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Tsagualsa wrote:

 spiralingcadaver wrote:
Yeah, I get that they're useful for mechanical balance, but they also so quickly turned into a weird design space: especially when gear is common (yeah, smoke launchers) or unique and makes more sense to just be lumped into equipment you buy or come with.

At the current scale and scope of the game, stuff like smoke launchers is probably very near to the point that it just has to go away. Consider it 'always on' and built-in to general modifiers, cover and so on, and save actual wargear for stuff like sophisticated countermeasures or active denial systems.

This is a pretty reasonable take

That pastebin is plausible just because it makes the rules distribution situation seem like an incredibly convoluted mess that isn't really any use at all, and that sounds exactly like GW's rules distribution strategy.

Can we have digital codexes I can read on the train? No! Follow this flow chart that will explain if you can see the rules for this unit depending on fourteen different interactions!

 The Phazer wrote:
That pastebin is plausible just because it makes the rules distribution situation seem like an incredibly convoluted mess that isn't really any use at all, and that sounds exactly like GW's rules distribution strategy.

Can we have digital codexes I can read on the train? No! Follow this flow chart that will explain if you can see the rules for this unit depending on fourteen different interactions!

On the other hand, having printed inserts with rules in boxes, presumably in language-localized versions, would lead to a lot of overhead for packaging, shipping and handling as well as introducing another, historically unreliable factor into operations. That's the big red flag in this batch of rumours for me.

Tsagualsa wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

How big box you expect it be? 1k dollars?

Well they call it out as 'the most expensive box ever', and the current record holder is probably one of the boxes they did back when they had 'Apocalypse' as a concept.
999$ is a pricepoint i could see.

The most expensive single thing I remember actually seeing on GW's online store is the Chaos fortress when AoS launched. I don't remember if that was sold as a single box rather than a bundle collection of individual items, though. The price for that exceeded 1000€ (or USD, I don't quite remember since the spectacular thing was the four digits really) and provoked a lot of laughter.

On veracity, it's not hard to say moste expensive box ever because with some context it could be the most expensive launch or starter box GW did, and just be 5€, 10€ or 15€ more expensive than what, Horus Heresy or the Necromunda one with the Khornates? That would be plausible and in keeping with GW's approach to starter boxes, involve a price hike because GW and wouldn't stand out as outrageous in GW's ecosystem. Whereas selling a starter item, even if it's marketed as a launch box rather than a starter box, for many times what these things usually costs seems uncharacteristic for GW.

That was mentioned with gt pack so assuming rumour were legit either leaker got confused or tournament players are expected to buy that.

Or if organizer super thin terrain for boards as the price wouldn't even cover 1 proper table most likely

 Geifer wrote:

Tsagualsa wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

How big box you expect it be? 1k dollars?

Well they call it out as 'the most expensive box ever', and the current record holder is probably one of the boxes they did back when they had 'Apocalypse' as a concept.
999$ is a pricepoint i could see.

The most expensive single thing I remember actually seeing on GW's online store is the Chaos fortress when AoS launched. I don't remember if that was sold as a single box rather than a bundle collection of individual items, though. The price for that exceeded 1000€ (or USD, I don't quite remember since the spectacular thing was the four digits really) and provoked a lot of laughter.

Current record holder AFAIK is the Astartes Ultra set.

Think tournament scene with official copies of officient rules woxld die quicker than ice melts in sun if players had to pay that per year lol

 AduroT wrote:
I hope they go with AoS version of Stratagems. Here’s a ~dozen generic ones everyone has access to, but then many characters offer their own unique one they can use.

Absolutely. One similar command (strat) per phase allowed, with several choices each phase, just like AOS. Then the other command actions right on the datasheet.
It works so well in Sigmar, I truly hope they can do something similar.

 Valkyrie wrote:

 Geifer wrote:

Tsagualsa wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

How big box you expect it be? 1k dollars?

Well they call it out as 'the most expensive box ever', and the current record holder is probably one of the boxes they did back when they had 'Apocalypse' as a concept.
999$ is a pricepoint i could see.

The most expensive single thing I remember actually seeing on GW's online store is the Chaos fortress when AoS launched. I don't remember if that was sold as a single box rather than a bundle collection of individual items, though. The price for that exceeded 1000€ (or USD, I don't quite remember since the spectacular thing was the four digits really) and provoked a lot of laughter.

Current record holder AFAIK is the Astartes Ultra set.

