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The amazing infinity starter Icestorm that missed out including the actual rules so you play using starter rules and then have to unlearn everything once you e actually bought the rulebook? Amazing value.

Assuming you ever get the models together.

The value of the starter set for Infinity and Infinity prices in general are not relevant to this N&R thread. If you wish to continue that discussion then please take it to a different thread.

SeanDrake wrote:

 aka_mythos wrote:

 Galas wrote:
Making the SC! boxes more expensive was probably the worst move to catch new players GW has done in the past 3 years.

The "Well make kits more expensive going forward to avoid making sweeping price increases" was moot when they did a price increase for nearly everything a couple of months ago.

GW's statement to investors states they are a margin focused business, meaning they have more interest in growing margin than growing revenue or growing customer base. If a product costs GW $100 to make, they would rather sell 1000 of them for $300 each than 10,000 of them for $200 each... atleast that what they say, and it sure seems to be the case.

GW have always been margin focused from the point Kirby took over, I interviewed with GW over a decade ago and spoke to there head of retail and sales and even then they were very proud of the fact that nothing in a GW’s store had a margin of less than 70% and most stuff was considerably higher. Obviously the Kirby years cannibalised sales to maintain/increase margin to the point that there sales were abysmal and was in the start of a death spiral, now however nu-GW has pulled out of the spiral and massively increased sales or as I like to think of it restocked the fridge.

GW have warehousing issues, manufacturing issues, infrastructure issues and have discovered that having lots of customers is way too much like work and costs more, now the fridge is restocked they can go back to increasing prices and decreasing costs and improving margins by selling less for more and cannibalising sales again it took them well over a 15yrs last time before they started to have issues so they likely think they have time especially now they have a fb page

They will likely keep turning the heat up on the frogs sorry I mean increasing prices until they reach what they believe is a maintainable ratio unless they just go full Kirby of course and go for maximum profitability at the cost of sustainability I mean nobody on the board is exactly a spring chicken.

The release and support for Necromunda and the other specialist games is more about recapitalizing the people that left than growing the market and getting new entrants to the hobby. This new starter set and its price point, makes it just a set, not a starter set. GW really needs better self control in accepting "starter" products need to be lower priced and that means low margins.

I think there is something illusory about the 'nu-GW' ... for once they did something that grew their customer base. However it was more like recapturing old customers and they know it. The margin focused nature of GW comes from their belief that the size of the wargaming market is only so big and that they already saturate it. -That they can only make so much more money expanding the customer base and can make so much more by milking the ones they've got. GW doesn't care about customer retention because there aren't much in the way of viable alternatives to their products, when you weigh community size. So when someone leaves the hobby, they inevitably comeback, but usually after selling off their collections, forcing them to start over from scratch and that is again far more lucrative than a good customer relationship or community building. At the end of the day they're a company that makes mass produced toys, who's margin focus has shifted the average age of their customer base up a decade. When we're all old men looking around wondering what will happened to our hobby, we'll know, and it'll be too late. They may have bought themselves some time, but its only about as much as it takes to operationally burn through the extra money years from now, as opposed to getting new customers that can buy them decades. Its a ticking timer set to hit its last minute when our generation thins out.

GW likes to point out that more than half their customers just collect and enjoy the hobby, but regardless of the amount people may spend doing that... GW seems blind to the fact that some of that is the perception of the cost to play. Its not only expensive but it is something of a moving goal post so if you can't or don't want to try and keep up you'll have a lot of sunk costs and you'll have rules and models so left behind you almost can't have a fair game.

Points of interest:

-Corpse Grinder Cult is 15 models and appears to be sprue of 5 models repeated three times.

-Palanite Enforcers contain 11 models, 5 of which are current models. This means that 6 models are new. Perhaps an upgrade sprue of 3 models, repeated twice?

jullevi wrote:
-Palanite Enforcers contain 11 models, 5 of which are current models. This means that 6 models are new. Perhaps an upgrade sprue of 3 models, repeated twice?

Personally, I'd find that good news on quite a few levels. 3 model boosters would be nice and managable for long term slow gang expansions. We're still waiting for the long rumoured Juve/Specialist boosters and they'd work with 3 model boxes...

jullevi wrote:
Points of interest:

-Corpse Grinder Cult is 15 models and appears to be sprue of 5 models repeated three times.

-Palanite Enforcers contain 11 models, 5 of which are current models. This means that 6 models are new. Perhaps an upgrade sprue of 3 models, repeated twice?

While that seems about right, it does seem weird to have a team of 3 repeated sprues of basic units (especially one that seems almost entirely melee) and a team of 1 basic sprue and 2 specialist sprues.

