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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/01/21 19:51:58
Subject: NFL 2014
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Junior Officer with Laspistol
Perth/Glasgow
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I usually do in February/march,
Brooks has done stuff like this before, last year year he wrote about the benefits of the Bears drafting a guy because he fitted a Tampa 2 D scheme despite the Bears basically stopped using that scheme in 2012 moving to more of a cover 3 scheme
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Currently debating whether to study for my exams or paint some Deathwing |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/01/21 19:52:35
Subject: NFL 2014
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Pragmatic Primus Commanding Cult Forces
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Hlaine Larkin mk2 wrote:Chancetragedy wrote:I haven't really followed college this year but what's so crazy about it? Besides maybe Jameis going #1 overall? Not being sarcastic generally interested because I'd be pumped if the patriots ended up with armstead.
It's just pretty basic mistakes, mariota falling to 18th to the chiefs (Who have alex smith & AJ mcCarron on the roster) past teams such as the Jets and the Titans, Raiders will more than likely go with an offensive pick, both Seattle and baltimore selecting RBs (Seattle even without Lynch have both Turbin and Michaels and Baltimore just signed Trestman as their OC as well as having forsett Pierce & potentially Rice) Lions selecting a DT, even assuming Suh does leave DB is still more of a pressing concern as is WR considering the injuries suffered and lack of production past Johnson &Tate, Bears selecting a 4-3 OLB despite just signing Vic Fangio (A 3-4 co-ordinater) Cardinals taking an ILB which isn't top of their propriety
Basically it boils down to lots of stupid errors which would be avoided with minimal research before writing.
I don't agree with you. I mean, you're holding up Alex Smith as a reason why Reid wouldn't pull the trigger on Mariota? Um.
Sure, I don't *think* that the Steelers are going draft a DT #1. But then I didn't see ILB coming last year either. Sometimes teams feel that guys are too good to pass up. Fans and the media like to get locked into the idea of "having to get a [insert position] at #1," but generally speaking you don't go wrong drafting BPA. Besides, the "conventional wisdom" is mostly a fan/media creation this time of year without much basis in how the scouts and GMs really feel.
Look at the Rams last year. DL was a relative strength for them, but they drafted Aaron Donald from my alma mater and he ends up a defensive rookie of the year. (whembly, I told ya he was gonna be a really good one.)
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/01/21 20:07:44
Subject: Re:NFL 2014
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5th God of Chaos! (Ho-hum)
Curb stomping in the Eye of Terror!
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fething love Aaron Donald... that kid is a beast inside.
Oh... if Mariota drops, I can't see the Rams passing on him.
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Live Ork, Be Ork. or D'Ork!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/01/21 20:09:08
Subject: NFL 2014
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Confessor Of Sins
WA, USA
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I've been growing more and more distrusting of "conventional" draft wisdom as the years go on. It's a thing that people can latch on to to lambast draft decisions, but almost all the time the quality of a draft pick comes 2-3 years after the pick is made.
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Ouze wrote:
Afterward, Curran killed a guy in the parking lot with a trident.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/01/21 20:52:49
Subject: NFL 2014
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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Hlaine Larkin mk2 wrote:Chancetragedy wrote:I haven't really followed college this year but what's so crazy about it? Besides maybe Jameis going #1 overall? Not being sarcastic generally interested because I'd be pumped if the patriots ended up with armstead.
It's just pretty basic mistakes, mariota falling to 18th to the chiefs (Who have alex smith & AJ mcCarron on the roster) past teams such as the Jets and the Titans, Raiders will more than likely go with an offensive pick, both Seattle and baltimore selecting RBs (Seattle even without Lynch have both Turbin and Michaels and Baltimore just signed Trestman as their OC as well as having forsett Pierce & potentially Rice) Lions selecting a DT, even assuming Suh does leave DB is still more of a pressing concern as is WR considering the injuries suffered and lack of production past Johnson &Tate, Bears selecting a 4-3 OLB despite just signing Vic Fangio (A 3-4 co-ordinater) Cardinals taking an ILB which isn't top of their propriety
Basically it boils down to lots of stupid errors which would be avoided with minimal research before writing.
Yeah... I would seriously put money down that Winston gets picked sometime AFTER Mariota.
