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p_gray99 wrote:On the subject of 18 VRs, does anyone else remember a bit in the first post about not much income? I'm sure I heared it somewhere.

Behold the scratchbuilt Voidraven bomber

KingDeath wrote:

p_gray99 wrote:On the subject of 18 VRs, does anyone else remember a bit in the first post about not much income? I'm sure I heared it somewhere.

Behold the scratchbuilt Voidraven bomber

Lmao! That's awesome! Can't wait to see it painted! Actually our group has discussed buying a "my size Barbie" and putting on PVC armor and guns as a scratch built warlord/emporer Titan.

Lack of funds.... Well as IG/GK why not thunderbolt fighters? Auto cannons and lazcannons. Plus you could use ww II model aircraft for them. Wich at the very least will
Cost half what the fw model does. May not be exact on size, but shouldnt be a major issue.


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Lol at the Barbie thing.... My friend built a ultra marines Barbie. It counts as some kind of Garg creature. But it's a Barbie in ultramarine armor :p

Ok so my power game buddy(Matt) and his brother(Scott) are issuing a challenge game for next Monday. An apocalypse game of massive proportions(at least for us). He and his brother on one team with about 40k pts vs everyone else and their combined points.

I haven't had time to get models to do some of the formations that have been discussed so I gotta go with what I got. What I'm going to do is run all my Paladins as converted Grandmasters and give them Orbital Strike Relays. Keep them spread out and single model units(Harder to nuke with pie plates). See how he like 30 Orbital Spikes a turn!!! Mwahahaha!

plus, thunderhammers vrs titans = WIN.

also, im not 100% but dont void shields only work on ranged attacks outside of 12" ? - if so - get inside that 12" zone and spam meltas. - maybe a grud ton of IG melta vets.

DarthSpader wrote:plus, thunderhammers vrs titans = WIN.

also, im not 100% but dont void shields only work on ranged attacks outside of 12" ? - if so - get inside that 12" zone and spam meltas. - maybe a grud ton of IG melta vets.

Attacks at 12" or more are revolved against the void shields. Inside that 12" all shooting attacks are resolved against the armor. The problem is getting this inside that 12" bubble and dealing with the bunch of Wolf Lords on Thunder Mounts. Actually can you fire Orbital Strike Relays 1st turn?

Ok it made it to page 3 and no one has mentioned it yet.

Lukas the Trickster.

Really.

The FAQ specificly says that his stasis ability affects anything in BtB. Even more specificly it states it works with Warlord class titians.

Space Wolves FAQ. Pg 4 bottom on the right hand of the page.

Actually I'm pretty sure I posted it in the op. You are right though. My friend that plays the warlord is an all in Space Wolves player, and will almost always use Lukas in a drop pod with a unit of Blood Claws.

It works, and its something I'm considering even though I completely despise Space Wolves. I was exploring other options at this point.

*** pic heavy response - sorry***

ok, so i reviewed your earlier posts and heres my thinking. and ill use vassal to visualise here. this is a tatic that should counter his warlord, and the TWC he places around them. now, i dont have the pts values for the TWC lords, but i imagine its about 150-200 each? ill avg and go with 175. please correct me if im wrong on this.

in any case:

the warlord is 2500 pts. he can take a number of weapons. 2 of wich are carapace weapons wich have minimum range of 24". it can also take 2 arm weapons with no minimum range.

all of his weapon choices are blasts. and 10" ones at that. a few smnaller ones like the 7" blast and 5" blast have a ton of shots. in any case: warlord plus 10 TWCL = 4250

for that, you can outfit a GK grandmaster with thunder hammer, orbital strike, psycannon and melta bombs for i believe 210 pts a pop. (not sure im going off memory here) that would give you 20 of those for 4200pts. pretty close.

now, the way apoc works, is your reserves up to half come in turn 2, then the REST show up turn 3. hold all your GK GM in reserve untill turn 3. most likley his titan will have a grand time of blasting your tanks and whatnot, but otherwsie dont worry... your vengance will be swift.

deepstrike those GM all around the titan like the pic 2 shows. (approx - i just threw them down in a random spot surrounding the titan) now, you cant do anything except shoot.... so SHOOT! fire those psycannons at the TWCL and focus on busting up the middle. your firing 4 str 7 rending shots EACH hitting on 2+. you should easilly drop 3 or 4 guys from focused and massed fire.

the titans turn to respond. he cant fire those shoulder weapons at you, regardless of his move, and he cant move through or over you. (he CAN tank shock you however) in either case a 12" move through the cap with the remaining wolf lords charging you to protect, should look like the 5th pic. his arm weapons can target and maybe get a few of your guys, but really you shouldnt loose more then 4 of your men TOTAL to his firing, due to ID. (the red circle is a 10" blast for example) now lets be super optimistic for the titan side, and each wolf lord kills the GM he charged. you also lost 5 to the shooting (from blasts) assuming he was BANG ON with all his scatters. suceeded in his wound rolls, and you failed ALL your saves. leaving 9 men still up.

your turn 4.

each gm now moves 6" totally ignoring the TWCL getting into optimum charge range against the titan. if you have rear armor shots, try...str 7 rending on armor 13 is a long shot... but worth it anyway. might knock off some hull points or otherwise make life tough. dont expect much here.

