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Made in de
Been Around the Block




Vienna

I think a big part is accessibility. Not talking about rules or anything, just that GW stuff is easy to get in most areas. They have solid shipping coverage, but they also have stores.
I'm in Austria, which is basically the ass end of availability for such stuff and still got 2 Warhammer stores around here.

If I look beyond the horizon at some other games/miniatures, they often come with huge shipping or take forever to get here. CMON for example even has their store region locked it seems, cause I simply can't access it and have to go through their distributor website, which doesn't have the same stuff available.
   
Made in gb
[SWAP SHOP MOD]
Killer Klaivex







Treating this purely as a hypothetical business exercise:-

The core strength of Games Workshop's business model is that everything is in-house. Product development, to manufacturing, to the high street. Every step is controlled by them except owning the buildings the shops are in and the raw material production. And both of those things are easily replaced (leasing a building or sourcing another plastic derivative is not hard). In other words, they have an immense level of control which can be manipulated as best suits to meet whatever form of competition arises.

If I was going to compete with them, I'd need the backing of someone with deep pockets willing to pay to jump the steps below, or I'd need to have a profitable retail setup ready to go as a base (aka five plus stores of my own). Because there's no way I can compete without being able to market directly to the customers. I can always buy in other hobby product at first (it's how GW started). There are plenty of other companies out there, and FLGS's do well enough with good management. But I'd need to focus on that core retail base for the first step.

Assuming I've got my first five profitable stores, I can start working on my product and IP and set up a small design studio with the profits from the stores. Easiest way to do this would be to license something with mass appeal like Star Wars. But it would be easy enough to make a Battletech style game or somesuch with lots of expansion potential. Heck, I could do both. Again, Games Workshop did both back in the day. Cash flow is king at that stage, because the cash flow enables me to invest in my own IP and growing my store base. As my own product lines hit the shelves, I can then slowly reduce how many other ranges my stores are carrying in favour of my own lines. That's standard commercial practice in a lot of fields.

Now I've got five plus stores and a decent game out, I can start building the network effect. The more stores I have, the greater the customer base for my game. The real jump however, would be from turning my little studio which produces the game into a manufacturing hub. I'm clearly going to have to outsource initially, HIPS machines are not cheap. I could finance to borrow the money to pay for them, but I suspect that might chew up too much credit and cripple the business. What I'd really look for would be a business angel/seed investor at this stage.

Assuming past market trends have held, I could actually use Games Workshop as an example of the potential return for a partner. If I've got something like a dozen stores plus at this stage and a little studio and we're predictably in profit (however minimal)? I reckon you could sweet talk a partner with serious cash into funding the cost of the machines and factory. You'd have to surrender control of a good chunk of the company and corporatise, but you could do it.

From there, you basically turn into Games Workshop. You buy up a paint range company, slowly excise the remaining external product lines, pay off your investors, and so on. Next thing you know, you just turned fifty and your company is their number one rival. Congrats?

--------------------------------------------------------

Where most game companies fall down is taking the wrong way to build this. They're either nerds buying a job and so their retail store fails. Or they start with the wargaming company/IP, making them almost completely dependent on other parties to market/sell their product and produce the goods. This makes them one trick ponies. A good retailer can sell anything to turn a buck and a manufacturer can make lots of things for other customers. But a small wargaming company can really only sell what they can commission other people to make and market for them.

I should note that the internet has made it possible to do some degree of marketing on their own (hence the growth in model companies), but the minute they hit a blip? A bad edition, or a production stall? They're screwed. Whereas the retailer just swaps to something else profitable which they can get hold of. It's a business version of all the eggs in one basket, and the basket is very easily upset.

No, you either need to start from the manufacturing end (meaning you can produce plastic for lots of different other sectors) or the retail end. Starting with the wargaming bit in the middle is a surefire way to cripple yourself from the word go.

This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2020/08/31 10:57:24



 
   
Made in gb
Decrepit Dakkanaut




UK

This does raise the question about places like Troll Trader (Tabletop Combat) and Wayland games (Warcradle). Both of which have basically got stores doing the money rolling and then have bought out failing/struggling wargame companies that hit those "blips". Though it seems that they themselves have trouble getting things going in good speed (WC has spent what 4-5 years getting anything from Dystopian Wars and Spartan back on the market and would have only managed to just release at the start of this year if it were not for corona - though they have got plastic casting now as part of the process).

