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Can I just say (again) whilst there is no causal racism, some stuff can tie the line. Be careful what you say and where you say stuff.

To d-usa there is a pretty big gap between people thinking you are racist and actually being it. Perceptions are things you can fight and often successfully win. Actually being something? Tough.

 Dannyrulx wrote:

To d-usa there is a pretty big gap between people thinking you are racist and actually being it.

I think I have made it pretty clear that you can actually be non-racist, but still do things that makes other people think that you are and that other people treating you like a racist doesn't make you actually be a racist.

 d-usa wrote:

 Dannyrulx wrote:

To d-usa there is a pretty big gap between people thinking you are racist and actually being it.

I think I have made it pretty clear that you can actually be non-racist, but still do things that makes other people think that you are and that other people treating you like a racist doesn't make you actually be a racist.

You just got out of college or are just getting into college right? Your narrow views on the world stink of a over privileged teacher telling how he is "pure and nice" and how everyone else is mistaken and corrupting the students.

OgreChubbs wrote:

 d-usa wrote:

 Dannyrulx wrote:

To d-usa there is a pretty big gap between people thinking you are racist and actually being it.

I think I have made it pretty clear that you can actually be non-racist, but still do things that makes other people think that you are and that other people treating you like a racist doesn't make you actually be a racist.

You just got out of college or are just getting into college right? Your narrow views on the world stink of a over privileged teacher telling how he is "pure and nice" and how everyone else is mistaken and corrupting the students.

Hillarious.

Wait, who are you referring to? Also. D, you never said that. In none of your arguments did you make that clear.

 Dannyrulx wrote:
Wait, who are you referring to? Also. D, you never said that. In non of your arguments did you make that clear.

I thought I did, so sorry if it wasn't clear enough.

It's easy for people to judge others, so someone making racist jokes will result in others judging them. They might not have that actual racist mindset, but others can't see the true motivation behind a racist joke so they will just assume that racism is the motivation.

Actions are easy to observe and judge, and a racist joke can result in judgement, deserved or not. I'm sure that there are also serious hardcore racists who are great at hiding it and that people would never judge them to be racist.

 d-usa wrote:

 Dannyrulx wrote:
Wait, who are you referring to? Also. D, you never said that. In none of your arguments did you make that clear.

I thought I did, so sorry if it wasn't clear enough.

It's easy for people to judge others, so someone making racist jokes will result in others judging them. They might not have that actual racist mindset, but others can't see the true motivation behind a racist joke so they will just assume that racism is the motivation.

Actions are easy to observe and judge, and a racist joke can result in judgement, deserved or not. I'm sure that there are also serious hardcore racists who are great at hiding it and that people would never judge them to be racist.

The tone really helps your argument...

Furthermore, the point is that you, like morgoth, are insisting on playing devils advocate.

Let's get back to the OP's question eh?

 d-usa wrote:

OgreChubbs wrote:

 d-usa wrote:

 Dannyrulx wrote:

To d-usa there is a pretty big gap between people thinking you are racist and actually being it.

I think I have made it pretty clear that you can actually be non-racist, but still do things that makes other people think that you are and that other people treating you like a racist doesn't make you actually be a racist.

You just got out of college or are just getting into college right? Your narrow views on the world stink of a over privileged teacher telling how he is "pure and nice" and how everyone else is mistaken and corrupting the students.

Hillarious.

It is indeed hilarious how people might actually judge you on how you act when around them.

Why is this so fething difficult, people?

The act of reducing someone to a stereotype, even if that stereotype is not necessarily negative is still marginalizing them and reducing their status as a human being. So while you may not be directly saying they are an inferior race, it is still an attempt to degrade them due to race.

Saying someone is good at math, can't jump or likes watermelon because of race is rude and racist because it basically attempts to tear them down by making them a contrived stereotype opposed to an individual.

I think that ironic racial 'banter' between people with whom you have an 'understanding' is fine. As an example, me and my girlfriend tease each other all the time about that stuff. However, if someone else was to make a racist comment to her I'd fething kill them, and vice versa.

I would question the wisdom of attempting it with total strangers though. Too much risk for too little benefit. There are other ways to be funny and engaging that are less likely to make you look like a total jerk-off.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

nkelsch wrote:
The act of reducing someone to a stereotype, even if that stereotype is not necessarily negative is still marginalizing them and reducing their status as a human being. So while you may not be directly saying they are an inferior race, it is still an attempt to degrade them due to race.

Saying someone is good at math, can't jump or likes watermelon because of race is rude and racist because it basically attempts to tear them down by making them a contrived stereotype opposed to an individual.

Word.

nkelsch wrote:
The act of reducing someone to a stereotype, even if that stereotype is not necessarily negative is still marginalizing them and reducing their status as a human being. So while you may not be directly saying they are an inferior race, it is still an attempt to degrade them due to race.

Saying someone is good at math, can't jump or likes watermelon because of race is rude and racist because it basically attempts to tear them down by making them a contrived stereotype opposed to an individual.

So... jokes about an Englishman, Irishman and Scotsman in a bar are bad?

