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Sorry, I'm just going to drop in here (without reading virtually anything and not caring about the current conversations going on (sue me)) but I'd like to ask about the current competitiveness of the Kustom BattleFortress.

Fully kitted out, this thing costs more than a Baneblade but is it worth the points?
In 7th, what with Escalation etc., is the Battlefortress an acceptable LOW?

Also, how would you kit one out if you wanted to squeeze out as much bang for your buck as you can?

Thanks

 Otto Weston wrote:
Sorry, I'm just going to drop in here (without reading virtually anything and not caring about the current conversations going on (sue me)) but I'd like to ask about the current competitiveness of the Kustom BattleFortress.

Fully kitted out, this thing costs more than a Baneblade but is it worth the points?
In 7th, what with Escalation etc., is the Battlefortress an acceptable LOW?

Also, how would you kit one out if you wanted to squeeze out as much bang for your buck as you can?

Thanks

It is a LoW and accepted at ITC events. It works great for a delivery system for large units. You can load it it with some pretty awesome weapons. Currently mine has a supa-kannon and 2 zzap kannons on it. I use the supa kannon to take out armor, the zzap kannons are really there to disable blast shooting vehicles (Like the scorpius whirlwind) You can also use it to thunderblitz units around on the table.

Thunderblitz is a rare rule and its pretty damn strong. I dont get why Thunderblitz still just happens before resolving the tankshock/ram while a Deffrolla now requires the defending player to perform a suicidal DoG attempt before getting hit.

Battlefortress is probably the only one that actually can abuse thunderblitz. All the other supers are either a walker or doesnt want to move up the field.

Speaking of which i just noticed thats not on the website anymore. Sadface....

 Vineheart01 wrote:

Speaking of which i just noticed thats not on the website anymore. Sadface....

Be glad the CRASSUS ARMOURED ASSAULT TRANSPORT still is on the webstore. If the CRASSUS ARMOURED ASSAULT TRANSPORT disappears off the FW webstore, then I will do the following:



Let's hope the CRASSUS ARMOURED ASSAULT TRANSPORT doesn't disappear.

Back on topic.

I think that if Orks get a Deep Strikey thing, it won't be Rokks (which are more like Orbital Bombardments, anyways) and more of a Tellyporta upgrade- which, isn't that already a thing? Can't Nobz or something Tellyporta into battle sometimes?

Everyone can in ghaz detach if they rpll a 6 ot 5 for infantry. It never works.

It's worked for me once. Managed to DS some Tankbustas and they would have won me the game as I need to do seven HP of damage with 7 Tankbustas.

But no, GW employee makes me roll to hit against the building and I of course, fluff my to hit rolls.

when the ghaz supplement came out, I was running 30 man boy blobs with shootas and usually was able to deep strike 1 of the 4 of them in my list. I was awesome. Now for apoc there is an asset that allows you to deep strike a apoc formation. If you do this, I suggest having another player have prescience coordinates. That way you don't scatter.

 Vineheart01 wrote:
Thunderblitz is a rare rule and its pretty damn strong. I dont get why Thunderblitz still just happens before resolving the tankshock/ram while a Deffrolla now requires the defending player to perform a suicidal DoG attempt before getting hit.

Battlefortress is probably the only one that actually can abuse thunderblitz. All the other supers are either a walker or doesnt want to move up the field.

Speaking of which i just noticed thats not on the website anymore. Sadface....

Wait, do Super Heavy Walkers not have Thunderblitz? I was 'Thunderblitz'd by a Big Mek Stompa at a local tourney and I'm curious. I just assumed he could and we didn't even bother looking up the table so I just said roll a 2+ and you'll pop my drop pod.

It really didn't matter, the outcome of the game was set in stone even with him popping a pod a turn. They are free anyhow

Super Heavy Walkers have Stomp instead.

I think the only Super Heavy Walker that has Thunderblitz is the Khorne thing that is 888 pts because Khawne

Saythings wrote:

 Vineheart01 wrote:
Thunderblitz is a rare rule and its pretty damn strong. I dont get why Thunderblitz still just happens before resolving the tankshock/ram while a Deffrolla now requires the defending player to perform a suicidal DoG attempt before getting hit.

Battlefortress is probably the only one that actually can abuse thunderblitz. All the other supers are either a walker or doesnt want to move up the field.

Speaking of which i just noticed thats not on the website anymore. Sadface....

Wait, do Super Heavy Walkers not have Thunderblitz? I was 'Thunderblitz'd by a Big Mek Stompa at a local tourney and I'm curious. I just assumed he could and we didn't even bother looking up the table so I just said roll a 2+ and you'll pop my drop pod.

