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 Ehsteve wrote:
The Solitaire is an Elite, but he is unique unforunately :(

Well if there was more than one of him he'd hardly be a Solitaire, would he?

Really tempted to actually pick some of these up.

Mostly for retro 2nd ed gaming.

Backfire wrote:
Well these look real nice. My only complaint about the sculpts is the overuse of 'tip-toeing on a shard object' -gimmick. Old Harlequins had some pretty silly poses, but there was bit more variation. These are like Witch Elves or Wild Riders - when everyone is on their toes leaping, it gets bit tiresome.

Floaty seems to be the cool trend with a lot the recent GW sculpts, liked some of the undead didn't understand why they all had to float.

Drazosh wrote:

Bojazz wrote:
Does Caress of Death cause the 6-to-hit to be discarded, or does it cause a wound in addition to the "to wound" roll that comes afterwards?

Basically, that hit is a wound, without a need to roll. You still roll to wound for the rest of the attacks that hit, but no funky double wounding from one hit.

This. It's kind of a bastardization of the old Harlie Kiss, where rending went of on rolls of 6 to hit. Kiss will usually be the better option on regular 'quins, with high attack characters (Hi solitaire) benefiting from the caress slightly more.

Against MEQ with 10 charging Harlequins (no master to keep it simple):

Kiss- 30 regular attacks = ___ ~3.2 unsaved wounds_________10 Kiss attacks = ~5.5 unsaved wounds_________Total= ~8.7 unsaved wounds

Embrace- ~20 HoW attacks = ~5.5 unsaved wounds_________40 Reg. attacks= ~4.3 unsaved wounds_________Total= 9.8 unsaved wounds

Caress- 40 Reg attacks=____~6.4 Caress wounds __________20 Regular hits= ~3.3 unsaved wounds_________Total= ~9.7 unsaved wounds


So they "should" all come out to be nearly identical. Embrace will certainly not perform as well as I've modeled here given that HoW is on a per model basis, and getting every Harlequin in B2B isn't always guaranteed. Besides which, you are getting virtually no benefit from the I10 benefit of HoW. You're already Initiative-Eldar and they have grenades (technology that they've never shared with DE apparently). You'll nearly always be going first in combat.

The points increase for Caress means we will probably end up using Kiss's on 'quins generally. Throwing prescience on them actually keeps the number of wounds ~ equal still. Caress really only makes sense for something like the Solitaire, which has a high probability of generating more than one AP2 wound in a round of combat.

Troupe master still does better on the charge with a Power Sword, so no change there. Also does slightly better after the charge with the PS as well. However, the difference is small (.5 more wounds on charge, .1 after) and you're paying 3x more for it than a kiss. I think you actually just stick with a kiss on the Troupe Master as well.

Disclaimer: All napkin math above, verify independently.

Thanks for the math but...

Please don't try and make 'quins a 'thing'!

 Alpharius wrote:
Thanks for the math but...

Please don't try and make 'quins a 'thing'!

Harlies sounds too much like we're talking about bikes, and there's no way I can reliably spell Harlequin correctly on a regular basis.

We could call them HQ's....oh wait...

You never know. That abbreviation might be freed up in 8th when there isn't even a FOC anymore...

Could call them EHs.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
For Eldar Harlequin.

Or..... Everyone could just suck it up and call them.... get this.... Harlequins.



Shocking, I know, having to use the actual word for something instead of abbreviating it to gak.

Mechanised Eldar Harlequins?

 Dash2021 wrote:

Drazosh wrote:

Bojazz wrote:
Does Caress of Death cause the 6-to-hit to be discarded, or does it cause a wound in addition to the "to wound" roll that comes afterwards?

Basically, that hit is a wound, without a need to roll. You still roll to wound for the rest of the attacks that hit, but no funky double wounding from one hit.

This. It's kind of a bastardization of the old Harlie Kiss, where rending went of on rolls of 6 to hit. Kiss will usually be the better option on regular 'quins, with high attack characters (Hi solitaire) benefiting from the caress slightly more.

