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 mikhaila wrote:

Relapse wrote:

 mikhaila wrote:
Just put up details for our first tournament. Threw together some scoring and list building rules, and seeing what happens next.

https://www.facebook.com/ShowcaseComicsGR/posts/993278557371865

Will you be putting a report about the tournament up, with maybe some pictures? I'd enter this in a heartbeat if I was near your store.

Yep, will try to get some good pictures of the this and some thoughts on the games and the system. Nothing like a tournament with lots of different people to break a game in interesting ways

I'm leaving list building pretty open, so we can see what happens. Lots of my preconceived ideas about "what's good" have been shattered so far Stats and rules are so different, and many models are much easier to hurt.

I'm off work this week, so I'll be getting as many games of this in as I can with my undead. I think it's going to be quite fun, myself. For those times I want ranked forces, I can do KoW. It really seems like a win win here, with a couple of honestly different fantasy systems instead of clones.

 Melissia wrote:
I'm horrified, I find myself agreeing with HBMC. What a terrible thought.

You'd spend less time being wrong about everything if you did that more often.

 streamdragon wrote:
Honestly my skaven army would basically be dead in the water under those rules, but I fielded a couple hordes of stormvermin and slaves, so I suspect my army won't work at all in AoS.

Yeah, going -strictly- by wounds just helps to contain the problem a little - it is definitely not a firm 'fix'. Some armies basic 1-wound models do not compare to 1-wound models of other armies.

But it -does- help keep the game from reaching ridiculous levels, and I think that's what Mik is aiming for.

Now that AoS is out, what are the rumors of the next release?
Surely there will be other content, even for 40K before the rumored Tau release in September.

 Alpha wrote:
Now that AoS is out, what are the rumors of the next release?
Surely there will be other content, even for 40K before the rumored Tau release in September.

Earlier in the thread there have been pics showing some of the next waves of Eternals. Presumably, after those are out, they'll further flesh out Khorne, and after that, probably another faction or 2 before 40k hits again. Take this strictly as a guess, not a rumor. Well, the first part isn't a guess, but the latter part are.

I am one of those old farts who has Warhammered for 20+ years. I drifted away from WHFB because of life, and then bailed after 8th edition, which was IMO a disaster that combined tedious grinding with essentially random, game-deciding events. Judging by sales, this was not just my O.

So I didn't have high hopes for Age of Sigmar. But I gotta say...looking at all the backpatched warscrolls...I can see how this might actually work.

IMO the biggest problem with 8th was that the game didn't match the hobby. The Warhammer hobby asked you to invest absurd amounts of time and money into an army. And then the 8th edition game mocked that. As soon as a game started, you'd be clawing up fistfuls of your carefully-painted wound markers - er, models - as quickly as you put them down. The pride and joy Big Thing that you spent a month painting took a turn 1 cannonball to the face. And then someone got off a Purple Sun or Black Horror FTW. You spend all this time on your army, and then the game is decided by lulz. Very unsatisfying.

You could fix this by rewriting the rules to fit the massive armies that the hobby told us to collect. Warhammer's weakness (well before 8th) has always been that it is too fiddly for a giant mass-combat game. If you're fielding 200 figures, the precise location of characters within units should not matter. You shouldn't have to care if a unit has 47 or 51 of a rank and file dude. The "spear or hand weapon?" decision should not be fraught with peril. You don't need 150 similar-but-different magic items, or 18 different generic Orc & Goblin heroes and wizards. Etc. So get rid of that clutter and build a ruleset focused on multiple big units moving, shooting, and fighting. This is essentially Kings of War.

But Age of Sigmar goes a different way. After years of insisting that the hobby is collecting massive armies chock full of regular dudes, I think GW just looked at what was actually selling. People like fancy heroes, big centerpieces (goony monsters and war machines), shiny cavalry, and a smattering of the rank-and-file figures that catch their eye. So why fight that? Why not build a game where "what people are willing to buy" also works as an army? Don't feel like painting 120 Zombies, 150 Skaven or even 50 Empire State Troops? OK...how about 10? Can you do 10? Come on, you know you can...because that's all you need for a unit. You don't need to do more. Unless you do feel like it. Then do.

(Oh, and also get rid of some of the "18 different generic Orc & Goblin heroes and wizards" clutter.)

I can see the point: GW is trying to align the game with the hobby. I don't know if AoS is going to be fun. But at least it makes sense, which is more than I can say for the last 5 years of WHFB.

I just wish I liked the WWE-meets-Space Marines aesthetic more. I will miss the historical-ish inspiration for WHFB. But then, as I said, I am an old fart.

 pretre wrote:

 GiraffeX wrote:

 pretre wrote:

 Melissia wrote:
So no more orcs and goblins.

Whelp, there goes my plans to buy a spider rider army.