I'm sorry, but for all the BS talk about how Winston was a "leader" in that locker room, why was he not a captain of the team? Why did he completely choke, sorry, "beat himself" in the rose bowl? I know it was a "kid's mistake" but, why is he trying to steal crab legs from stores? Why is he wrapped up in allegations of sexual assault that get ruled a non-thing by a "judge" who just so happens to have gone to Florida State AND played football there AND is still a fairly "major" contributor to the booster/alumni programs?
Current rumors I've been seeing right now is that Chip Kelly wants Mariota, and is seemingly going to try "anything" to get him.... If he doesn't I would almost expect Mariota to be drafted by Tampa Bay, as his talent level and his obvious head skills (I mean the mental aspects of the QB game) set him well apart from most other QBs who could be coming out this year. Automatically Appended Next Post: Ohh... and the Seahawks take Todd Gurley so that ", the Georgia star could give Pete Carroll the power runner he covets to pound the ball between the tackles."
Umm... does this guy not see that the Hawks have Turbin AND Lynch? (Lynch is, IMO a bit more suspect, as he's in a contract year and will probably want a bit more coinage than he currently gets) I don't really see how you can get much more of a "power runner" than those guys, unless Jerome Bettis has a son coming out of college that is built the same way
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/01/21 20:55:35
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/01/21 20:58:51
Subject: NFL 2014
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Confessor Of Sins
WA, USA
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I pity anyone who takes Winston, he has bust written all over him.
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Ouze wrote:
Afterward, Curran killed a guy in the parking lot with a trident.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/01/22 00:59:53
Subject: Re:NFL 2014
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Regular Dakkanaut
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/01/22 01:05:53
Subject: NFL 2014
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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curran12 wrote:I pity anyone who takes Winston, he has bust written all over him.
The Browns or Tampa...
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/01/22 01:10:49
Subject: NFL 2014
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5th God of Chaos! (Ho-hum)
Curb stomping in the Eye of Terror!
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Rams.
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Live Ork, Be Ork. or D'Ork!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/01/22 01:25:24
Subject: NFL 2014
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Junior Officer with Laspistol
Perth/Glasgow
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or the Jets if Tampa takes mariota
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Currently debating whether to study for my exams or paint some Deathwing |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/01/22 01:27:02
Subject: NFL 2014
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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YES! Winston would be perfect for the Jets. Good call.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/01/22 03:27:17
Subject: Re:NFL 2014
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5th God of Chaos! (Ho-hum)
Curb stomping in the Eye of Terror!
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Is Mike Martz truly in the runnings for Brown's OC?
O.o
That. WOULD. BE. AWESOME!
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Live Ork, Be Ork. or D'Ork!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/01/22 15:19:59
Subject: NFL 2014
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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So bellichick just had his press conference and basically threw Brady under the bus. Saying he had no idea about the psi of the footballs and to talk to Tom about it. Pretty surprised by that although I guarantee they've internally discussed their strategy for dealing with this.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/01/22 15:21:17
Subject: NFL 2014
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Junior Officer with Laspistol
Perth/Glasgow
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Does Brady pass the blame onto Garapollo now?
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Currently debating whether to study for my exams or paint some Deathwing |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/01/22 15:25:23
Subject: NFL 2014
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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That would be hilarious :p but idk, Brady's press conference has been moved from tomorrow to today at4. Wikfork and Dan connely's conferences were moved to tomorrow. so my guess is regardless of what happens this is wrapped up today. Automatically Appended Next Post: Another thing is Bellichick specifically cited an example of if they fill the footballs to 12.5 and they drop to 12.3 that's not acceptable but if they fill them to 13.2-12.9 it wouldn't matter. So I'm wondering if mortenson reported 2 psi under and missed a decimal point so it should have been reported as .2 psi which I feel like changes everything IF and that's a big IF true.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/01/22 15:40:53
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/01/22 16:35:12
Subject: NFL 2014
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Hangin' with Gork & Mork
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Chancetragedy wrote:That would be hilarious :p but idk, Brady's press conference has been moved from tomorrow to today at4. Wikfork and Dan connely's conferences were moved to tomorrow. so my guess is regardless of what happens this is wrapped up today.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Another thing is Bellichick specifically cited an example of if they fill the footballs to 12.5 and they drop to 12.3 that's not acceptable but if they fill them to 13.2-12.9 it wouldn't matter. So I'm wondering if mortenson reported 2 psi under and missed a decimal point so it should have been reported as .2 psi which I feel like changes everything IF and that's a big IF true.
