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Made in us
Badass "Sister Sin"






Camas, WA

 Zewrath wrote:
 TheNewBlood wrote:
 pretre wrote:
Just a quick one:

Two Demi-Companies so both DC groups have Obsec, Tactical Doctrines, Free Transports

Demi Company 1
Captain - 90
5 Tac with Combi-Melta/Melta in DP with Deathwind - 100
5 Tac with Combi-Melta/Melta in DP with Deathwind - 100
5 Tac with Combi-Melta/Melta in DP with Deathwind - 100
5 Assault Squad with 2 Flamers in Drop Pod with Deathwind - 90
5 Dev Squad with 4 Grav, Cherub in Drop Pod with Locator Beacon - 225

Demi-Company 2
Chaplain - 90
5 Tac with Combi-Melta/Melta in DP with Deathwind - 100
5 Tac with Combi-Melta/Melta in DP with Deathwind - 100
5 Tac with Combi-Melta/Melta in DP with Deathwind - 100
5 Assault Squad with 2 Flamers in Drop Pod with Deathwind - 90
5 Dev Squad with 4 Grav, Cherub in Drop Pod with Locator Beacon - 225

1st Company Task Force (PE vs one unit at start of game, -2 Leadership for enemy if within 12" of 3 units)
5 Sternguard in Drop Pod
5 Sternguard in Drop Pod
5 Sternguard in Drop Pod

1845


Your list is 1885. A tactical squad with deathwing DP is 105 and the assault squad is 95. So you're 35 too fat on a list that's almost trimmed to the bone. You could drop the Cherub and both locator beacons and then you'd be 1855, which means you need to drop a Deathwind or 2. Honestly, I think that list merely annoying than it is gamebreaking and why have 3 Sternguards, when they're basically dead weight without combi's? Also, I can't honestly see what that list can do against a proper bubblewrap list, other than flamers but since bubblewrap units are bought as disposable bodies, I'd doubt that anything meaningfull will die in turn 1. And as the poster said above, I don't think this kind of list holds a candle to Eldar/Necron/Flyrant lists.
Personally, I'd be more intimidated by the WS list posted.


How is the tac squad too expensive?
70 for 5 Tacs, Combi and Melta - 20. Deathwind is 10.

Oh deathwind is 15. Drop the Assault Deathwinds and 1 Cherub

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2015/06/11 18:21:56


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Made in ca
Fixture of Dakka






@pretre -- it's all missed hit rerolled for 1 model in the unit during the shooting phase, 1 use. However, you can use it the same round as a doctrine, and you don't have to pre-declare. So, you can fire off 4 grav cannons, pick the one you don't like the results for, and reroll the misses.

It's nice because you can trigger it any time in the shooting phase (don't need to declare ahead of time), so you can wait for wound rolls before you use the cherub.
   
Made in us
Badass "Sister Sin"






Camas, WA

As for a proper bubble wrap list, I drop tacs, sternguard and flamers turn one and eat the bubble wrap.

Sternguard are there for poison on high tough, mass AP3 or getting low armor out of cover. You can also swap them out for a Storm Raven and two storm talons. You need one aux for the Gladius benefits.

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Infiltrating Prowler






 pretre wrote:
 whembly wrote:
Yeah... that DropPod list seems uber good.

The only fault I see is lack of decent anti-air.

I'm curious what would a pod list would look like if you could fit in a Storm Wing Auxilliary?

The three Sternguard are 435
The Storm Raven with TLL/TLMM and 2 Stormtalons with Skyhammer are 430.

So easy swap.



But that's the problem with DP list, it isn't. If you remove 3 DP's then you reduce the number of DP's that arrive by turn 1, from 7 to 5 which is much less intimidating with units that have mediocre damage output and even worse staying power. You also exacerbate the problem of having half your army in reserve even further.
   
Made in us
Badass "Sister Sin"






Camas, WA

 Talys wrote:
@pretre -- it's all missed hit rerolled for 1 model in the unit during the shooting phase, 1 use. However, you can use it the same round as a doctrine, and you don't have to pre-declare. So, you can fire off 4 grav cannons, pick the one you don't like the results for, and reroll the misses.

It's nice because you can trigger it any time in the shooting phase (don't need to declare ahead of time), so you can wait for wound rolls before you use the cherub.

Yeah, I just saw that. I want to keep it if possible.


Two Demi-Companies so both DC groups have Obsec, Tactical Doctrines, Free Transports

Demi Company 1
Captain - 90
5 Tac with Combi-Melta/Melta in DP with Deathwind - 105
5 Tac with Combi-Melta/Melta in DP with Deathwind - 105
5 Tac with Combi-Melta/Melta in DP with Deathwind - 105
5 Assault Squad with 2 Flamers in Drop Pod - 80
5 Dev Squad with 4 Grav, Cherub in Drop Pod with Locator Beacon - 225

Demi-Company 2
Chaplain - 90
5 Tac with Combi-Melta/Melta in DP with Deathwind - 105
5 Tac with Combi-Melta/Melta in DP with Deathwind - 105
5 Tac with Combi-Melta/Melta in DP with Deathwind - 105
5 Assault Squad with 2 Flamers in Drop Pod - 80
5 Dev Squad with 4 Grav, Cherub in Drop Pod with Locator Beacon - 225

Stormwing
Stormraven with TLL, TLMM - 200
Stormtalon with Skyhammer - 115
Stormtalon with Skyhammer - 115

1850 on the dot


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Zewrath wrote:
 pretre wrote:
 whembly wrote:
Yeah... that DropPod list seems uber good.

