pretre wrote:
Really, because most of the entries hurt your opponent a LOT more than it hurts you. Against MSU anything, they are going to be taking all those hits on the 'all enemy plus some of yours' and they probably won't have the invuls you have.

 Slayer le boucher wrote:

 pretre wrote:

sninsch on Warseer wrote:
from gw fanworld:

warpstorm table:
2: all units take a d. instability test
3: one daemon char tests on Leadership with 3D6 and takes wounds like d.instability
4: all daemons -1 ward save
5: affects enemies and nurgle units, through a D6 on a 6 use 5" template S4, DS:
6: affects enemies and tzeentch units: on a 6 D6 hits with S4 DS:3, poison, ignore cover
7: nothing
8: affects enemies and khorne units: on a 6 D6 hits with S6, Ds:-, ignore cover, rending
9: affects enemies and slaanesh: 3" template S8, Ds3
10: +1 wardsave for daemons
11: enemy psiker test on Leadership with 3D6, if failed he dies and a new herold is born
12: a new core unit of is summoned, 2D6+3 models

5 represent Tzeentch Deamons attacking Nurgle units as well as enemies during the Warpstorm.
6 is Nurgle deamons who strikes Tzeentch Deamons
8 is Slaanesh Deamons attacking Khorne Deamons
9 is Khorne Deamons hurling Xplody Skulls of flames to Slaanesh Deamons.

Now if you play a lets say a Khorne Monotheist list, except for 8, the other results hurts the ennemy, and 2,3,4 are bad and 7 doesn't do anything.

The fluff behind it, i think, is that the Warpstorm is sending outburst of Warp power from a perticular Gods Domain on the battlefield,that hits the enemie and the Hated Gods soldiers.

But this is the Fantasy chart of Warpstorm.

So expect something similar for 40k

zeentch Chariot thing has two fire modes - Stbd AP3 Torrent, and 18" S9AP2 Assault 3

Screamers are basically identical, except they lose Eternal Warrior
Flamers got mega-nerfed ... largely the same, possibly 3 points cheaper if I'm reading correctly, but their weapons became S4AP4 flamers

Eternal Warrior is largely gone
This will make Daemons players upset in weird ways (WHAT, THEY ARE DAEMONS!?!) but actually makes a ton of sense fluff-wise. Daemons are eternal in the warp ... on the material plane they are bound to existence by the physical form they are occupying or holding onto through sheer power ... devastating damage to their corporal hosts makes it very difficult for them to remain on the material plane. Hence, destruction from things like Instant Death would actually be MORE devastating to Daemons, b/c as soon as it hits them they're going to largely vanish back into the ether, leaving nothing or a completely different looking corpse-host behind.

Skulltaker, btw, seems to still be eternal. All the other dudes, including Greater Daemons, are not. This makes them a bit Enfeeble / rad grenade bait under certain situations, but isn't a HUGE dealbreaker otherwise. If Kairos is T5 still, this is worst for him ... b/c he can suddenly be a grounding test away from game over if he takes an Enfeeble or similar effect.

You roll this in the shooting phase, apparently. The snake eyes isn't as bad as people feared. Still kinda sucks. On the flipside, boxcars means you get a potentially very expensive scoring unit of choice added to your army. Kinda cray cray.

Instability seems to be fearless to shooting based morale checks, but not in CC. In CC, you take extra wounds for each # you fail your LD test by. That said, boxcars poofs the entire unit, and snake eyes regenerates all the damage you suffered in that combat (so, yes, you could whittle a screamer unit down to a single wounded model w/ a nice charge, and if they snake eyes their Instability test, see them all come back to life as if the combat never happened to them).

Kairos apparently has only a 4++, and I heard somewhere that his re-roll only applies to invul saves now. His powers also seem a little whack / difficult to use properly / oriented around his two heads. It would be GW-ish to see him get nerfed, since so many Daemons players use him. Additionally, looks like plaguebearers got the worst of it with the nerf bat ... getting cheaper, but also dropping to T4 and losing FNP (though there are ways to give it back apparently).

Daemon Princes are indeed HQ, but taking a standard or named Greater Daemon of their mark lets you take them as Heavy Support anyway. They seem to have largely gotten more expensive, especially if you want wings.