on the charge however is a diffirent beast. i was able to get all 9 guys into charge range. now, im not 100% sure if CC attacks on a titan work like a vehicle (hitting rear armor) or like a dread, (front armor) so ill default to worst and go vrs front armor. each GM should get i believe 3 attacks each, 4 on the charge. with hammerhand, your str 10. the titan is WS 2, so youll hit on 3+ and have 36 attacks. the vassal engine calculated 27 hits, with 6 glances and 8 pens. since each pen removes a hull point as does each glance, thats 14 hull points removed. each SP on the titan is = 3 hull points so you just nuked 4 of his 9 structure points, with an additonal 8 rolls at AP 1 (+2) on the damage chart, and another 6 rolls at even result (glance -2, AP +2) of those 14 dice, all you need is 5+ to cause ANOTHER SP in damage. so say 2 of 6 actually do this for 4 more SP gone, and 2 get an additonal roll (wich we will assume is a lowball stun etc) thats 8 of the titans 9 structure points removed in a single turn, not counting what you managed to do in shooting (from psycannons) or if you got lucky and rolled a few more 5s and 6s. 9 SP removed = DEAD titan. in ONE round of CC. i didnt even factor in the orbital strikes. (careful with those however as they scatter huge and could friendly fire in this scenario)

EDIT: even if you dont kill it....you should inflict plenty of drive damaged, and gun damaged results, wich will pretty much make the thing useless anyway. - also remember after the fight you back off an inch, out of CC - so your ripe for shooting at. but - you also get to charge it again next turn!

so basically.... you need 20 GK termie models with hammers to make this work, or even just 20 termies and have them "proxxy" in.

to counter his "replacments" strategem - i suggest a house rule that forbids using it on super heavies. ive played in MANY apocalypse games and thats a house rule in just about every group and game ive been to. - and besides its straight up douchey to do that. if he refuses the house rule, then just dont play him he has a titan, you dont, (and its not a small one either!) if he cant stand loosing it, then dont play it. and if he DOES loose it - take it like a man.


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ill add this as well: the titan is terrifying, and causes fear checks at -1 LD.... however i believe ATSKNF means your immune to fear.... and thus terror so nuts to him trying that on ya

Spot on Darth, except Hammers arn't AP1. They're only AP2.

still... at AP 2 its plus 1 on the roll. so any 4+ on those pens = SP gone and so on. also, i think i may be off on the pts for the GM i think hes 250 or so with the psycannon and melta bomb. (wich is another asset you could use, throw melta bombs at it!) he may also have more attacks then i credited him with. but still..the tatic should be sound.

The Super Heavy damage chart is no longer used. They use the normal damage chart, with Explodes replaced by Lose a Structure point and roll again on the Chart with no modifiers. so its a 5+ to lose a SP.

Great tactics! Right now I don't have enough TH to do that many Terminators/Grandmaster, but you've given me a reason to buy more Lol! For this challenge game, its "no max points for your side" so I'm master crafting all weapons and giving each Grandmaster all the fun grenades. The grenades will be great for either his TWCL, or his brother's Blood Angels should they attempt to assault the Grandmasters.

O'damn, he's going to really regret charging multiple Grandmasters with crazynades. 2-3 Psychotroke results plus 2-3 -1 toughness results will have even TWC at T1-2.


3 grandmasters getting charged by Thunderwolves will make the TWC get ID'd by the base strength of the Grandmasters. "Pass those 3++ saves B****s!!!"

Grey Templar wrote:O'damn, he's going to really regret charging multiple Grandmasters with crazynades. 2-3 Psychotroke results plus 2-3 -1 toughness results will have even TWC at T1-2.


3 grandmasters getting charged by Thunderwolves will make the TWC get ID'd by the base strength of the Grandmasters. "Pass those 3++ saves B****s!!!"

Lol exactly! Congrats, your guys are still standing after a round of overwatch. Here is your prize! *tosses buckets full of grenades at the enemy* If they don't kill each other the Grandmasters step in with digital weapons and master crafted hammers to wipe them out.

You dont even need hammers really. Although you could combine normal assault termie boxes with gk termie boxes for a nice ton of hammers. Or just convert halbreds. But as long as your clear with wargear I don't think wysiwyg should matter too much.

Also a thought: take another 20, attach them to each other for 2 squads and hide them in storm ravens. If he replacements the Titan, then Repeat by moving in and disembarking the new unit (detaching into single units as you do so)

Wysiwyg is one of the stipulations for this game. However, I was thinking of taking a few units of TH/SS Terminators with Lysander for the Titan Hammer formation.

that works too. attach a GM to each squad to get that hammerhand and str 10, otherwise your str 8, wich makes the fight much harder.
*** getting hammerhand off is key! dont forget! - and with 20 gm in 20 units, thats alot of psychic checks... but it works awsome.

if your going normal termies, take chain fists. 8+2d6 is awsome.

melta bombs!

if you can figure out how to get meltaguns on termies, those work nice as well! (i like the GK GM because of that psycannon - 4 str 7 rending shots can deal with just about anything)

I love psycannons, but the cost of bits is outrageous! Last time I checked they're something like $9 for 1 Psycannon!

I may take a couple Titan Hammer Formations and a generic HQ in termie armor. This will be for future games, but soon I'll have 3 Vortex Missile formations, and probably Lukas, blood claws, and a drop pod. After that its either pick up the C:SM Terminators or Shadowswords.

Yeah, i'm bummed they discontinued the 5 pack of GK terminator psycannons. At least I bought some before they dropped them.

I prefer them to the new psycannons.

Ally in some Wyches with Haywire Grenades and fly them into the titan, assault and watch it die.

Haywire grenades only glance Super Heavies on 6s now.

I just got mine and a buddies legion of Greater Daemons and inflicted a pretty severe leg humping on the titans.

And Baneblades...


Hell I don't think 17 Greater Daemons and Princes left much alive at all...

Yea.... That would be a pretty serious threat for
ANY army.... 4 of each greater daemon and a prince of each... Ouch.