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 warboss wrote:

Casualty wrote:

Is this the right link? There's absolutely nothing there that could be read as "pre insulting the existing fanbase".

You and I have vastly different opinions then about calling parts of your customer base that are criticizing your upcoming movie's poster unenlightened and "closet misogynists". Maybe across the pond it's a term of endearment but over here it's an insult.

He insults misogynists. Not fan base. If they were　fans they could be get to watch movib. Mlsogynists won't come. So there's no risk calling them out. Their money wasn't coming anyway.

He's not insulting fanbase. He's insulting opposite of fanbase

Watched this again with my Lass, and her friends. Positive receptions all round.

I still remain impressed with just how “done with this” Sarah is. She won, yet lost everything. She’s bitter, and she just doesn’t give a flip.

It’s a wonderful role!

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Watched this again with my Lass, and her friends. Positive receptions all round.

I still remain impressed with just how “done with this” Sarah is. She won, yet lost everything. She’s bitter, and she just doesn’t give a flip.

It’s a wonderful role!

I think I'd have found it a bit tired eventually if not for the bit in the woods about John's pictures, which make it clear it's a bit of a facade to some extent. It's not so much that she's beyond all caring at all, but that caring means letting some really painful stuff in to breathe, so she just hasn't been able to afford to until then. And Linda's very good at both.

I like that after the cabin stuff her dynamic with Grace has quietly changed, too. Grace starts actively looking out for her, she starts worrying about Grace. S'nice.

And she kinda finds redemption of a sort with Dani. Another future to prepare for, mother of the future once again.

 Lance845 wrote:
As great as Terminator and T2 are it's insane that Cyberdine thought Arnold would be a good infiltration unit. He speaks like nobody else he is interacting with and is a 7 ft tall wall of muscle.

If I ran into that knowing that the robots were trying to make units that could infiltrate human resistance cells I would know immediately that he was one of them.

The Rev-9 can emote like the others couldn't. It can hold a normal conversation to get information like it did when it first arrived or when it bantered with the soldiers. Then it's in the position it wants to be in or it got the information it wanted and a switch flips and it just starts killing.

The Rev-9 is terrifying.

To be fair to James Cameron, the original idea was for Lance Henrikson to play the Terminator, precisely because he was much more normal looking. I think it was quite late in the process for casting Terminator that Arnie was put forward. That's why the T1000 was played by Robert Patrick - he was a much more regular looking person who'd be more believable as an infiltration unit.

It gets especially weird when you consider after Judgement Day the Resistance would likely be malnourished, or at the very least not exactly Mr Universe contestants. The films do seem to realise this, though, and show Skynet adapting its Terminators as the Resistance adapts to Skynet's tactics. I prefer to think the initial models Skynet uses were a result of what it had to work with in the immediate aftermath of Judgement Day.

Has anyone found a canon explanation of how the fleshless T-1000 was able to use the time machine?

That was one, and probably one of the only, things I liked about Salvation, the idea that Skynet has been struggling with scaling down the tech so its early Terminators are all built like tanks just because it's still ironing out the design. Kinda like the firdt PS3 vs the slim one!

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Has anyone found a canon explanation of how the fleshless T-1000 was able to use the time machine?

Because it's "alive" kind of, although the restrictions of the TDE seemed to be based on it being powered by narritivium

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:

 warboss wrote:

Casualty wrote:

Is this the right link? There's absolutely nothing there that could be read as "pre insulting the existing fanbase".

You and I have vastly different opinions then about calling parts of your customer base that are criticizing your upcoming movie's poster unenlightened and "closet misogynists". Maybe across the pond it's a term of endearment but over here it's an insult.

He’s quite clear who the comment is directed to though. And it’s in response to mindless trolls who used chauvinistic hate speech (the exact words of the question).

He’s telling them and them alone out.

Or....he could just tell them to watch the movie and see if that'll change their minds or just ignore the backlash. Imagine if instead a director said if you don't like it you're not red pilled and are a hater of men. Would that seem insulting to you? Would you then decide to watch that movie?

MDG can probably remember, I beshatted this movie long and hard when trailers came out. The trailer looked like the CGI was unfinished, the story looked stupid, and I expected it to be more Genisys trash.

