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I wrote this email to Workshop this week:

"Dear Games Workshop

I am emailing to complain regarding my recent purchase of this month's White Dwarf.

I have been into "The Hobby" for over 20 years now, including a stint working for Workshop, and had not bought a copy of White Dwarf for some years as, to be honest, I found the articles less and less interesting or relevant. However, with the new paints and Empire releases, both of which I am very excited about, I decided to buy this month's edition. I was extremely disappointed to realise that virtually all of the content is repeated on the website, which is of course free.

I was originally tempted to go into my local store (Leicester) and request a refund but I don't really want to fall out with the staff over this, as it clearly is not their fault.

This did raise a conversation between some buddies of mine as to the relevance of White Dwarf any more. Why bother going to the effort of producing a magazine when most of the material is on the web (clearly the revenue...)? The magazine has fallen a very long way, in my opinion, over the last 5-10 years and really feels much like a catalogue.

I should add I am not a Games Workshop "Hater" as you regularly see on forums such as DakkaDakka and Warseer. I think the models are the best in the world, and new armies are properly released now (with all the models), and I'm really excited about the new paints. I just feel that White Dwarf is a rip off, and as such I request a refund.

Yours faithfully

James"

And received the following reply:

"Hi James,

I am very sorry to hear you did not enjoy this month’s White Dwarf, I am curious as to which articles specifically you are referring that are repeated on the webstie in full? Although we have included a lot of material in White Dwarf and on the web about new paints and Empire I feel only small bits of it overlap which is inevitable when we want to inform people of the new products we have made. The White Dwarf also includes several articles including official rules that can found only in the book including the 40k Deathworld Campaign Rules, part 3 of the Warhammer Civil War Rules and the 40k Battle Report to name but a few. On this basis we will be unable to offer you a refund.

Thanks"

I have to say I could not be more annoyed with this response. The magazine has become such a non event that I hear, from people working at the head office, that the whole White Dwarf team got asked to reapply for their jobs this week. So, when a customer of 20+ years makes a complaint, you think they'd offer the refund even if I was completely wrong. I don't even want to think about the amount of money I've spent on Workshop stuff in that time.

Certainly won't be buying White Dwarf again in a hurry...

/rant over

Bit daft acting for a refund like mate, I mean.. WD is pretty much what it says on the cover.

I agree its absolute gak though!

I had a 12 month sub bought for me last Christmas and.. well.. I demanded the missus not renew it. The magazine is total dog gak, but I do think you come across as a tight bastard for asking for a refund.

I honestly am NOT a tight bastard - especially not on Workshop stuff!!! I just think it is not fair to charge for the magazine and then put it all on the web.

Fair do's, all I mean is I think I personally couldn't be fethed writing the email and then taking the cheque to the bank for a fiver.

Just do what I did and feth off buying anymore!

Yeah that is the ultimate plan. I suppose I figured if no-one moans, they'll never change anything...

Why didn't you just flick through it before you bought it.

Like everyone else does.

I haven't bought a WD in over 7 years (I did have a subscription gifted to me for 5-6 years, but that was someone else' money buying it) because of the general downturn in quality of content.

I liked the dreadfleet edition [as i call it] I suppose if I wanted to play any new army I'd buy it, but that is never the case
though with the renewing of lord of the rings, they might get a little better.

I haven't bought a White Dwarf since at least 2004. I pretty much stopped being interested when they stopped including other people's armies and conversions. When they axed Dok Butcha's Convershun Clinik that was pretty much it for me.

Since then it's just been a monthly GW catalogue, no longer care.

The fact is that it was never that great as a magazine.

In the current 'culture' of the 'community' promoted by the interwebz, where everything is terrible....

Back in the pre issue 100 days, it was often worth getting. Mind you, back in those days, WD was 95p.
Post ish 250, the downturn/slide started.

Magazine sales are down in general aren't they?
I would guess that White Dwarf isn't aimed at people like us any more (if it ever was) it's primarily aimed at kids.

I'm not sure why most of the creative stuff from WD is now gone. Surely these elements encouraged people to buy more models than 'Shiny advert'

What were you talking about in terms of the WD writers jobs, didn't quite understand that point.

I think asking for a refund was a bit unnecessary.

GW are probably well aware that WD doesn't cater to the same audience any more.

To be fair though, we don't really need WD, we have Dakka.