When it comes to being a massive, depressing disappointment, GW never disappoints.

Orcs and Goblins are still there...

They are until they release the new version of the Orcs then the old will be discontinued

Your minis don't self-destruct when they make new models...

Unless they're finecast and you leave them in the trunk while you go into the store to get the new one.

Next up is more AoS stuff.

At the very least there's more Sigmarite models (and rules) to comes, and it's likely there'll be more after that.

I don't think it'll be anything other than new models and warscrolls, though.

*I should probably say this is not a rumor, this is from the pictures we've seen so far and some speculation on my part

 Matt.Kingsley wrote:
Next up is more AoS stuff.

At the very least there's more Sigmarite models (and rules) to comes, and it's likely there'll be more after that.

I don't think it'll be anything other than new models and warscrolls, though.

I will be interested to see what the new undead will be looking like.

posted this on that other forum.
Concerning balance.
Here's my suggestion. Players agree on a wounds limit with the following modifiers. One hero and one monster or war machine for every 40 wounds. Heroes with 10 or more wounds count as two choices. Models with a 6+ save or worse half their wounds total. ( 50 clan rats counts as 25 wounds.) Models with the deamon keyword or the deathwizard ability double their wound total.
Also a couple of house rules. You can't summon models you don't have with you, so if you bring 5 locs you can attempt to summon them.
Summoned models may take no action except for fighting in combat until the following turn.
command abilities are once per game.
sudden death applies to wounds not models. It is must be agreed by both players before being applied.
measuring is base to base.
models in combat may not use ranged weapons.
thoughts?
P.s. i know some people think doing this is like polishing a **** but it is a fun thought experiment for me.

Yes it will be interesting...
I have a funny feeling that they'll be removing the Ancient Egyptian theme that Tomb Kings have completely from the undead faction, though.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:
Simply saying that the nonsense that gets posted constantly about how GW shouldn't do this or that because they'll "lose good will with a good portion of the customer base" has been so overplayed that it detracts from any real criticisms.

Be fair Kan, GW doesn't have any goodwill left with the community.

Tell that to all the White Knights here and on Warseer and BoLS...

So... has anyone done a post yet to compare rumor to reality? What was accurate, what was gak, and which sources are creditable (credible? incredible?)?
And once that's over, we could stick a fork in this thread and call it done.

 insaniak wrote:

 Whumbachumba wrote:
Haven't seen this pop up during all the complaining.

It's been posted at least half a dozen times so far.

They do look very cool, though...

They certainly do.

How long before they get knocked off by another round of people taking advantage of the new Longbeard rules?

 Matt.Kingsley wrote:
I don't think it'll be anything other than new models and warscrolls, though.

New terrain! Don't forget that.

That's at least one thing to look forward to...

 Matt.Kingsley wrote:
Yes it will be interesting...
I have a funny feeling that they'll be removing the Ancient Egyptian theme that Tomb Kings have completely from the undead faction, though.

I might have to get a Sphinx soon then, for my Necron army.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 Matt.Kingsley wrote:
I don't think it'll be anything other than new models and warscrolls, though.

New terrain! Don't forget that.

That's at least one thing to look forward to...

The terrain market is so bloated and saturated I can safely pass on anything from GW.

In fact, the entire tabletop wargame scene so so bloated and saturated, I can safely pass on anything from GW, including 40K.

That's nice dear, but some of us are GW terrainaholics (like me!) and can't get enough of the stuff.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 Matt.Kingsley wrote:
I don't think it'll be anything other than new models and warscrolls, though.

New terrain! Don't forget that.

That's at least one thing to look forward to...

TBF Terrain could be counted under models, but I will admit I did forget about them. For some reason I was under the (false) impression the Gate and Ruins went up for pre-order already.

At least there's something in this release that you can look forward to and enjoy, H.B.M.C.

 Matt.Kingsley wrote:
At least there's something in this release that you can look forward to and enjoy, H.B.M.C.

Are you kidding? I think the Khornate stuff in the AoS box is fantastic. Hell I even like the one thing that everyone here seems to hate (that Khorne skull beast thingy with the tiny head).

Chikout wrote:
posted this on that other forum.
Concerning balance.
Here's my suggestion. Players agree on a wounds limit with the following modifiers. One hero and one monster or war machine for every 40 wounds. Heroes with 10 or more wounds count as two choices. Models with a 6+ save or worse half their wounds total. ( 50 clan rats counts as 25 wounds.) Models with the deamon keyword or the deathwizard ability double their wound total.
Also a couple of house rules. You can't summon models you don't have with you, so if you bring 5 locs you can attempt to summon them.
Summoned models may take no action except for fighting in combat until the following turn.



command abilities are once per game.
sudden death applies to wounds not models. It is must be agreed by both players before being applied.
measuring is base to base.
models in combat may not use ranged weapons.
thoughts?
P.s. i know some people think doing this is like polishing a **** but it is a fun thought experiment for me.