 Acardia wrote:

 Slayer le boucher wrote:

 pretre wrote:

sninsch on Warseer wrote:
from gw fanworld:

warpstorm table:
2: all units take a d. instability test
3: one daemon char tests on Leadership with 3D6 and takes wounds like d.instability
4: all daemons -1 ward save
5: affects enemies and nurgle units, through a D6 on a 6 use 5" template S4, DS:
6: affects enemies and tzeentch units: on a 6 D6 hits with S4 DS:3, poison, ignore cover
7: nothing
8: affects enemies and khorne units: on a 6 D6 hits with S6, Ds:-, ignore cover, rending
9: affects enemies and slaanesh: 3" template S8, Ds3
10: +1 wardsave for daemons
11: enemy psiker test on Leadership with 3D6, if failed he dies and a new herold is born
12: a new core unit of is summoned, 2D6+3 models

5 represent Tzeentch Deamons attacking Nurgle units as well as enemies during the Warpstorm.
6 is Nurgle deamons who strikes Tzeentch Deamons
8 is Slaanesh Deamons attacking Khorne Deamons
9 is Khorne Deamons hurling Xplody Skulls of flames to Slaanesh Deamons.

Now if you play a lets say a Khorne Monotheist list, except for 8, the other results hurts the ennemy, and 2,3,4 are bad and 7 doesn't do anything.

The fluff behind it, i think, is that the Warpstorm is sending outburst of Warp power from a perticular Gods Domain on the battlefield,that hits the enemie and the Hated Gods soldiers.

But this is the Fantasy chart of Warpstorm.

So expect something similar for 40k

I don't think that apploes to fantasy, makes reference to rending, and ignore cover. that doesn't make sense.

 Slayer le boucher wrote:


There is No AP, but a DS value, It says Ward saves and not invulnerable saves and the #12 Says "Core units" and not Troop units, so its 3 Fantasy-ish hints Vs 3 40k-ish hint, but i suspect it to be a mix up of the two Charts.

Might be wrong though.

epis tally nerfed compared to previous chart

0-6 wounds no effect
7+ +1 strength
1x+ +1 toughness
1x+ poison 2+
2x+ feel no pain 4+

ive put x as some numbers as i cant remember perfectly what the exact amount was

 Slayer le boucher wrote:
There is No AP, but a DS value, It says Ward saves and not invulnerable saves and the #12 Says "Core units" and not Troop units, so its 3 Fantasy-ish hints Vs 3 40k-ish hint, but i suspect it to be a mix up of the two Charts.

Might be wrong though.

 Swara wrote:
From comments on Faeit:

epis tally nerfed compared to previous chart

0-6 wounds no effect
7+ +1 strength
1x+ +1 toughness
1x+ poison 2+
2x+ feel no pain 4+

ive put x as some numbers as i cant remember perfectly what the exact amount was

Would match up with a way of getting T5 back for PB's. Not sure how to feel though.

 Panic wrote:
yeah,

 Swara wrote:
From comments on Faeit:

epis tally nerfed compared to previous chart

0-6 wounds no effect
7+ +1 strength
1x+ +1 toughness
1x+ poison 2+
2x+ feel no pain 4+

ive put x as some numbers as i cant remember perfectly what the exact amount was

Would match up with a way of getting T5 back for PB's. Not sure how to feel though.

Boom!
with CSM/CD including epi' allies, PlagueMarines will rock! going up to strength5 toughness6 FNP4+



Panic...

 Panic wrote:
yeah,

 Swara wrote:
From comments on Faeit:

epis tally nerfed compared to previous chart

0-6 wounds no effect
7+ +1 strength
1x+ +1 toughness
1x+ poison 2+
2x+ feel no pain 4+

ive put x as some numbers as i cant remember perfectly what the exact amount was

Would match up with a way of getting T5 back for PB's. Not sure how to feel though.

Boom!
with CSM/CD including epi' allies, PlagueMarines will rock! going up to strength5 toughness6 FNP4+

Panic...

