Vraks Terminators were vulnerable to enough small arms fire from Cultist stubbers anyway.

The question wasn't whether or not a lucky shot or shots from small arms fire can down a Terminator... it was what could puncture a Teminator's armor where it was thickest?

The question in fact is how tough the Terminator armor is.
And we already know that standard marine armor can withstand tank shell.
I think you forgot to put "tactical nuke" in the list

Ragnar4 wrote:Wait a minute

S1, armed with a pocket knife can kill a Terminator (at worst) 1 out of 111 times.

So a simple .22 round can kill a termie.

not often.. but it'll do the trick.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
this is with the understanding that a real life human punches at str 3, and a .22 calibre rifle hits much, much harder than that.

I think you would break your fist on the armor... Just saying. The rules dont need to have Space Marines with a new special rule: "And they shall only have broken fists"