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 Las wrote:

To answer your question directly, yes, if you were running a dumb Eldar list I would refuse to play you. Whatever. The person I play with the most is an Eldar player, we've already began the discussion on how to mitigate this clusterfeth. Were still gonna have fun with something we like.

We got a WAAC, Try Hard here, guys! He has to modify the rules to allow himself a chance to win. If you're truly not playing to win, you shouldn't care.


And legitimaly, its not fair to Eldar players who have armies that go from good to absolutely busted. And if you're gonna house rule, I hope you're not paying for making up your own rules.

You're right, what you do isn't part of anyone's business. But when you do odd things like support a company that obviously is super bad at their jobs, folks will raise an eyebrow. Oh, and some will flat out have their entire collections invalidated. I guess that's cool too.

I just pre ordered the codex and 3 bikes and a Farseer on bike javascript:emoticon('');

if the new rules are true I will end up welcoming my friends imperial knight army, those games should be fun.

 Vaktathi wrote:

 Blacksails wrote:

 Vaktathi wrote:
GW consistently bungles the execution. They always have a ton of actually really very good ideas, and then go out of their way to do it in the worst, most unbalanced way possible.

Which is the sad and frustrating part.

Yeah, it's really very odd. It's like they actually take time to sit around and plan out "ok, what's the least intuitive way to actually implement this, that will cause maximum confusion and have the worst effect on balance?". The basic army construction rules are probably the best example I can think of

You couldn't f~*k-up THAT badly intentionally, surely?

Mind blowing that people will pay so much money for garbage. If people simply boycott it then they might try harder.

I shudder at everyone who pre-orders and/or buys the limited edition books. I am actually disgusted that people do that.
But the viscous cycle must continue and the money sheep must be shaved so that gw can keep making these great balanced rule sets their so wildly known for.

Support your local non-gw flgs guys and order from their.

Latest from Warseer:

Iuchiban wrote:One more before I go to bed ...

Warp Spiders:

They can move as before 6+2D6" and if double "1" loose a model, but they can choose to jump (2D6") in the opponent's shooting phase after the Warp Spiders are chosen as a target. If Warp Spiders are out of range or out of LoS after this movement, firing unit cannot choose another target. If they jump in the opponent's shooting phase, they cannot jump on their next turn.

Dark Reapers:
25 points per model. They re-roll to hit against anything that flies, turboboosts or moved flat out. All models ignore Jink saves.

 SirDonlad wrote:

 Vaktathi wrote:

 Blacksails wrote:

 Vaktathi wrote:
GW consistently bungles the execution. They always have a ton of actually really very good ideas, and then go out of their way to do it in the worst, most unbalanced way possible.

Which is the sad and frustrating part.

Yeah, it's really very odd. It's like they actually take time to sit around and plan out "ok, what's the least intuitive way to actually implement this, that will cause maximum confusion and have the worst effect on balance?". The basic army construction rules are probably the best example I can think of

You couldn't f~*k-up THAT badly intentionally, surely?

One would think...but they seem to do it routinely

 ninjafiredragon wrote:
I shudder at everyone who pre-orders and/or buys the limited edition books. I am actually disgusted that people do that.
But the viscous cycle must continue and the money sheep must be shaved so that gw can keep making these great balanced rule sets their so wildly known for.

Support your local non-gw flgs guys and order from their.

I advocate a boycott, but if you must buy it I'd strongly suggest groups purchasing single copies for the club/shop simply as reference. Even if this gets FAQ'd to hell and back there is no way that book is worth the paper it is printed on.

 ninjafiredragon wrote:
I shudder at everyone who pre-orders and/or buys the limited edition books. I am actually disgusted that people do that.
But the viscous cycle must continue and the money sheep must be shaved so that gw can keep making these great balanced rule sets their so wildly known for.

Support your local non-gw flgs guys and order from their.

I bought the Special Edition. I'm sorry I have pride in my army and would like the tokens and cards as well. I only play Eldar and have been playing Eldar since I started in 4th. Just because you don't like it doesn't mean you should criticize people who spend their own money the way they want to spend it.

Pride has nothing to do with it. You can be proud of your collection and favored faction all while not supporting that disgrace of a book.

 Red Corsair wrote:
Pride has nothing to do with it. You can be proud of your collection and favored faction all while not supporting that disgrace of a book.

How am I supposed to play my army without buying the new book?

I only bought the standard codex but also love eldar, had them since 5th and only play this army because I don't have the time or money for other armies,

been waiting for jetbikes since forever, so happy now. But a bit confused with all the strength D.

newest info

Warp Spiders:

They can move as before 6+2D6" and if double "1" loose a model, but they can choose to jump (2D6") in the opponent's shooting phase after the Warp Spiders are chosen as a target. If Warp Spiders are out of range or out of LoS after this movement, firing unit cannot choose another target. If they jump in the opponent's shooting phase, they cannot jump on their next turn.