Heh, beat me to it.

Well sigmar is odd one. At start of aos3 they increased generic oees but early books had virtually all warscroll specific ones removed. Then mid-edition design change happened with khainites and removal was reduced to most. Then with gits they took another route and certain characters have additional effect if they give certain command. So trollboss giving +1 to hit order also gives +1a. But it still is that generic command so can't give +1 to hit elsewhere.

Tsagualsa wrote:

 The Phazer wrote:
That pastebin is plausible just because it makes the rules distribution situation seem like an incredibly convoluted mess that isn't really any use at all, and that sounds exactly like GW's rules distribution strategy.

Can we have digital codexes I can read on the train? No! Follow this flow chart that will explain if you can see the rules for this unit depending on fourteen different interactions!

On the other hand, having printed inserts with rules in boxes, presumably in language-localized versions, would lead to a lot of overhead for packaging, shipping and handling as well as introducing another, historically unreliable factor into operations. That's the big red flag in this batch of rumours for me.

Not at all. They've already baked the rules on instruction booklets down to symbols and numbers, so there's very little localization of the rules parts that needs to be done.

It's plausible, especially if they push WH+ as the way you get all the 'base' datasheets in the apps. Then you don't have to fool around with whatever 'codes'.

The thing that reeks to me is... ok, so future kits will have these 'codes' or whatever, but what about kits people have already bought? If I bought the new Chaos Possessed before 10th, I'm just up shitake creek or something?

Ultimately doesn't matter, this is why the codexes exist, or, otherwise, list-building apps like battlescribe.

drbored wrote:


The thing that reeks to me is... ok, so future kits will have these 'codes' or whatever, but what about kits people have already bought? If I bought the new Chaos Possessed before 10th, I'm just up shitake creek or something?

Ultimately doesn't matter, this is why the codexes exist, or, otherwise, list-building apps like battlescribe.

The way it reads, you can use the box codes to get access to that specific unit or buy the codex(or the new package with every unit) and use THAT code to get access to all your faction's units.

Doesn't gw still offer the "build sheets" as free PDF downloads?

 Platuan4th wrote:

drbored wrote:


The thing that reeks to me is... ok, so future kits will have these 'codes' or whatever, but what about kits people have already bought? If I bought the new Chaos Possessed before 10th, I'm just up shitake creek or something?

Ultimately doesn't matter, this is why the codexes exist, or, otherwise, list-building apps like battlescribe.

The way it reads, you can use the box codes to get access to that specific unit or buy the codex(or the new package with every unit) and use THAT code to get access to all your faction's units.

With a "warhost" book at launch as a sort of catch up for all armies at once purchase.

 Geifer wrote:

Tsagualsa wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

How big box you expect it be? 1k dollars?

Well they call it out as 'the most expensive box ever', and the current record holder is probably one of the boxes they did back when they had 'Apocalypse' as a concept.
999$ is a pricepoint i could see.

The most expensive single thing I remember actually seeing on GW's online store is the Chaos fortress when AoS launched. I don't remember if that was sold as a single box rather than a bundle collection of individual items, though. The price for that exceeded 1000€ (or USD, I don't quite remember since the spectacular thing was the four digits really) and provoked a lot of laughter.

They did sell it in one big box. It's still sitting in my closet.

 Platuan4th wrote:

drbored wrote:


The thing that reeks to me is... ok, so future kits will have these 'codes' or whatever, but what about kits people have already bought? If I bought the new Chaos Possessed before 10th, I'm just up shitake creek or something?

Ultimately doesn't matter, this is why the codexes exist, or, otherwise, list-building apps like battlescribe.

The way it reads, you can use the box codes to get access to that specific unit or buy the codex(or the new package with every unit) and use THAT code to get access to all your faction's units.

Ah yeah, thinking about it and reading through...

But, we'll see. A lot of it actually seems 'too good to be true' to me.

