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I used a weighted 25mm base. Then again, My Celestine's plumage already has her at a disadvantage.

 KalashnikovMarine wrote:


I used a weighted 25mm base. Then again, My Celestine's plumage already has her at a disadvantage.

Nice model.
Also check page... 8.
You don't count weapons (guns/swords), or wings and tails, only the central torso (arms, legs and body) when determining what you can see.
As it specifically states the rules are designed to not penalise players for having awesome models, the way I read it is, this will carry over to determining Cover too.

The avenger's amazing.

Avenger bolt cannon with 7 shots
2 Las cannons

Can be given a variety of different bombs and missiles or extra multi lasers, las cannons or auto-cannons.

Armour 12.

All for the cost of Saint Celestine and a Rhino. Pretty great stuff.

For proxying Avenger strike fighters has any one had any success with or looked a the Puppet's War fighters?



The loads out it has should be able to match up with the Avenger with some creative extra modeling on your part and I'm strongly considering it for my ladies. Any one have a source on Immolator gunners? I need a pilot.

So I won't be able to make the Bay Area Open this year but that didn't stop me from thinking about lists. I figured I'd start with my 1500pt list from the Golden Throne GT and then rework it from there.

Golden Throne - 1500pts
From my experience the biggest weakness of this list is its inability deal with fliers and weak troops choices with poor mobility. There's really nothing from the SoB list that can help with that so allies are the only option. I didn't really want to use IG and the Coteaz henchmen lists that have been so successful don't add much in the Troops dept. I decided to go with a Grey Knights Strike Squad. A 10-man squad with 2 Psycannon and Psybolts is 240pts. Since I had to bring in an HQ as well, I wanted to do Coteaz, but he wouldn't be able to join the squad if they used their Deep Strike ability, so I settled on an Ordo Malleus Inq with TDA, Psycannon, Daemonhammer, Psyker L1.

The Inquisitor will take a Divination power. Prescience is guaranteed and it will make the unit quite effective against fliers. There's also a possibility of getting Forewarning for a 4++ (which will be a 3++ in combat thanks to the Nemesis Swords). The Inquisitor will also be able to shield the unit from some small arms fire with his 2+. Altogether that unit can put out 8 to 12 Psycannon rounds and 16 Psybolter shots. It's a scoring Ld 10 unit that, can twin-link (Prescience), and has Force Weapons, Hammerhand, Warp Quake, and can Deep Strike if need be. I had to drop the Aegis Line to get the points, but the Knights should be much stronger against fliers than the Quad Gun.

I Wish I Was Going To The Bay Area Open 1750 pts
HQ
St. Celestine
Ordo Malleus Inquisitor - TDA, Psycannon, Nemesis Daemonhammer, Psyker L1

TROOPS
Battle Sister Squad - 10 Women, Flamer, Multi-Melta, VSS with Combi-flamer
Battle Sister Squad - 10 Women, Flamer, Multi-Melta, VSS with Combi-flamer
Grey Knights Strike Squad - 10 Men, 2 Psycannon, Psybolts, Nemesis Force Swords

FAST ATTACK
Dominions - 5 Women, 2 Meltaguns, VSS with Combi-flamer, Immolator with twin-linked Multi-Meltas
Dominions - 5 Women, 2 Meltaguns, VSS with Combi-flamer, Immolator with twin-linked Multi-Meltas
Seraphim - 10 Women, 2 Twin Hand Flamers, VSS with Meltabombs

HEAVY SUPPORT
Exorcist
Retributors - 10 Women, 4 Heavy Bolters
Retributors - 10 Women, 4 Heavy Bolters

Has anyone been using Strikes as allies? How have they worked out? Hopefully I can get a few games in with some of the locals who are going to the BAO and see how it fares.

 Celtic Strike wrote:
The avenger's amazing.

Avenger bolt cannon with 7 shots
2 Las cannons

Can be given a variety of different bombs and missiles or extra multi lasers, las cannons or auto-cannons.

Armour 12.

All for the cost of Saint Celestine and a Rhino. Pretty great stuff.

Yeah, its firepower is pretty good.

But the downside is the low side armour and only 2 HP. It tends to crash and burn under fire real quick. I usually hope it turns up after turn 3 so that I've had at least a chance of killing the enemy's anti-tank fire.