Please post in my wounds thread in warhammer general. Very close to your suggestion

 Whumbachumba wrote:
Haven't seen this pop up during all the complaining.

It's odd at first that they are resting the arrow on the wrong side of the bow, but then I noticed that they are actually using their index fingers as the arrow rest, which I guess is a benefit of wearing plate gauntlets. So as long as they tilt the bow to the left, technically it would work.

I just can't believe it's an army the size of fething 40k terminators. I thought the bases were the new 32mm ones, and then I see they are 40mm? If they are priced anything like terminators, Sigmarines armies are gonna cost a mint to field as an army outside of the great deal of the starter set.

The biggest thing that worries me about AoS beyond the rules is that the prices are going to skyrocket yet again. Smaller armies, sure, but at prices even higher than now? Yeesh.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
That's nice dear, but some of us are GW terrainaholics (like me!) and can't get enough of the stuff.

I'm not your fething "dear".

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 Matt.Kingsley wrote:
At least there's something in this release that you can look forward to and enjoy, H.B.M.C.

Are you kidding? I think the Khornate stuff in the AoS box is fantastic. Hell I even like the one thing that everyone here seems to hate (that Khorne skull beast thingy with the tiny head).

The Skull beast seems like it can have a lot of uses in 40K as well.

 Orock wrote:

Chikout wrote:
posted this on that other forum.
Concerning balance.
Here's my suggestion. Players agree on a wounds limit with the following modifiers. One hero and one monster or war machine for every 40 wounds. Heroes with 10 or more wounds count as two choices. Models with a 6+ save or worse half their wounds total. ( 50 clan rats counts as 25 wounds.) Models with the deamon keyword or the deathwizard ability double their wound total.
Also a couple of house rules. You can't summon models you don't have with you, so if you bring 5 locs you can attempt to summon them.
Summoned models may take no action except for fighting in combat until the following turn.



command abilities are once per game.
sudden death applies to wounds not models. It is must be agreed by both players before being applied.
measuring is base to base.
models in combat may not use ranged weapons.
thoughts?
P.s. i know some people think doing this is like polishing a **** but it is a fun thought experiment for me.

Please post in my wounds thread in warhammer general. Very close to your suggestion

Problem is with models with 6+ save counting as 1/2 wound is that some elite units have 6+ saves (wardancers or witch elves) one way is to limit this rule to those with min 10 models in the unit. i notice that elite units are all min size 5 instead of 10.

 AegisGrimm wrote:
It's odd at first that they are resting the arrow on the wrong side of the bow, but then I noticed that they are actually using their index fingers as the arrow rest, which I guess is a benefit of wearing plate gauntlets. So as long as they tilt the bow to the left, technically it would work..

There's no 'wrong' side. Different styles of archery use either.

The bigger problem is the lack of flights, and the ring on the end that they're using to draw it back is going to hit that index finger and make the 'arrow' tumble.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
You'd spend less more time being wrong about everything if you did that more often.

But why would I want that?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Can someone give an image of the Skullbeast?

 Whumbachumba wrote:
Haven't seen this pop up during all the complaining.

Spoiler:

The Sigmarines remind me of Dark Souls, that's why I like them. Still don't want to touch the game, but will be looking to find a cheap lot to mess around with. I like those models.

If they were truly a minis company, they'd be selling them in one or two packs for a reasonable price, IMO. This current product line still flies in the face of that.

 fellblade wrote:
Did I somehow imply that I thought the 8th ed. rulebook ever worked well? WHFB 8th ed. was my ragequit moment.

I'm with JH on this- I'd pay $20 for GW to print the rules and all the warscrolls for me. HA! You know what I expect? I expect card decks of warscrolls, at $20 retail each, for a limited time. (Actually, I can only dream the price point will be $20. This is GW we're talking about.)

Yeah, I stopped playing WFB shortly after this article came out in May of 2011:
http://www.belloflostsouls.net/2011/05/editorial-warhammer-fantasy-8th-not-being-played-much.html

Cards or book? Why can't we have both?

 TheKbob wrote:
Unless I'm misunderstanding you, no, the $85 core rulebook doesn't work well anymore.

I don't think the big expensive rulebook has ever worked terribly well. What worked well was having the smaller book in a good value starter set.

I don't know for sure, but at a guess I'd say ever since GW started with having their big rulebooks (was it 6th ed WHFB and 3rd ed 40k?) I would think the big rulebooks probably sold less than the starter sets did.

Personally, the only times I've bought big rulebooks is when they have been very cheap (either on sale because they were being replaced or 2nd hand from players who were quitting the game).


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
That's nice dear...

You do realise this is an internet discussion forum and not a pub where you are trying to start a drunken brawl? Maybe try and be less condescending, eh?