I was quite surprised this was the third best movie in the franchise, and while that might sound like damning it with faint praise, when the first 2 movies were some of the best sci-fi movies in history, that's a high bar. I quite enjoyed it.

 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
Anyway, how does everyone rate the Rev 9? I thought the actor nailed the creepy, manipulative infiltrator part. He was scarier when he was talking than he was when he was fighting.

I know I'm not adding anything new, but he was legit great. First, it was nice seeing an infiltrator that actually... infiltrated, other then immediately resorting to violence, which usually attracts mission-impairing attention. The dyad thing was kinda neat. I would like to have seen more of them doing that horrible tentacle monster thing they did during that future chopper attack scene.

A little thing, but I like when he scanned Arnold, he immediately and accurately inferred what he was and what that represented, and asked why he wasn't joining him.

I know a lot of people hated the Arnold twist but honestly I kinda liked it. "Doesn't she wonder why you weigh 500 pounds? And never sleep?"

Dani kinda sucked.

The high point of course was Mackenzie Davis, whose name I am very proud to have finally gotten correct.

Some of the CGI remains a bit ropey to be fair.

Mostly during the first fight in the factory. But it’s well paced and well directed enough to not rely on CGI alone.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Has anyone found a canon explanation of how the fleshless T-1000 was able to use the time machine?

In the extended universe stuff - and I think maybe the original script - the T1000 was sent back in liquid form inside a kind of bio-engineered fleshbag.

You could fanon some alternatives though, for example that the damage that might be done to an inorganic traveller is mitigated to something all-liquid because it can just reform itself anyway.

Legion's version of time travel in Dark Fate does seem to have some significant differences to Skynet's, in that it brings ice rather than fire with it, but the organic surface thing would seem to be consistent - otherwise Grace might have been able to arrive wearing a twin set or something and could have carried something with the message rather than needing a tattoo.

Rev 9 seems to be made of something largely carbon based though, so he might be just close enough to organic to make the cut.

 Ouze wrote:
I would like to have seen more of them doing that horrible tentacle monster thing they did during that future chopper attack scene.

I think those may have been Rev 7’s. Pretty sure I heard them say they were being pursued by Rev 7’s. Although that could also have been the suicide drone bombs.

 AduroT wrote:

 Ouze wrote:
I would like to have seen more of them doing that horrible tentacle monster thing they did during that future chopper attack scene.

I think those may have been Rev 7’s. Pretty sure I heard them say they were being pursued by Rev 7’s. Although that could also have been the suicide drone bombs.

You're right, they're the Rev 7s. You can see a clearer render of them here:

https://terminator.fandom.com/ru/wiki/Rev-7

Notably, they have more cat-like hind legs for sprinting and their goo-bit doesn't even make an effort to simulate a face

At one point there were plans to show Rev 3s too, which Miller describes in the commentary as rudimentary dog like "bloodhound" type machines, used to comb ruins earlier in the war. This is what Grace is referring to when she talks about Legion hunting survivors -an earlier draft of the flashback to her childhood at this point depicted her evading Rev 3s in the ruins by setting traps, rather than humans after her food.

This was scrapped because Miller thought it tacked too close to stuff seen in other sequels.

 AduroT wrote:

 Ouze wrote:
I would like to have seen more of them doing that horrible tentacle monster thing they did during that future chopper attack scene.

I think those may have been Rev 7’s. Pretty sure I heard them say they were being pursued by Rev 7’s. Although that could also have been the suicide drone bombs.

Yup, you're 100% right. I only saw it once in the theater and I forgot they had earlier versions.

I quite liked how Imperial Guardy that sequence felt, I could watch an IG movie with that vibe.

I believe they shot a good bit more of it that wasn't used, which seems a waste (and a pity)

I also appreciate how Dani and Grace’s Future War isn’t a carbon copy of John’s Future War.

I mean, it’s familiar, sure. But different enough without reinventing the wheel.

It occurred to me that we never heard that humanity had won against Legion. We don’t have any reason to believe Legion was desperate other than the presence of the Rev-9. But could there be some other reason for Legion to send it back in time to try to assassinate Dani? Perhaps Legion is much more confident in its understanding of time travel, or felt compelled to complete a causality loop linked to its own existence?