That said they do have the backing of stores for a steady income; they are not reliant on the games alone.

   
Made in us
Excellent Exalted Champion of Chaos





 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
That’s one reason I want to see more people treat tabletop games like board games: if you want to play, you supply a complete game. When I played BFG, I had to buy ships for multiple fleets to get my friends to play. My friends would buy other games that I could play with 0 investment.

The prices are also much smaller for non-GW games. You could make two forces with lots of options for Frostgrave for a lot less than $500. For $500, one can supply two or more factions for dozens of non-GW games. The fact you think people are investing $1000 per faction for non-GW games kind of baffles me.


Well because when I look at every wargame I've seen played, the cost for a full force is about $500-$1000 for a non skirmish scale game. Thats a pretty wide range but thats about what I see people spend. I'm talking 40k and AOS here, so the scale of those games matters to me in this discussion.

A game like frostgrave is more akin to warcry which I don't see much played at all. In fact I don't see most GW games played with any regularity, just 40k and to a side degree AOS.

Also people here don't buy models for other people to play games with. Thats cool that you all have that going but here we don't really do that. I don't know how common that is, since that isn't something I hear very often.

Parabellum Conquest Vanguard and champion of all things Conquest: The Last Argument of Kings

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Made in gb
Princeps of the Titan 'SDF-1'






Statistx wrote:
I think a big part is accessibility. Not talking about rules or anything, just that GW stuff is easy to get in most areas. They have solid shipping coverage, but they also have stores.
I'm in Austria, which is basically the ass end of availability for such stuff and still got 2 Warhammer stores around here.

If I look beyond the horizon at some other games/miniatures, they often come with huge shipping or take forever to get here. CMON for example even has their store region locked it seems, cause I simply can't access it and have to go through their distributor website, which doesn't have the same stuff available.


Also visibility.

In the U.K., GW dominate the high street scene. They’re typically just off the main areas, but not so far that you don’t get significant passers by. There’s apparently a marketing thing where 1% of people advertised to will buy your product (picked this up from Fact Fiend, so third info at best). And I’m assuming the same goes for passing trade.

So, if I’m right, the theory goes that one in every hundred passers by will drop in and buy something. How GW’s in-store demos might affect that will have to be picked up by someone who actually knows their onions here, but I can’t see it hurting.

And if we look at store layouts? When done correctly, your store should be fairly open spaced, with products facing out. This helps with clear visibility, and relative ease of shopping. The staff are trained to be friendly and welcoming, and able to show off the hobbies potential to would be customers. And, here’s the trick. You are not selling it to Little Timmy. You’re selling it to the Bringers of Cash, Little Timmy Senior & Little Timmy’s Mum. Because Little Timmy is already sold.

That’s then backed up with Beginners sessions, which parents are also encouraged to attend (mixed results, but hey). After a few weeks, and a few purchases of various goodies, you’ve got ‘em.

That’s one in one hundred passers by, theoretically.

The overall Beginners Sessions really are key. Little Timmy approves, and shows it off to Johnny, Jimmy, and Spazz. Little Timmy’s parents might discuss the wider hobby (creativity, mental arithmetic, patience, reading) with their peers, which can bring further new blood, especially in middle class dormitory towns like wot where I live.

Will all of them stay on as long as we have (31 years and counting)? Of course not. But, by having a built in gaming and social venue, a well run store, where no group of gamers is allowed to hold particular sway, can maximise involvement.

That formula hasn’t really changed since I got going. Friendly, welcoming space. Knowledgable staff, the stuff I want to buy (there on the shelf, or more modernly, the mail order terminals), and a place to actually do my hobby. It’s just been better refined in terms of staff training.

It’s also about as universal an experience as can be expected. Yes, some stores won’t be as good as others, but it’s still the same basic template. All under GW’s direct control, because the stores aren’t franchises.

FLGS? Some offer a genuinely better experience. Some are sadly pretty dingey and run down looking. They’re also, typically, harder to stumble across, so don’t get as much passing traffic.

