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Holy Macquerel.

Three Flyrants gone in a single turn. I didn't expect to see that happening. As jy2 said, 1 or at worst 2 of them. But the whole bunch...

Good showing by the Mawloc though! Maybe I should add one of those to my to-build list.

I guess the next round of Eldar shooting will be crucial in how many more Tyranids are blasted off the table..

ouch, that was a scary turn of shooting for the Eldar, it just proves how deceptively competitive that codex is... and i am sure that list can be optimized a lot.

On the other hand really curious how the Eldar will take out the superheroes team ... (trygon, mawloc, doom) they have the power to cripple the backfield, which they already did half by killing a waveserpent and molesting a unit of warspiders.

However i predict the power of shuriken catapults will be seen now... (one of the reasons my nids will change owner...)

Turn 3 updated.


Sorry, will finish the report tomorrow. Time to go to sleep.

So Eldar just make a mockery go MCs then.....

Why did the doom get to disembark 6"? the rule for spore pods is only a 2" disembark, unless I missed it in a FAQ?

Without that 6" disembark looks like the WS would have had plenty of room to move out of the mawlocs way.

Ouch, painful to see all 3 flyrants go down in a single turn. The Mawloc trick looks like fun, but seems very situational to me with so many things that could go wrong, the most probably one being either the Mawloc scattering off target, or one of the other models that are required to box in does so. Or am I missing something.

Interested in seeing the rest of the fight.

Bronzino88 wrote:
Why did the doom get to disembark 6"? the rule for spore pods is only a 2" disembark, unless I missed it in a FAQ?

Without that 6" disembark looks like the WS would have had plenty of room to move out of the mawlocs way.

It was errata'd in the January FAQ update to be 6":
http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m2940052a_Tyranids_v1.2_JANUARY13.pdf

Bronzino88 wrote:
Why did the doom get to disembark 6"? the rule for spore pods is only a 2" disembark, unless I missed it in a FAQ?

Without that 6" disembark looks like the WS would have had plenty of room to move out of the mawlocs way.

Tyranid FAQ.




Automatically Appended Next Post:
Redemption:

The Mawloc is still a 6 Wound Toughness 6 MC that hits whatever he pops up under like this with a S6 AP2 hit and he can hold his own in CC. Not quite like a Trygon, but still.

I don't think when you use the Mawloc you count on boxing in and destroying something, that is just a bonus..

Oh I know, I play 'Nids myself, it is my first army.

But for me they usually don't do much unless I get lucky. The 2-3 S6 AP2 Large Blasts he can do over the length of a game are usually mitigated or negated by cover saves, scatters or just placing any juicy targets inside a transport or in the upper levels of a ruin. They're a fun concept though, so I sometimes run 'em in friendly games for gaks and giggles.

Note to self: Monstrous creatures, Deep Struck next to Eldar, will die horrible and painful deaths. Statistically, a Shurikan catapult within 12" will do the same number of wounds as a DE Splinter Rifle... Ouch o.O

I think one of your "standard" Nid lists would have fared much better here. This game is just screaming for Biovores! But this has also almost completely shaken me off Trygons. I never really liked them, but in todays Meta Nid reserves need to all arrive at once, and they need to do things THAT TURN. The threat of "I'm big and scary!" just gets you killed without doing enough damage.

That Nid list was designed as an "MC overload" but I think it played right into the hands of the Eldar list. Ymgarls, Biovores, the Doom in a Pod, Zoeys in a Pod, all of these could do a lot of damage if together. Of course, losing those Flyrants in one turn is horrendously bad luck and pretty much triggered your doom, but I think you (and I admit I did too) underestimated the Eldar v. Nids matchup. It looks like we may want to stay in that ~24" gap with our monstrous creatures until we've killed enough infantry to matter.

While the eldar have some good tricks in their codex, from what i've seen in the batrep Jy2's biggest enemy in this battle is his own dice. Yes, shuriken weapons ignore armor saves on a 6, D-weapons cause instant death on a 6, mono-filament weapons are ap1 on a 6, etc etc, but it looks to me like between failing so many normal dice rolls like armor saves and grounding checks, Jy2 would be in dire straits with any army.

Interested to see how it plays out, but man those first 3 turns were absolutely brutal.

And this is exactly what I've seen happen running Nidzilla against Tau and Eldar...

I can hold my own against anything else (so far) but I can't even make it halfway across the board against a good Tau list.

I don't DS my fexes though (and I use fexes instead of trygons because I dislike the snake look). Maybe I should (but that means more pods...)