 Iron_Captain wrote:

nkelsch wrote:
The act of reducing someone to a stereotype, even if that stereotype is not necessarily negative is still marginalizing them and reducing their status as a human being. So while you may not be directly saying they are an inferior race, it is still an attempt to degrade them due to race.

Saying someone is good at math, can't jump or likes watermelon because of race is rude and racist because it basically attempts to tear them down by making them a contrived stereotype opposed to an individual.

So... jokes about an Englishman, Irishman and Scotsman in a bar are bad?

Well, they aren't racist because none of those are races.

Hmmm, I thought boring, drunks, and sheep fethers were all legit races. My bad.




Oh, and for anyone who gets offended by that, my blood is made up of Welsh, Irish and Scottish ancestry. So I'm self insulting there.

 ScootyPuffJunior wrote:

 Iron_Captain wrote:

nkelsch wrote:
The act of reducing someone to a stereotype, even if that stereotype is not necessarily negative is still marginalizing them and reducing their status as a human being. So while you may not be directly saying they are an inferior race, it is still an attempt to degrade them due to race.

Saying someone is good at math, can't jump or likes watermelon because of race is rude and racist because it basically attempts to tear them down by making them a contrived stereotype opposed to an individual.

So... jokes about an Englishman, Irishman and Scotsman in a bar are bad?

Well, they aren't racist because none of those are races.

Yes they are. 'Race' in regard to humans has a very broad definition.
From Merriam-Webster's dictionary:

race
noun
Definition of RACE
1
: a breeding stock of animals
2
a : a family, tribe, people, or nation belonging to the same stock
b : a class or kind of people unified by shared interests, habits, or characteristics
3
a : an actually or potentially interbreeding group within a species; also : a taxonomic category (as a subspecies) representing such a group
b : breed
c : a category of humankind that shares certain distinctive physical traits
4
obsolete : inherited temperament or disposition
5
: distinctive flavor, taste, or strength

And regardless of that, the post I quoted still aplies to aforementioned jokes.
So apperantly someone thinks making jokes about English, Irish and Scots in a bar is degrading them as human beings?

@ironcaptain.

Calling the Irish 'human beings' is a bit of a stretch..........

 MrDwhitey wrote:

 d-usa wrote:

OgreChubbs wrote:

 d-usa wrote:

 Dannyrulx wrote:

To d-usa there is a pretty big gap between people thinking you are racist and actually being it.

I think I have made it pretty clear that you can actually be non-racist, but still do things that makes other people think that you are and that other people treating you like a racist doesn't make you actually be a racist.

You just got out of college or are just getting into college right? Your narrow views on the world stink of a over privileged teacher telling how he is "pure and nice" and how everyone else is mistaken and corrupting the students.

Hillarious.

It is indeed hilarious how people might actually judge you on how you act when around them.

Why is this so fething difficult, people?

People thinking that I might be some college kid isn't hilarious.

What's hilarious is that "if you do X, people might assume that you are X" appears to be some sort of idealistic privileged viewpoint that only a college student or college teacher might have. .

I dunno, I laughed at him saying you're a college kid.

 MrDwhitey wrote:
I dunno, I laughed at him saying you're a college kid.

I don't know. That world cup outfit he wore in that one avatar seems so "college" like.
But I did read that post that was aimed at d-usa and pretty much went "possible Raven44 influence

 Mr. Burning wrote:
@ironcaptain.

Calling the Irish 'human beings' is a bit of a stretch..........

Calling the Welsh human is a big one as well...

Guess I might be to regimented being I had to use this as my guide lines among other AR, PAMs and Reg's

https://www.uscg.mil/civilrights/History_files/ArmyEOHandbook.pdf

You go to a bar or a party or club.
You tell your favorite racist joke.
You say, "by the way, l'm not really racist."

You take a girl on a date, and tell her your favorite racist joke. You say, "but I'm not racist."

You're standing in line at the grocery store and tell the person next to you your favorite racist joke. "But I'm not racist."

You're out on the street at night and you see a group of drunk young people. You tell them your favorite racist joke. You remind them you're not racist.

You're at work and there is about to be a meeting. You pass the time telling your favorite racist joke. You remind your co-workers, "I'm not racist."

You are a racist in any of those situations. If you don't understand that, than you are a dumb racist.

Nobody but your mommy cares about the special snowflake that is your inner most soul and your most cherished feelings and thoughts. Society will judge you on your behavior. Your words and actions are what others see you as. Tell your favorite racist joke and say your not a racist. You're a coward racist and a hypocrite.

 Radiation wrote:
You go to a bar or a party or club.
You tell your favorite racist joke.
You say, "by the way, l'm not really racist."

You take a girl on a date, and tell her your favorite racist joke. You say, "but I'm not racist."

You're standing in line at the grocery store and tell the person next to you your favorite racist joke. "But I'm not racist."

You're out on the street at night and you see a group of drunk young people. You tell them your favorite racist joke. You remind them you're not racist.

You're at work and there is about to be a meeting. You pass the time telling your favorite racist joke. You remind your co-workers, "I'm not racist."

You are a racist in any of those situations. If you don't understand that, than you are a dumb racist.