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[DCM]
Decrepit Dakkanaut




UK

One other thing that having their own stores does for GW is it lets them gather data really fast and accurately on what works and what sells

We may well remember the idiotic Kirby comment that GW didn't need to do market research or words to that effect,

but looking at what is selling in their own stores, how fast, and in combination with what other stuff

GW releases a new faction, the Megarachnids as a taster, and Bobs Best Games releases Scary Space Spiders, both companies start with a unit and a couple of characters

Both get preorder data from individuals: very helpful, but people online and looking at for stuff are probably already fairly heavily involved in the hobby and are probably not where the majority of the money will come from (although they are important drivers)

both get preorder data from distibutors and independent stores, but this is far less useful as it doesn't represent sales, boxes may languish on shelves, or may move but only if discounted. If less is hitting the shelves that month maybe stores & distributors order more than they would normally, If there's a lot going on maybe they order less product than they really want as they're having to spread their cash around

But GW has a big advantage they get sales numbers from their own stores, how many boxes sell each day, do sales stall, are the growing as word of mouth spreads, are customers talking about them etc

GW will know months before Bobs whether the new faction is well received and worth carrying on the roll out with (and these new factions can stall even if well received if nothing new arrives for ages).

Without the direct data Bob's is doing far more guessing, and working a lot more slowly, maybe the faction is a hit but they don't support it fast enough, maybe it goes the way of the Fire Slayers and they've committed too much design and production time before they realise it and are in production for a not very popular wave 2 before they realise their player base isn't interested

 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





Halifax

I think the best notion is to look at how GW started out, and then look at some of the decisions that made them big, like bringing plastics production in-house, bringing artists in-house, and lately leveraging that production capability to make games.


   
Made in gb
Decrepit Dakkanaut




UK

Also don't forget a GW store staff member only has to sell GW products. No matter what he picks off the shelf to sell, he's promoting and selling GW products.


A 3rd party store has many many different product lines and types. From wargames to card to board to digital to anything else. As a result if you're relying on 3rd party stores then there's a risk that your stuff might not sell just because it "doesn't sell" whilst things that do sell already get more attention and focus.

That's why so many are heavily reliant on local representatives in the community to promote their game; because even a store that does like the game and does promote it, sitll has many competing brands on offer. Plus the main bread-winner might well not be that game (indeed we oft hear its card games). Whatever the breadwinner is that is going to get the lions share of attention and promotion.


Wargames typically take up a lot of shelf space for a slower turnover of stock; cardgames in contrast take up far less space and have a very high rate of product turnover.



Indeed wargames like Warhammer are actually quite an old business model of long term products. Consider that you can still use today generation 1 Space Marine models and they are not only legal in the game, they still stand up well mechanically. Sure you might have to change the base here and there; but by and large most things have kept valid. There's a few things lost and gained and a few change size (eg the old greater demons have jumped up to FW sized demons now), but even there conversions and counts as (eg old greater demon = demon prince).

In contrast card games cycle cards very fast - MTG cycles every year with a rolling block update system. Sure there's the format that allows you to use any cards, but that's a very different format - the standard limited format on the current blocks is what remains the most popular in most regions.

So not only does the product sell fast and easy but it also has a built in time limit; once past there's a new slew of products that the same customers want.

   
Made in gb
Princeps of the Titan 'SDF-1'






It’s also worth noting that since they became Big, GW haven’t really dabbled in business borrowing.

If memory serves, the only time they’ve borrowed was during the post-LOTR slump, to provide a dividend to share holders. However, they may well have had some early years borrowing for tooling etc.

That’s really quite unusual in the modern day. And may not be easily replicable due to ever increasing shop rental and local tax costs. At least, not without it being done by someone who is already fairly wealthy.

Even just to get a decent number of plastic kits out requires a decent chunk of cash, whether or not you’ve got you’re own production facilities and blokes wot makes the molds.

GW are also in the best position to dictate the baseline of the industry. The bog standard. What satiscraptory might look like.

What do I mean by that? They’re the Ford of Wargames. By no means the cheapest, by no means the swankiest. But a widely considered middle ground.

If you want to compete, you need, at first, is do what GW aren’t, or find a niche and be better at it. If your sculpts can’t match GW’s? The market is very unlikely to pay GW prices for them, for example.

The difficulty there of course in the very modern day? GW have remembered they can grow as many thumbs are there are gaming pies. You’ve got mass battle, you’ve got skirmish, you’ve got dungeoneering, you’ve got dog fighting, you’ve got semi-deck building games too.