Dark Reapers:
25 points per model. They re-roll to hit against anything that flies, turboboosts or moved flat out. All models ignore Jink saves.

My Hydras are angry...

The jetbikes look awesome, I just wish there was more than one head type. Seeing as how if you run a Saim Hann force it will consist of mostly these bikes, a bit of variety on the sprue would have been nice...or some character/customization

and the farseer/warlock jetbike dual kit is great aswell a well needed model since 40k began.

 SirDonlad wrote:

 Vaktathi wrote:

 Blacksails wrote:

 Vaktathi wrote:
GW consistently bungles the execution. They always have a ton of actually really very good ideas, and then go out of their way to do it in the worst, most unbalanced way possible.

Which is the sad and frustrating part.

Yeah, it's really very odd. It's like they actually take time to sit around and plan out "ok, what's the least intuitive way to actually implement this, that will cause maximum confusion and have the worst effect on balance?". The basic army construction rules are probably the best example I can think of

You couldn't f~*k-up THAT badly intentionally, surely?

Jervis stated in the White Dwarf after the Knight came out that they basically come up with cool rules that they feel fit the fluff first, and everything else trickles down from that. When you consider that they probably play in very, very strange ways that virtually no one else does, it's easy to see how things like this slip through, because they likely never take or consider the options. I doubt any of them looked at how they priced scatter lasers and think it's OP because they'd never take more than 1. The idea that anyone would spam it is inconceivable to them.

That's the biggest issue. They don't playtest things, they just play with it. If Phil Kelly fields only one squad of Jetbikes with just a single Scatter Laser and a lot of Guardians, it will never cross his mind that people will spam Jetbikes if they're too good. If he uses a Wraithknight only once in a while, it'll never even come into play that someone can field three and crush everyone.

That's how GW operates. They stat things out for the way they play, not anyone else.

 Xerics wrote:

 Red Corsair wrote:
Pride has nothing to do with it. You can be proud of your collection and favored faction all while not supporting that disgrace of a book.

How am I supposed to play my army without buying the new book?

Step 1: explain some stuff about new eldar to your local meta
Step 2: ask them if they would just let you keep playing the 6e book.

they will thank you for it.

 TheKbob wrote:

 Las wrote:

To answer your question directly, yes, if you were running a dumb Eldar list I would refuse to play you. Whatever. The person I play with the most is an Eldar player, we've already began the discussion on how to mitigate this clusterfeth. Were still gonna have fun with something we like.

We got a WAAC, Try Hard here, guys! He has to modify the rules to allow himself a chance to win. If you're truly not playing to win, you shouldn't care.


And legitimaly, its not fair to Eldar players who have armies that go from good to absolutely busted. And if you're gonna house rule, I hope you're not paying for making up your own rules.

You're right, what you do isn't part of anyone's business. But when you do odd things like support a company that obviously is super bad at their jobs, folks will raise an eyebrow. Oh, and some will flat out have their entire collections invalidated. I guess that's cool too.

Get a grip, dude. I work for my money, I'll spend it as I please. Ditto for free time. And I damn well won't be dissuaded by some internet gremlin on a warhammer forum.

niv-mizzet wrote:

 Xerics wrote:

 Red Corsair wrote:
Pride has nothing to do with it. You can be proud of your collection and favored faction all while not supporting that disgrace of a book.

How am I supposed to play my army without buying the new book?

Step 1: explain some stuff about new eldar to your local meta
Step 2: ask them if they would just let you keep playing the 6e book.

they will thank you for it.

Sorry but there are people that run 5 Imperial Knight Armies... I have no sympathy for them.

Anybody else think 2 wound Exarchs is a pretty stupid thing?

You lot can all b*tch and moan. I'll buy 3 Y'vahras. Or 5 cents or 6 Helldrakes!

I don't think the codex is all that op.

the biggest effect on the meta will be that wraith knights can't be tar pitted and will completely wreck Imperial knights, but they will still be hard countered by cent-star so don't expect to see mass wraith knights wining tournaments.

bikes and access to mass farseers could make hyper mobile seer council bike lists successful at gt's.

the D on wraith guard not a big deal the range and speed will make them a suicide unit no easy access to hit and run stops invisible wraith stars being viable. their really just a hard counter to super super heavy vehicles and gmc.

I think It will be top tier but not the game wrecking army that some are making out.

I do think that casual players are going to struggle though just like they do against imperial knights.

 iddy00711 wrote:
You lot can all b*tch and moan. I'll buy 3 Y'vahras. Or 5 cents or 6 Helldrakes!

The escalation of force method.

Its a bold move. Let's see if it pays off.

 Sir Arun wrote:
Anybody else think 2 wound Exarchs is a pretty stupid thing?