Subjucators carry massive shields as big as themselves, The important question here is with 3 bodies now, what they'd do to fill up the space?

Wild guess on my part regarding the Subjugators, but going off the image:

There will be 1 'mounted character sized' sprue per pose. There looks to be 3 distinct poses, at a glance.

Is there a limit as to how many of the breaching kits can be given to a group?

You mean subjugators with shields in an Enforcers 'gang'? Their only unique gang composition rules are (applies to new gangs only):

-at least 2 gangers of the same type as the Leader (Palanite/Subjugator)
-at least 1 Ganger for each Leader & Champion in the gang

All fighters are Palanite by default, but can be upgraded to Subjugator (+10 credits). The House Weapon List is divided in 2 parts, one for each type (Palanites/Subjugators). Only Subjugators have access to shields.

People earlier were saying they're disappointed there's no lawladies in the box, but looking at that image, is it my imagination or do the two on the right at the front row have a slighter build than the others?

When I compare them to the two on the front left the feet, ankles, kneepads, upper arms look just a wee smidge thinner, and maybe a hint on the 2nd from right that the waist is a little narrower? Could just be imagination/perspective, but if not and if they follow the trend from AT of releasing an "updated" gang box with one regular 5 figure sprue and two of these new probably 3 figure ones, that'll be two female models in the box.

 Yodhrin wrote:
People earlier were saying they're disappointed there's no lawladies in the box, but looking at that image, is it my imagination or do the two on the right at the front row have a slighter build than the others?

Front row, second from the right does appear to have a much smaller helmet than the guy standing immediate behind (looking the same direction) - but all the others look beefy to me, which makes me think it is a trick of perspective.

Those Enforcers are such excellent models. I really wish they'd give them some 40K and/or Killteam rules. Out of all the Necromunda models they would make most sense in other games.

And yes, I know that they're Necromundan Enforcers specifically, but other 'Space Police' forces can use similar gear just like most Guard armies use Cadian gear.

Baxx wrote:
You mean subjugators with shields in an Enforcers 'gang'? Their only unique gang composition rules are (applies to new gangs only):

-at least 2 gangers of the same type as the Leader (Palanite/Subjugator)
-at least 1 Ganger for each Leader & Champion in the gang

All fighters are Palanite by default, but can be upgraded to Subjugator (+10 credits). The House Weapon List is divided in 2 parts, one for each type (Palanites/Subjugators). Only Subjugators have access to shields.

Yeah, I don't know anything about Necromunda outside of "The Enforcers aren't Arbites, but damn I want those models".

 Kanluwen wrote:

Yeah, I don't know anything about Necromunda outside of "The Enforcers aren't Arbites, but damn I want those models".

Best way to find out is start playing! Should be super fun.

Baxx wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

Yeah, I don't know anything about Necromunda outside of "The Enforcers aren't Arbites, but damn I want those models".

Best way to find out is start playing! Should be super fun.

When money and time work out, the idea is Enforcers pewpew

Can't wait to finally see the box though. Got at least one person who might be interested in the Slaughtercult.

The shield enforcers are quite nice and characterful (although I'm looking at them from an RPG character mini perspective admittedly).

BTW, who was that company that made the "Not Enforcers"?
Adding them in would be a good place to get a couple extra sniper rifles to the table.

Probably Artel W.

 warboss wrote:
Probably Artel W.

Artel W and Heresy Labs both have sets of Femforcers. They are both more human scale, so more slender and smaller than GW Heroic scale.

I'm going to be one of those people who buy 2 of this set from my FLGS. I want the new enforcer models (CCW scouts for marines!) and new terrain for both 40K (compatible with the sector imperialis/mechanicus should be fun) and it looks like it would work well for Fallout Wasteland Warfare too. I use some other GW terrain for that game as well.

 Sqorgar wrote:

 kendoka wrote:
USD145 for the box would be reasonable.

There is no way in hell.

Infinity's Operation: Wildfire retails at $132. It includes 15 metal miniatures, a heavy cardboard terrain set (retails for $36 separately), dice, rulebooks, templates, tokens, and whatever else. I feel like that is a fair price for what I got.

Dark Uprising has a similar value proposition as a player - there's more miniatures but due to repeated sprues, the cost of the extra miniatures is negligible. The main difference is in terrain, between cardboard and sturdier plastic scenery, not to mention the mat going from paper to hard cardboard, and it is fairly substantial. Let's assume that this is comparable to a Ravaged Lands expansion for Warcry at $90 (and overpriced, at that), so if we subtract $36 from $132 and then add $90, we get $186. So, $190 seems like the upper limit to what I'd expect for this box. Going over $200 is a big nope from me anyway.