Amerikon wrote:
So I won't be able to make the Bay Area Open this year but that didn't stop me from thinking about lists.

Sorry to hear that. I just bought a ticket, so I might be going.

I had to drop the Aegis Line to get the points, but the Knights should be much stronger against fliers than the Quad Gun.

Psycannons are only 24" and even with Prescience, it's really difficult to hit flyers. At least the Aegis Defense Line provides longer and more reliable anti-air with the added benefit of cover saves for your Retributors and static scoring elements.

Not I. But mine came with a 40mm base so I don't understand where the issue of the smaller base would come in?

I have had mine for a long time though while never actually using her for most of that time (til the new codex). So maybe it was a change at some point.

Any of you fine folks headed to NOVA this year? I'm going to be looking to pick your brains for some list tweaking in the upcoming weeks/months.

What new codices are anticipated between now and August? Daemons and Tau?

I'm still torn between running Sisters and Guard or Sisters and GK. What answers do we have for helldrakes and blastmaster spam? The surge of AP3 ignore cover templates has me running back to the safety of my metal boxes, but I'm already feeling the pain of finding points for rhinos again.

Heldrake and BlastMaster spam is gonna be pretty awesome.

Tau has been a rumor for YEARS. UNLESS someone shows me the codex, Im not going to beleive it.

Daemons got a White Dwarf treatment meaning they probably aren't next.

the logical choices would be a Xeno since they just did Dark Angels. Orcs, Tyranids, and Eldar would top my list of probabilities, in that order, but that is pure supposition and in no way a qualified opinion.

Orcs are a way off I think.
From what I've seen rumour wise, Tau or Eldar are next.

But yeah, Tau have been 'on the cards' for years, I was told not to start Tau in Oct 2011 because they were 'going to be redone in a few months'. So I agree, when I've got the new book in my hand, THEN I'll believe it.. and maybe not even then.

So I have my first match with my Sisters tomorrow against a friend in a "wrung what you brung" game where I'm still working on refining and expanding my Sisters:

1494pts
HQ
Saint Celestine

Elites
Repentia Squad (9x Repentia)

Troops
Battle Sister Squad(9x sisters) 2x Flamers

Battle Sister Squad 13x Battle Sister - 2xSB

Battle Sister Squad(9x sisters) 2x Flamers

Fast Attack
Dominion Squad (5x sisters), 2x MG Immolator w/ MM

Seraphim Squad 7x Seraphim , 2x HF, BP/PS

Heavy Support
Exorcist

Penitent Engine

Retributor Squad - 4x HB, Rhino, Simulacrum Imperialis, PP (Rhino given to Repentia)

I'd rather trim the 13 sister squad down to 10 and expand the rets a bit to get extra wounds. Otherwise the first casualty means you lose an important model.

....good idea, I'll adjust that

 SabrX wrote:

Amerikon wrote:
So I won't be able to make the Bay Area Open this year but that didn't stop me from thinking about lists.

Sorry to hear that. I just bought a ticket, so I might be going.

It's cool. I've got a baby now, so it's not for some lame reason like work. If they do the Golden Throne again this year, he might be old enough by then that I won't feel like a bum taking two days to play with my toys.

Are you taking the Torks?

 SabrX wrote:

I had to drop the Aegis Line to get the points, but the Knights should be much stronger against fliers than the Quad Gun.

Psycannons are only 24" and even with Prescience, it's really difficult to hit flyers. At least the Aegis Defense Line provides longer and more reliable anti-air with the added benefit of cover saves for your Retributors and static scoring elements.

I've been really unimpressed with my Quad Gun so far. I think it maybe scratched the paint on a flyer once. It's a really big target and it usually doesn't last very long. If I pare down the Retributor squads to 5 women each, I can afford to put the Quad Gun back. Similarly, if I drop the Strike Squad down to 5 men, I could fit it in as well. I'm not really too happy about either of those things though. It may be worth it to free up 50 points for just the ADL itself. I don't know. Some playtesting would help figure that out.

