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If you think about it, there is one good thing bout Games Workshop selling their products for ridiculus amounts of money:
Imagine a box of Spees Meweens or anything else cost 4 or 5$; You'd think this would be pretty nice, right?
Now imagine the effect this would have on the hobby: Every noob would buy a billion armies, and the gaming community would be crowded with players who aren't taking the game seriously at all. After all, a box of models only costs 5 bucks. Nobody would paint their models to a high standard because theyd have so many.

So with the high prizes, you will find only the ones who take the hobby seriously will buid up an army.

Edited because of my lousy spelling


Edit; after some time

yeah i know i talked rubbish, please excuse me. wont happen again

You have a point there.

You mean high "prices." I came in here thinking it was something about GW's tournament prizes.

It's interesting to see a counterargument to GW's expensive hobby bits but I think I'll leave it to the rest of dakkadakka to respond negatively.

High prices also create another thing, older players. Kids nowadays have to wait for christmas or some other gift giving holiday to get a new box of tactical marines or a rhino, it's so expensive. While I enjoy the fact that there are less and less under-18 (kids) players, one does realize that this hobby will die here and now if we didn't get new blood.

Yes, while I do think the GW's prices are too high, I certainly am not asking for $4 for a 10 man tactical squad (or even a 5 man). I think a 10-15% price reduction is enough to give my wallet some breathing space and still make me feel like I'm paying a fair price for a product. As it is now, ebay and the Swap Shop are my mini stores

What a load of rubbish. This is just snobbery, keep the prices up to keep out people who aren't going to 'take it seriously'. Who are you to say what is and isn't taking the game seriously and who deserves to take part?

People don't paint their armies now, high standard or not, so bang goes that train of logic. The noobs do buy lots of armies and hops from one thing to the next.

What we have is people who can afford GW, and those that cannot. It's nothing to do with how well they play or how 'seriously' they take it. GW shops are full of kids screaming and throwing expensive models about and not bothering to paint or model anything properly. It's just a hobby for spoilt kids now, so I don't know where you get this glowing impression that maintaining high prices somehow create a better standard within the game. All the most serious wargaming takes place in other games and manufacturers not GW. You might as well argue that McDonalds shouldn't lower prices because it would allow a poorer standard of customer in through the door.

I'd happy run the risk letting these undesirables of yours into our hobby if it meant having cheaper models.

Howard's right, this is financial elitism. Cost isn't going to change people's mindset either way. It certainly doesn't now, it would be no different if it were cheaper. Besides, no-one's forcing you to play with this supposed gaming riff-raff.

I laughed OP well done for the funny!

What do you mean rubbish - it's GW's marketing plan. Seriously... MrMerlin is closer to the truth than you think.

RanTheCid wrote:What do you mean rubbish - it's GW's marketing plan. Seriously... MrMerlin is closer to the truth than you think.

...charging high prices to make people buy less?

You've got a point, but the price is only because its an independent company that's pretty unique, and well if thought about, plastic, resin and metal cost a lot to manufacture, especially on a large scale like GW do. that's why the prices are high, but when I started the hobby I went from space marines to tyranids to orks to necrons to orks again and I dont have all too much money, and another point about the army switching is that the company wont really care about it because their aim is solely to make a large profit of everything they sell. so I dont think there's an advantage or disadvantage to it really because at the end of the day your buying the models and making GW a profit.

htj wrote:

RanTheCid wrote:What do you mean rubbish - it's GW's marketing plan. Seriously... MrMerlin is closer to the truth than you think.

...charging high prices to make people buy less?

No, so people take it mor seriously

I know it is somewhat unfair to people with little money (me included, i have to rely on gifts and christmas money ) but i take it very seriously and many people i know also do. If they had low prizes, many small kids woud buy "those cool mall GI joe guys", not leran the rules properly and not paint them properly. I know a few of those kids, they have rich parents so spending 50€ here and there does not mean anything to them. They dont know the rules, throw their models around the room, paint them with two coulors in what seems to be 2 minutes and so on. That sucks.

Howard A Treesong wrote: All the most serious wargaming takes place in other games and manufacturers not GW.

For the sake of the like, 2 GW fans left on the site, I'd be careful with that.

There are still tons of GTs, RTTs, and hell, even the terribad Throne of Skulls, so, while your point remains valid, just wanted to slip this in.

TL;DR You're right, but the amount of GW based tournaments suggests a level of seriousness.

and that howard guy is completely right in my opinion

RanTheCid wrote:What do you mean rubbish - it's GW's marketing plan.

Again, Rubbish.

GW's 'marketing plan' is to sell overpriced miniatures to kids and their parents who don't know any better, as well as those in the wargaming community who can't seem to stop buying their product.

As to the OP - no, no, no. Your post reeks of both economical and in-game elitism. I would gladly embrace 40k again - I'd even convert over to Fantasy - if something that costs as much as a Tactical Squad (you call them 'Spees Meweens' - therefore I declare you don't take the hobby - whoops, sorry, GW games - seriously enough, and should therefore be forcibly removed from ever playing them again, and all your models should be melted down) were to be be priced so low.

