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I have to admit - I have never seen Epic 40K played. And I've been in the hobby for about 15 years. My FLGS used to sell the models. But somehow the game was always overshadowed by 40K in my area.

Epic - just 40K's little brother? Or an interesting and unique game worth playing?

Definitely it is a specialty game. I just wonder if anyone actually plays it. Of those that do, does it offer something unique that 40K does not?

Thanks!
Solorg

I think you have a dead thread here too!

I had a bunch of Titans and indeed Marines from the 'Adeptus Titanicus' and 'Space Marine' sets, even some rather attractive Eldar Titans too.
However it doesn't look like GW are pushing these ranges at all these days.

Epic is better than 40K is, in my opinion. Certainly the game I'd be prepared to play more often.

The UK has a pretty solid event scene as well and the rules/lists are managed by the fanbase instead of getting a Wardex every 6 months and all that. GW abandoning the game is the best thing that happened to it IMO.

So, pretty healthy if you go looking for it.

http://epic-uk.co.uk/wp/

Ahhh Epic, so misunderstood but yet such a superior game.

Epic: Armageddon is a vastly more enjoyable and hugely tactical game. Far superior than 40k and the rules are so much tighter. The armies play exactly as they appear in the back story: Space Marines are a true rapid strike force, with an empty battlefield one minute and the next you've got thunderhawk strikes, drop pods landing, marines appearing everywhere and you're in a whole world of trouble. Imperial Guard are a proper lumbering shoot you to pieces type of force. And Titans are as they should be - heavy death machines with weapon ranges in the kilometres.

The game is different to the you-go-I-go system of 40k and is an activation based system. This is where each player alternates activating one of their own detachments. Battlefields are much more fluid affairs where you launch counterstrikes, outmaneuvering becomes a possibility with the special crossfire rule and tactics are the order of the day. Not forgetting the blast marker mechanic which is pretty nifty in giving you a visual clue to which units are in trouble.

 zedmeister wrote:
Ahhh Epic, so misunderstood but yet such a superior game.

Epic: Armageddon is a vastly more enjoyable and hugely tactical game. Far superior than 40k and the rules are so much tighter. The armies play exactly as they appear in the back story: Space Marines are a true rapid strike force, with an empty battlefield one minute and the next you've got thunderhawk strikes, drop pods landing, marines appearing everywhere and you're in a whole world of trouble. Imperial Guard are a proper lumbering shoot you to pieces type of force. And Titans are as they should be - heavy death machines with weapon ranges in the kilometres.

The game is different to the you-go-I-go system of 40k and is an activation based system. This is where each player alternates activating one of their own detachments. Battlefields are much more fluid affairs where you launch counterstrikes, outmaneuvering becomes a possibility with the special crossfire rule and tactics are the order of the day. Not forgetting the blast marker mechanic which is pretty nifty in giving you a visual clue to which units are in trouble.

Exactly this. Epic is... well, epic...

*Three LRBT companies of then vehicles later*
You can imagine why

GW certainly wants Epic to be dead and buried and they've gotten their wish from what I've seen.

I've played NetEpic (the fan-made successor to Epic: Space Marine rather than Epic: 40k) a couple of times in the last few years though not recently. I'm just finishing off painting a DA army, so I'm interested in playing again.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Harriticus wrote:
GW certainly wants Epic to be dead and buried and they've gotten their wish from what I've seen.

I don't know how the range you can buy on the website translates into units for the most recently game version, but if it's anything like Epic:SM then you can't really make armies out of what's there (except Space Marines, they seem to have almost the full collection of infantry and vehicle there).

The sales on the website don't mean very much. There's no support out from GW. People who are new to the hobby, get a bunch of epic kits, are going to find out GW pretends it doesn't exist.

Just to clarify.
Net Epic. the fan developed version of Epic Space marine is a great game.

Epic Armageddon is also a great game.(As zedmeister said.)

However, the edition in between Epic 40k was far to bland for many , after the depth of character Epic Space Marine had.(Net Epic.)

'Epic' is the game 40k pretends to be,but fails to deliver due to 40k focusing on minatures not game play.

Epic has more straightforward rules that are elegant and intuitive.And Epic delivers far more depth of game play than 40k could ever hope to.

So what were the differences between E:40K and and E:A?

Riquende wrote:
So what were the differences between E:40K and and E:A?

E:A is based on individual vehicles or infantry stands fighting in detachments where E:40k is basically based on the detachment itself.
example: shooting:

in E:A each vehicle or infantry stand gets to roll a number of dice based on the stat line for that vehicle/infantry stand

in E:40k each vehicle or infantry stand is assigned a firepower value, which is added to the firepower value of all the other vehicles/infantry stands to come up with a total value for the detachment that is cross referenced on a chart giving you the number of dice to roll against the target detachment

In my area, Epic40K killed off a very active Epic/Titan Legions player base.

