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I agree. Orks already have many options to choose from, be it characters, vehicles or units.
I just want to be able to use them without feeling handicapped!
I would really like to see the meks do something more for vehicles besides carrying a KFF. I would like to see painboyz supporting squads of Nobz and Flashgits, and I would love the look of warbikers riding alongside buggies and trukks.

According to Stevo, theres a 2021 Munitorum field manual mk 1 that comes with the white dwarf magazine that puts Deffkopta rokkits at the same price tag as the Twin big shootas. Looking through the video, it sure does say 10+ points for rokkits but also for twin big shootas.

When does such a change go through? Is that relevant now already? I it a mistake?

Edit:
Apparently this change is different from the FAQ munitorum field manual thats online on games workshops own webpage. The name is the same, both is 2021 and mk 1, but for some reason the kopta rokkits are cheaper in the physical manual, than the PDF version

Wow, that might actually make them good again

I'm hoping that this is instead them making big shootas a lot better! otherwise there's no way 2 big shootas = 2 rokkits.

Maybe the Ork codex was already supposed to be out by the time this WD dropped and they forgot to change some things back.. Maybe it's a simple mistake and they accidentally pasted the same points cost twice. It'd certainly make them interesting but if it turns out to be true then GW better buff those damn big shootas through the roof, because that's not an equivalent loadout.

If it is true then a 5man deffkopta squad with evil sunz, visions in da smoke and drive-by krumpin' is even more tempting. It's pretty good even now but that feels like more in spite of the deffkoptas than anything else.

True. 6 big shoota shots dont seem to have the same value in my book as 2 rokkit shots.

Yeah really all i truly want new model wise is a proper warboss kit with actual options (as in give him access to damn near the entire codex, da boss gets da biggest an' bestest toyz so why the gak does he only get an S4 AP0 gun...)

Both because proper warbosses are ancient models and usually require modification, but also because GW's mindset = they wont do anything unless its a new model as well, and bosses need more than a statboost they need options.

Most likley they'll get a few upgrades like the various marine characters. Or at least I certainly hope so. Very keen to see all the stuff DE gets.

Well tomorrow we have a GW preview. So maybe we'll get lucky with that?

cody.d. wrote:
Most likley they'll get a few upgrades like the various marine characters. Or at least I certainly hope so. Very keen to see all the stuff DE gets.

Well tomorrow we have a GW preview. So maybe we'll get lucky with that?

Well it looks like we are getting a model for Snakebites.

Love it. Anti big stuff things according to chat and in theme with the klan meme.

EDIT: maybe, just maybe, it hints at more Klan related units?

Going by the artwork in the teaser we may be getting a good deal more than just squigboar cavalry. The war-wagon and the savage boss seemed a little too specific in their design to not be alluding to actual models in production.

So that reveals what we thought was a new big mek model from the teaser a while ago

Ugh, AoS pig-noses... :(

Looks like they are going to just relabel a whole bunch of AoS stuff "snakebites" and drop it on us.

 Jidmah wrote:
Ugh, AoS pig-noses... :(

Looks like they are going to just relabel a whole bunch of AoS stuff "snakebites" and drop it on us.

Pig-noses are not new for Orks, but yea whoever they've got working on the non-goblin greenskin stuff in general is not the greatest at sculpting Orc/Ork heads. Weak jawlines, undersized tusks, not very expressive faces, and they sort of squash the noses a bit too much.

I have no objections on general principles with the idea of expanding the squig beasts and low-tech Ork end of our range. I'd have preferred it to come after they addressed a few key models that are outdated, we all know the ones, but GW will always find wholly new model releases more attractive than redesigns.

The new squig riders I'm not quite sold on but maybe I'll warm up to them. What are we thinking T6 and 4 wounds? Basically bigger nob bikers with less dakka..?

That heavy chariot squig could be cool and the new mek/doc has potential as well. But I'm mostly psyched about what looks like a new "vanilla" warboss in mega armour (with presumably BS4+ since it's a grot-manned, shoulder mounted gun).

The Ork in the video says, "...we're the strongest, in any clan we're in", which suggests that Beast Snaggas are not (exclusively) Snakebites, but rather a group like Speed Freeks that can work in any clan. While I don't exactly miss my 2e Boar Boyz, I do like the idea of having more Squigs around.