Guess what? Even with the prices nowadays, people don't paint their armies. Even with the prices nowadays, kids will buy whole armies because it's either a) some sort of gift-giving holiday or b) a ploy by their parents to shut them up.

Unfortunately (and I really don't mean for this to be an negative comment leveled at you) you're most likely one of those 30-50 year olds who take GW games way to seriously. Games Workshop mainstream games - Fantasy and 40k - are kids games, meant to be played by kids and collected by kids. If you're an adult who plays, fine! I don't consider that weird. Hell, I've known 60 year olds who play paintball on the weekend, and what is paintball if not simply a more expensive version of 'Army Soldier' that little kids play. But any sort of 'elitist snobbery' just comes off as a pathetic, strange attempt to try and preserve something that perhaps used to be there in the first place, but isn't there today.

/rant

I don't agree with OP. It has a "look down your nose" feel to it. $5 squads for everybody!

Actually it is a negative. A greater base of players means a greater base of people you can choose from to play with. In our hobby we are stuck with the same faces pretty often and at least one of them we hate. I would love to play a decent kid with an unpainted army (yes they are out there) instead of a "my army is all painted manbaby" who cannot take it loosing.

Howard A Treesong wrote:What a load of rubbish. This is just snobbery, keep the prices up to keep out people who aren't going to 'take it seriously'. Who are you to say what is and isn't taking the game seriously and who deserves to take part?

People don't paint their armies now, high standard or not, so bang goes that train of logic. The noobs do buy lots of armies and hops from one thing to the next.

What we have is people who can afford GW, and those that cannot. It's nothing to do with how well they play or how 'seriously' they take it. GW shops are full of kids screaming and throwing expensive models about and not bothering to paint or model anything properly. It's just a hobby for spoilt kids now, so I don't know where you get this glowing impression that maintaining high prices somehow create a better standard within the game. All the most serious wargaming takes place in other games and manufacturers not GW. You might as well argue that McDonalds shouldn't lower prices because it would allow a poorer standard of customer in through the door.

I'd happy run the risk letting these undesirables of yours into our hobby if it meant having cheaper models.

I'm not saying the prices are good that way or anything, I'd actually like to see them fall by like 10-15%. I just said that there seems to be at least one good thing about them, wich is that people take expensive things more seriously.

And talking about the kids that don't treat models properly; as mentioned before, most f those kids propably have rich parents, or else they wouldn't throw a 50€ landraider around the room. but if that raider cost 10€, more people would treat it badly because its "just some 10 euro platic toy"

More people being in the hobby doesn't make it worse, it makes it better. You don't HAVE to play against people that don't take the game as seriously as you, and an increase in people playing 40k can only raise the number of serious players, not lower it...

MrMerlin wrote:
And talking about the kids that don't treat models properly; as mentioned before, most f those kids propably have rich parents, or else they wouldn't throw a 50€ landraider around the room. but if that raider cost 10€, more people would treat it badly because its "just some 10 euro platic toy.'

But it is essentially a '10 euro [plastic] toy'. Putting a 50€ price tag on it doesn't magically increase the model's quality.

Could you imagine if the world actually worked that way? I guess it wouldn't be so strange when people spend $120 on a pair of sneakers.

What people are trying to say is that, even though tons of "kids" would pick up the game, there would still be an influx of positive players, who would take the game absolutely seriously.

So ultimately, the effects would still be positive if the prices lowered.

Oh, you are serious Mr Merlin.
I thought you were being ironic.

My bad.
What am I saying!?

Your bad.

(but thanks for the chuckles. It is still very funny)

MrMerlin wrote:If you think about it, there is one good thing bout Games Workshop selling their products for ridiculus amounts of money:
Imagine a box of Spees Meweens or anything else cost 4 or 5$; You'd think this would be pretty nice, right?
Now imagine the effect this would have on the hobby: Every noob would buy a billion armies, and the gaming community would be crowded with players who aren't taking the game seriously at all. After all, a box of models only costs 5 bucks. Nobody would paint their models to a high standard because theyd have so many.

So with the high prizes, you will find only the ones who take the hobby seriously will buid up an army.

Edited because of my lousy spelling

Your funny oh wait your not trying to be funny.....

This is just elitism, can't stand people joining because they aren't ultra super serious as you are and if they don't have well painted models. Most if what you have said is utter BS.

The idea of Warhammer elitism is mega lulz

MrMerlin wrote:And talking about the kids that don't treat models properly; as mentioned before, most f those kids propably have rich parents, or else they wouldn't throw a 50€ landraider around the room. but if that raider cost 10€, more people would treat it badly because its "just some 10 euro platic toy"

Who cares? It's their stuff, let them do what they want with it. Let the vast majority of GW's sales be ground down to be snorted by yuppies, let it provide hardcore for building roads, let it be fired as ammunition by the army, whatever. If it reduces the price I get it for cheaper and I still get to do what I want with it. No yuppies snorting my stuff, why should I care what he does with his?