Just out of curiosity I ran the numbers for Psycannons vs the Quad Gun shooting at flyers. They're both S7 AP4 so hits are what count.
Here's a lot of numbers:

TL/DR: The "full monty" of 12 twin-linked Psycannon shots are almost as good vs flyers as the Quad Gun. If the flyer is AV11 then the Psybolters can be used, which would make the unit significantly more effective. They're still not as effective as I thought they would be before I crunched the numbers. That said, even if the squad is similarly useful vs flyers as a Quad Gun, it adds so much other extra stuff it might be worth it.

It's a shame that IG Primaris Psykers can't use Divination, as it would be pretty nice to be able to put Prescience on my Retributors.

Has anyone tried an alpha-strike type list with Sisters? I generally tend to favor a much more aggressive playstyle, and am curious if something like this would work (1850pts):




I know it is *very* contingent upon going first, but what alpha strike isn't? Coteaz helps with seizing, and absolute worst case the dominions are still a disruptive threat when outflanking. Dominions scout forward then unleash hell, DK shunts turn 1 to add pressure, while the GK and Sisters advance up into the middle and get to play clean up. Celestine advances on her lonesome behind the Dominion rush and either joins a unit to pass on fearless and improve their faith check, or she goes character hunting. The list has no explicit answer for fliers, but crippling what is on the ground may as well be an answer. Right now I am not worrying about only have 3 scoring units when I will have so many units actively contesting and targeting their troops...should I be?

What would you tweak to the "alpha strike" or "in your face" approach?

IMO, it's not really all that much different that a typical SoB list. I think even if you don't go first you can still get a similar effect. You can hide the NDK until your Dominions come in from reserve and then shunt.

Coteaz is tricky. I don't remember what his other special rules are, but he pretty much has to be with the Strikes to get any benefit from "I've Been Expecting You". Similarly, he's got no invulnerable save so again, he has to join the Strikes to not be sniped. What psychic powers do you want him to use?

Battle report... sorta:
Sisters vs. Vanilla Marines
1500 points
My list is above, his list was two combat squadded groups of tactical Marines spread across four razorbacks all armed with heavy bolters, a predator with AC and HB sponsons, and lead by a chaplain with vanguard veterans on foot (I think it's vanguard, the elite assault marines)
Game type: Relic
Deployment: Dawn of War
Final score:
SM: 5 kill points, possession of the relic
Sisters: 3 kill points including slay the warlord

Things I learned:
Exorcists are terrifyingly good
Bubble wrapping Retributors with extra bodies in the squad is a very good plan.
Remember faith management.
Increase squad level anti-tank
St. Celestine is nigh invincible with half way decent rolls
-Repentia are scary, but fragile and failing their act of faith can make for a bad week.

Questions I still have:
-Is shield of faith an actual act of faith? Or can I just use that invulnerable roll at any time?
-Opponent believed Seraphim pistols counted as twin linking instead of double bolt pistols. I'm pretty sure he was wrong, what's the word there?

 KalashnikovMarine wrote:

Things I learned:
Exorcists are terrifyingly good

I would add the "with halfway decent rolls" caveat to this as well. Also, your opponent's list seemed a bit short on long range anti-tank so that probably helped them out a bit. They're usually very high priority targets which is why I've been moving over to Retributors more and more.

 KalashnikovMarine wrote:

Bubble wrapping Retributors with extra bodies in the squad is a very good plan.

Yep. They'll take some punishment before you start to lose any of your HBs and in the few cases where you get to use them, 6 rending bolters can be pretty nasty too.

 KalashnikovMarine wrote:

Questions I still have:
-Is shield of faith an actual act of faith? Or can I just use that invulnerable roll at any time?

Shield of Faith is just a 6++ for any unit that has it. (Don't forget that your vehicles have it too.) No faith checks or points are necessary.

 KalashnikovMarine wrote:

-Opponent believed Seraphim pistols counted as twin linking instead of double bolt pistols. I'm pretty sure he was wrong, what's the word there?

Your opponent is wrong. Two pistols = two shots, not twin-linked. If it was twin-linked the hand flamers would be pretty lousy since they'd already get the re-roll to wound that the Seras' act of faith brings.

Yeah, he's thinking of the old rules and not the new ones for double pistols.

Amerikon wrote:
IMO, it's not really all that much different that a typical SoB list. I think even if you don't go first you can still get a similar effect. You can hide the NDK until your Dominions come in from reserve and then shunt.