The original epic game had become very cluttered and cumbersome to play over many editions but had a lot of fans. When Epic40k was introduced two things led to its demise in about one year.

1 Many players hated the rules because the units became more generic and lost a ton of special rules

2 GW was EXTREMELY slow at releasing models for all the races except space marines

The only downside to Epic, for me, is the outdated and ridiculously hard to get a hold of miniatures.

I've been hankering to get into a large scale, small models game. My first port of call was checking out what's available for Epic to build my 40k Tyranid army into an actual Hive Fleet invasion force (the overall goal was to also start BFG and build a Tyranid fleet as well).

Then I saw the Tyranid models are gone from the GW website. Strike 1. Ebay. Looks like I'll be paying about $80au for a 2 infantry boxes, which is... barely anything. Strike two. Then I remembered the models still have their 2nd edition aesthetics, which I really don't like regarding the Nids. Strike 3.

I'd be all over a new Epic. Updated model ranges using the new model aesthetics, preferably moving to 15mm rather than 6mm, but not essential. But in its current state, while I like the ruleset, I can't bring myself to pay exorbitant amounts of money on ebay for models I don't like.

 -Loki- wrote:
The only downside to Epic, for me, is the outdated and ridiculously hard to get a hold of miniatures.

I've been hankering to get into a large scale, small models game. My first port of call was checking out what's available for Epic to build my 40k Tyranid army into an actual Hive Fleet invasion force (the overall goal was to also start BFG and build a Tyranid fleet as well).

Then I saw the Tyranid models are gone from the GW website. Strike 1. Ebay. Looks like I'll be paying about $80au for a 2 infantry boxes, which is... barely anything. Strike two. Then I remembered the models still have their 2nd edition aesthetics, which I really don't like regarding the Nids. Strike 3.

I'd be all over a new Epic. Updated model ranges using the new model aesthetics, preferably moving to 15mm rather than 6mm, but not essential. But in its current state, while I like the ruleset, I can't bring myself to pay exorbitant amounts of money on ebay for models I don't like.

The only time I've played Tyranids was waay back when they had their Hive War expansion for Space Marine (with the special hexagonal army unit cards) I have to say I loved the Dominatrix model (doubt it would be called that in a rerelease!) but have to agree the rest was a little clunky.

Nothing lends itself better to the Epic scale than a massive, wide scale planetary hive fleet invasion by Nids!

 -Loki- wrote:
The only downside to Epic, for me, is the outdated and ridiculously hard to get a hold of miniatures.

I've been hankering to get into a large scale, small models game. My first port of call was checking out what's available for Epic to build my 40k Tyranid army into an actual Hive Fleet invasion force (the overall goal was to also start BFG and build a Tyranid fleet as well).

Then I saw the Tyranid models are gone from the GW website. Strike 1. Ebay. Looks like I'll be paying about $80au for a 2 infantry boxes, which is... barely anything. Strike two. Then I remembered the models still have their 2nd edition aesthetics, which I really don't like regarding the Nids. Strike 3.

I'd be all over a new Epic. Updated model ranges using the new model aesthetics, preferably moving to 15mm rather than 6mm, but not essential. But in its current state, while I like the ruleset, I can't bring myself to pay exorbitant amounts of money on ebay for models I don't like.

Tyrannids are definitely, by far the rarest and hardest to get of the epic armies. The problem is that the plastic box was only available for a short time during the epic 40K release and of course not at all from the epic armageddon release. The "buy it now" prices on ebay are really stupidly too high.

 azreal13 wrote:

 -Loki- wrote:
The only downside to Epic, for me, is the outdated and ridiculously hard to get a hold of miniatures.

I've been hankering to get into a large scale, small models game. My first port of call was checking out what's available for Epic to build my 40k Tyranid army into an actual Hive Fleet invasion force (the overall goal was to also start BFG and build a Tyranid fleet as well).

Then I saw the Tyranid models are gone from the GW website. Strike 1. Ebay. Looks like I'll be paying about $80au for a 2 infantry boxes, which is... barely anything. Strike two. Then I remembered the models still have their 2nd edition aesthetics, which I really don't like regarding the Nids. Strike 3.

I'd be all over a new Epic. Updated model ranges using the new model aesthetics, preferably moving to 15mm rather than 6mm, but not essential. But in its current state, while I like the ruleset, I can't bring myself to pay exorbitant amounts of money on ebay for models I don't like.

The only time I've played Tyranids was waay back when they had their Hive War expansion for Space Marine (with the special hexagonal army unit cards) I have to say I loved the Dominatrix model (doubt it would be called that in a rerelease!) but have to agree the rest was a little clunky.

Nothing lends itself better to the Epic scale than a massive, wide scale planetary hive fleet invasion by Nids!

That's when I started my bug collection. My brother and I got into Titan Legions, and I bought the Hive War expansion when it came out, then when we got into 2nd edition 40k, I grabbed Codex Tyranids straight away. I loved those style of bugs back then. Now they look pretty bad compared to what we have now.