Nation Can’t Wait To Hear Patriots Fans’ Excuses This Time
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Amidst the mists and coldest frosts he thrusts his fists against the posts and still insists he sees the ghosts.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/01/22 16:45:48
Subject: NFL 2014
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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Our excuse? Is thank god the refs caught the fact the balls were deflated because after they fixed them Brady's number were almost twice as good in the second half as the first half.... So luckily the refs fixed our mistake! Automatically Appended Next Post: Also as much as I love the onion that was an extremely weak article Ahtman.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/01/22 16:47:19
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/01/22 19:59:45
Subject: NFL 2014
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Hangin' with Gork & Mork
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That is a lot of whining in response to a fake news article.
Speaking of sour grapes, the Ravens claim they tipped off the Colts that the Pats were using deflated balls.
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Amidst the mists and coldest frosts he thrusts his fists against the posts and still insists he sees the ghosts.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/01/22 20:52:40
Subject: Re:NFL 2014
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[ARTICLE MOD]
Fixture of Dakka
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That makes no sense.
First off, Harbaugh says they didn't know anything about it and never got their hands on Patriot offensive balls during the game.
But think it through.
If the Ravens had suspicions before their game, they should talk to the refs, to get the balls checked during their game. This would probably be based on prior games versus the Patriots.
If they had suspicions after their game, they should talk to the league office at that time, because that gives them the very minuscule chance of having the league reverse the outcome of their game based on the supposed cheating.
What possible good (or bad) comes from telling the Colts to watch for it? Certainly nothing that benefits the Ravens. And, if the Colts had been warned ahead of time, why didn't they ask the refs to check for it throughout the game.
One thing that's bothering me about this whole thing - if this deflation makes a notable difference in the game - if it's something that these professional athletes can tell, then why didn't the refs, equally trained professionals used to interacting with the balls, notice it during the game.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/01/22 20:57:23
Subject: NFL 2014
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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This deflate-gate situation is getting stupid. At least I don't have to hear about Ray Rice all the time.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/01/22 20:57:59
Subject: Re:NFL 2014
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5th God of Chaos! (Ho-hum)
Curb stomping in the Eye of Terror!
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The point really isn't if it made any difference in the game...
It's the fact that the balls were not legally maintained.
What's unfortunate here is that no matter what happens, the Patriots wins are "asteriskized".
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Live Ork, Be Ork. or D'Ork!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/01/22 21:11:37
Subject: NFL 2014
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Pragmatic Primus Commanding Cult Forces
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Ahtman wrote:Chancetragedy wrote:That would be hilarious :p but idk, Brady's press conference has been moved from tomorrow to today at4. Wikfork and Dan connely's conferences were moved to tomorrow. so my guess is regardless of what happens this is wrapped up today.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Another thing is Bellichick specifically cited an example of if they fill the footballs to 12.5 and they drop to 12.3 that's not acceptable but if they fill them to 13.2-12.9 it wouldn't matter. So I'm wondering if mortenson reported 2 psi under and missed a decimal point so it should have been reported as .2 psi which I feel like changes everything IF and that's a big IF true.
Nation Can’t Wait To Hear Patriots Fans’ Excuses This Time
The one I've heard is "you're just jealous."
But the team I follow has won two Lombardis since the Patriots' last SB victory, so it's really not that...
whembly wrote:fething love Aaron Donald... that kid is a beast inside.
Best thing about the kid is that he'll only work to get better.
curran12 wrote:I pity anyone who takes Winston, he has bust written all over him.
MANY more on-the-field questions about Mariota, though.
The offense is plays in is very goofy compared to what everyone other than the Eagles is running, making it very hard and scary to project how his game will translate. It's just a quick look and fire, never going through an NFL-style progression, and usually throwing to a wide-open target. His arm strength seems only adequate. Can he read defenses? Can he hang in the pocket and make NFL throws? Can he put the ball into very tiny NFL-style windows? Here's another one -- can he LEAD? Some people think the guy could be too quiet and reserved to be THE MAN for an NFL franchise. I can guaran-damn-tee you that most scouts think that Winston does all those things better right now.
Mariota runs that zone read stuff well, but most coaches aren't going to run any of that, especially after seeing what happened in DC. What scouts undoubtedly want is Winston on the field, but Mariota off the field.
Remember that the media mocks had Bridgewater #1 around this time last year, and look how that turned out.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/01/22 21:51:35
Subject: NFL 2014
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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gorgon wrote:
MANY more on-the-field questions about Mariota, though.
