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So, basically, I collect De, though I haven't gamed with them yet. I'm come back to the hobby after a 10 year hiatus and would consider myself to be a 'dabbler' at the moment. I collect, I paint, but have no one to game with.

On the odd occasion that I visit my flgs, I play against our manager on the beginners board... or sacrificial shrine as I'm coming to know it. Basically, I get my arse handed to me each time!

I take the orcs, trying to get the mentality that I have to be in cc to do my shizzle. The list as I recall it is:

Orcs -

20 boys, couple of big shootas
5 nobs
warchief
3x koptaz

Marines -

10 taci marines
dreadnought
captain sicarius
5 termis

The question is, which units are best suited to attacking the different squads? I've thrown boys at TM's and did... OK... nobs at termis and got squashed... Blew some paint off the dread with the koptaz, tore its arm off wi the warchief, then I just get chased about the board by everything and its bye bye greenskins!

Anything you might suggest? Manager man is getting cocky, and i need to level the playing field!

Cheers,

Kitch

You lose everytime or your meant too.
There Is a point difference between the two.

The best thing Is too multi assault. Koptas for taking out the Dread. Warboss and Nobz multi assault with the Boyz at the Termies and wipe them then move on towards the tactical using the Koptas too assault too stop them shooting.

Scout your Koptas behind BLOS or behind the dread. Fire at him kill It then do what I said

Seeing how th Assault on Black Reach did result in a SM victory, it only makes sense that there are SM points then Ork points there.

Just do the above mentioned advice and you should do fine.

The AoBR captain, is not meant to be Captain Sicarius. There's your huge problem right there.

Thanks, I tried them individually (nobs and boys) and lost each time, though didnt try just weighing 'em down. I suffered a narrow defeat in my first game, and was obliterated in the second. That could just be because his deployment zone was about 12" further forward than it should it have been but ah well, that should've only helped my cause.

So you'd say my flgs manager's a cheating swine too then Yuber?! Thank god, I thought it was just me

The Marines have more points. especially if they use the captain as siccarius.

Between a regular captain and captain siccarius is a 100 point difference in unit cost.

He's significantly stronger:
Sicarius gives a initiative reroll.
His tactical squad gets extra special rules at no cost
Plus he has better wargear as the regular captain.

In AoBR there is already a 135 point difference to the benefit of the SM, i suggest for a fair fight, get extra defkoptas to even the points or to have your FLGS manager to drop the dreadnought and use regular captain rules.

This should still be a fair fight.

kitch102 wrote:Thanks, I tried them individually (nobs and boys) and lost each time, though didnt try just weighing 'em down. I suffered a narrow defeat in my first game, and was obliterated in the second. That could just be because his deployment zone was about 12" further forward than it should it have been but ah well, that should've only helped my cause.

So you'd say my flgs manager's a cheating swine too then Yuber?! Thank god, I thought it was just me

Yes because even without the sicarius upgrade, you are still gimped in terms of points. Even out the points by turning that warboss into ghazghkull, and convert those BP+CCW on your boys into shootas. That way you can always outshoot his Tac Marines and Terminators. The dreadnought is the real problem here because I dont think you have the proper tools to deal with AV12.

Just use the Boyz as your firebase and have the Warboss and Nobz standby for countercharge. The very moment you kill off the dread, there will be a huge breathing space for you - this is ofcourse assuming that he is playing with a normal captain not sicarius: A guy with 2+ armor save, 4+ invu save and FNP is just unfair.

Kopta's missiles are the only thing you have for shooting the dread. Use Nobs to beat on tactical marines and use boyz to beat on terminators. Terminators instant death the Nobs, and the Dread instant deaths the Warboss, and you cant afford that when you already are playing a bit behind points-wise.

The warboss is pretty good at stomping everything else the Marine player has, however, with his s10 klaw that ignores their saves, so of course use him as much as possible.

As for your table, stick to cover when possible. Sure its dangerous for your koptas, but the marine player is packing a missile launcher and a multimelta which instant death you... better to risk dangerous terrain to get a 4+ save than to eat an instant death attack.

my advised... as dirty as it makes me feel to say... play as the space marines. as said there is a desparity in points between the two sides. The starter box heavily favors the marines. you don't get a nob with the 20 boys, you get 5 nobs but with the exact same equipment for no wound shenanagins. The fact that your fls is using the captain as a special character that he may be somewhat close looking to... but isn't meant to be for balance is not helping.

I think they (GW) did the box like that to corale more players toward space marines which are their bread and butter income wise.

I'm an old marine player anyway, and wanted the challenge of a different race with a different style of play.

Wedging the box to favour marines definitely sounds like something GW would do, ah well.

Thanks all, I'll try again taking your tactics in to account and will feed back with the results.

You could also declare the warboss to be mad doc grotsnik, and give everyone a 5+ inv..

Get a second warboss, and run two They are dirt cheap on ebay.

And yeah, your flgs guy is cheating his butt off in an already stacked deck..

Lol, it was just the introductory game, I dont collect or game orcs normally (have been tempted though) so I'm not that bothered, I just want to win with 'em! At least I know now why I'm losing so badly each time

It's funny, because everything the Orks get is a good choice for their army, while the Captain and regular Terminators aren't good choices for a SM one.

If you scaled the Ork side up to normal points levels, the army would be OK at least. I played against an army that was basically a double Space Marine AoBR list, and it didn't go well for my opponent. In fact, I almost can't conceive of any battle going well for my opponent with that list at 1500.

My tourney winning 1500 point list was 2 AoBR boxes of marines.

Pedro as converted captain
Librarian as converted captain
10 termies, 2 cyclones, 1 sarge converted to chainfist
2 ven dreds
2 tac squads, powerfists added

So this manager is taking an army that already has more than 100 points more than you, upgraded the HQ to a SC that is more than 100 extra points and is getting cocky because he's beating you?! What a tool.

Ask him for a proper game (so he has to drop something else so he can afford to take a second troop) of equal points and you'll have a lot more luck.

Nah, I wouldn't say he's getting cocky (if anything, that would almost always be me, irrespective of who's winning!), it's still a good vibe and - trust me - I still make him bleed, I just never win! There's been a couple of occasions where it's looked like it would swing in my favour - wiping out the dread in turn 3 with my warboss, annihilating his TM's with my boyz, but somehow he just kept managing to swing it back in his favour.

He's notorious for rolling a shed load of 1's in the early turns which is where I do well, but he seems to outmanouvere me in the latter, crushing me between termis, SC and TM's, having wiped out my heavy hitters.

The game itself was only ever so I could get used to playing the game - I keep threatening to destroy his Crimson Fists with my DE (just need to get back to painting...) - I never technically asked to win in these demo games!

Thanks for all the replies - it's good to know that I'm not necessarily a naff gamer, I've just had the odds stacked against me.