And in terms of market research, I dare say the obvious initial fault might be to listen to complaints about GW’s offerings alone.

Now, that is not a back handed “lol stfu complainers”. Many complaints are valid (Necromunda’s book cycling and poor proof reading etc). But you’ll also need to understand what it is GW are doing right in the eyes of the satisfied. Because you’re gonna need a fat old dollop of that, too.

Finally? Luck. In the internet age, there’s a lot of offerings out there. Some on Kickstarter, some from bigger names etc. This all means that you can have the objectively tightest rules set, the objectively nicest models at good price point, and still fail - because there’s so much choice out there.

Worse, and I accept this is unlikely...if you do start gaining traction, a half dozen malicious people with various sock puppet accounts can quickly spread negative reviews. (No i am not saying or implying this happens on Dakka).

GW are GW because when GW started? There was no GW. Citadel was sculptors creating models that could be used in AD&D. Eventually that was married to WHFB, which started out as a generic rule set usable with pretty much any Fantasy Figures - another way to use an existing collection. It took some time for Warhammer to become Warhammer proper. I’m not sure that path exists anymore, because of GW’s success an early, RPGesque focus on background and a narrative for your battles. It’s become expected by the market.

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Made in us
Nimble Skeleton Charioteer





 Eldarain wrote:
Time machine.


This is the most correct answer in this thread.

GW became what they are due to a combination of timing, smart business decisions, and luck.

Rivaling them now while not impossible; would be a near insurmountable task.

Honestly the only way I could see it happen is if someone with Bill Gates or Jeff Bezos money got pissed at GW for whatever reason and decided to spend their fortune burning them to the ground.

   
Made in gb
Decrepit Dakkanaut




UK

Considering that GW has seen their number of customers grow over the last few years with a big marketing push; tihs suggests that there's a greater market than that which GW has already tapped into.

The core issue is that its mostly only GW tapping into the market. So the designs, themes, concepts and branding are all GW. For a large majority (esp in the UK), GW is the gateway to wargames, esp for the larger under 20s market.


So there's actually loads of creative gaps that another firm could exploit and market too.

   
Made in us
Tunneling Trygon




Mexico

The issue is that it is going to be expensive and it will take time and luck.

So basically you need someone that can throw millions even if there is no guaranteed return of investment, specially not in the short term.

Basically you need a corporation and people that are willing to lead this project and potentially sink with it if it fails, and I'm talking only somewhat rhetorically, people could easily lose their standing in the industry for such failure.
   
Made in gb
Princeps of the Titan 'SDF-1'






 Overread wrote:
Considering that GW has seen their number of customers grow over the last few years with a big marketing push; tihs suggests that there's a greater market than that which GW has already tapped into.

The core issue is that its mostly only GW tapping into the market. So the designs, themes, concepts and branding are all GW. For a large majority (esp in the UK), GW is the gateway to wargames, esp for the larger under 20s market.


So there's actually loads of creative gaps that another firm could exploit and market too.


Push hasn’t even been that big. Still no traditional advertising campaign, just a far better in-house push.

We may also be seeing the second/third gen thing, where those like myself that cut their teeth as kids, are now old enough to have kids the right to play (no kids on my behalf. Never been my bag).

Kids drag their Dad’s in, Dads rediscover an enjoyment of their youth, the rest is just profit and increased sales.

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Made in gb
Decrepit Dakkanaut




UK

True that's certainly taking place. So another firm advertising/marketing to a different or related crowd could indeed have room to grow without having to "steal/poach" GW's market directly.

Honestly I'd actually welcome that. I do worry that with GW bearing the brunt of advertising/marketing outside of the established; it holds the whole market back. Most of the other companies into wargaming rely almost entirely on GW customers leaving the GW ship; or at least being open to other games. It means any time GW does poorly the market rapidly expands and any time GW does well its a rapid contraction.

If we got a second or third firm drawing in more fresh customers it might create a bigger buffer pool. Of course the flipside is if there are two big names in town people might just jump between the two.

   
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Princeps of the Titan 'SDF-1'






Freely admit, too many pints in to properly reply right now

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Made in us
Napoleonics Obsesser




MN

During the Kirby days, GW left a lot of area for rivals to sneak in and grab a bite of the apple. In fact, they did by focusing on areas GW was retreating from with the closing of Specialist Games.

