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Dark wrote:

The Fox Lord wrote:

H.B.M.C. wrote:Look on the bright side - if GW had continued the trend of Marines riding things with the Blood Angels, and we had got Blood Angels riding giant bats, we would get Black Templars riding horses (obviously), but what would the Dark Angels be riding? Other Dark Angels? *shudder*

Dark Angel wouldn't ride other Dark Angles, They'd be riding giant green Lions in red battle armor holding massive power swords over their heads and screamin "I HAVE THE POWER!" with really cool lightning effects flying all around them.

Well, that sounds manly... THIS manly. Fits the DA

Yes that manly.
"BY THE POWER OF THE EMPORER!...I HAVE THE POWER!"

So, what was this thread about again? Unless we can get it back on track, the modquisition will be here any moment...

BTW, my girlfriend said liked the Canis figure, I wanted to slap her, but my marbles would have been lodged in my throat...

Vargtass wrote:So, what was this thread about again? Unless we can get it back on track, the modquisition will be here any moment...

BTW, my girlfriend said liked the Canis figure, I wanted to slap her, but my marbles would have been lodged in my throat...

It is suposed to be about why does everyone seem to hate him and how he actualy Does Not Suck, not how ugly the model is.

Except that he does suck, and his model is ugly.

A general concensus on this point has been reached.

SaintHazard wrote:Except that he does suck, and his model is ugly.

A general consensus on this point has been reached.

I do agree that the model has issues and have been trying to avoid that discussion from that start.

As for rules wise I don't Agree.
Yes, you can build a Better "Thunder Wolf Lord"
Yes, you can build a Cheaper "Thunder Wolf Lord"
But you can’t build one cheaper that does what he does.

You have go Back to a basic rule: The Right Tool for the Job
You have tailor you list a little with him, you just cant throw him a list and expert results.

You are taking on a Leaf Blower List: Wrong list for him to be on.
You are taking on a Space Marine Gun Line: Wrong list for him to be on.
You are taking on a multiple Monolith Necron List: Wrong list for him to be on.

You are taking on that all Grot Amy: Right list for him to be on.
You are taking on that Mass Genestealer Horde: Right list for him to be on.
You are taking on the Blob Guard list: Right list for him to be on.

Everything else is hit or miss. You need to build your list around him and you have two basic schools of thought on that.

First: As part of the list. Make sure you have something to counter he weakness: No Range. With this you are trying to make a Tournament Level Competitive Winning List.
-Long Fangs are good for this [is there any thing they can’t do]
-Dreads [Auto-Cannons, Las Cannons, Missile Launcher and/or Plasma Cannons]
Use him as a counter charge unit.

Second: Who gives a lets just go to the wall, I am going to run over you and then suck out your eyeball list. These list while not a Tournament Level Competitive Winning List, are just fun to play. You ar just taking Canis, one or more Wolf Lords on Thunderwolf Mounts and as many Thunderwolf Cavalry and Fenrisian Wolf Packs you have managed to get are trying to table the other guy under a sea of Fangs and Fur.
This is the list he should be on most of the time, a Fun list.

And you have Fun with him he Can’t Suck.

Regardless of how you run him, if you run him in any army with any ranged capability whatsoever (read: all of them) he'll likely be dead turn 2, before he gets anywhere near combat.

He sucks, and his model is ugly.

It's that simple.

SaintHazard wrote:Regardless of how you run him, if you run him in any army with any ranged capability whatsoever (read: all of them) he'll likely be dead turn 2, before he gets anywhere near combat.

He sucks, and his model is ugly.

It's that simple.

Could you contribute something other than that for that few pages.

I've already contributed.

I'm just summing up this thread so far, and the general concensus reached herein.

I don't see that, there has been many who have said thay have used him sucsesfuly and with great effect.

The Fox Lord wrote:"BY THE POWER OF THE EMPORER!...I HAVE THE POWER!"

That's about Matt Ward-ish level writing right there.


And for those trying to call He-Man manly, remember that in the She-Ra movie, Prince Adam wore a pink shirt, and talked about making sweetbread. So not the best example here...

H.B.M.C. wrote:

The Fox Lord wrote:"BY THE POWER OF THE EMPORER!...I HAVE THE POWER!"

That's about Matt Ward-ish level writing right there.


