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Thanatos_elNyx wrote:Now you are just nitpicking...

No, I'm showing a contradiction.

You say the Horus Heresy is only about the Legions fighting, when we all know the Heresy had far more to it than that. To claim otherwise is ignorance. I cited the example of the Dark Mechanicus. You cannot dismiss my argument with a nice buzzword.


And reds8n - Is that true? That's... lame.

Here's an idea...the ultrasmurfs go to a world and are owned by daemons? Kinda like the Blood Angels at sigma prime. Except the smurfs escape with more billies left alive. Also, they should write a HH book about te BA

I'd like to see one about the Iron Warriors, preferably the events leading up to the massacre at Olympia, but also the World Eaters, or the War Hounds as they were known before Angry Ron took over command of his Legion. Only problem is that some titanic events are so rushed and so muted. They've taken three novels to describe the fall of Horus but the Drop Pod massacre is but a small footnote so to say in the Fulgrim novel. I'm afraid that they might try and squeeze as much in a novel as they can, cutting away a lot as they trim it down to the required page amount.

Thanatos_elNyx wrote:

BrookM wrote:Hopefully a more in depth recollection of the webway portal beneath the Palace and the battle that raged there because some one-eyed donkey-cave had to use powerful magic to talk to his daddy and accidentally breach the seals put there.

Take that back!

But seriously, afaik the only source of the Webway project is the awful Collected Visions books.
I personally wouldn't mind if they squated that fiction and came up with a better reason for the Emperor retreating to Terra.

YES, to both of you!

If only that could be!

reds8n wrote:

ShumaGorath wrote:I know what the twist is, but I'd rather not ruin it for everyone. I heard it in an author interview a bit back. It is a pretty significant twist for basically all of the background fluff.

..is it that...

Spoiler:

the Emperor isn't the golden lovely shiny figure we know, but is in fact some hideously shrivelled and dried up old husk looking thing who projects such a powerful psychic aura that "we" all see a perfect version of what we want to see... which is what Grammaticus saw in Legion... and he is forced to drop this illusion when Horus %^$£" him up.. and this is what gives Horus pause and enables the Emperor to overcome him ?

We heard about this a long, long time ago, and I really hoped it wasn't true then, and I certainly hope it isn't true now.

That would be a very, very stupid 'twist' indeed...

The secret twist:

Soylent Gold is the Emperor!

So far I've read Horus Rising, False Gods, Battle for the Abyss, and Legion. I thought False Gods was strongest. I like Dan Abnett's style of writing, but find his habit of practically ignoring the most important characters and events infuriating.

I'd really like each legion to have at least one book. Whatever they did during the Heresy, they were a part of events and it would be interesting to see what they were like in those days, and see the information from Index astartes fleshed out. I do think 3 books for the Ultras is excessive though.

Sinister Brain wrote:I'd also love to see some White Scars (it escapes me if they really did anything major during the Heresy).

They only, y'know, fought at Terra. Nothing major there.

My original statement was that the Ultramarines contributed very little to the Horus Heresy and don't deserve 3 books.
I realise that you probably took that personnally (being a half-brother and all), but that was not what was intended.

You accuse me of saying that only the fighting on Terra counted as the Horus Heresy, which of course is 'absurd' (and also completely not what I said) since there is alot more to the Heresy than the fight on Terra, there was of course the Istvaan massacres, the burning of Prospero, etc.
I then reiterated my point about the UM meagre contribution to the actual fighting in the Heresy, as they didn't fight 'brother Marines' except for Calth.

You then accuse me of saying that only the Legion Vs Legion fighting counted as the Horus Heresy, which of course is 'absurd' (and also completely not what I said) since the aforementioned Mechanicus Wars.
On my statement: "I think that [for the Ultramarines] to be involved in the Heresy [they] had to be fighting against brother Legions." I wasn't dismissing your arguments, I was just saying you totally missed the point.

H.B.M.C. wrote:You say the Horus Heresy is only about the Legions fighting, when we all know the Heresy had far more to it than that. To claim otherwise is ignorance.

You know you lose when you start insulting people right?
Though it is possible that you mean that in the American way rather than the European way. If so, I shall let it slide.

We'll, he's Australian, so not sure if that helps or hurts...

I think we can all probably agree that we DON'T need THREE Ultramarine based Horus Heresy books though, right?

The Ultras probably did more of 'substance' after the Heresy anyway, so maybe they can star in the inevitable Scourging series of books...

I think we may well need three Ultramarines books, afterall they were the biggest (and most organised) legion at the time and this debate makes it clear we're not entirely sure on what they did, although in contrast to Thanatos they certainly did something (Calth/near destruction, journey to Terra, Seige of Terra aftermath etc.)

But yeah, as Alpharius said they also did a lot (probably more) post Heresy/scourging

But yeah I'd like to see the rest of the legions activities looked into with more depth, even the World Eaters, although I'm not entirely sure how much killing I could stand in 1 book!

Maybe the twist is that Loken (?) survived and he's the one who drops Horus' shields.

Regarding the "spoiler":

Ozymandias wrote:Maybe the twist is that Loken (?) survived and he's the one who drops Horus' shields.

I believe Loken is still alive, it was left too open at the end of the book, and it would be cool to see him come back in some way.

I heard McNeil get asked that question at a signing a while ago (Fulgrim era) and he said that (at the time) he was not going to do anything with Loken and it was entirely up to Dan Abnett, but as of then there were no plans to bring him back.

At another convention they said that Loken still lived and they wanted to use him in the post-heresy novels if they ever got around to that.