The only fault I see is lack of decent anti-air.

I'm curious what would a pod list would look like if you could fit in a Storm Wing Auxilliary?

The three Sternguard are 435
The Storm Raven with TLL/TLMM and 2 Stormtalons with Skyhammer are 430.

So easy swap.



But that's the problem with DP list, it isn't. If you remove 3 DP's then you reduce the number of DP's that arrive by turn 1, from 7 to 5 which is much less intimidating with units that have mediocre damage output and even worse staying power. You also exacerbate the problem of having half your army in reserve even further.

I said it was an easy swap, meaning points wise. 10 Pods is still really good.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Or Sternguard version:
Two Demi-Companies so both DC groups have Obsec, Tactical Doctrines, Free Transports

Demi Company 1
Captain - 90
5 Tac with Combi-Melta/Melta in DP with Deathwind - 105
5 Tac with Combi-Melta/Melta in DP with Deathwind - 105
5 Tac with Combi-Melta/Melta in DP with Deathwind - 105
5 Assault Squad with 2 Flamers in Drop Pod - 80
5 Dev Squad with 4 Grav, Cherub in Drop Pod with Locator Beacon - 225

Demi-Company 2
Chaplain - 90
5 Tac with Combi-Melta/Melta in DP with Deathwind - 105
5 Tac with Combi-Melta/Melta in DP with Deathwind - 105
5 Tac with Combi-Melta/Melta in DP with Deathwind - 105
5 Assault Squad with 2 Flamers in Drop Pod - 80
5 Dev Squad with 4 Grav, in Drop Pod with Locator Beacon - 220

1st Company
5 Sternguard with Drop - 145
5 Sternguard with Drop - 145
5 Sternguard with Drop - 145
1850 on the dot

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/06/11 18:29:39


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Infiltrating Prowler






 pretre wrote:

 Zewrath wrote:
 pretre wrote:
 whembly wrote:
Yeah... that DropPod list seems uber good.

The only fault I see is lack of decent anti-air.

I'm curious what would a pod list would look like if you could fit in a Storm Wing Auxilliary?

The three Sternguard are 435
The Storm Raven with TLL/TLMM and 2 Stormtalons with Skyhammer are 430.

So easy swap.



But that's the problem with DP list, it isn't. If you remove 3 DP's then you reduce the number of DP's that arrive by turn 1, from 7 to 5 which is much less intimidating with units that have mediocre damage output and even worse staying power. You also exacerbate the problem of having half your army in reserve even further.

I said it was an easy swap, meaning points wise. 10 Pods is still really good.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Or Sternguard version:
Two Demi-Companies so both DC groups have Obsec, Tactical Doctrines, Free Transports

Demi Company 1
Captain - 90
5 Tac with Combi-Melta/Melta in DP with Deathwind - 105
5 Tac with Combi-Melta/Melta in DP with Deathwind - 105
5 Tac with Combi-Melta/Melta in DP with Deathwind - 105
5 Assault Squad with 2 Flamers in Drop Pod - 80
5 Dev Squad with 4 Grav, Cherub in Drop Pod with Locator Beacon - 225

Demi-Company 2
Chaplain - 90
5 Tac with Combi-Melta/Melta in DP with Deathwind - 105
5 Tac with Combi-Melta/Melta in DP with Deathwind - 105
5 Tac with Combi-Melta/Melta in DP with Deathwind - 105
5 Assault Squad with 2 Flamers in Drop Pod - 80
5 Dev Squad with 4 Grav, in Drop Pod with Locator Beacon - 220

1st Company
5 Sternguard with Drop - 145
5 Sternguard with Drop - 145
5 Sternguard with Drop - 145
1850 on the dot


I know what you meant and my point still stands. Furthermore, even with your 'Sternguard version' how will your list do anything against Knight formations? Even if you dedicated your entire 6/7 of available DP's to drop the tacticals with meltas, you still wouldn't realiably kill anything which only gets worse now that you spent your combi-weapons and effectively decreased your firepower by half.

I don't want to come off as rude but I don't really get the impression that you're very experienced with playing SM's. Your list and understanding of the army seems quite lackluster from a competetive POV.
   
Made in gb
Secretive Dark Angels Veteran






Pretty terrifying lists. Pod Marines are now an official thing

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/06/11 18:42:47


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Infiltrating Prowler






By which I mean, you seem to think that these kinds of lists are gamebreaking, even though you omit the fact that your list will pretty much fold against anything Eldar/Necron/Flyrant/Knights and argueably Daemons.
   
