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Made in au
Dangerous Leadbelcher






Australia

jp400 wrote:I think the damn charges should be just like any other weapon.

Roll to hit, and if you miss.... well you miss.

Nothing like throwing the Charge and haveing it somehow hit behind your guys.

Must be a strong headwind.


But then, what's supposed to happen if you miss? Does it just float off into space or something? Vanish into another dimension?
   
Made in au
Owns Whole Set of Skullz Techpriests






Versteckt in den Schatten deines Geistes.

But why can't a person play Salamanders withing bringing Vulkan Whatshisface to every battle? Why can't I use a Ravenwing army without having to have Shrike show up to every battle? Why does the Master of the Deathwing attend every conflict the Deathwing participate in, no matter how minor?

These are the reasons I dislike the current special characters. I really like special characters - Calgar and Yarrick especially - but I shouldn't need to take them to play a style of army. Once I have to do that, they cease being special and become mandatory.

BYE

Industrial Insanity - My Terrain Blog
"GW really needs to understand 'Less is more' when it comes to AoS." - Wha-Mu-077

 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





lalabox wrote:
jp400 wrote:I think the damn charges should be just like any other weapon.

Roll to hit, and if you miss.... well you miss.

Nothing like throwing the Charge and haveing it somehow hit behind your guys.

Must be a strong headwind.


But then, what's supposed to happen if you miss? Does it just float off into space or something? Vanish into another dimension?


The same thing as every other weapon in the game when you miss....

Nothing!

Also is it just me or is anyone else not excited about the ICBM of doom? Sure its a beast, but how much is it going to cost for a weapon that you only get one shot per game at BS 3?
Now if it was BS 4 id pay through the nose for it. lol

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2009/02/23 06:48:58


 
   
Made in us
Fireknife Shas'el





A bizarre array of focusing mirrors and lenses turning my phrases into even more accurate clones of

lalabox wrote:
jp400 wrote:I think the damn charges should be just like any other weapon.

Roll to hit, and if you miss.... well you miss.

Nothing like throwing the Charge and haveing it somehow hit behind your guys.

Must be a strong headwind.


But then, what's supposed to happen if you miss? Does it just float off into space or something? Vanish into another dimension?


Maybe he didn't prime it right or it's a dud. Nobody complains that missed laser shots don't continue to travel and hit something.

WARHAMS WARHAMS WARHAMS WARHAMS WARHAMS WARHAMS WARHAMS WARHAMS WARHAMS WARHAMS WARHAMS WARHAMS WARHAMS WARHAMS WARHAMS WARHAMS WARHAMS

2009, Year of the Dog
 
   
Made in au
Owns Whole Set of Skullz Techpriests






Versteckt in den Schatten deines Geistes.

jp400 wrote:Also is it just me or is anyone else not excited about the ICBM of doom?


I don't like it either, but not because of its rules. I dislike the idea of the Deathstrike being an actual Guard Codex unit because it just doesn't fit with 40K. Much like the Hydra, this is a unit that doesn't belong in the standard Guard Codex. It's a game suited more to play lots of Apoc games, not something you take in a regular game.

BYE

Industrial Insanity - My Terrain Blog
"GW really needs to understand 'Less is more' when it comes to AoS." - Wha-Mu-077

 
   
Made in us
Angry Chaos Agitator




Rochester, New York

lalabox wrote:
jp400 wrote:I think the damn charges should be just like any other weapon.

Roll to hit, and if you miss.... well you miss.

Nothing like throwing the Charge and haveing it somehow hit behind your guys.

Must be a strong headwind.


But then, what's supposed to happen if you miss? Does it just float off into space or something? Vanish into another dimension?


I vote "floats off somewhere".


: 4000 Points : 3000 Points : 2000 Points 
   
Made in us
Stone Bonkers Fabricator General






A garden grove on Citadel Station

The demolition charge can scatter and hit other things because it's not just a straight shot that has to be aimed to hit something, the demolition charge blows up a giant area.

ph34r's Forgeworld Phobos blog, current WIP: Iron Warriors and Skaven Tau
+From Iron Cometh Strength+ +From Strength Cometh Will+ +From Will Cometh Faith+ +From Faith Cometh Honor+ +From Honor Cometh Iron+
The Polito form is dead, insect. Are you afraid? What is it you fear? The end of your trivial existence?
When the history of my glory is written, your species shall only be a footnote to my magnificence.
 
   
Made in au
Owns Whole Set of Skullz Techpriests






Versteckt in den Schatten deines Geistes.

Yeah but how do you throw it forward and it ends up several meters behind you. That's just silly.

BYE

Industrial Insanity - My Terrain Blog
"GW really needs to understand 'Less is more' when it comes to AoS." - Wha-Mu-077

 
   
Made in us
Stone Bonkers Fabricator General






A garden grove on Citadel Station

H.B.M.C. wrote:Yeah but how do you throw it forward and it ends up several meters behind you. That's just silly.