It really didn't matter, the outcome of the game was set in stone even with him popping a pod a turn. They are free anyhow

Super heavy tanks have thunderblitz. Super heavy walkers have stomp attacks. The Lord of skulls is a tracked super heavy walker. He can thunderblitz, but does not have stomps. Looks like you are a dirty ork but its okay we will forgive you.

 Glitcha wrote:

Saythings wrote:

 Vineheart01 wrote:
Thunderblitz is a rare rule and its pretty damn strong. I dont get why Thunderblitz still just happens before resolving the tankshock/ram while a Deffrolla now requires the defending player to perform a suicidal DoG attempt before getting hit.

Battlefortress is probably the only one that actually can abuse thunderblitz. All the other supers are either a walker or doesnt want to move up the field.

Speaking of which i just noticed thats not on the website anymore. Sadface....

Wait, do Super Heavy Walkers not have Thunderblitz? I was 'Thunderblitz'd by a Big Mek Stompa at a local tourney and I'm curious. I just assumed he could and we didn't even bother looking up the table so I just said roll a 2+ and you'll pop my drop pod.

It really didn't matter, the outcome of the game was set in stone even with him popping a pod a turn. They are free anyhow

Super heavy tanks have thunderblitz. Super heavy walkers have stomp attacks. The Lord of skulls is a tracked super heavy walker. He can thunderblitz, but does not have stomps. Looks like you are a dirty ork but its okay we will forgive you.

HAHAHA. Thanks but I was the dirty Imperial player with free transports I was playing against an Ork player that didn't know his rules very well. But it was the first round of the tourney so we were both having fun with it!

Edit: I frequent this post all the time as I bought the newest version of the Ork Codex (not the Waaagh update), and I'm always hoping to catch the newest fad! hehe.

The giant Khorne Tank thing? That doesn't have legs, though, it has treads. I think it just has a 'counts as walker' special rule.

Stomp is "technically" stronger than thunderblitz since a roll of 6 is flatout "go away" for stomp and for thunderblitz its just a bunch of S10 AP1 hits.

Only reason i say "technically" is while it cant bypass EW or reliably take out high toughess multiwounds, you CAN thunderblitz multiple units if you are in the right position. It behaves as tankshock does after resolving the thunderblitz table, which means they get out of the way and you continue on 12" and hit another unit. That and your sheer size lets you snag two units side by side easier.
Could be wrong, but im pretty sure they dont fire snaps afterwords either, since even a fast vehicle tankshocking must snapfire.

Green tide confirmed gone. Not in New version which when you see it is quite clearly version two, invalidating version 1

 PipeAlley wrote:

geargutz wrote:
Just a little list I put together. Seems like it could be quite competitive.
“All da koptas”
CADZ X2
HQ
zhadsnark (150)
150
Painboy (50) bike (25) bp (5) grot orderlies x2 (10)
80
TROOP
gretchin (35)
35
warBike x3 (54)
54
warBike x3 (54)
54
warbike x15 (270) nob (10) pk (25)
305
ELITE
Tankbustas x8 (104) nob (10) bp (5)
119
Tankbustas x8 (104) nob (10) bp (5)
119
Tankbustas x8 (104) nob (10) bp (5)
119
Tankbustas x8 (104) nob (10) bp (5)
119
Tankbustas x8 (104) nob (10) bp (5)
119
Tankbustas x7 (91) nob (10) bp (5)
106
FAST
Warkopta (65)
65
Warkopta (65)
65
Warkopta (65)
65
Warkopta (65)
65
Warkopta (65)
65
Warkopta (65)
65
FORT
Aegis defense line (50) coms relay (20)
70
TOTAL (1849)

So, if I most likely go 2nd then I deploy only the adl, grots, and the 3 man biker squads on the battle field in as much cover as possible and out of line of sight. When other forces come from reserves the bikes focus on objectives. The grots go to ground behind the defence line and keep close to the comms relay.
Turn 2 rolls around and all warkoptas filled with tankbustas will be rolled from reserves with reroll from the comms relay. They are dual roll of assault vehicles or shoot from their jinking transports.
Zhadsnark will either scout or outflank with the 15 man warbiker unit. The bike painboy will join them as well. This sub par defstar is mainly there to hid vulnerable targets.
This list focuses on one of our better units, the tankbustas. Their bomb both burst vehicles and rip apart heavy armoured infantry….and hopefully they can get you “glory hogs” if the grots and bikers can hold on in the 1st turn (and if your opponent has some vehicles). The semi bikestar is more or less a distraction, its there to keep the enemy focusing on the big scary bike boss, and not on the much deadlier flyin melta bombs.
The warkpta is a great transport. While maybe a little overpriced it is extremely fast and has some descent dakka.
Let me know what you guys think.

Your PainBoy on bike is under costed by 10 points. Also, you need another Grot Squad for min troop choice for your second CAD.