Nobody but your mommy cares about the special snowflake that is your inner most soul and your most cherished feelings and thoughts. Society will judge you on your behavior. Your words and actions are what others see you as. Tell your favorite racist joke and say your not a racist. You're a coward racist and a hypocrite.

Key phrase though. He does not consider them "inferior"

 Jihadin wrote:

 Radiation wrote:
You go to a bar or a party or club.
You tell your favorite racist joke.
You say, "by the way, l'm not really racist."

You take a girl on a date, and tell her your favorite racist joke. You say, "but I'm not racist."

You're standing in line at the grocery store and tell the person next to you your favorite racist joke. "But I'm not racist."

You're out on the street at night and you see a group of drunk young people. You tell them your favorite racist joke. You remind them you're not racist.

You're at work and there is about to be a meeting. You pass the time telling your favorite racist joke. You remind your co-workers, "I'm not racist."

You are a racist in any of those situations. If you don't understand that, than you are a dumb racist.

Nobody but your mommy cares about the special snowflake that is your inner most soul and your most cherished feelings and thoughts. Society will judge you on your behavior. Your words and actions are what others see you as. Tell your favorite racist joke and say your not a racist. You're a coward racist and a hypocrite.

Key phrase though. He does not consider them "inferior"

Then he is a dumb racist.

 Radiation wrote:
You go to a bar or a party or club.
You tell your favorite racist joke.
You say, "by the way, l'm not really racist."

You take a girl on a date, and tell her your favorite racist joke. You say, "but I'm not racist."

You're standing in line at the grocery store and tell the person next to you your favorite racist joke. "But I'm not racist."

You're out on the street at night and you see a group of drunk young people. You tell them your favorite racist joke. You remind them you're not racist.

You're at work and there is about to be a meeting. You pass the time telling your favorite racist joke. You remind your co-workers, "I'm not racist."

You are a racist in any of those situations. If you don't understand that, than you are a dumb racist.

Nobody but your mommy cares about the special snowflake that is your inner most soul and your most cherished feelings and thoughts. Society will judge you on your behavior. Your words and actions are what others see you as. Tell your favorite racist joke and say your not a racist. You're a coward racist and a hypocrite.

Do you think Chris Rock and Louis CK are racists?

 Hordini wrote:

 Radiation wrote:
You go to a bar or a party or club.
You tell your favorite racist joke.
You say, "by the way, l'm not really racist."

You take a girl on a date, and tell her your favorite racist joke. You say, "but I'm not racist."

You're standing in line at the grocery store and tell the person next to you your favorite racist joke. "But I'm not racist."

You're out on the street at night and you see a group of drunk young people. You tell them your favorite racist joke. You remind them you're not racist.

You're at work and there is about to be a meeting. You pass the time telling your favorite racist joke. You remind your co-workers, "I'm not racist."

You are a racist in any of those situations. If you don't understand that, than you are a dumb racist.

Nobody but your mommy cares about the special snowflake that is your inner most soul and your most cherished feelings and thoughts. Society will judge you on your behavior. Your words and actions are what others see you as. Tell your favorite racist joke and say your not a racist. You're a coward racist and a hypocrite.

Do you think Chris Rock and Louis CK are racists?

There's a real fine line there. Michael Richard cross that line (Kramer from Seinfeld)

 Hordini wrote:

Do you think Chris Rock and Louis CK are racists?

If they were telling their jokes to random people on the street who had no idea who they are, those people might assume that they are racist.

People who know more about them probably wouldn't think that they are.

That's the hard thing about perceptions, people are quick to make judgements but often make them on a very limited knowledge.

Knowing more about a person, such as a public comedian, lets you put the racist jokes in perspective.

 Hordini wrote:

 Radiation wrote:
You go to a bar or a party or club.
You tell your favorite racist joke.
You say, "by the way, l'm not really racist."

You take a girl on a date, and tell her your favorite racist joke. You say, "but I'm not racist."

You're standing in line at the grocery store and tell the person next to you your favorite racist joke. "But I'm not racist."

You're out on the street at night and you see a group of drunk young people. You tell them your favorite racist joke. You remind them you're not racist.

You're at work and there is about to be a meeting. You pass the time telling your favorite racist joke. You remind your co-workers, "I'm not racist."

You are a racist in any of those situations. If you don't understand that, than you are a dumb racist.

Nobody but your mommy cares about the special snowflake that is your inner most soul and your most cherished feelings and thoughts. Society will judge you on your behavior. Your words and actions are what others see you as. Tell your favorite racist joke and say your not a racist. You're a coward racist and a hypocrite.

Do you think Chris Rock and Louis CK are racists?

Are they? I'm not talking about standup. I know they are blue. Is Kramer racist?

 Radiation wrote:
[spoiler]

 Jihadin wrote:


Key phrase though. He does not consider them "inferior"

Then he is a dumb racist.

You're not talking about me here are you? Because Rule #1...

What's that? Context matters?

Mind blown.

 MrDwhitey wrote:
What's that? Context matters?

Mind blown.

Thats what I've been arguing. Or trying to argue, anyway.