BYE

Yeah, it can be pretty stupid how it scatters sometimes. I think that it should scatter, but not as much as it does now.

ph34r's Forgeworld Phobos blog, current WIP: Iron Warriors and Skaven Tau
+From Iron Cometh Strength+ +From Strength Cometh Will+ +From Will Cometh Faith+ +From Faith Cometh Honor+ +From Honor Cometh Iron+
The Polito form is dead, insect. Are you afraid? What is it you fear? The end of your trivial existence?
When the history of my glory is written, your species shall only be a footnote to my magnificence.
 
   
Made in gb
Stalwart Veteran Guard Sergeant






West Sussex, England

Well, you'd swing it backwards before you swing it forwards towards the enemy. It's entirely possible to let go of it on the swing back!

Play:
2000 Points 
1000 Points
1000 Points

 
   
Made in be
Guard Heavy Weapon Crewman




Dexy wrote:Well, you'd swing it backwards before you swing it forwards towards the enemy. It's entirely possible to let go of it on the swing back!


yeah that might be true, bet when a tank fires how can it explode behinde the tank?
   
Made in nl
[MOD]
Decrepit Dakkanaut






Cozy cockpit of an Archer ARC-5S

Chaos did it.

That's what Jervis said.



Fatum Iustum Stultorum



Fiat justitia ruat caelum

 
   
Made in gb
Fixture of Dakka





Southampton

Dexy wrote:Well, you'd swing it backwards before you swing it forwards towards the enemy. It's entirely possible to let go of it on the swing back!


Yes, that happens to me at bowling all the time

   
Made in de
Dominating Dominatrix






Piercing the heavens

Flashman wrote:
Dexy wrote:Well, you'd swing it backwards before you swing it forwards towards the enemy. It's entirely possible to let go of it on the swing back!


Yes, that happens to me at bowling all the time
I asumme you don't have that many bowling buddies left Flashman
   
Made in gb
Fixture of Dakka





Southampton

Anung Un Rama wrote:
Flashman wrote:
Dexy wrote:Well, you'd swing it backwards before you swing it forwards towards the enemy. It's entirely possible to let go of it on the swing back!


Yes, that happens to me at bowling all the time
I asumme you don't have that many bowling buddies left Flashman


Only ones with broken ankles

   
Made in gb
Fixture of Dakka





Southampton

Back on topic...

It was about time we had a good IG leak. It all looks very positive for Guard players (time to dig around in the Warhammer cupboard for that old box of Cadians), if not too overpowered.

   
Made in gb
Ultramarine Land Raider Pilot on Cruise Control






Yorkshire, UK

I don't fully undestand the issue with the new HW teams. If its two models on one base, fine. If its 2 models on seperate bases, equally fine.

In game terms either way you physically put the stuff on the table it will count as a single 2-wound model.

For those worried about the meat-shield effect, think about the way wound allocation works in 5th ed:
In 4th, you would have been able to fail up to 9 saves (from any weapon) without losing your HW. Now, you'll allocate 8 wounds to the rest of the squad before you need to allocate one to your HW team. As long as the wound you allocate is less than S6, you won't lose your HW to instant death. So the only way this is worse is if every wound is caused by S6 or greater.

It may even lead to your HW being able to survive more punishment, because until you get to the 18th allocated wound (or the 9th allocated wound of S6 or higher) you can guarantee they'll survive...

...they'll run away, but survive

While you sleep, they'll be waiting...

Have you thought about the Axis of Evil pension scheme? 
   
Made in de
Dominating Dominatrix






Piercing the heavens

Another plus-point of the new HW team rule is that you can add more characters to a unit without having to worry about space in dedicated transports.
   
Made in nl
[MOD]
Decrepit Dakkanaut






Cozy cockpit of an Archer ARC-5S

I doubt it works that way, they'd probably add a small line to their rules that they are bulky and therefore take up two spaces.

Besides, the Chimera has space for twelve men, more than enough for a full squad and attached somebodies.



Fatum Iustum Stultorum



Fiat justitia ruat caelum

 
   
Made in de
Dominating Dominatrix






Piercing the heavens

Oh right. I forgot that the Chimera was superior to the Rhino in pretty much every way
   
Made in nl
[MOD]
Decrepit Dakkanaut






Cozy cockpit of an Archer ARC-5S

Plus the Chimera is water tight.

But when the Chimera finally takes a dip in point cost she's well on her way to becoming the ultimate transport of the game again.



Fatum Iustum Stultorum



Fiat justitia ruat caelum

 
   
Made in de
Dominating Dominatrix






Piercing the heavens

Which it really shouldn't be, considering the hunk of junk the Emporer's finest have to use.
   