Also, the mini reveal suggests that the new Ork Codex isn't too far off, as Ad Mech has to be next, and then probably Sisters, and then Orks.

Not really. 40k orks have slightly triangular noses, those flat round noses can only be found on ork release for AoS.

I know it's just a matter of taste, but I really don't like the look.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 AceXT wrote:
The Ork in the video says, "...we're the strongest, in any clan we're in", which suggests that Beast Snaggas are not (exclusively) Snakebites, but rather a group like Speed Freeks that can work in any clan. While I don't exactly miss my 2e Boar Boyz, I do like the idea of having more Squigs around.

Also, the mini reveal suggests that the new Ork Codex isn't too far off, as Ad Mech has to be next, and then probably Sisters, and then Orks.

Possible, considering how feral orks are to snakebites as speed freeks are to evil suns.

Squig cav, NICE! I was not expecting a bone to be thrown for Orks in the preview. While I am glad that they're giving us new things, I am also worried this will be an excuse for them to avoid updating stuff like deffkoptas and our Warboss. So at the very least, I hope that this is a larger scale release that covers enough of our older stuff that needs updating while also bringing in new design elements.

Yeah, they might just have a keyword like speed freeks and gain an extra little buff if you use them as snakebites. Or they might be like flash gitz and they're separate from the rest of the kulturs unless you're playing snakebites but otherwise they don't break your detachments.

Hmm I still have 12 ork cyboars that seem to proxy fine as these new orks but we will see when they finally come out if I can dust off those old models or buy new ones.

To be fair I see several new models in that video. Which is significant since most of the models in the artwork are already legit models so showing specific models like new squig riders and a new warboss is huge deal.
New models in artwork
Squig riders
Heavy weapon squig riders
Mega armor warboss
Plus red squigs which might not be new models.

PiñaColada wrote:
The new squig riders I'm not quite sold on but maybe I'll warm up to them. What are we thinking T6 and 4 wounds? Basically bigger nob bikers with less dakka..?

I wouldn't discount 4 wounds just by virtue of the size of the mount, but the one shown is definitely not meant to be a Nob, the grot is much too large compared to the rider for it to be anything but a Boy. We do see a larger, cyborked-up rider in the trailer art that is likely the boss Nob. He's also got a double clawed weapon that looks an awful lot like a rumor engine from a while back.

 Jidmah wrote:
Not really. 40k orks have slightly triangular noses, those flat round noses can only be found on ork release for AoS.

I know it's just a matter of taste, but I really don't like the look.

What I'm saying is, most Orcs/Orks (regardless of setting) have that style of nose and they're staying consistent to it, but the sculptor who's been getting the greenskin projects lately is not very good at getting the details right on the prototypical Orc/Ork face. One of the telltales is that the nose is a bit pudgier and more rounded on the corners than it should be. Ironjaws don't have this problem (though they still have weak jawlines), but take a look at several of the heads from the buggy releases and you'll see those noses.

There's always headswaps, though. These guys are probably not on my list to acquire but Mork knows we've all got spare heads for days, shouldn't be a problem.

Madjob wrote:

PiñaColada wrote:
The new squig riders I'm not quite sold on but maybe I'll warm up to them. What are we thinking T6 and 4 wounds? Basically bigger nob bikers with less dakka..?

I wouldn't discount 4 wounds just by virtue of the size of the mount, but the one shown is definitely not meant to be a Nob, the grot is much too large compared to the rider for it to be anything but a Boy. We do see a larger, cyborked-up rider in the trailer art that is likely the boss Nob. He's also got a double clawed weapon that looks an awful lot like a rumor engine from a while back.

No, the Ork is clearly a boy and not a nob. But I was just talking about datasheets and I assume that the giant squig has a decent/good attack profile in addition to what the boy and grot bring to the table. The clawed up guy I presume (much like you) is wielding the klaw from the rumour engine, which I assumed was a snagga klaw then and considering the name of these guys it surely has to be now, right?

Not sure how i feel about them.
We already have 3 "biker" type units, though one is a vehicle atm for some reason and naturally this would be cavalry but similar roles regardless.
In addition....that looks like a fantasy ork with a 40k melee weapon. Which feels jarring.