 Panic wrote:
yeah,

 Swara wrote:
From comments on Faeit:

epis tally nerfed compared to previous chart

0-6 wounds no effect
7+ +1 strength
1x+ +1 toughness
1x+ poison 2+
2x+ feel no pain 4+

ive put x as some numbers as i cant remember perfectly what the exact amount was

Would match up with a way of getting T5 back for PB's. Not sure how to feel though.

Boom!
with CSM/CD including epi' allies, PlagueMarines will rock! going up to strength5 toughness6 FNP4+

Panic...

 Eldarain wrote:

If it works outside of the codex. Several things in the 6th books so far have been very specific about affecting only the units within that book/primary detachment only.

 gorgon wrote:
The approach to daemonic rewards seems bonkers at first blush -- who's going to spend points on a random weapon? But the base "0" weapon option makes it work.

Chaos <> randomness, but then the warp is stormy and fickle too. And I think the random components should bring some sense of that to gameplay in a better way than the old daemonic assault rule, and be significant without being either crippling or game-winning.

The old placement of the army is gone.
No flyers, but flying MCs.
Demons belong to a god and have hatred to demons of an opposing god. Furthermore a Slaanesh Herald for example can't joint nurgle demons.
Khorne: Furios charge, HoW with chariot is S7
Tzeentch: +3 on Ld for casting PSI, reroll of failded inv. saves of 1
Nurgle: Shrouded, slow (don't remember the english rule name), every unit consisting just of Nurgle Demons counts equiped with defence grenade
Slaanesh: Rending and fleet, Slaanesh-only unit runs D6+3". Slaanesh cavallerie runs 6" more. Vehicles (no walker) move 3" more in the shooting phase.

Demonic Instability
Units with these rule can't be joined by a model without these role. Unit pass every Ld., pinning or fear test. If the demons are loosing a CC they must test with 2D6. The difference between mod. Ld and dice roll is the number of additional wounds without saves!
Double 1: Every lost wound in this phase is restored. Every removed model comes back.
Double 6: Remove the whole unit.

Warlord:
1) Every CC weapon of the warlord gains instant death.
2)Warlord and unit has hatred against everyone
3) As long as the WL is alive every enemy gets -1 for fear tests
4) Friendly units choosen from these codex in 12" of the WL can reroll failed demonic instability tests
5) As long as the WL is alive you can reroll every roll on the warpfire table
6) As long as the WL was on the table at the beginning of the turn, every unit with the rule demon (including from Codex: Chaos) coming via deepstrike won't scatter if the first model is placed in 6" of the WL

Warpfire table
Is only active when demons are the main army. Role 2D6 at the beginn of the demon shooting phase and apply the result.
2) Every unit with demonic inst. (friend and foe) has to test for it
3) Choose randomly one character with demonic inst. rule. Test with 3D6. Wounds can only applied to the character.
4) Every unit with demon gets -1 for inv. saves until next roll on the table
5) Roll 1D6 for every unit not in CC which contains at least one model with the sign(?) of nurgle or demon of nurgle. If you roll a six place the 5" template on the model of the unit and scatter as normal. S4 AP5 for friend and foe, ignores cover.
6) Like Nr. 5 just for Tzeentch. D6 hits with S4 AP3. Ingores cover, poison (4+), vehicles get a hit at side armour.
7) Nothing happens.
8) Roll one D6 for every Khorne unit or enemy unit not in CC. On a six - D6 hits with S6 AP-. Ignores cover and rending, vehicles get a hit on the side armour.
9) Roll one D6 for every Slaanesh unit or enemy unit not in CC. On a six - place 3" template. Every unit (friend and foe) gets one hit for every model with S8 AP 3. Count as barrage weapon.
10) Every demon gets +1 on the inv. save.
11) Choose random one enemy Psyker (no vehicle, no demon, must be on the table). Has to take Ld test with 3D6, if he fails, he will be removed. Place a new herald of your choice without upgrades within 6". Not allowed to charge.
12) Place instantly a new unit with 2D6+3 demons (Bloodletters, pink horrors, demonettes or plague bearers, your choice) via deep strike,