Made in gb
Legendary Dogfighter





Birmingham - GB

Sooo many options now......

scatter rules are daft, but fun. Will teach you to pick a better target. Also remember that most IG troops won't have specific training, give a 'normal' person a havy thing and tell them to make a hammer throw. Or check it on you tube. Bound to be on there. It's funny.

Chimeras mmmmmmm yummy. Wonder what options they add.

I agree that Hydras/Deathstrikes are apoc type things. They could be icluded to help encourage players to use bigger things in normal games (GW seem to be pushing this in WD and in store at the moment.)

I'm excited, surprised about the amount of options but happy.

Anyone have a picture of a colossus? Or any idea what one is?

I'm coming to get you

My Silver Deamon winning GD entry http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/302651.page

check out my P&M for more projects!

part of other hobby - dark age jewellery www.darkagejewellery.com 
   
Made in us
Veteran Inquisitor with Xenos Alliances






Anung Un Rama wrote:Which it really shouldn't be, considering the hunk of junk the Emporer's finest have to use.


I think its important to point out the main difference of marine and IG vehicles and the advantage of the rhino that doesn't have a way of being represented is that the Rhino can be carried on Tactical Transport, Thunderhawks and deployed by those means from orbit; IG have larger strategic transports that carry generally carry larger assets, say a company. It is much the same way the M113 can be air dropped but many superior armored vehicles can't. In the case of the space marines they need that ability and that simply means sacrificing vehicle combat effectiveness in exchange for more rapid deployment, airlift capability, ability to operate in vacuum, and surviving atmospheric entry. Those three thing are strategic abilities that fluff dictates these Space Marine vehicles have but IG vehicles wouldn't.
   
Made in us
The New Miss Macross!





Deep Frier of Mount Doom

Chimera_Calvin wrote:
It may even lead to your HW being able to survive more punishment, because until you get to the 18th allocated wound (or the 9th allocated wound of S6 or higher) you can guarantee they'll survive...

...they'll run away, but survive


depends. if you get shot from two units, it'll happen alot sooner. your scenario works only if all 18 wounds come from one enemy unit (unlikely even with marines shooting). if we assume a strength 4 ap5 weapon like a bolter, you'll only need 13-14 wounds from two squads. even if they're armed with the crappiest weapon in the game (our lasgun!), they only need 16-17 wounds from two squads.
   
Made in us
Heroic Senior Officer





Woodbridge, VA

Anung Un Rama wrote:Which it really shouldn't be, considering the hunk of junk the Emporer's finest have to use.


But........... The Guard ARE the Emperor's Finest!!

Don "MONDO"
www.ironfistleague.com
Northern VA/Southern MD 
   
Made in gb
Ultramarine Land Raider Pilot on Cruise Control






Yorkshire, UK

But how is that any different to the surrent situation?

At present, if the number of wounds equals the number of men left in the unit (from any source or at any point in the shooting phase) then both members of the HW team have to take a save (if applicable) or just die from AP5 or better.

When you change to a 2-wound model, unless the wound is S6 or greater (and such a wound should be easily shifted to a normal guardsman via wound allocation) you assign 1 wound to the HW team. Extra wounds then have to be assigned to the normal guardsmen until everyone has a second wound before a second wound get to the HW team.

This applies in every case, irrespective of when in the shooting phase it happens or how many men are left in the squad.

Only when the HW team has taken 1 wound does it become as vulnerable as a normal guardsman to the next batch of incoming fire (by which time the squad is probably splashed anyway).

While you sleep, they'll be waiting...

Have you thought about the Axis of Evil pension scheme? 
   
Made in de
Dominating Dominatrix






Piercing the heavens

aka_mythos wrote:
Anung Un Rama wrote:Which it really shouldn't be, considering the hunk of junk the Emporer's finest have to use.


I think its important to point out the main difference of marine and IG vehicles and the advantage of the rhino that doesn't have a way of being represented is that the Rhino can be carried on Tactical Transport, Thunderhawks and deployed by those means from orbit; IG have larger strategic transports that carry generally carry larger assets, say a company. It is much the same way the M113 can be air dropped but many superior armored vehicles can't. In the case of the space marines they need that ability and that simply means sacrificing vehicle combat effectiveness in exchange for more rapid deployment, airlift capability, ability to operate in vacuum, and surviving atmospheric entry. Those three thing are strategic abilities that fluff dictates these Space Marine vehicles have but IG vehicles wouldn't.

If a Rhino can be used in a vacuum, shouldn't it be at least be amphibic as well?
   
Made in us
The Last Chancer Who Survived





Norristown, PA

On that note, how do space marines with helmets off operate in a vacuum? Or are wars only fought on planets where you can breathe?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2009/02/23 15:59:49


 
   
Made in nl
[MOD]
Decrepit Dakkanaut






Cozy cockpit of an Archer ARC-5S

Rhino's and Lard Raiders are used as subs if not mistaken.



Fatum Iustum Stultorum



Fiat justitia ruat caelum

 
   
 
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