These Valrak rumours are all fake. Probably way more of the real stuff will leak out soon, so I will leave this here:

- 10th is a complete reset, some extreme changes, but still D6 based
- there is an index book called warhosts
- Overall themes:
terrain destruction
more options during army construction, streamlined game itself
faster rolling, no re-rolls
freer unit activation
- Charges, action economy, all-out attack, ward + damage taken more or less from AoS, no double turn
- units activate one at a time and can do stuff in any order they want. still ‘all your units in your turn then all your opponent’s units in his turn’
- fighting is less fiddly. you only fight in your own turn
- stats are dice values and now go from 1+ to 6+
- initiative is back
- there is no wound roll
- profile layout is aos-like
- stratagems have to be bound to units and written on the army handout
- terrain can be destroyed
- morale is completely different, some units don’t attrition but get debuffed
- GT is a completely revamped game mode with a ton of differences. for example a loadout sideboard and
- no more power levels
- armor is not only a numerical value, but has attributes against which weapon it is good

RoyRobHobGob wrote:
These Valrak rumours are all fake. Probably way more of the real stuff will leak out soon, so I will leave this here:

- 10th is a complete reset, some extreme changes, but still D6 based
- there is an index book called warhosts
- Overall themes:
terrain destruction
more options during army construction, streamlined game itself
faster rolling, no re-rolls
freer unit activation
- Charges, action economy, all-out attack, ward + damage taken more or less from AoS, no double turn
- units activate one at a time and can do stuff in any order they want. still ‘all your units in your turn then all your opponent’s units in his turn’
- fighting is less fiddly. you only fight in your own turn
- stats are dice values and now go from 1+ to 6+
- initiative is back
- there is no wound roll
- profile layout is aos-like
- stratagems have to be bound to units and written on the army handout
- terrain can be destroyed
- morale is completely different, some units don’t attrition but get debuffed
- GT is a completely revamped game mode with a ton of differences. for example a loadout sideboard and
- no more power levels
- armor is not only a numerical value, but has attributes against which weapon it is good

Got anything to give that any credence? Happy to chew it over as it lines up with a lot of previous rumours, just curious if it has anything else you can mention to give extra merit to it.

Cannot give more details at the moment. But the launch box is called Vigil of Blood and will be previewed way sooner than rules teasers. Maybe teasered as early as next month.

RoyRobHobGob wrote:
Cannot give more details at the moment. But the launch box is called Vigil of Blood and will be previewed way sooner than rules teasers. Maybe teasered as early as next month.

That's a nice clear yard stick to work against, the only major "wtf" I can spot is why bring back initiative if you fight only in your own turn and in any order you like?

RoyRobHobGob wrote:
Cannot give more details at the moment. But the launch box is called Vigil of Blood and will be previewed way sooner than rules teasers. Maybe teasered as early as next month.

Any comment on the rumored content of the starter ?

New Terminators yea or nay ?

It is a bit more complicated than the broad strokes I used. If your initiative is high enough you can interrupt the enmy turn in certain situations. In addition to other purposes.

But that's it for now. Wait for the confirmation.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
No terminators in the launch box.

But I'll stop now.

RoyRobHobGob wrote:
It is a bit more complicated than the broad strokes I used. If your initiative is high enough you can interrupt the enmy turn in certain situations. In addition to other purposes.

But that's it for now. Wait for the confirmation.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
No terminators in the launch box.

But I'll stop now.

Cheers. Goes to sob in corner..

Only fighting in your turn stands out as a negative. Surely that makes the game quite a bit less interactive and also less tactical.

It's kind of odd that in games like AoS there's things like close combat which are operating almost in alternate activation within an I GO YOU GO game system. Perhaps GW wants to reinforce that they are making IGYG games and not considering alternate activation, which would discourage demands for AA systems over what GW is more used to working with.

Chikout wrote:
Only fighting in your turn stands out as a negative. Surely that makes the game quite a bit less interactive and also less tactical.

tbh its gonna depend on systems around it, initiative existing as a stat implies there might be ways to interrupt

Lurker here. So we get two years out of each Edition with modern GW? Then, buy the rulebook, codices and supplements all over again?

I'm seeing stacks of hardback books on the used market for like $5...

RoyRobHobGob wrote:
It is a bit more complicated than the broad strokes I used. If your initiative is high enough you can interrupt the enmy turn in certain situations. In addition to other purposes.

But that's it for now. Wait for the confirmation.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
No terminators in the launch box.

But I'll stop now.

I'm throwing the whole salt mine. Just joined this morning, and very first post is to crap on Valrak? Feels more like someone with an axe to grind.

 RedSarge wrote:
Lurker here. So we get two years out of each Edition with modern GW? Then, buy the rulebook, codices and supplements all over again?

I'm seeing stacks of hardback books on the used market for like $5...

3. 2017, 2020, 2023.

But basically yes.

I added these rumours to the OP.

Personally, i think they're bunk, but who even knows anymore.