Baktru wrote:
Three Flyrants gone in a single turn. I didn't expect to see that happening. As jy2 said, 1 or at worst 2 of them. But the whole bunch...

I'm afraid to say this doesn't surprise me one bit. At our local shop my brother's Eldar have absolutely annihilated all flying tyrants they have come across in one round (generally their first turn of shooting - as happened here), to the point that killing them is more of a sport than an actual tactical priority to him...

Still nice to see the Mawloc getting that one-in-a-million hit with Terror From the Deep!

 jy2 wrote:
Wait til Wave Serpent-spam comes out. I guarantee you that is a top-tier tournament-winning eldar army build.
The question is, how will it look like? I don't believe it is a 9-AV12 build like pure CronAir. Rather, think of it more like my wraithwing crons - a hybrid build with 4-5 wave serpents and some other good units.

I fully agree. My brother's serpent spam army so far is undefeated at our shop (6 out of 6) and has yet to really suffer significant unit casualties (worst he has suffered so far I think was two tanks from Hive Guard and a handful of dire avengers).

His list currently looks something like this from memory:



The firepower output is quite alarming to put it mildly. The last game he had was called turn 3 as the enemy didn't have anything really left to fight back with.

Wake up jy2, sleep when your dead. Looking forward to seeing how this one ends. I find your battle reports by far the easiest to follow of all the ones I read online, so thanks and keep it up!

Quick question; Where in the rules does it state that FMCs cant start the game flying? There was some debate over this in my group and we couldnt find a definate answer.

Moosatronic Warrior wrote:
Wake up jy2, sleep when your dead. Looking forward to seeing how this one ends. I find your battle reports by far the easiest to follow of all the ones I read online, so thanks and keep it up!

Quick question; Where in the rules does it state that FMCs cant start the game flying? There was some debate over this in my group and we couldnt find a definate answer.

they have to move and state whether they are flying in the air or about to charge some one. Not to mention it would have been more painful for him if his warlord was flying. He didn't make one grounding test.

To the rest though. The WK loves MC's apparently.

GTKA666 wrote:


To the rest though. The WK loves MC's apparently.

See, that's one thing as a nidzilla player myself that scares me. Distort weaponry has a 16% chance with each shot to instantly kill all of my multi-wound MC's (barring iron arm on a flyrant). It has a 100% chance to instant death all my T4/T5 models. Without some form of eternal warrior, eldar may prove to be a struggle for nidzilla players to face against (much like dark eldar always have been since their 5th edition update).

GTKA666 wrote:

Not to mention it would have been more painful for him if his warlord was flying. He didn't make one grounding test.

And that ^^ is a big factor in Jim's trouble with the game (as i can tell from the report). It seems like his dice just completely left him in the cold for many key rolls. Failing a couple grounding tests here and there is not unheard of...failing EVERY grounded test on the first go is just crippling for the Hive Tyrants.

Report updated to Turn 5.





Automatically Appended Next Post:

Moosatronic Warrior wrote:
Wake up jy2, sleep when your dead. Looking forward to seeing how this one ends. I find your battle reports by far the easiest to follow of all the ones I read online, so thanks and keep it up!

Quick question; Where in the rules does it state that FMCs cant start the game flying? There was some debate over this in my group and we couldnt find a definate answer.

LOL.

Wished I could play more games as well when I'm dead.

Don't have my book with me, but flying for MC's is done on their Movement phase. If you aren't going first, then you haven't had the chance to fly yet as you have not had your Movement phase yet.

Page 49, "Deployment:" A FMC that is deployed starts in in Glide mode.


And, I'm very happy to see the turnaround! I'm still thinking adraw, although I'd have to go back and check how many points each objective was worth. I hold to my prediction though, Eldar can't muster the forces to kick Nids off the objective.

 jifel wrote:
Page 49, "Deployment:" A FMC that is deployed starts in in Glide mode.


And, I'm very happy to see the turnaround! I'm still thinking adraw, although I'd have to go back and check how many points each objective was worth. I hold to my prediction though, Eldar can't muster the forces to kick Nids off the objective.

Currently, my opponent only has the 1-pt objective.

I've got (or will get when I move) a 4-pt, 3-pt and 2-pt objective. I've also killed 2 scoring FA units. If the game ends on 5, it will be a crushing victory for my bugs. That's quite a turnaround.

However, I need for the game to end before he shoots down my tervigons and I need to start testing for Instinctive Behaviour!

This is a helluva battle. If nids dont fail their IB tests horribly and the game ends it looks like they managed to pull out a win.

If it continues...