It will be interesting to see how they differentiate them appropriately without stepping too much on each other's toes, though I have a bad feeling they might do a repeat of what they did with the buggies and have 2 of them fall behind because there's too much overlap.

Ideally, regular warbikers get a big price cut and they're the cost efficient lower level dakka/choppa platform where you can pack the numbers. Nob Warbikers would need strats or weapons buffs for them to change, assuming the FW datasheet and points values stay the same. Deffkoptas should be focused on as a skirmishing/harrassment backfield unit. The new squig riders on the other hand should be the melee focused unit that wants to be in a scrum in the middle of the board, possibly with some form of mortal wound generation from charges. I feel like Nob bikers or Warbikers will probably be one of the losers in this update, since they're limited to a fairly one-note loadout that will require some form of bespoke ruleset or significant price cut to be competitive.

 Vineheart01 wrote:
Not sure how i feel about them.
We already have 3 "biker" type units, though one is a vehicle atm for some reason and naturally this would be cavalry but similar roles regardless.
In addition....that looks like a fantasy ork with a 40k melee weapon. Which feels jarring.

Warbikers are extremely underwhelming as melee cavalry, and from the description given in the stream these guys also seem to be geared towards going after heavy targets (monsters and vehicles), so while there might be a bit of role jostling with Nob bikers, there is an unfilled niche they can fit, depending on the price and stats. As far as weapons go I will reserve judgment until we see more of the kit, plus there's something odd going on with the rider's weapon - it almost looks like there's micro-rokkits attached to it, so I do wonder if these are going to be melee and shooting profile weapons (probably short range high Str).

I think there will be bigger redundancy conflicts with a couple of the other, potentially teased models in the trailer - slugga/choppa squig rider boyz (because you definitely think of orks when it comes to cavalry mounted pistol shootists?!) and the big squigboar-pulled wagon that is absolutely bristling with guns. How many more heavy tanks do we really need?

Cavalry will most likely be the melee versions of bikers/buggie... especially if they have thier own version of warboss on bike if not hopefully the warboss on bike waaagh ability will include cavalry.

Buggies should stay as mobile gun platforms as none of them are really decent at melee. Some like the scrapjet are just okay at it. Warbikers should be similar to squig riders but much faster and have more dakka gun shots... in other words squig riders should be slower cheaper and have more attacks overall but have a few hard hitting melee hits and FNP. Honestly snakebites should have thier class ability upgraded to a +1 fnp modifier and stack w painboy/squig riders. I agree though someone is going to be the odd man out.

I’m suspecting squig units to be much slower then bikers/buggies... 6in movement is my guess 8in if we are lucky...

 DrGiggles wrote:

cody.d. wrote:
Most likley they'll get a few upgrades like the various marine characters. Or at least I certainly hope so. Very keen to see all the stuff DE gets.

Well tomorrow we have a GW preview. So maybe we'll get lucky with that?

Well it looks like we are getting a model for Snakebites.

Spoiler:

Well i have been saying for ages that orks need more squig representation. Also is it odd i think the grot looks better than the actual rider?

I've just taken a closer look at the choppa they're holding. Looks like a rough rider esque explosive weapon or a power stabba to me.

 Afrodactyl wrote:
I've just taken a closer look at the choppa they're holding. Looks like a rough rider esque explosive weapon or a power stabba to me.

Yeah you're right. Some sort of rokkit or explosive tip to the spear? Goodness knows what the rules will be. Likley an extra swing from the grot and some extra chomps from the squig to suppliment a limited amount of high quality attacks from the spear itself. But just guessing mind you.

So next new ork wave is Snakebites? Well.... If I had liked to model some fantasy, I would play AoS.

After discussion here about different wagons, I' ve gave a try to them.

I run a list with usual mix of buggies and kommandos + deffrola Battlewagon (4 manz and 10grots inside), Gunwagon with ZagZap (10 boyz and kff mek inside) and Kannonwagon.

Jidmah, you were right. ZagZap is very decent. Last game was againts Tau with tones of -1to hit huge drons and ZagZap was exactly the solution.

MANz and Grots standing in front of them works also great. If you describe well how grot shield works in advance, most of the people shoot at grots first. So grots protect the MANz and you don' t have to waste the CP for the real grotshield

Edit - loot it on MANz deleted, my fault, sorry