And for those trying to call He-Man manly, remember that in the She-Ra movie, Prince Adam wore a pink shirt, and talked about making sweetbread. So not the best example here...

What is scaring me about that is he has taken all of my “He-Man” Heads from my Space Wolf Battle Forces and now I think he may be looking for good Saber-Tooth Tiger Minis.
His Chaos Maries are currently lead by Hordak

Anpu42 wrote:

H.B.M.C. wrote:

The Fox Lord wrote:"BY THE POWER OF THE EMPORER!...I HAVE THE POWER!"

That's about Matt Ward-ish level writing right there.


And for those trying to call He-Man manly, remember that in the She-Ra movie, Prince Adam wore a pink shirt, and talked about making sweetbread. So not the best example here...

What is scaring me about that is he has taken all of my “He-Man” Heads from my Space Wolf Battle Forces and now I think he may be looking for good Saber-Tooth Tiger Minis.
His Chaos Maries are currently lead by Hordak

It'd be cooler is the Chaos Marine leader was Skeletor, but I'm always complaining anyway.

He has him done up to.

Yes, yes I do.
Hordak Rules my Tzeench army & and Skeletor heads my Slanesh army.

I want pics of that.

Anpu42 wrote:

SaintHazard wrote:Except that he does suck, and his model is ugly.

A general consensus on this point has been reached.

I do agree that the model has issues and have been trying to avoid that discussion from that start.

As for rules wise I don't Agree.
Yes, you can build a Better "Thunder Wolf Lord"
Yes, you can build a Cheaper "Thunder Wolf Lord"
But you can’t build one cheaper that does what he does.

You have go Back to a basic rule: The Right Tool for the Job
You have tailor you list a little with him, you just cant throw him a list and expert results.

You are taking on a Leaf Blower List: Wrong list for him to be on.
You are taking on a Space Marine Gun Line: Wrong list for him to be on.
You are taking on a multiple Monolith Necron List: Wrong list for him to be on.

You are taking on that all Grot Amy: Right list for him to be on.
You are taking on that Mass Genestealer Horde: Right list for him to be on.
You are taking on the Blob Guard list: Right list for him to be on.

Everything else is hit or miss. You need to build your list around him and you have two basic schools of thought on that.

First: As part of the list. Make sure you have something to counter he weakness: No Range. With this you are trying to make a Tournament Level Competitive Winning List.
-Long Fangs are good for this [is there any thing they can’t do]
-Dreads [Auto-Cannons, Las Cannons, Missile Launcher and/or Plasma Cannons]
Use him as a counter charge unit.

Second: Who gives a lets just go to the wall, I am going to run over you and then suck out your eyeball list. These list while not a Tournament Level Competitive Winning List, are just fun to play. You ar just taking Canis, one or more Wolf Lords on Thunderwolf Mounts and as many Thunderwolf Cavalry and Fenrisian Wolf Packs you have managed to get are trying to table the other guy under a sea of Fangs and Fur.
This is the list he should be on most of the time, a Fun list.

And you have Fun with him he Can’t Suck.

Unless someone can come with a good counter-argument on this I dub this post a winner.

Vargtass wrote:

Anpu42 wrote:

SaintHazard wrote:Except that he does suck, and his model is ugly.

A general consensus on this point has been reached.

(stuff)

Unless someone can come with a good counter-argument on this I dub this post a winner.

I'll Bite.

This Winning post itself is the counter argument as to why and how Canis sucks.

First it shows that against most of the Top-tier Lists Canis is fail.

Then it tells you against several of the (considered) weak lists; he can do quite well.

So it summarizes as: Canis is Top-tier of the bottom-Tier units. Great.

And with Several of the lists Canis is "made to go against"; you are required to nerf Canis's "slaughter the hell out of anything nearby" rule in order to deliver him into combat to begin with. The only Delivery method we have for him is to place him into a large unit of Fenrisian wolves, and send the whole shebang straight towards the largest concentration of enemy models you can find; then when you get the group into combat the rules require you to get as many of those wolves into b2b as possible, while the defender react is flexible enough to allow the enemy to get more models into contact with the wolves instead of Canis. 16 models assaulting what is often going to be a smaller unit(especially with the genestealer hordes), or a not much larger unit(I don't know of anyone that advocates blobbing more than 3 squads max for IG); means you are not going to get the requisite 6+ models in contact with Canis to make use of his rule.