Mantic's Dread Ball= Blood Bowl
Spartan's D-Wars= Epic
X-wing= Aeronautica Imperialis
Frostgrave= Warcry/Mordheim
War Machine= Kill Team/Necromunda

Then, GW smartened and decided to build strategic loyalty in brand. If you wanted to play at a different scale, they have it in house with Titanicus and Apocalypse. If you wanted skirmish, they have it with Warcry and Necromunda. If you wanted a sports theme, they have that now too.

Now a days, there are not a lot of niches that GW has not sunk their tentacles into. That makes it harder for a competitor to sink their own teeth into an underserved market and give themselves a platform to grow upon.

If GW keeps up their current strategy and expand into a BFG and EPIC range, they will have sucked all the opportunity for a competitior to "start small" and grow big.

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http://bloodandspectacles.blogspot.com/ 
   
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Decrepit Dakkanaut





Halifax

There's a considerable amount of off-brand imitators out there though. Heck, I started Titanomachina about 9 years ago to hop on that bandwagon. Fortunately by the time I was scooped by the new Adeptus Titanicus it had mutated into its own thing, but still.

   
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Preacher of the Emperor






Raleigh

A lot of these takes rely on a newcomer trying to beat GW at its own game. I see 3d printing as eventually redefining the entire space. Beat GW to that punch and anyone stands a chance to dethrone them.

"drinking liqueur from endangered rain forest flowers cold-distilled over multicolored diamonds while playing croquet on robot elephants using asian swim suit models as living wickets... well, some hobbies are simply more appealing than others." -Sourclams

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[MOD]
Making Stuff






Under the couch

3D printing will eventually change the retail landscape quite significantly, although I feel not until the process is significantly simplified... but is difficult to monetise, and doesn't do anything to get people actually playing your game.

Ultimately, what a new company needs is people playing their game. The gaming community (at least in scifi/fantasy gaming - historical gamers seem to be more brand agnostic) has always been reluctant to try new things, by and large. Nobody wants to invest in the new game until they see that everybody else is playing it, which is a bit of a catch-22.

 
   
Made in gb
Decrepit Dakkanaut




UK

 insaniak wrote:
3D printing will eventually change the retail landscape quite significantly, although I feel not until the process is significantly simplified... but is difficult to monetise, and doesn't do anything to get people actually playing your game.


At the same time whilst you can buy a really good printer, most people still use bookbinders and printing services. In fact even though the price of top end printers has come down somewhat; in general most people use their home printer for printing casual stuff. If they want to spend money on it they tend to keep using normal printing services.

I wonder if 3D printers might end up the same. A small handful buy ones that can actually do pro-end stuff; whilst the masses get ones to cast a cup or bowl badly and the operator still has no idea how to remove the mould lines or to fix basic issues (how many people get confused on how to do toner or clean the head in their paper printer). I feel like 3D printing is going to make some big differences, but perhaps not the ones people think.

Also I agree its very hard to monetise, especially if you want to be more than 1 person designing 3D models. That's a market that seems to work; but much beyond that I don't think is easily possible. I can't see a firm as big as GW easily running off customers buying 3D print files from them. I also see issues when production is left in the hands of the customers.

   
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[MOD]
Making Stuff






Under the couch

Yeah, the Patreon model seems to be working for some freelancers and small mini companies, but I can't see it scaling well. The bigger you are, the bigger the risk in relying on what is essentially a subscription service.

 
   
Made in us
Incorporating Wet-Blending






Maybe 30+ years ago, I watched Magic the Gathering take over the CCG market, and I'd say there are similarities with GW.

I also play boardgames, so have a contrast between them and Magic.

Essentially, WH40K and Magic are "lifestyle hobby games":
* Those who play "lifestyle hobby games" will only or primarily play these games.
* Those who play "lifestyle hobby games" need to pay a high investment (eg. $100+) to competitively play the game, although less expensive casual entry points exist.
* "Lifestyle hobby games" often have a non-gaming component (eg. painting, collecting and trading) that involves their audience outside of the game.
* "Lifestyle hobby games" typically have heavy company support, in the form of tournaments, store events, prizes, etc.
* "Lifestyle hobby games" often have a rotation of product, retiring older purchases. Players are expected to make continual purchases.
* "Lifestyle hobby games" typically require a community of players to play the game.