Demons have 6+ armour, some have better saves (blood demon has 3+).
Blood demon no eternal warrior. The skulltaker(?) has eternal warrior and 3+ armour. Skarbrand and Karanak don't have eternal warrior. Lord of Change is Mastery Lv. 2 (divination and change(?)) and flying MC.
11 to15 pink horrors generate two warppoints, 16 to 20 horrors three warppoints. Kairos has a 4+ inv. save. Each of Kairos heads is a Lv. 4 Psyker. Both heads knew every change spell. In addition gains the right head on power from pyro and one divination. Left head - one pyro and one telepathy. Have to decide which head you use these turn. Can reroll one D6 every player turn (even from 2D6 or 3D6).
The blue Tzeentch demons are no psykers, but can use one power from the rulebook rolled with the dice without psy test.
Changeling in basecontact can replace one his stats (WS, S, T, I and/ or A) with one the enemy.
Big plague demon has mastery lv. 1 and plague and biomanty.
Nurgle slime beast can charge in the enemy phase! Ku'Gath can give wounds back to Nurgle Swarms.
Epidemus and his special rule
Count every unsaved wound caused by a demon of nurgle (friend and foe). Count even lost wounds saved by fnp or reanimation protocolls. Every Nurgle unit in 6" of Epidemus gains following bonus (cumulative)
7+: +1 strength
14+: +1 toughness
21+: poison (2+)
28+: fnp (4+)

Keeper of secrets has prefered enemy Eldar/ Dark Eldar. Mastery Lv. 1 telepathy and Slaanesh party lore.
The mask can reroll every failed inv. save. Has different dance.
There are chaos furies (maybe chaos harpyies in english).

Flame weapon of tzeentch - SR warpflame. At the end of every phase a unit with an unsaved wound caused by it has to make a Toughness test. Fail - D3 more hits withour armour or cover, passed - gains fnp 6+. If the unit has already fnp it be better by +1.
A unit hit by a skullcannon can be charged withount Ini loss caused by difficult terrain.
Axe of Khorne: Instant death by a to wound roll of 6.
Mutated warpsword (Tzeentch) If the bearer kills an enemy Character or MC roll a D6. On a +2 it be replaced with a chaos spawn.
Warp...(Tzeentch): A character or MC killed by the staff of change will explode. Every unit in D6" will gain D6 S5 AP- hits.
Plagueweapon: Models with one unsaved wound caused by these weapon have to pass a Toughness test or will loose another wound (no armour or cover).
Sword (Slaanesh). Like plagueweapon, but with Ini test.

A lot of characters don't buy equiment. They buy gifts in three different levels for points. What exacly these gifts are will be choosen random (D6). Roll at the same time as for the Warlord trait. One model can't have a gift twice (reroll), but you can have a gift more than one time in your army. You can replace one of the gifts with the 0. You gain a weapon or artefact for it (just one example given in the german text - Blade with Ap2, mastercrafted and special weapon).

Skarbrand or Blood Demon make demon princes of Khorne to Heavy Support instead of HQ.
Kairos and Lord of Change do the same for Tzeentch.
Ku'Gath and Big Nurgle demon for Nurgle.
Lord of Secrets does it for Slaanesh.

Damonprince 145 points, has to choose one god:
Khorne 15p.
Tzeentch 25p.
Nurgle 15p.
Slaanesh 10p.
Can be a flying MC for 40 points.
Up to 50 points for gifts (Lv. 1 gift 10p. Lv. 2 20p. Lv. 3 30).
Demon Prince not can be a psyker (not Khorne)
Mastery Lv. 1 25p.
Lv. 2 50p.
Lv. 3 75p.

Heralds counts only as a half HQ choice. They have special presences. which can be upgraded and give the unit a bonus.
Icons can be upgraded for unique effects and instruments can get more units out of reserve and give you rerolls on the warpstorm table.

Thats all. I hope that my bad english is better than the automatic translator.

randomguy8891 wrote:
proper translation, just scroll down

http://www.belloflostsouls.net/2013/02/monster-chaos-daemons-rumors-in-german.html

 Shandara wrote:
I'm glad Daemon Princes won't be stuck as HQ at least (The Blood Demon = Bloodthirster I presume) if those are true.