Sure he could be fun to play with; so could the Leman russ Punisher, Swooping hawks, storm troopers, Possessed, helions, or howling banshees.

I'm just sayin' is all.

^
^
^
What he said

So let move them apart in your movement phase and charge the now I5 wolves at something else, and charge Canis for max effect, they aren't glued together and if they are you're doing it wrong

Anpu... you finally nailed it... If you had said that at the beginning... well, I would be a much happier person...
Anus Wolfporn, really... I can't say his name without saying 'Anus Wolfborn'...

Oh, well.

Canis Wolfborn may well be a stupid character, but that's ok, we still have Logan Grimnar, whose name does it right.
Besides, in a game featuring space elves and orks, who cares about the ridiculousness? Some people still think the Squats were a good idea, for god's sake. Admittedly, there are times when it gets a bit much, but I would argue that the SW stuff was not at that infamous level at all.

Canis Wolfborn: Rending
o It states he has Rending it his Profile
o He has Wolf Claws
o Under the Thunderwolf Mount Rule it says that a rider with a Thunderwolf Mount can not use the rending if he is using a “Special Close Combat Weapons”.

Which is Right by RAW?
-By the statement “Specific Overrides General”?
o The General Rule: Thunderwolf Cavalry can not get Rending with “Special Close Combat Weapons”
o The Specific Rule under the Canis Wolfborn's “Special Rules:” it States Rending
To me thar reads very clear “The Specific Rule of Rending overrides the Genral Rule of Thunderwolf Mount”

I had always thought that the rending rule would apply to the extra attacks from Fangir when he and Canis were surrounded in close combat. If I went with my interpretation of the rules, any Wolf Claw attacks wouldn't have rending, where any additional attacks from the mount would offer rending.

Just my input though.

Erik Wolfbrother wrote:I had always thought that the rending rule would apply to the extra attacks from Fangir when he and Canis were surrounded in close combat. If I went with my interpretation of the rules, any Wolf Claw attacks wouldn't have rending, where any additional attacks from the mount would offer rending.

Just my input though.

But were does Fangir's Attacks come in?
His Wrath of the Savage give him his extra attack from his Wolf Claws.

Anpu42 wrote:Canis Wolfborn: Rending
o It states he has Rending it his Profile
o He has Wolf Claws
o Under the Thunderwolf Mount Rule it says that a rider with a Thunderwolf Mount can not use the rending if he is using a “Special Close Combat Weapons”.

Which is Right by RAW?
-By the statement “Specific Overrides General”?
o The General Rule: Thunderwolf Cavalry can not get Rending with “Special Close Combat Weapons”
o The Specific Rule under the Canis Wolfborn's “Special Rules:” it States Rending
To me thar reads very clear “The Specific Rule of Rending overrides the Genral Rule of Thunderwolf Mount”

Only Via GW FAQ(i.e. Studio House Rules) do Thunder Wolf Cabvalry not get rending with their Special Rules. Neither thunderWolf Cavalry nor Canis have a Peice of Wargear called a "ThunderWolf mount"(Canis has Fangir as Wargear and the Fluff description of Fangir states he is a monstrous T-wolf; but a: that is Fluff, and B: still does not call him a Thunderwolf Mount, only a Thunderwolf.)

Erik: there are no Bonus attacks from Fangir, Ever; by any reading of the Rules. Fangir provides a mysterious bonus to Canis's profile(one that we will never know of) and that is all. Wrath of the Savage is definitely Canis's own special rule(the fluff states that he and fangir make up all of the attacks), and there is no "bonus" to his attacks; the number of enemy models replaces his base A Value.

1: The model is made from pure fuglyness.
Needs to be re-posed and altered alot.

2: Until GW re-FAQ's it, rending does nothing for him just yet.

3: No inv. save makes him power weapon food.
Against anything with more than basic attacks he will be brought down quickly. (slaanesh daemons being a prime example)

4: No eternal warrior.
Nearly every single army has something S10 that they can take a few of now.
Not only that, instant death has become pretty common in armies.

5: List wise - Just like meph for BA, you need to taylor the list around him, rather than adding him to the army.
Its mainly for this reason people dont want to commit to using him.


Just my thoughts anyway.