Contrast this to boardgames:
* Boardgamers play multiple different boardgames.
* Most boardgames need only one copy, owned by the owner, to play with.
* Most boardgames do not have a non-gaming component, although may have a BGG forum for strategy discussion.
* Most boardgames do not have company support, other than maybe an internet representatitve. Some, like FFG, have demo kits.
* Most boardgames are a single purchase that can be played indefinitely, with addtional purchases (eg. expansions) typically optional.
* Most boardgames don't require a community of players for the game, although general gatherings to play boardgame exist.

D&D and Pathfinder are something of a middle ground. They certainly require a community of players who play the game, and are willing to schedule it even into their working lives (eg. a biweekly campaign). Paizo, the company behind Pathfinder, even has company support for game events at game conventions. However, they don't have as much of a non-gaming component. While RPGs can be expensive (eg. a D&D Player's Handbook is $50) this still doesn't compare to WH40K and Magic purchases.

Should mention that chess and shogi, and are also "lifestyle games" but don't have some aspects of "lifestyle hobby games", such as painting, and collecting. While sports are often played casually, serious players will treat them as a "lifestyle games", spending a fair amount of money on equipment and training.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2020/09/01 02:41:39


I'm not going to get into another argument with someone who thinks the way *they* paint is the *only* way to paint, am I?? 
   
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SoCal

I feel like the big box board games that started on Kickstarter straddle the line, or even cross over. For example, the Shadows of Brimstone community on Facebook is really active, and people seem to be really into it in ways other than just playing the game.

   
Made in gb
Princeps of the Titan 'SDF-1'






 AesSedai wrote:
A lot of these takes rely on a newcomer trying to beat GW at its own game. I see 3d printing as eventually redefining the entire space. Beat GW to that punch and anyone stands a chance to dethrone them.


Issue for would be competitors is that GW has millions in cash reserve to throw at that problem.

GW Branded Printers. Possibility of uniquely programmed “one and done” STL files. GW branded filament. All little ways that GW can command that market by flexing their brand and cash reserves.

And it’s the branding that matters. To a newcomer, it’s a sign of assurance that specific printer is suited to producing the detail typical of GW’s sculpts. That the filament is the right sort etc.

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Decrepit Dakkanaut




UK

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
 AesSedai wrote:
A lot of these takes rely on a newcomer trying to beat GW at its own game. I see 3d printing as eventually redefining the entire space. Beat GW to that punch and anyone stands a chance to dethrone them.


Issue for would be competitors is that GW has millions in cash reserve to throw at that problem.

GW Branded Printers. Possibility of uniquely programmed “one and done” STL files. GW branded filament. All little ways that GW can command that market by flexing their brand and cash reserves.

And it’s the branding that matters. To a newcomer, it’s a sign of assurance that specific printer is suited to producing the detail typical of GW’s sculpts. That the filament is the right sort etc.


I can see it now - legions of geeks arguing over the best brand of filament and printer; lamenting that GW's printer is good, but their filament is overpriced.

The big issue I see is that the first hurdle in a new hobby is the buy-in-price. GW has worked on pushing that down, but going the pathway of high end 3D printers pushes it WAY up. Even if 3D printers became a home item chances are many would have a lower grade made for printing basic household items not high definition models. So chances are it would remain a high bar of entry. Granted it could end up like computer games, whereby the average home PC to surf the net and do emails isn't enough, but its easily justified to get a higher end machine for gaming.

That kinda depends on a massive 3D printing revolution to happen. Somehow I feel that specialist goods like models will be on the back end of that rather than the front end; even if model making is currently a front-end part of the market.

   
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[MOD]
Making Stuff






Under the couch

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:

Issue for would be competitors is that GW has millions in cash reserve to throw at that problem.

GW Branded Printers. Possibility of uniquely programmed “one and done” STL files. GW branded filament. All little ways that GW can command that market by flexing their brand and cash reserves.

And it’s the branding that matters. To a newcomer, it’s a sign of assurance that specific printer is suited to producing the detail typical of GW’s sculpts. That the filament is the right sort etc.