Fair play to you for asking for a refund I say, not because I'd expect you to get anything back, but nothing says "gak, we're doing something wrong here" than a customer demanding their money back!

I'm a subscriber personally, yeah I know it's nowhere near as good as it was in the Paul Sawyer days (that being when I first entered in to the hobby - I think that was his name... nickname "fat bloke"?!) and I frequently wish it would go back to its roots. I keep hanging in there almost expecting a change next month, like its a practical joke, so far I've been proved wrong lol.

So yeah, I'd like to see a step back to 10 years prior, a BR on fantasy and 40k every month, less on LotR (personal view), more painting articles, more "create your own xxxxx" articles... just more good stuff!

When I started right before 5th ed. I was pretty happy with WD, back then it was like $6 or something, I think the last issue I bought was the Island of Blood issue, it was a little before that that I noticed a drop in quality and a hike in price.

For me, it was when they took out the costs of product inorder to not scare people away that marked the turning point for me.

I used to think White Dwarf was worth the time, just for the little painting session in the back end of it, but then I joined this forum, and got all of my P&M tips from here, for significantly less, so I have not needed to purchase any more of them.

I get the Magazine for free as a perk from my FLGS, and I couldn't be happier with the magazine for how much I pay for it

All joking aside, the magazine isn't what it used to be going as far back as 2006. From 2006-2009 it was steadily declining, and it kind of plateaued in how bad it was. It's gotten better since then, but not much better. The sprue breakdowns of new models are great, the painting articles are fantastic, and occasionally they'll have something really cool like the Necrons vs. Black Templars campaign from a few issues back that's worth it. It's going back in the right direction right now, but not quick;y enough.

White Dwarf is as good as it ever was. Battle reports, photos of new models, painting articles, goldem demon pics, new rules...

What exactly are you expecting?

Battle Ready Studios wrote:White Dwarf is as good as it ever was. Battle reports, photos of new models, painting articles, goldem demon pics, new rules...

What exactly are you expecting?

Have you ever read WD's from as recent as six years ago? There used to be a lot more content, a lot more showcases on player and staff armies, converting and customizing articles, WAY better battle reports with more images and in-depth reporting with a lot of staff armies, columns where reader questions were answered, experimental rules for new units, and all the stuff that's in there now. However, this month's issue covering the new paints and the Deathworlds battle missions is pretty cool, and I'll be picking it up.

I'll echo the sentiment. Late 80's / very early 90's WD were pretty good. I remember the baneblade templates, numerous terrain projects, WFRP articles. I missed out on the D&D / Runequest inclusive era, but kind of started with the 'decent' GW hobby era.

I bought the latest issue purely for the mini-paint guides, which for me show what I can expect from the new paints. With 3 kids bombing around the house like sugar-fuelled hellions it's hard to get out to try paints duing the day and not catch flak from the wife. I had a subscription for a bit a couple of years back, based on an upsurge of decent masterclass articles, but they rapidly dried up. It's not really a good read these days at all.

Print media is dying. Why create aticles to put in a magazine? You have to spend money and time to create them, and then you have to charge money to cover the cost of creating them.

And then some hobbyist with a passion and some spare time creates a better article and puts it up on the web for free.

Whats the point?

It's not a phenomenon limited to White Dwarf, it's evident in almost all publications.

Its made for fans with sole purpose of been an expensive advertising pamphlet.

Makes sense to me, why would they do anything about it 0_o?

Whilst I agree the quality of content put into WD has deteriorated exponentially over the years asking for a refund was a bit futile.

Had they agreed the floodgates would of well and truly opened.

My first WD was issue 176 - I still own it and many of my other 'favourites' attained down the years. It was a thoroughly better product back then. As Brother SRM stated, every single aspect of WD has decreased in quality over the years from painting and modelling guides to battle reports (when did the 'new army' ever lose a Batrep? )

It's fair to say I believe the target market for the mag has shifted from the veteran collectors and gamers to the younger generation. From a business point of view this makes sense for GW. If the veteran gamers and collectors are already hooked and have more disposable income to spend on figures then why not flesh out the mag with a simpler, more catalogue(y) ?? feel and use it to act as revenue stream to draw in new hobbyists? The earlier they can get people into the hobby the more money they can ultimately make.

There is a good chance that the new generation getting into the hobby are as impressed with it as I was when I got my first WD. Hard to say as with age :( my perspective and expectations are different from when I was 11 years old. This may or may not have some bearing on our opinions of WD.