However, when you compare it to the value in GW's own Warcry starter, which was $170, the amount of miniatures and terrain seems very similar (or even exceeding - it also included a dozen chaos beast models) the value in Dark Uprising - and it was, what? Four months ago?

I think it will be close to Warcry, maybe the 170 or possibly they up the price, the only set that was above that was the Epic rerelease, forget its name, it was like 290 or something like that, needless to say i didn't get that and if necromunda follows suit, I will have to be a hard pass for me too. Here is to hoping it is 170.

 Sqorgar wrote:

 Yodhrin wrote:
People earlier were saying they're disappointed there's no lawladies in the box, but looking at that image, is it my imagination or do the two on the right at the front row have a slighter build than the others?

Front row, second from the right does appear to have a much smaller helmet than the guy standing immediate behind (looking the same direction) - but all the others look beefy to me, which makes me think it is a trick of perspective.

It is indeed difficult to say. Then again, wearing all this equipment I'm not even sure male and female figures would have to look much different. Substituting the head for a female one might not look too bad. Just to decide on the style...

I will not be able to watch it, but if someone watch it and can post photos of the scenography sprues (if they show it) it would be very interesting.

if you can complain about the price it would also be very good

angel of death 007 wrote:

 Sqorgar wrote:

 kendoka wrote:
USD145 for the box would be reasonable.

There is no way in hell.

Infinity's Operation: Wildfire retails at $132. It includes 15 metal miniatures, a heavy cardboard terrain set (retails for $36 separately), dice, rulebooks, templates, tokens, and whatever else. I feel like that is a fair price for what I got.

Dark Uprising has a similar value proposition as a player - there's more miniatures but due to repeated sprues, the cost of the extra miniatures is negligible. The main difference is in terrain, between cardboard and sturdier plastic scenery, not to mention the mat going from paper to hard cardboard, and it is fairly substantial. Let's assume that this is comparable to a Ravaged Lands expansion for Warcry at $90 (and overpriced, at that), so if we subtract $36 from $132 and then add $90, we get $186. So, $190 seems like the upper limit to what I'd expect for this box. Going over $200 is a big nope from me anyway.

However, when you compare it to the value in GW's own Warcry starter, which was $170, the amount of miniatures and terrain seems very similar (or even exceeding - it also included a dozen chaos beast models) the value in Dark Uprising - and it was, what? Four months ago?

I think it will be close to Warcry, maybe the 170 or possibly they up the price, the only set that was above that was the Epic rerelease, forget its name, it was like 290 or something like that, needless to say i didn't get that and if necromunda follows suit, I will have to be a hard pass for me too. Here is to hoping it is 170.

If only epic was rereleased

Motograter wrote:

If only epic was rereleased

It was. Apoc 2019. Just divide the distances by 4.

 MajorWesJanson wrote:

Motograter wrote:

If only epic was rereleased

It was. Apoc 2019. Just divide the distances by 4.

Nah, just swap inches to CM and you're set more or less.

From twitter, probably a new WHW diorama:

It is shown in the livestream, White Dwarf board (amongst other usage) by Mark Bedford

They are currently showing that table on https://www.twitch.tv/warhammer

Thorgor on Yaktribe

Not yet, I hope it will be in the second part.

You've not missed anything interesting imo. It was mostly stuff we already knew. I took a few notes from the beginning but then I had to mute the stream:
​
General:​
Very big box (seems AT-sized)​
Different way to play the game set in a different hive​
New doors slot in and out​
Uprising campaign (similar to Dominion but with scavenging, need for meat) (seems very similar to Law & Misrule)​
"Just the beginning". They have stuff in the pipe for the next 2~3 years.​
​
CGC:​
Corpsegrinder cult is linked to the Corpsegrinder guild. It's what happens when workers decide to sample the unprocessed product.​
Use repurposed tools​
Little guys are the initiates. Start with the infiltrate skill.​
Masks are special armour. Each type of fighter has a different mask with different effect.​
T3 S3. Faster than Goliath. Glass cannon​
​
Enforcers:​
1 palanite frame + 2 subjugator frames​

Interesting stream (imo), Mark is giving painting tips and talks about the new terrain (in part two, currently broadcasted)


Automatically Appended Next Post:

The meatgrinder shown above is made from the Khorne (Daemon) terrain piece

I thought the main part was from the Noctolith(?) ring that they CSM got. Looks like that's the base of it, at least. Clever and subtle use of a Chaos scenery piece.