Against MEQ with 10 charging Harlequins (no master to keep it simple):

Kiss- 30 regular attacks = ___ ~3.2 unsaved wounds_________10 Kiss attacks = ~5.5 unsaved wounds_________Total= ~8.7 unsaved wounds

Embrace- ~20 HoW attacks = ~5.5 unsaved wounds_________40 Reg. attacks= ~4.3 unsaved wounds_________Total= 9.8 unsaved wounds

Caress- 40 Reg attacks=____~6.4 Caress wounds __________20 Regular hits= ~3.3 unsaved wounds_________Total= ~9.7 unsaved wounds


So they "should" all come out to be nearly identical. Embrace will certainly not perform as well as I've modeled here given that HoW is on a per model basis, and getting every Harlequin in B2B isn't always guaranteed. Besides which, you are getting virtually no benefit from the I10 benefit of HoW. You're already Initiative-Eldar and they have grenades (technology that they've never shared with DE apparently). You'll nearly always be going first in combat.

The points increase for Caress means we will probably end up using Kiss's on 'quins generally. Throwing prescience on them actually keeps the number of wounds ~ equal still. Caress really only makes sense for something like the Solitaire, which has a high probability of generating more than one AP2 wound in a round of combat.

Troupe master still does better on the charge with a Power Sword, so no change there. Also does slightly better after the charge with the PS as well. However, the difference is small (.5 more wounds on charge, .1 after) and you're paying 3x more for it than a kiss. I think you actually just stick with a kiss on the Troupe Master as well.

Disclaimer: All napkin math above, verify independently.

Your math looks ok to me, but I'm no expert. In addition to your points about the embrace it only works for the first round of a charge, if you don't charge or are in the second turn of an assault it does nothing. One nice advantage of the caress over the kiss is that it can glance any vehicle to death, while the kiss can only damage up to AV12. In your example most super heavies would even go down in one charge (if you miraculously managed to get your harlequins to them).The kiss will probably kill MCs better though.

When we are going to have any news regarding the bikes? When is the next wave expected?

Presumably next week. What we don't know is whether this is a 2 or 3 week release but if it's the latter I except to see characters+book next week and bikes+vehicle the week after.

I favour PECs (prancing elf clowns)

what could be a simpler acronym for everybody to remember

considering that they're still the weaver and the bikes to be released, i'm expecting that the next WD preview will announce a ''last dance'' for next week.

I don't think GW has ever released 2 plastic box in the same week, and I doubt they'll do it now.

The Harlequins seem quite interesting. Depending on how their DT and the jetbikes pan out I might include a small allied detachment to round up my DE army.

In short, GIMME THE PICS AND RULES NAO!

My solitaire is gonna have their very own Venom to go vroom vroom around in, scaring little children away from objectives, then blitzing clear across the table to wipe a totally different objective out late game.

I am just hoping that the jetbikes are gonna be "generic" jetbikes and not harlequin specific.

Have jetbikes actually been confirmed yet?

No, not yet.

 Souleater wrote:
Mechanised Eldar Harlequins?

I think you meant HARLEQUIN HOLOARMOURED ASSAULT TRANSPORT!

I wonder if they will have the same ally matrix as Craftworld and Dark Eldar or if GW will battle brother them with something else to sell more models.

 Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:

 Souleater wrote:
Mechanised Eldar Harlequins?

I think you meant HARLEQUIN HOLOARMOURED ASSAULT TRANSPORT!

This...This needs to be a thing

 MrFlutterPie wrote:

 Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:

 Souleater wrote:
Mechanised Eldar Harlequins?

I think you meant HARLEQUIN HOLOARMOURED ASSAULT TRANSPORT!

This...This needs to be a thing

Well, they used to have Land Raiders. Brightly colored ones with funny banners.

I'm surprised 5+ invulns are as good as there protection gets.

Solitaire gets a 3+ Invul instead of 5+.

It is quite likely that the Black Library artifacts(of which a Troupe Master can actually take one) might have something to give more protection.

There's nothing to give the Veil Of Tears effect that I've seen yet, so there's a good chance there'll be an option for that somewhere.

2nd Ed Veil of Tears would nice.

 Azreal13 wrote:
There's nothing to give the Veil Of Tears effect that I've seen yet, so there's a good chance there'll be an option for that somewhere.

We still haven't seen the Shadowseer, so I'm guessing that'll hit in the next wave. Whether this can work will really come down to her and the transport.

Wishlist alert* I hope the Starweaver is an assault vehicle with the ability to unload passengers after going more than 6". I want to see Harlequins flipping out of that thing like a jack in the box!