The offense is plays in is very goofy compared to what everyone other than the Eagles is running, making it very hard and scary to project how his game will translate. It's just a quick look and fire, never going through an NFL-style progression, and usually throwing to a wide-open target. His arm strength seems only adequate. Can he read defenses? Can he hang in the pocket and make NFL throws? Can he put the ball into very tiny NFL-style windows? Here's another one -- can he LEAD? Some people think the guy could be too quiet and reserved to be THE MAN for an NFL franchise. I can guaran-damn-tee you that most scouts think that Winston does all those things better right now.
Mariota runs that zone read stuff well, but most coaches aren't going to run any of that, especially after seeing what happened in DC. What scouts undoubtedly want is Winston on the field, but Mariota off the field.
Remember that the media mocks had Bridgewater #1 around this time last year, and look how that turned out.
Really!? Every singly Oregon game that I watched this year, the commentators were always fawning and marvelling at out "NFL ready" Mariota is... He did go through read progressions, a lot. His accuracy, IMO can't really be questioned... I mean, all the dropped passes in the CFNC were right on the money, it was receivers simply dropping the ball. As I watched most of the Oregon games, I've personally seen him put the ball into some VERY tight coverages (the kind that make commentators get all excited as the ball is flying into it). That's not even taking into account that Mariota has learned what is essentially 2 separate offenses during his time at Oregon. Helfrich doesn't really run anything close to what Kelly did in his time.... Sure, you'll see similarities in the tempo and possibly formations, but they really are much more different offenses. Kelly didn't really run too much of that read option stuff... but then he also had De'Anthony Thomas and some other pretty decent running backs that allowed him to simply call designed runs more often than the zone read.
Personally, I think Mariota is more adaptable than some people give him credit for, and that he'll make a great QB in the NFL. I would honestly compare him to a Russell Wilson... A guy who can stand in the pocket and deliver an accurate pass, but who can also create significant problems with his feet if the passing game isn't coming right away. Mariota doesn't strike me as being "dumb" the way RG3 was his first couple years (I don't necessarily mean dumb, but c'mon... RG3 tried to treat it like he was still at Baylor, and diving instead of sliding, getting extra yards instead of getting out of bounds and physically protecting himself)
And answer me this... if Winston is such a "great leader" why was he not the captain of his team? It's a job/role the players vote on, so why wasn't he a captain? He clearly has some leadership issues and they are only exacerbated by his off-field antics.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/01/23 14:27:37
Subject: NFL 2014
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Pragmatic Primus Commanding Cult Forces
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Ensis Ferrae wrote: gorgon wrote:
MANY more on-the-field questions about Mariota, though.
The offense is plays in is very goofy compared to what everyone other than the Eagles is running, making it very hard and scary to project how his game will translate. It's just a quick look and fire, never going through an NFL-style progression, and usually throwing to a wide-open target. His arm strength seems only adequate. Can he read defenses? Can he hang in the pocket and make NFL throws? Can he put the ball into very tiny NFL-style windows? Here's another one -- can he LEAD? Some people think the guy could be too quiet and reserved to be THE MAN for an NFL franchise. I can guaran-damn-tee you that most scouts think that Winston does all those things better right now.
Mariota runs that zone read stuff well, but most coaches aren't going to run any of that, especially after seeing what happened in DC. What scouts undoubtedly want is Winston on the field, but Mariota off the field.
Remember that the media mocks had Bridgewater #1 around this time last year, and look how that turned out.
Really!? Every singly Oregon game that I watched this year, the commentators were always fawning and marvelling at out "NFL ready" Mariota is... He did go through read progressions, a lot. His accuracy, IMO can't really be questioned... I mean, all the dropped passes in the CFNC were right on the money, it was receivers simply dropping the ball. As I watched most of the Oregon games, I've personally seen him put the ball into some VERY tight coverages (the kind that make commentators get all excited as the ball is flying into it). That's not even taking into account that Mariota has learned what is essentially 2 separate offenses during his time at Oregon. Helfrich doesn't really run anything close to what Kelly did in his time.... Sure, you'll see similarities in the tempo and possibly formations, but they really are much more different offenses. Kelly didn't really run too much of that read option stuff... but then he also had De'Anthony Thomas and some other pretty decent running backs that allowed him to simply call designed runs more often than the zone read.