And yeah, Tyranids exemplify the type of planetary war 40k is meant to be about. I mean, it's what they do. They don't do skirmishes, they do all out planetary war. And they're the worst represented army in Epic.

Honestly, the best thing that could come from a GW collapse would be someone redoing the Tyranid line in 6mm or 15mm.

Forgot to mention, check out the tactical wargames network: http://www.taccmd.tacticalwargames.net/

A huge epic community there

I missed out on a brand new, unopened, box of Epic:40k around 2 years ago. It came up on eBay as an auction with a starting price of £30.00. I ignored it, thinking that it would go much higher than that....It didn't. I could have had it, but some things are just meant to be...

Ebay prices for most stuff isn't that bad. I got nearly an entire Space Marine chapter for £30 (I'm only missing a Devastator company), most of the models were from the Space Marine edition of the game but thats fine by me.

While you can still buy (some) Epic stuff from GW the prices have reach crazy levels,even by GW's standards. There is no way that I am going to pay over £1 for a 6mm infantry model. The cost coupled with the sheer neglect that Epic has suffered has all but killed the game for the average gamer, it has become very hard to find people who actually play anymore.

in some ways I wish that it was still a core game but if it was I am sure that the rules would have been 'streamlined' by now just like $0k and Fantasy have been.

 Palindrome wrote:
Ebay prices for most stuff isn't that bad. I got nearly an entire Space Marine chapter for £30 (I'm only missing a Devastator company), most of the models were from the Space Marine edition of the game but thats fine by me.

Definitely. When Epic hunting on Ebay, beware of price gougers. For some reason, Epic has attracted a lot of price gougers but if you're patient for a few days, what you want usually turns up as they're pretty common models. £5-£10 for a set of three metal vehicles is usually a good price range to go for. Infantry can vary with Space Marines the cheapest and, as Loki mentioned, Tyranids being extreme. The original Imperial Guard sprue holds its value well. However, if you're after original metal Titan Weapons, Ordinatus, Warmonger Titans, Hellbores, Capital Imperialis or Tyranid Plastics, you'll be paying quite a bit (but again, ignore the gougers and you will find them cheaper when they turn up!)

I play E:A more often than 40k. Mainly as I like the rules much more and want to play army scale battles (which you can't do properly in 28mm scale).

GW certainly is trying to kill of Epic and spec games in general. Epic doesn't have any new armies from 3rd edition onwards (so no Necrons or Sisters of Battle, Tau was produced for a while by FW but no more), which makes it a bit more annoying as players can't get their 40k army in this scale automatically.

 Palindrome wrote:
Ebay prices for most stuff isn't that bad. I got nearly an entire Space Marine chapter for £30 (I'm only missing a Devastator company),

Space Marines are in general quite cheap because the old boxed game came with hundreds so they're relatively common. Orks and Eldar are also fairly common (but only the basic troops). Try making a similar sized army for Chaos!

I have about half a chapter in my DA army, and I was going to make an IG/Titan Legion army army as an ally/possible opponent but the price of infantry has curtailed its size somewhat.

Squats and Tyranids are the hardest to get hold of - I have a small army of both - say about 7500 points each, I haven't counted them up recently - and the Ebay prices are astronomical.

Other Epic stuff is quite plentiful if you are patient and can spot a bargain. I picked up an unopened, unpunched copy of Titan Legions the other day for £40 so it can be done.

Squats aren't too bad. The only thing that goes for a bit more than usual is the Cyclops.

Epic Armageddon is a great game, and should have been pushed in preference to the daftness of Apocalypse. But money talks, and they fundamentally don't want to sell lots of cheap 6mm tank companies when they can try to sell expensive 28mm tank companies.

The best thing that could happen to the system is if they turned Jervis, who wrote it, loose like they did Rick Priestly. How many variants of Warmaster are there out there now? And it's a GREAT system. Possibly the best GW have ever produced.

E:A is certainly the best rule system I've played. I'm not sure why GW dont bring the activation system to 40K, it makes for a far more tactical game than you-go-I-go.

I can see why lovers of previous versions didn't like Armageddon, as in comparison it is somewhat 'dumbed down' in some respects, but I think for range of tactical options combined with slick speed of play, E:A hard to beat.

 Palindrome wrote:
in some ways I wish that it was still a core game

Epic has never been a core game, and that's the actual problem.

In a pinch you could use Dystopian Wars or Dropzone Commander miniatures.

 -Loki- wrote:

 Palindrome wrote:
in some ways I wish that it was still a core game

Epic has never been a core game, and that's the actual problem.

It was once back in the early to mid 1990's. It was one of the big three 40K, WFB, and Epic

Yeah, those models don't make it out much. On the other hand, they're far from useless!

(I thought it would be neat to make the Storm Talon's base a scenic illustration of the 'escort' rule.