If zhadsnark is warlord then bikes are troops in your "army", it doesn't specify cad or detach.
Thx for the catch on the painbow. I'll just get rid of the orderlies.

geargutz wrote:

 PipeAlley wrote:

geargutz wrote:
Just a little list I put together. Seems like it could be quite competitive.
“All da koptas”
CADZ X2
HQ
zhadsnark (150)
150
Painboy (50) bike (25) bp (5) grot orderlies x2 (10)
80
TROOP
gretchin (35)
35
warBike x3 (54)
54
warBike x3 (54)
54
warbike x15 (270) nob (10) pk (25)
305
ELITE
Tankbustas x8 (104) nob (10) bp (5)
119
Tankbustas x8 (104) nob (10) bp (5)
119
Tankbustas x8 (104) nob (10) bp (5)
119
Tankbustas x8 (104) nob (10) bp (5)
119
Tankbustas x8 (104) nob (10) bp (5)
119
Tankbustas x7 (91) nob (10) bp (5)
106
FAST
Warkopta (65)
65
Warkopta (65)
65
Warkopta (65)
65
Warkopta (65)
65
Warkopta (65)
65
Warkopta (65)
65
FORT
Aegis defense line (50) coms relay (20)
70
TOTAL (1849)

So, if I most likely go 2nd then I deploy only the adl, grots, and the 3 man biker squads on the battle field in as much cover as possible and out of line of sight. When other forces come from reserves the bikes focus on objectives. The grots go to ground behind the defence line and keep close to the comms relay.
Turn 2 rolls around and all warkoptas filled with tankbustas will be rolled from reserves with reroll from the comms relay. They are dual roll of assault vehicles or shoot from their jinking transports.
Zhadsnark will either scout or outflank with the 15 man warbiker unit. The bike painboy will join them as well. This sub par defstar is mainly there to hid vulnerable targets.
This list focuses on one of our better units, the tankbustas. Their bomb both burst vehicles and rip apart heavy armoured infantry….and hopefully they can get you “glory hogs” if the grots and bikers can hold on in the 1st turn (and if your opponent has some vehicles). The semi bikestar is more or less a distraction, its there to keep the enemy focusing on the big scary bike boss, and not on the much deadlier flyin melta bombs.
The warkpta is a great transport. While maybe a little overpriced it is extremely fast and has some descent dakka.
Let me know what you guys think.

Your PainBoy on bike is under costed by 10 points. Also, you need another Grot Squad for min troop choice for your second CAD.

If zhadsnark is warlord then bikes are troops in your "army", it doesn't specify cad or detach.
Thx for the catch on the painbow. I'll just get rid of the orderlies.

I understand the "army" argument but I think that was originally written before the whole multiple CADs. I could be wrong. I'd let other people play it that way but my Zhadsnark list is triple CAD and has two Biker units as troops and four grot units. Just in case some oppnenet feels different. Would be a non-issue if people were cool with Unbound lists.

I don't understand the Great Derp detachment. Orks have already had fantastic units that are far superior to anything the Great Derp detachment lists can put out with their formation handicaps.

W!G already had a savage formation, which was bully boyz. Problem is that the stuff that Codex: Orks had looked great on paper, but looks pretty horrifying by contrast on my bank statement.

3 units of MANz *5 = 600

Why not, add a Blitz Brigade? 5 Battlewagons with scouts, big shootas, and reinforced rams. 600 pts.

So, I've got 2 extra battlewagons. Take a CAD.

One painboy, 19 boyz, one nob w/ PK/BP, 204
One painboy, 19 boyz, one nob w/ PK/BP, 204

242 left over for three heavy support slots, 3 fast attack slots, or 3 elite slots for 1850. Replace two boyz with Meks for challenges, add three killsaws. Is that better than a Great Derp? You tell me. Or switch out a Painboy, throw a Megaboss w/ Da Lucky Stikk in.

Problem is, nobody is gonna play this because:


You could always just try Zhadsnark Da Rippa, two 15 man units of Warbikers, a Painboy, with as many Lootas until you're blue in the face, all behind an ADL?

Is a 17 man unit with Toughness 5, a 4+ armor save, a 2+ jink save, that can snapshot its 51 TL S5 shots at a flyer rear armor and then jink at 2+ better or worse than a Goff Killmob/Waagh formation?

Or how about a 17 man unit of warbikers with WS5 from a DLS Warboss w/ a PK and FNP from a biker painboy? Two basic units of Grots for CAD behind ADL with Mek Guns. Is that better or worse than a Great Waaagh detachment?

The reality of the situation is, if I had 30 thousand dollars to spend on models, there's no question what I would be running. That's the limiting factor to Orkz.