My first 3 turn= outstanding. The following turns= my inability to play an objective game due to inexperience, at least against Tyranids. Mainly because I have only played Purge against nids and did not know how impossible it was to get nids off a bloody objective. My dice also cooled down by now and my rending didn't want to rend anymore :(. So many mistakes following turn 3 that I ended up giving the game to Jy2 on a platter. At least he worked for it though .

Great Report, way to stick in there jy2!

 Redemption wrote:
Oh I know, I play 'Nids myself, it is my first army.

But for me they usually don't do much unless I get lucky. The 2-3 S6 AP2 Large Blasts he can do over the length of a game are usually mitigated or negated by cover saves, scatters or just placing any juicy targets inside a transport or in the upper levels of a ruin. They're a fun concept though, so I sometimes run 'em in friendly games for gaks and giggles.

Well I can't comment how the thing works out as I don't have one anyway so I've never used one. But if I did, my logic would be that the Getting a WS blocked from moving away thing would just be a bonus. But for now I'm still building Trygons first.

Too many Nids to build... too many..

 jifel wrote:
Page 49, "Deployment:" A FMC that is deployed starts in in Glide mode.


And, I'm very happy to see the turnaround! I'm still thinking adraw, although I'd have to go back and check how many points each objective was worth. I hold to my prediction though, Eldar can't muster the forces to kick Nids off the objective.

How did I miss that!? Its right there in the FMC rules.

Thanks for all the responses.

I am no longer surprised by jy2's amazing come backs. I am begining to think he throws the early turns for dramatic effect.

Great turn around jy2. That's what I love about nids, shove a load of hard hitting scary stuff in people's faces to deal with and all the while the tervigons are spawning gants and taking the midfield. Well done GTKA666 for bringing the hive fleet to the brink! Looking forward to the last instalment. Nid victory against the odds?

I do think that this game highlights the usefulness of the skyshield for nids. Placed dead centre when the flyrants come out to play the 4++ can be an absolute life saver from the inevitable return fire. However I think the torrent of S6+ from eldar and tau really has limited their effectiveness. 116 point skyray = dead 260 point flyrant.

Yea those first two turns where nasty for the nids. I am really interested to see how this one goes.

Well just by looking at the board you can tell what is about to and will happen. I really should have left the right flank alone and came down heavy on the left after turn 3. Learning has been made from the battle!

Battle report completed.


Post-games to come tomorrow.

ummmmm...I still consider it a loss lol, regardless of using the quad...though I might have just shot down the tervigon instead, but I definitely made mistakes that will be fixed. Our next game though....that quad might be better protected and no mawlocks in sight!

Bloody hell, wasn't expecting that much of a comeback. Kudos to you sir

 Red Corsair wrote:
I've seen the same mawloc trick done in 5th but using lictors or Ygnarls to pin gun line units in their corner before popping up. Also glad to see you burrowed turn 1 like any smart player though you may want to add that to your turn one so others know the same trick. Never reserve the mawloc. If he lives the mawloc will be crucial by the end of this game due to burrowing and hit and run, he is a great end game contester.

Don't sell that trick short btw, with three flying MC's, a spod/doom and two trygons you have great odds at trapping even hardened players. As I've said I've seen it done even to suspecting players using lictors though I'll agree it is hit or miss but when it goes off, like in this game, it is awesome.

Looking at the eldar list again I think he would benefit more with a Bastion. It's cheaper, gives his quad gun better visibility, protects a unit inside while adding heavy bolter support and on top of all that allows his WW to battle focus behind it each turn so he can use his seers powers elsewhere.

Funny game so far, a lot of unlikely things have happened which I find make the most fun game.

That is true. Sometimes, you can make it happen even when your opponent knows about it. You just need the reserves to come in almost all at the same time. A note about ymgarls though. That would only work if the enemy unit is in or near area terrain where the ymgarls come out from because if the ymgarl has to move to block off the enemy unit, then that is already pass the beginning of the movement phase.

Also, people still run lictors? Lol. Must be a really casual game.

Yeah, I like the Bastion for eldar. Gives those walkers and others a hiding place.

This game was nerve-wracking....to be down so much for me initially and then to find yourself with not enough scoring units or offense to get rid of tyranid scoring units for my opponent. It was a very back-and-forth game, which made it very exciting.

Amerikon wrote:
I agree, but I see this as less of an argument for naked guardians and more a call for people to wake up and stop letting the grav platform tail wag the dog.

That's right. Personally, I would give them a gun platform as well, but it isn't the end of the world if you don't. They can still function well if you use the unit properly.