Remember when GW used those vast resources to release their own army builder software 15 years or so ago?

It didn't exactly set the world on fire.

 
   
Made in ch
Warped Arch Heretic of Chaos





Honestly, GW feels sluggish on occaision.
Probably precislcly becuase they are so large and domineering .

Exploiting that is possible, but difficult.

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A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.

 Daedalus81 wrote:

In the 41st millennium there is only overpriced hamberders.

 
   
Made in de
Been Around the Block




Vienna

 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
I feel like the big box board games that started on Kickstarter straddle the line, or even cross over. For example, the Shadows of Brimstone community on Facebook is really active, and people seem to be really into it in ways other than just playing the game.


I'd say if they consistently offer expansions, miniatures and other goodies, boardgames can tap a little bit into the other aspects too, just look at Kingdom Death.
You got an expensive base game that obviously still sold like crazy and they regularily offer up expansions and miniatures that are counted among the best, at least see it in a lot of suggestions threads for non-GW minis.
If they'd also offer less crazy priced versions, they could expand a lot, but that's a different philosophy
   
Made in gb
Decrepit Dakkanaut




UK

Not Online!!! wrote:
Honestly, GW feels sluggish on occaision.
Probably precislcly becuase they are so large and domineering .

Exploiting that is possible, but difficult.


The problem with a big business is its a bit like an oil tanker. It's got vast wealth and vast potential and vast resources to do stuff. But at the same time its a huge moving object that can't quickly change course without dumping vast amounts of that wealth in one big go.

GW moving into 3D printing and changing the whole design of their company would be hard; they've got long term staff expecting to move up and retire casting plastic; designing sprue, working the machines, packing etc... They've got machines, distribution, factories etc... Their whole system is built to run a certain way. A massive shift that might well result in them having almost no factory production and cutting out a huge number of staff and resources is a big change. It's the kind of change you want to put off because you hope you can push through and not have to basically rebuild the company into a new system that, who knows in 3 years could totally change again.

Newer firms can muscle in during these changing moments, they can take the risks because to them it doesn't matter. They have to take a big risk anyway to get into the market so they can either risk it the traditional way or the new way. If they get it right they might just rise up and overtake the big name; get it wrong and they fall to the side.




We saw this with cameras. Kodak was vast and powerful in the film era. When digital game along they didn't jump in with both feet, it was too different; too big a change and back then it wasn't even superior to film. It was a novelty but distinctly not as good a product at the end. Other firms did, they made big investments, took the risk and the digital got better in a very short span of time. Suddenly the market shifted and digital overtook film. It still wasn't technically superior, but it was digital, it was instant, it was computer based. Today Kodak is a shadow of its former self and has given away the market lead to Canon, Nikon and Sony.

GW could go the same way or perhaps the 3D printing revolution never happens. Heck we can remember that in the 90s VR was going to take over the world, yet it never did. Even today, 30 years later, its still not really taken over gaming. It's far more stable than it was and its seeming that it will settle down into a steady growth within the market; but it never rose to dominance like some predicted 30 years ago. Same with 3D TVs they had a huge amount of noise made about them a few years back, yet it never really translated into an actual change. Perhaps we've another 30 years before 3D printing becomes a household thing. OR heck who knows perhaps there's a huge push against plastics and 3d printing falls to the side as household good start being made of more green and long lasting materials.

   
Made in gb
Princeps of the Titan 'SDF-1'






 insaniak wrote:
 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:

Issue for would be competitors is that GW has millions in cash reserve to throw at that problem.

GW Branded Printers. Possibility of uniquely programmed “one and done” STL files. GW branded filament. All little ways that GW can command that market by flexing their brand and cash reserves.

And it’s the branding that matters. To a newcomer, it’s a sign of assurance that specific printer is suited to producing the detail typical of GW’s sculpts. That the filament is the right sort etc.

Remember when GW used those vast resources to release their own army builder software 15 years or so ago?

It didn't exactly set the world on fire.


True, but army builders are an oddity, insofar as they’re useful, but not essential. If I’ve got my books, I don’t need army building software.

Of course, that changes in the tournament scene. TO can dictate a specific one to be used, to better ensure list accuracy for hundreds of participants. Helluva lot easier to check too.

Fed up of Scalpers? But still want your Exclusives?Why not join us?

 
   
 
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