Coteaz is tricky. I don't remember what his other special rules are, but he pretty much has to be with the Strikes to get any benefit from "I've Been Expecting You". Similarly, he's got no invulnerable save so again, he has to join the Strikes to not be sniped. What psychic powers do you want him to use?

Misfortune or Perfect Timing are the ideal powers for Coteaz... and given NOVA is going to use mysterious objectives I think Scryer's Gaze could be handy as well (I think it affects mysterious objective rolls, please correct me if I'm wrong). The 4++ to a squad would not be horrible for the GKSS either... so really, most of the DIV powers work out nicely.

Give the transition from mech to foot, I'm not sure if I should run 2 meltagun Dom squads, or 1 melta-gun squad and 1 flamer squad. I could also break-up the 10 girl Dom squad into another 5 girl squad and use the points for some henchmen (for a 4th troop choice). Something like, 3 MM Immolators, 2x 2 flamer squads, 1x 2 meltagun squad... is the 10 strong unit of Dominions going to consistently be overkill?

10 Doms with 4 flamers and a combi-flamer rip everything apart. I also ran 2 melta/2 flamer/Combi-flamer and that was a nice squad (in 5th).

Yeah, originally the squad was exactly that (2/2/combi) but I realized I probably have more than enough anti-tank with the MM Immos and melta-gunners.

Any thought or opinion on whether to start testing with two 5 girl squads and one 10 girl squad, or three 5 girl squads and an extra henchman squad?

If the henchmen have a ride, then go with that. Otherwise, do the big dom squad.

Also in 5th, I ran a 10 woman Dominion squad with 3 meltas, 1 flamer, and a combi-plasma. I found that configuration to be strong against pretty much everything except maybe the hordiest of hordes.

That particular configuration really wants to twin-link successfully, so a Simulacrum is useful, but that ups the points cost.

Yeah, I was trying my best to figure out a way to get Kyrinov into the 10 girl squad for fearless and the re-rollable 3+ faith check. At one point he was running in one of the Immolators, then switching squads with the disembarkation move, but it really hampers my ability to spread out - not to mention it makes an already suicidey squad that much more expensive.

I should really just do the math on it... but do you guys think 10 Seraphim with Celestine is a better option than the 10 dominions? I lose the scout move, which takes away a bit of the alpha-strike... is 2 dominions and the DK enough to keep my opponent busy until the seraphim show up the next turn, or should I stick to just running 3 doms?

Yes, 10 Seraphim with Celestine is awesome.

Even 5-8 is better than nothing. You're buying ablative wounds and hit and run for Celestine, if nothing else.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Oh and don't sweat the loss of Scout move. Seraphim and Celestine are always great. Never deep strike them though.

 pretre wrote:
Never deep strike them though.

Super Disagree.

Deep Striking is safer now than it was in 5th and with Hammer and Anvil deployments it's possible that you'll have to cover a ton of ground to get to an objective or a pesky unit. You just have to pick your landing site carefully. A well placed Deep Strike can win a game. Of course the downside is that if you do mishap, you have a 50% of something very bad happening, and IIRC "Terrible accident!" is pretty much the only thing that Celestine can't come back from.

I'd say, be careful when you Deep Strike them, and don't do it unless you have a good reason.

Amerikon wrote:

 pretre wrote:
Never deep strike them though.

Super Disagree.

Deep Striking is safer now than it was in 5th and with Hammer and Anvil deployments it's possible that you'll have to cover a ton of ground to get to an objective or a pesky unit. You just have to pick your landing site carefully. A well placed Deep Strike can win a game. Of course the downside is that if you do mishap, you have a 50% of something very bad happening, and IIRC "Terrible accident!" is pretty much the only thing that Celestine can't come back from.

I'd say, be careful when you Deep Strike them, and don't do it unless you have a good reason.

Except you want them to shoot at Celestine while crossing open ground. Time she's off the board is time she isn't absorbing shots and dying.

As long as you place Celestine as the first model for deep strike, she's still on the board when she's removed as a casualty so can still get back up, btw.

(Note: some opponents may disagree to that).

I agree that deep-striking is bad. Half the time you have night-fight anyway and so can advance in turn 1 in relative safety (behind cover with Stealth/Shrouded). Gambling on a turn 2 no-scatter deepstrike is just asking to get shafted.