I have never understood people who say GW is insanely overpriced, because they are not really that bad TBH. If you compare them to PP fair enough, they are a bit worse, but don't exaggerate.

The thing that GW does that is bad is that they are manipulative b ds. Taking advantage of parents not knowing GWs little game. If they knew, maybe they might not spend so much on spoiling their kids. Maybe? I'm not sure, but they might not care.

One thing they do is that they somehow get us to play larger games than other games. That is their diamond for manipulation. In GW run tourneys and the such they set the points high, say 1500pts. And then they release stuff like apoc, planetstrike, spearhead, the such, so that we all have larger point values. That made it's toll, and I can just imagine the domino effect of people getting larger armies then other people getting larger armies so they can play, etc. It seems childish that we should play such large games, does it not? Why do we do that? That could sort GW out once and for all, but GW know that that is a hard process. We all need to decide that at the same time, the chances of that is pretty slim.

Now I remember why I used to want to be a sociologist.

So we get cheap, if small, armies, some rich kid get's spoilt, GW makes a fortune out of the rich kids. Everybody's happy.

Anyway with hope GW will go bankrupt at this rate of people stopping, maybe the parents would care if an army costs $300? Hopefully, with FOG and PP doing what they do best we might have a hope of that.

I've noticed a bit of pattern on DakkaDakka. The moment anyone sees common sense, and breaks away from the communist "The Cooperation Is Evil!" viewpoint this forum is stricken with and defend GW, they are branded a fanboy, or accused of elitism or snobbery. Heck, the original poster has a point.

And it is most certainly not true that people don't paint their armies anymore. Heck, I've seen "kids" with reasonably painted armies.

And what's wrong with Throne of Skulls?

Raising prices doesn't filter out non-serious players, it filters out poor players. Making a game like this less accessible can never be a good thing.

Also, the poster above me's argument is also garbage and breaks down to "those who disagree with me are wrong"

They are overpriced. If PP are as expensive they are overpriced too.

Given the age of some of GW's moulds they have been paid for several times over by now.
One of the reasons GW is so expensive is because people keep buying the damn things despite price rises.

Squiqshuasher:
To say that GW charge too much is hardly indication of card carrying membership of the CP!

To say that the OP is common sense is like saying the Flat Earth Society is the epitome of empirical reasoning

To suggest that GW should charge high prices to keep out the hoi poloi is elitist snobbery.
Good grief Charlie Brown, how is it anything other. Else the gibberings of an addled pan.

People defending the prices make me laugh. Have you looked at what's out there?
Look at a Tamiya M113a (1/35 scale so it's larger than a GW model):


Not look at a GW Rhino (which is based upon the M113a anyway):



Would it shock you to know that the Tamiya model costs $22.92 (USD) on Amazon and the GW Rhino costs $26.40 even though it's smaller and actually has less material, extras, realism and detail?

I buy GW models because I play GW games and they have me by the short and curlies because they (rightly so) have their own scale size that isn't matched by any competitors. If I had the patience and skill with green stuff, I'd buy a bunch of Tamiya tanks and Warlord games WW2 miniatures for troops.

These themes and threads always seem to pop up and usually I just skim past them or exit the thread altogether but I think this time I'll tip toe in. The global/market leader in any respect is always going to get the focus and blame and ire of any population/patronage regardless of whether they are better, similar or worse than any viable counterpart.

The USA sees it in ways both deserved and undeserved as one of the most financially and militarily powerful governments/nations on Earth.
Microsoft sees/has seen it as a dominant force in software/computing.
The President of any nation will take blame and approval rating hits for things that congress/parliament etc. should be seeing a much larger blame for.
A sports team manager gets fired even when its the players who are not up to task.

Games workshop sees it as the market leader in minature based wargaming.

Privateer Press, Corvus Belli, Wyrd Minatures all make great games and have models that lots of people see as beautiful. I understand this is subjective, I personally don't care for warmachine but that's irrelevant to everyone else as it should be. These games are more skirmished based most likely for one most important reason: Cost of Entry. If it cost $800 to start infinity I wouldn't start it. As it is I just spent $150 on Infinity and probably have way too many models to use. This is exciting to me and kind to my wallet.

Please do not confuse however, the cost of entry with the cost of models. GW is not far out of line with most of their competitors on this front, and do have a lovely variety of multi part plastic models which personally are my favorite. I believe that if given the opportunity every one of these mini manufacturers would scale their game to 40k sized levels. They would have to want that. That sells product, and makes them lots of money.

People referred to financial elitism when he talked about cost of entry, I however find it equally offensive that people would use the analogy of a spoiled child with rich parents, or a 30-50 year old gamer with disposable income and a mental obsession. People who work hard for their money deserve to spend it as they like. Since those of you who are decrying other people spending their money on the same thing you are its pretty obvious what the issue is. You feel you don't have enough, and they don't deserve to have more than you.

It's not anyone's place to dictate the choices and terms of anyone elses life. Don't take umbrage on one side of this conversation and then commit the same kind of offense on the other.