They were originally 2 w characters. Honestly I think it makes sense, before no one used them because they were way to expensive for 1w t3 models. Now no one will use them because they would rather get more bikes

 Xerics wrote:

 ninjafiredragon wrote:
I shudder at everyone who pre-orders and/or buys the limited edition books. I am actually disgusted that people do that.
But the viscous cycle must continue and the money sheep must be shaved so that gw can keep making these great balanced rule sets their so wildly known for.

Support your local non-gw flgs guys and order from there.

I bought the Special Edition. I'm sorry I have pride in my army and would like the tokens and cards as well. I only play Eldar and have been playing Eldar since I started in 4th. Just because you don't like it doesn't mean you should criticize people who spend their own money the way they want to spend it.

Well for one burning an extra 60(?) dollars for the Limited Edition is just outright preposterous. Spend the extra money that you would save from buying the actual dex instead of LE by purchasing from small companies that produce far better tokens, and photoshop some much better cards.
I mean really paying that much for one book is just out right lunacy. Good job supporting the great rule-writing of Gw thought

(fyi im salty af right now at gw so...)

 ninjafiredragon wrote:

 Xerics wrote:

 ninjafiredragon wrote:
I shudder at everyone who pre-orders and/or buys the limited edition books. I am actually disgusted that people do that.
But the viscous cycle must continue and the money sheep must be shaved so that gw can keep making these great balanced rule sets their so wildly known for.

Support your local non-gw flgs guys and order from there.

I bought the Special Edition. I'm sorry I have pride in my army and would like the tokens and cards as well. I only play Eldar and have been playing Eldar since I started in 4th. Just because you don't like it doesn't mean you should criticize people who spend their own money the way they want to spend it.

Well for one burning an extra 60(?) dollars for the Limited Edition is just outright preposterous. Spend the extra money that you would save from buying the actual dex instead of LE by purchasing from small companies that produce far better tokens, and photoshop some much better cards.
I mean really paying that much for one book is just out right lunacy. Good job supporting the great rule-writing of Gw thought

(fyi im salty af right now at gw so...)

What's your concern? The Limited Edition was sold out in absolutely no time, seems there are many lunatics in the wild world. He can pretty much buy what he wants to, even seel it on ebay for double the price right now. Additionally, that doesn't mean what he supports at all, or do you support exploiting endless resources on our planet when you drive per bus or car? I bought myself a two-tomed, monumental monography some years ago about the codicology and art of bookmaking in early medieval St. Gallen for almost 200€ - a wonderful work. Keep the lunacy to you but don't tell Xerics what he is supposed to do. Whining about broken ingame stuff good and fine, but anyone here can do in RL what he/she pleases without having to get hammered in an online forum about a game.

However, I'm curious about if you define "pride in your army" with getting the Shiny Edition, Xerics?

Suite wrote:

 ninjafiredragon wrote:

 Xerics wrote:

 ninjafiredragon wrote:
I shudder at everyone who pre-orders and/or buys the limited edition books. I am actually disgusted that people do that.
But the viscous cycle must continue and the money sheep must be shaved so that gw can keep making these great balanced rule sets their so wildly known for.

Support your local non-gw flgs guys and order from there.

I bought the Special Edition. I'm sorry I have pride in my army and would like the tokens and cards as well. I only play Eldar and have been playing Eldar since I started in 4th. Just because you don't like it doesn't mean you should criticize people who spend their own money the way they want to spend it.

Well for one burning an extra 60(?) dollars for the Limited Edition is just outright preposterous. Spend the extra money that you would save from buying the actual dex instead of LE by purchasing from small companies that produce far better tokens, and photoshop some much better cards.
I mean really paying that much for one book is just out right lunacy. Good job supporting the great rule-writing of Gw thought

(fyi im salty af right now at gw so...)

What's your concern? The Limited Edition was sold out in absolutely no time, seems there are many lunatics in the wild world

To be fair, with print runs that are like 500 or 1000 in total, it's not hard to sell out no matter how ridiculous

 Sir Arun wrote:
Anybody else think 2 wound Exarchs is a pretty stupid thing?

It's a throw back to 2nd. They used to have 2W. GW is trying to make 7th into 2.5....

Nocturnus wrote:

 Sir Arun wrote:
Anybody else think 2 wound Exarchs is a pretty stupid thing?

It's a throw back to 2nd. They used to have 2W. GW is trying to make 7th into 2.5....

They seem to have forgotten that 2nd was a much more nuanced game with much more detailed rules and far lower model counts.

They also got 2nd to the point where the game was such a complicated and hideously unbalanced mess that they had to reboot the entire game.

Nocturnus wrote:

 Sir Arun wrote:
Anybody else think 2 wound Exarchs is a pretty stupid thing?

It's a throw back to 2nd. They used to have 2W. GW is trying to make 7th into 2.5....

$5 Virus Bomb Dataslate incoming in 5... 4... 3... 2...