Personally, I think Mariota is more adaptable than some people give him credit for, and that he'll make a great QB in the NFL. I would honestly compare him to a Russell Wilson... A guy who can stand in the pocket and deliver an accurate pass, but who can also create significant problems with his feet if the passing game isn't coming right away. Mariota doesn't strike me as being "dumb" the way RG3 was his first couple years (I don't necessarily mean dumb, but c'mon... RG3 tried to treat it like he was still at Baylor, and diving instead of sliding, getting extra yards instead of getting out of bounds and physically protecting himself)
It's a *very* simplistic offense compared to an NFL offense. It has to be to be able to play at that pace. Same goes for progressions. You can't get to your 4th read if the ball has to be out in 2.5 seconds.
If you draft a guy #1 overall, you better damn well be sure, and I think the goofiness of the offense raises some doubts. Don't believe me?
http://walterfootball.com/scoutingreport2015mmariota.php
http://www.bucsnation.com/2015/1/22/7872441/marcus-mariota-could-fall-in-the-2015-nfl-draft
Kiper addresses Winston's readiness vs. Mariota's here:
http://espn.go.com/blog/tampa-bay-buccaneers/post/_/id/8534/kiper-marcus-mariota-needs-time-to-develop
And this is Bucky Brooks' breakdown of Mariota, which explains his opinion in the mock draft that kicked this discussion off:
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000445081/article/scouts-take-marcus-mariota-comps-to-aaron-rodgers-off-base
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/01/23 16:16:08
Subject: NFL 2014
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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There's one thing in Kiper's assessment that I agree with. But to be fair, I agree with it for basically ALL QBs coming out of college:
They need time under a wing to learn.
It's no wonder to me that a team will draft a guy like Ryan Leaf, expect him to start game 1 of his rookie season, know an entire 6" thick notebook of offensive plays, including all audible calls, checkdowns, hot routes, etc, AND how much bigger and faster the defenses are.
I personally think that this is one of the reasons why Aaron Rodgers and Tom Brady have done so well. They both had time beneath Favre and Bledsloe (respectively) to learn the games pace and nuances at the pro level.
That said, I am still of the opinion that Mariota is the better QB than Winston, and it may actually come down to their off-field issues that make or break where they fall in the draft.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/01/23 16:46:45
Subject: Re:NFL 2014
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5th God of Chaos! (Ho-hum)
Curb stomping in the Eye of Terror!
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Okay... c'mon chance... this was pretty funny.
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Live Ork, Be Ork. or D'Ork!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/01/23 16:56:30
Subject: NFL 2014
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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Hahahaha wtf I can't even hate that your right. Look this whole situation sucks for the patriots and nothing anyone is gonna change the ignorant peoples opinion. So I've been trying to embrace the hate. Because the patriots clearly haven't done anything wrong and people are just being ignorant in their hate so it is what it is.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/01/23 17:06:41
Subject: NFL 2014
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Confessor Of Sins
WA, USA
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What exactly is the ignorant part of the hate, Chance?
I mean, it's obvious that something shady has happened. And in an organization as tightly and rigidly controlled as the Patriots (some of the spygate people have been quoted that nothing happens without Belicheck's say-so), the fact that neither the head coach nor the quarterback are owning up to it is telling. Brady is pretty condemning of himself, talking about how "12.5 psi is just how he likes it" and the following with "I can't feel the difference". Inconsistencies are plain as day and those need to be answered for.
That said, what should happen to the Patriots? That is more fluid and up for debate. Do I think they should vacate a win? Absolutely not. However, if a significant cover up or more facts come to light that seriously implicate Brady and/or Belicheck, I could see a suspension for the Super Bowl for them as within the realm of possibility. Given the Patriots' history of involvement in rather shady play, the NFL is likely looking to throw the book at them, too.
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Ouze wrote:
Afterward, Curran killed a guy in the parking lot with a trident.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/01/23 17:08:49
Subject: NFL 2014
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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How is it obvious curran? Where's the proof? People are making assumptions based on a tweet that may or may not be accurate. Automatically Appended Next Post: I'm not even gonna argue with past history because it's been proven no one will listen.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/01/23 17:09:10
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/01/23 17:10:19
Subject: NFL 2014
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Confessor Of Sins
WA, USA
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Chancetragedy wrote:How is it obvious curran? Where's the proof? People are making assumptions based on a tweet that may or may not be accurate.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
I'm not even gonna argue with past history because it's been proven no one will listen.
It's not just a tweet, though. The NFL checked the balls and 11 of 12 were underinflated. And it was only the balls provided by the Patriots.
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Ouze wrote:
Afterward, Curran killed a guy in the parking lot with a trident.
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