GTKA666 wrote:
Well when the mawlock came in (for some reason it didn't occur to me that I had trapped my WS. Thats what I get for saying "ah that will never happen.") and he put the pie plate down he had this grin on his face and when he said "I put it here. Now your Serpent is destroyed." I literally tried to find every nook and cranny to try and save the damn thing....whats worse is that I was thinking of disembarking the unit out of the WS in case the flyrants had lived though the onslaught...O' how deep that wound cut. Mark my words though....this will not happen to me again!

I think T2 is the turn of proving a units' worth. Not to mention the turn that I am still kicking myself for XD.

As for the Bastion....I don't own one . I also use the Quad for the scare factor and less for actual fire power, well with the crack shot gone and whatnot. This game of course would have been perfect for it though.

You actually still had 2 openings, which I then plugged up with my reserves. It's really hard to foresee that without first-hand experience playing against a mawloc. And I rolled really well for my reserves despite losing Hive Commander. If even 1 less unit came in from reserves, I wouldh't have been able to pull it off.

Eldercaveman wrote:

GTKA666 wrote:
Well when the mawlock came in and he put the pie plate down he had this grin on his face and when he said "I put it here. Now your Serpent is destroyed." I literally tried to find every nook and cranny to try and save the damn thing....whats worse is that I was thinking of disembarking the unit out of the WS in case the flyrants had lived though the onslaught...O' how deep that wound cut. Mark my words though....this will not happen to me again!

I think T2 is the turn of proving a units' worth. Not to mention the turn that I am still kicking myself for XD.

And so the Mawloc has done its job. The thing I have found with Nids, is more than any other army half the battle is won off the table. You need to be able to control the psychological warfare going on. And now any time you come up against a Mawloc, you will have this in your mind, and your opponent will already be controlling what you do, just by showing you a list.

The hive mind is watching.....

Yeah, nids are masters of psychological warfare. They've got so many disruption units that most people don't realize how much they make you think until they play against you, and then they are sweating. I believe this psychological factor is the true X-factor for the bugs. Sometimes, it is enough of an edge to give me the victory in many of my games as my opponents under-estimate my army and makes mistakes, especially when it comes to target prioritization.

Baktru wrote:
Holy Macquerel.

Three Flyrants gone in a single turn. I didn't expect to see that happening. As jy2 said, 1 or at worst 2 of them. But the whole bunch...

Good showing by the Mawloc though! Maybe I should add one of those to my to-build list.

I guess the next round of Eldar shooting will be crucial in how many more Tyranids are blasted off the table..

The mawloc is a support unit. Go with the core units first, which are the flyrants and tervigons. The mawlocs/trygons are situational units and can be good in some games against certain opponents, but the flyrant/tervigons are good against all the opponents almost all of the time. They are the foundation for a balanced, TAC (Take-All-Comer's) tyranids list.

 Valek wrote:
ouch, that was a scary turn of shooting for the Eldar, it just proves how deceptively competitive that codex is... and i am sure that list can be optimized a lot.

On the other hand really curious how the Eldar will take out the superheroes team ... (trygon, mawloc, doom) they have the power to cripple the backfield, which they already did half by killing a waveserpent and molesting a unit of warspiders.

However i predict the power of shuriken catapults will be seen now... (one of the reasons my nids will change owner...)

He did roll well with hist shooting initially and you know what the scary part was? He didn't even really use the psychic buffs of his farseer! If his farseer had survived, no doubt I would have lost this game. But the way he was shooting, he didn't really need his farseer. Lol.

My "superheroes team" just wasn't "super" enough. Lol.

 Redemption wrote:
Ouch, painful to see all 3 flyrants go down in a single turn. The Mawloc trick looks like fun, but seems very situational to me with so many things that could go wrong, the most probably one being either the Mawloc scattering off target, or one of the other models that are required to box in does so. Or am I missing something.

Interested in seeing the rest of the fight.

Bronzino88 wrote:
Why did the doom get to disembark 6"? the rule for spore pods is only a 2" disembark, unless I missed it in a FAQ?

Without that 6" disembark looks like the WS would have had plenty of room to move out of the mawlocs way.

It was errata'd in the January FAQ update to be 6":
http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m2940052a_Tyranids_v1.2_JANUARY13.pdf

The damage output of the mawloc isn't the most important thing. I really wasn't expecting him to do a lot of damage. Rather, I was expecting him to take some hits and then die. However, what I really like about him is that he is another disruption unit that can psychologically affect the way your opponent plays. And there is the potential gem of a strategy of wiping out a unit if the opponent isn't careful.

One of these days, I would love to burrow and come out from under a surrounded land raider filled with terminators (or some expensive unit) and an uber-character. That is my dream with the mawloc.