Well, we could see a novel in which the Ultramarines start conquering worlds really fast. This novel would deal with the formation of Ultramar, the intense recruitment and all that. Another one could deal with them fighting the Word Bearers and another one with them fighting the Alpha Legion.

Heres hoping for another DA book Loved the first two.

combatmedic wrote:Heres hoping for another DA book Loved the first two.

Seriously?

What was it that pushed it over the top for you - the billion uses of the word "surplice"?

I hope BL moves on the other Legions, but sadly the ending of Decent of Angels guarantees at least one more DA HH book...

BrookM wrote:The two missing legions are already discussed in the short story the Lightning Tower.

What book is this in? Any awesome revelations?

Scottywan82 wrote:

BrookM wrote:The two missing legions are already discussed in the short story the Lightning Tower.

What book is this in? Any awesome revelations?

It's a small short story "chapbook" that was available at Games Days. I forgot to pick one up at GD LA 2008 and am kicking myself for it.

You can always download the audio book, it has the story Lightning Tower in it. You scoundrels should be able to find it on your own.

Alpharius wrote:

combatmedic wrote:Heres hoping for another DA book Loved the first two.

Seriously?

What was it that pushed it over the top for you - the billion uses of the word "surplice"?

I hope BL moves on the other Legions, but sadly the ending of Decent of Angels guarantees at least one more DA HH book...

GW books are like Star Wars books. They're gak, but they're easy-to-read gak. The Dark Angels aren't as bad as some of the others, either. But none of them are good. They just are too unfocused and too poorly edited.

Personally I hope to see a sequel to Legion. Perhaps it could be combined with the Ultramarines novels. The Alpha Legion fighting against the Ultramarines. Or maybe something about the Alpha Legion trying to follow their own path instead of the orders of the Cabal, resulting in the Cabal maybe trying to manipulate the Ultramarines into fighting the Alpha Legion.

I dunno...just thinking out loud here!

Alpharius wrote:

combatmedic wrote:Heres hoping for another DA book Loved the first two.

Seriously?

What was it that pushed it over the top for you - the billion uses of the word "surplice"?

I hope BL moves on the other Legions, but sadly the ending of Decent of Angels guarantees at least one more DA HH book...

To be honest they should have just squished the first two books into one, as the second should have been the betrayal by Luther. But the ending to the second book did honestly shock me. Also surplices are awesome, everyone knows that, at least multi-lazers didn't make an appearance.

Iv tried to read some of the other HH books and just gotten board. I know it all comes down to personal preference, but I have always found the DA more interesting than any of the other chapters, save for 1k sons.

It just so happens that my preferred army is the most awesome.

I actually liked the first couple of HH novels, the DA, Mechanicum and Word Bearers novels on the other hand really bugged me. Sometimes I think its a shame that Abnett doesn't write the whole series, I really like his take on this sort of stuff, he almost manages to make 40k novels actually cool to read, rather than the purely "oh and then he grabbed his cannon and ran around shooting people" for about 300 pages...

Quite frankly, I hope Brown does a follow-up to Cadian Blood. That could make for a hell of a series!

Malika2 wrote:I actually liked the first couple of HH novels, the DA, Mechanicum and Word Bearers novels on the other hand really bugged me. Sometimes I think its a shame that Abnett doesn't write the whole series, I really like his take on this sort of stuff, he almost manages to make 40k novels actually cool to read, rather than the purely "oh and then he grabbed his cannon and ran around shooting people" for about 300 pages...

I thought only stand-out poor books in the series were "Battle for the Abysmal Novel" and "Descent of the quality of this series", although I found Eisenstein and Fallen Angels to be a bit lacking in writing quality, they made up for it with good storylines. I though Mechanicum was also a great book! But Dan Abnett and Graham McNeill are definately the best writers IMHO... Anyway, back to the future of the series and staying on topic:

I think the Assassins book sounds really good, however although I feel that pretty much every Legion should have a HH book about them, I struggle to find much depth to the World Eaters...

Kanluwen wrote:Quite frankly, I hope Brown does a follow-up to Cadian Blood. That could make for a hell of a series!

Whuh?!

Don't you "whuh?!" me! I liked it It was a cheap, quick action read. If he fleshed it out more, continued the 88th's progress and kept going...

It could become the next Gaunt's Ghosts series. Remember: First & Only/Ghostmaker were pretty poor compared to some of the later ones by Abnett. And they're pure garbage compared to the Eisenhorn trilogy and the Ravenor novels.

I thought they pulled off the pre-Ecclesiarch feel of the Imperium in the first couple books.
They really hammered home the scientific, anti-religious attitude of the military.

But they seem to have lost that with Battle for the Abyss and the Angel books.

I enjoyed Legion. We were given a view into the mindset and methods of the chapter.

Mechanicum was very removed from the others and brought a new perspective to the Heresy to me.

It is getting irritating how they are obviously milking the series. After they got to the Drop Massacre tidbit in Legion, they have been stalling.

I think skrulnik has it pretty much right, although personally I want to hear as much as I can - whilst still leaving bits for my imagination open however - about such a cool event...

Kanluwen wrote:Don't you "whuh?!" me! I liked it It was a cheap, quick action read. If he fleshed it out more, continued the 88th's progress and kept going...

It could become the next Gaunt's Ghosts series. Remember: First & Only/Ghostmaker were pretty poor compared to some of the later ones by Abnett. And they're pure garbage compared to the Eisenhorn trilogy and the Ravenor novels.

I was actually whuh[ing] about where it came from considering I didn't know the book and this is a thread bout the HH

Hah! My bad then Dave. I musta forgot to quote whoever was talking about it and the Night Lords novel Dembski-Brown has coming out.

Either way, pick it up if you enjoy Cadians, zombies, or the Death Guard