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Yes, nothing to do with rules but they need to update the fluff (all the ancient "war in heaven" stuff is really confusing)

Deadshot wrote:Necrons can be deadly to mech armies,as even the Warriors can glance LR enemy monolithes.


Question:If a weapon that is gauss can penetrate on a 6(ie-Guass cannon on a rhino),does it glance or penentrate?

Do you have any idea how hard it is to glance a Monolith to death? I really hope you do, because it's nigh impossible.

it is impossiable unless you are ap1

it has a weapon that cannot be destroyed thus you cannot glance it to death.

Corrode wrote:For context KingmanHighborn is the guy who thinks having 2 res orb lords and a Monolith in range of a squad gets you 4 WBB attempts so he's not really arguing in good faith.

For context I had one mistake that res orb gave a reroll, and even then, with that mistake it was 3 attempts. So yes they offically only get the normal WBB and then the extra one through the Monolith.

And I was misunderstand on being ran over, as it meant more like being mauled like losing 8 out of 10 for example. And with thier Ld 10 it'll take a lot to make them take a difficult LD test to run. So unless you do kill all of the squad in one go, they will come back good as new.

Anyway bottom line Necrons are not overpriced. And it amazes me how Necron players will whine even when they table update armies with ease. They do need a new dex to give them some variety, and a tweak on phase out, but the prices of what they have is fair.

KingmanHighborn wrote:Anyway bottom line Necrons are not overpriced. And it amazes me how Necron players will whine even when they table update armies with ease. They do need a new dex to give them some variety, and a tweak on phase out, but the prices of what they have is fair.

Who's whining about it?

You said that they were fairly priced compared to Marines and were shown how wrong that was. Costing 3 points more and not being nearly as good as a pretty standard model that you'll see around the gaming tables is a pretty good indication that something might cost a bit too much.

The fact that I (and many others) manage to win with them is entirely beside the point.

Deadshot wrote:When GW brins out a new codex,they either crap out on what's there and and downgrade all the special rules.

I take it you've not read the GK Codex?

Monster Rain wrote:You said that they were fairly priced compared to Marines and were shown how wrong that was. Costing 3 points more and not being nearly as good as a pretty standard model that you'll see around the gaming tables is a pretty good indication that something might cost a bit too much.

The fact that I (and many others) manage to win with them is entirely beside the point.

I haven't been shown jack squat. As at 18 points they are fair, and are better then the average marine model. And you proved my point. When you lose 9 times out of ten, even when being a cheesy power gamer then you might have a case. Until then, my points stand firm.

H.B.M.C. wrote:

Deadshot wrote:When GW brins out a new codex,they either crap out on what's there and and downgrade all the special rules.

I take it you've not read the GK Codex?

Ward's writing.Doesn't count IMO.

Deadshot wrote:

H.B.M.C. wrote:

Deadshot wrote:When GW brins out a new codex,they either crap out on what's there and and downgrade all the special rules.

I take it you've not read the GK Codex?

Ward's writing.Doesn't count IMO.

As much as I dislike Ward myself, you mentioned "GW", and Matt Ward is a part of GW. You cannot say "that doesn't count".

I just did.

It's kind of like if we showed up and said your posts don't count.

Basing statements on facts, whilst manipulating said facts by excluding relevant data, is ignorance.

The easy thing would be to notice the pattern of marine codices and power to non-marine codices and power. The new Necron codex would likely be easier for both the opponent and player by being more "streamlined"/basic and would likely be average at best. Their WBB changing to either flat FNP or a specialised version of it for simplicity; though not needed at all.

The problem I see with them is how combat resolves, it's a bit too easy for them to fail combat and be wiped out; leading to phase out. Really they just need either Stubborn or Fearless in order to reflect the "fearless" the codex seems to have attempted with the army wide LD10.

I think the Necrons, then Witchhunters and Tau should be updated next. I've only seen -one- Necron army do well in casual and competitive gaming. It comprised of two monoliths and as many Warriors and Destroyers as possible.

The new GK dex is no more OP then the crons when they came out. I realized this when i was playing a standard marine list and was outnumbered 4 to 1. We have some new hinky special rules that are irritating to play against but are by no means impossiable to overcome.

As it stands, marines ATSKNF should account for the same amount of points as we'll be back. they have a seargent (1 more attack) they have better initiative. with gauss weapons we should be the same price, not 2 points more.

KingmanHighborn wrote:And I was misunderstand on being ran over, as it meant more like being mauled like losing 8 out of 10 for example. And with thier Ld 10 it'll take a lot to make them take a difficult LD test to run. So unless you do kill all of the squad in one go, they will come back good as new.

In your case when they lose 8 of 10, only remaining two strike back and even if both of them cause a wound, they still lose the combat 8 to 2 so take -8 Ld modifier. You should check page 44 of the BRB.

KingmanHighborn wrote:And it amazes me how Necron players will whine even when they table update armies with ease.

Then may I ask those necron players to share their wisdom with a fellow necron player. Because only time I tabled an up to date army, it was pure luck (Longfang spam rolling 1s, etc.) and stressful.

Currently necrons are fundamentally flawed. We are weak at cc but ok at mid-range. However there is no more mid-range in the era of fast skimmer transports. Necrons need a new codex, not for op units or rules, that you think we want, but for a definition of our new role.

Edit: Spelling.

agreed.

we are no longer the shooting army we were. You cant really call yourself a shooting army when your specialty is mid range combat. By then most cc armies are one or two turns from you and you dont have the range to hammer current shooting armies.

Deadshot wrote:
Ward's writing.Doesn't count IMO.

Yes, GW downgrades every army with every new release except for in books written by Mat Ward, which account for about half of the 40k books from the last year. Oh, and Dark Eldar, Imperial Guard, and Space Wolves. You don't know what you're talking about.

In fact, the ONLY downgraded codex to come out in 5th edition would be Tyranids. Even Orks can still compete and their book was written on the tail end of 4th ed.

KingmanHighborn wrote:I haven't been shown jack squat. As at 18 points they are fair, and are better then the average marine model.

Well, actually, you have. The fact that you refuse to acknowledge it and keep saying "Yeah they are!" without making any actual points speaks volumes.

KingmanHighborn wrote:And you proved my point. When you lose 9 times out of ten, even when being a cheesy power gamer then you might have a case. Until then, my points stand firm.

This doesn't make sense. Clearly you aren't even reading what other people are writing.

And what points? The only point you make is the repeated and incorrect assertion that Necrons aren't overcosted.

I'm not the font of knowledge when it comes to Necrons, but I'm sure they'd fair a lot better if their points values were brought down to 'modern' levels?
My friend has a (very dusty, sun deprived) necron army and IIRC he said there is actually only 1 valid list that you can create with 500 points. Something has got to be wrong there surely...?

That is correct. With Crons you have only 1 list that is a legal list in a 500 point game.