My fanon?

At some future point, Legion discovers Sarah’s involvement in Dani’s training. Researching her, finds her interview tapes. From there it learns time travel is possible, and sets the loop in place, possibly entirely unwittingly.

 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
It occurred to me that we never heard that humanity had won against Legion. We don’t have any reason to believe Legion was desperate other than the presence of the Rev-9. But could there be some other reason for Legion to send it back in time to try to assassinate Dani? Perhaps Legion is much more confident in its understanding of time travel, or felt compelled to complete a causality loop linked to its own existence?

I thought about that, yeah. Grace's dialogue seems to tip toe quite carefully around suggesting Dani is winning or anything like it, and she talks about Dani very differently to how Kyle talked about John, the stakes might as well be totally personal vs a revolutionary leader.

It's not hard to imagine that if Legion is confident in winning the war for once and for all in its own time, but realises it needs to "seed" itself in the past to secure the victory, and that could be the purpose of sending Rev back, and killing Dani is a secondary objective if at all. Making its own fate, it you like.

Plus if Grace always comes back and always dies, that leaves 40 something Commander Dani down a bodyguard in 2042.

Hopefully it’s going to find it’s audience now.

Whilst I’d like a sequel, I think it stands self contained enough.

Solid 6/10 action film. I liked it better than Tenet and the newest Star Wars. I might actually re-watch it this morning while working on stuff

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
My fanon?

At some future point, Legion discovers Sarah’s involvement in Dani’s training. Researching her, finds her interview tapes. From there it learns time travel is possible, and sets the loop in place, possibly entirely unwittingly.

One wrinkle in this is that while Grace has been strongly influenced by Sarah, she doesn't recognise her on sight or by name. And the Rev 9 seems unprepared for her too.

I've wondered if Dani tried to do what Sarah talks about doing with John, and kept Sarah a "secret" up her past-self's sleeve by hiding any connection to her. It's Sarah Ex Machina that makes the difference more than once, she seems to be the closest thing to an actual free agent in this loop. Dani and Grace are locked into a kind of ouroboros of creating each other, but Sarah has far more room to manouvre.

The very existence of Legion’s timeline proves that causal loops are not closed, but are perhaps iterative. Sarah Connor as the outside-context-problem makes a whole lot of sense considering she already participated in the destruction of a ...uh ‘previous’ time loop.

It makes me wonder if an intelligent enough time-user could direct these iterative time not-loops towards a desired goal or an equilibrium that is more or less stable. Or are we doomed to some crazy-pants super time travel circus as more and more iterations leave their own time pollution in the “past”.

Rev-9’s reaction to Arnie is also suggestive that Legion knows something of Skynet?

I would have squeed if we’d gotten some kind of throw-away reference to a bigger picture time-spiral. “Do you serve Skynet, Deep Blue or the Singular?”

At a certain point, we need the Doctor or the Starfleet Temporal Agency to clean up this mess.

 Frazzled wrote:
At a certain point, we need the Doctor or the Starfleet Temporal Agency to clean up this mess.

The Doctor did already attempt to step in at the end of Genisys

 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
I would have squeed if we’d gotten some kind of throw-away reference to a bigger picture time-spiral. “Do you serve Skynet, Deep Blue or the Singular?”

At this point, that would be the coolest direction for the franchise to go, really.

Although, if they keep stopping Terminators and creating new timelines based on ever-advancing future tech, eventually are we just going to have machines coming back that are so advanced at mimic-ing us that they are basically just people coming back in time to kill other people?

Watched it on a flight this week. Really really enjoyed it. Was surprised by how good it was. Of course i didnt even see a trailer for it so i had thought Grace was the terminator at first. Also Grace and Dani were reading romantic thru the film so the like a mom didnt feel right.

Given Dani's tendency to be inspirational but do dumb gak makes you wonder if Legion put her on the path to avoid a potential opponent arising that could beat it. As it is she gathers all people willing to fight back into nice condesned groups and speeds up the externination.

Grace full carried this movie. Totally believable badass.