There's no way that with unlimited funds, I would think of running 6 minimum strength trukk mobs, a unit of Trukk nobs, and two units of gretchin and think that the unit is great because it can run D6" before assaulting. There is no way. That unit is garbage in comparison to the things I mentioned earlier.

So, what do y'all think of Trukks? Here's what I think:

Trukks: An effective way to get your Boyz into battle.

trukks are great if you have bikers or wagons in front to draw the main firepower attention. If you dont have either and youre just having a random trukk or spam trukks, gl theyre going to die in seconds.

I'm not really a fan of trukks.
Trukks = Death traps.

We need a medium wagon between trukks and Battle wagons.
With larger transport capacity than trukks and maybe a higher front armour.

For the record I have 15 trukks. Go big or don't go at all.
Mostly my experience has been half my trukks in any given list are pop'd in my deployment zone. Honestly, that's my largest problem with trukks.
My turn one is always going to be a full 24" toward my opponent minimal shooting and the lads who survived their trukks exploding who are able, will be moving and running to keep up.

Trukks die yes however in the great waaagh detachment you only need one turn for them to get into a first turn charge range.
And spamming truk boyz makes it hard for your opponent to hit everything in one turn of long range shooting. I find this list works best like this.
Take trukks with rokkits and spam them as such.
Orks 1850 Pts
WAAGH!-Band
Warboss, Mega armour and Lukky stick 1
Mek – 1
Nobs, big choppa 3
Trukk 1

Boyz Nob, Klaw 10
Trukk 1
Boyz Nob, Klaw 10
Trukk 1
Boyz Nob, Klaw 10
Trukk 1
Boyz Nob, Klaw 10
Trukk 1
Boyz Nob, Klaw 10
Trukk 1
Boyz Nob, Klaw 10
Trukk 1

Gretchin w runt herder 11

Speshulists
Tankbustas 5
Trukk 1

Tankbustas 5
Trukk 1

Council of WAAGH!
Ghaz – 1
Mad Dok – 1
Big Mek Big Choppa, Eavy Armor 1
Warboss Big Choppa, Eavy Armor 1
Warboss Big Choppa, Eavy Armor 1
Nobs w Waaagh banner– 3
Totals 103

That’s a lot of rokkits (19) and powerklaws (9) and big choppas (6) and two decent beatstick units. It's pure MSU and only misses the ob secured. Ghaz will likely outflank since he gets two rerollable warlord traits in his formation. Alternatively you can drop ghaz formation and just make the warlord in the waagh band your warboss and hope you get fearless with your reroll trait.

its also banking on turn 1. If it works thats very powerful but if you dont get first turn 3-4 of those trukks will explode turn 1 and there goes your entire game.

A race shouldnt have to have first turn to be viable. But i guess they do in GW's eyes

My last good game involving trukks actully went better than my usual norm, I did get first turn and trukk rushed the IG. on one side I managed to get 3 or 4 trukks well past half the table and a few of those into his deployment Zone. That list was very MSU. Oddly enough I had a Gorkanought and a Morkanought in the list. The Morkanought made it across the board and killed Pask and his tank squadron. I even killed some deep strikers with a few Grot mobs and some burna boys!
I Loves them burna boys!

 warhead01 wrote:


We need a medium wagon between trukks and Battle wagons.
With larger transport capacity than trukks and maybe a higher front armour.

We have the following transports if you inlcude the FW IA8 ones. + all sorts of variants of these vehicles with more guns and less transport capacity.

10/10/10 Trukk
11/11/10 Looted wagon (WD) transpc 35 pts transp 12 models
12/11/10 Big trakk (IA8) Tanspc 50 pts transp 12 models
13/12/10 Gun wagon (IA8) 60pt transp 10 models
14/12/10 Battle wagon

On top of that we have the following odd transports that are not really worth it.
-Big Squiggoths transport monster
-Gorkanauts transport walker
-Stompa's transport super heavy walker
-Gargantuan squiggoth transport Gargantuan walker
-Warkopta transport skimmer
-Bomma transport non low superheavy flier for storm boyz only

So in reality we have tons of transports they are just all kept out of the codex for some reason :\

Trukks are amazing for the points. I like them much more than battlewagonz.

I like looted wagons and used to love Gun wagons. Trukks are for grots or any other disposable unit.

As you said oldzoggy, Not in the codex for some reason.

I just last year grabed up two War Koptas but haven't had the chance to use them yet, I'd love to get my hands on a Big trakk.

I think what I was getting at is a middle sized plastic transport with in the codex. Ya, it's wish listing I guess.

I remember when the Gun wagon came out. Wish I had a few of those.

I just build them all my own. If GW doesn't want to sell me my av 13 transports then they don't. It is their right not to sell those to me : P

I prefer squiggoths for the hilarity and no explosion but that's just me. Finally getting around to painting and they look so much better.