Boar

Jamumools wrote:I should add I am not a Games Workshop "Hater" as you regularly see on forums such as DakkaDakka and Warseer.

Oh yeah. Way to get everybody 'on side'.

Medium of Death wrote:I'm not sure why most of the creative stuff from WD is now gone.

That shouldn't be too hard to figure out. They used to have extensive articles on making terrain, and use it in their battle reports. Now everything is packaged GW terrain played on a RoB board. If they can't sell it pre-packaged, then they won't tell you about it. Why show off how they created a massive crashed space shuttle out of an old Star Wars toy and lots of expanded polystyrene when Skull Fort of Skully Skulls is out next month?

H.B.M.C. wrote:

Jamumools wrote:I should add I am not a Games Workshop "Hater" as you regularly see on forums such as DakkaDakka and Warseer.

Oh yeah. Way to get everybody 'on side'.



Yeah - I hadn't planned on putting this on Dakka...! There are a lot of GW haters on here - for me I love the models, love the games, hoping to love the new paints, so usually let any Workshop BS roll over the top of me. I just felt really miffed that I'd decided to take a punt on the WD and not only was it boring, but the content was online. I would not have asked for a refund if it I just didn't enjoy it - that would be taking the piss a little really.

I dislike the fail-ports it has most of the times...
I never bought it again since they stop scenic tutorials and conversions..
Most of the times nowdays is full of crap pages. Money for nothing IMO.

I have heard that big changes are afoot with the magazine.

I'm not at liberty to discuss why or how, but apparently it is not just the fans who are complaining..

(So, watch this space I guess?)

Maybe White Dwarf is like it is because it sells really well and lots of people like it and enjoy reading it?

It's not for everyone I'm sure, but the content it has is what some people want obviously.

WD isn't something I particularly like or find a use for, but I see plenty who do.

In my opinion, WD is like it is due to the target market.
A large amount of GW's business strategy is directed towards teenagers who have minimal exposure to alternative sources of hobby material.
These people
a) Don't know that better material can be found online
b) Don't know how much other magazines are
c) Don't know what quality of material is available in other magazines
d) Don't know how good the magazine used to be

I know it took me about 18 months from buying my first white dwarf to finding online material (though that was ~12 years ago) and even longer before I bought another print publication (Wired, which is consistently good to this day )

Changing White Dwarf in any way is catering to veterans, something GW has consistently shown no interest in doing.

Brother SRM wrote:

Battle Ready Studios wrote:White Dwarf is as good as it ever was. Battle reports, photos of new models, painting articles, goldem demon pics, new rules...

What exactly are you expecting?

Have you ever read WD's from as recent as six years ago? There used to be a lot more content, a lot more showcases on player and staff armies, converting and customizing articles, WAY better battle reports with more images and in-depth reporting with a lot of staff armies, columns where reader questions were answered, experimental rules for new units, and all the stuff that's in there now. However, this month's issue covering the new paints and the Deathworlds battle missions is pretty cool, and I'll be picking it up.

My first White Dwarf was issue 104.

Like GW responded, the current issues are full of pictures and new rules. Maybe the battle reports are less in depth, but I think those have ALWAYS been boring.

Pacific wrote:I have heard that big changes are afoot with the magazine.

I'm not at liberty to discuss why or how, but apparently it is not just the fans who are complaining..

(So, watch this space I guess?)

Source on that? That sounds like great news and I'm sure that sales have been hurt due to the low quality, but I'm curious where you heard that.

Battle Ready Studios wrote:
Like GW responded, the current issues are full of pictures and new rules. Maybe the battle reports are less in depth, but I think those have ALWAYS been boring.

Well if you don't like battle reports that's on you. If you read the average battle report now, it's the new army of the month vs. another studio army that you already see on the front of every box, and the new army almost always wins. Sometimes these reports are okay, sometimes they're 2 pages long and gloss over a lot of detail without going into any depth whatsoever. Going back about 6 years, two of the staff played against each other with Speed Freaks and an IG paratrooper company. Every model in both armies was converted, the Ork vehicles were really converted from toys and random junk, and both armies used Forgeworld aircraft. The report was a good 10 pages long, the pictures were awesome, I always knew what was going on, and they even built a story around it. Neither IG nor Orks were new that month; it was just a battle fought out because it would be fun. It even had rules for the custom scenario they were fighting, and a few pages highlighting some of the cooler conversions each army had.