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Regular Dakkanaut






I think a Demi-Company in pods + normal marine goodies will be a more feasible TAC alternative than a full company. All those standard marines aren't that scary.
   
Made in us
Badass "Sister Sin"






Camas, WA

 Zewrath wrote:
I know what you meant and my point still stands. Furthermore, even with your 'Sternguard version' how will your list do anything against Knight formations? Even if you dedicated your entire 6/7 of available DP's to drop the tacticals with meltas, you still wouldn't realiably kill anything which only gets worse now that you spent your combi-weapons and effectively decreased your firepower by half.

I don't want to come off as rude but I don't really get the impression that you're very experienced with playing SM's. Your list and understanding of the army seems quite lackluster from a competetive POV.


Knight formation? Drop 2 Devs and 5 Tacs.

5 Tacs = 10 Melta. 80/9 Hits. So 8-9 Melta hits spread out over multiple facings. Probably around 8+ HP here after saves and full pens.
2 Devs = 24 Grav Shots. 168/9 Hits. 3 Immob and then rerolls for 2.5 More. 5 HP here. 3 after saves.
Edit: I didn't add in rerolls for 1's on Tac drop. That's more melta hits and Grav. Just fixed it. Maybe more with armorium cherub.

One to two dead knight on the drop probably, quite possibly more. Knights are certainly not my least favorite matchup. More importantly though you can use those seven drop pods to hem in the knights from moving (since they can't move past them) and have to assault them to get past anything (keeping your tacs/devs out of reach).


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Zewrath wrote:
By which I mean, you seem to think that these kinds of lists are gamebreaking, even though you omit the fact that your list will pretty much fold against anything Eldar/Necron/Flyrant/Knights and argueably Daemons.


Flyrants are probably the worst matchup, but the Flyrants are going to lose in any objective game. The knights I already covered.

This message was edited 8 times. Last update was at 2015/06/11 18:55:16


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Fixture of Dakka






@Pretre -- for comparison, of how good a 105 point DP with DWML and melta/combi is, a "free" drop pod on the 85 point ASM for flesh tearers comes to the same 105 points WITHOUT the DWML. And although you can take 1 more melta, it costs you 10 points, and you get no reroll doctrine.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/06/11 18:56:20


 
   
Made in us
Badass "Sister Sin"






Camas, WA

 Talys wrote:
@Pretre -- for comparison, of how good a 105 point DP with DWML and melta/combi is, a "free" drop pod on the 85 point ASM for flesh tearers comes to the same 105 points WITHOUT the DWML. And although you can take 1 more melta, it costs you 10 points, and you get no reroll doctrine.


Good call.

Also, the sheer volume of fire with deathwinds, bolters and everything else is going to chew up bubble wrap and pretty much any infantry. Hard targets die to grav and melta.

I'm not saying it's super lethal, but it passes. Add to that the ridiculous obsec and reroll doctrines and you have a pretty good list.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/06/11 18:58:08


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Screaming Shining Spear





Northern California

 pretre wrote:
 Talys wrote:
@Pretre -- for comparison, of how good a 105 point DP with DWML and melta/combi is, a "free" drop pod on the 85 point ASM for flesh tearers comes to the same 105 points WITHOUT the DWML. And although you can take 1 more melta, it costs you 10 points, and you get no reroll doctrine.


Good call.

Also, the sheer volume of fire with deathwinds, bolters and everything else is going to chew up bubble wrap and pretty much any infantry. Hard targets die to grav and melta.

I'm not saying it's super lethal, but it passes. Add to that the ridiculous obsec and reroll doctrines and you have a pretty good list.

Like I said before, I'm not saying that list is weak. I could definitely do well in tournaments with the right player.

What I am saying is that the new Space Marine formations are not, as other have complained, overpowered or broken.

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Made in us
Badass "Sister Sin"






Camas, WA

 TheNewBlood wrote:
 pretre wrote:
 Talys wrote:
@Pretre -- for comparison, of how good a 105 point DP with DWML and melta/combi is, a "free" drop pod on the 85 point ASM for flesh tearers comes to the same 105 points WITHOUT the DWML. And although you can take 1 more melta, it costs you 10 points, and you get no reroll doctrine.


Good call.

Also, the sheer volume of fire with deathwinds, bolters and everything else is going to chew up bubble wrap and pretty much any infantry. Hard targets die to grav and melta.

I'm not saying it's super lethal, but it passes. Add to that the ridiculous obsec and reroll doctrines and you have a pretty good list.

Like I said before, I'm not saying that list is weak. I could definitely do well in tournaments with the right player.

What I am saying is that the new Space Marine formations are not, as other have complained, overpowered or broken.

Oh, I can agree to that. I think they make SM competitive again though.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/06/11 19:06:59


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Rampaging Carnifex





South Florida

 pretre wrote:

 Zewrath wrote:
By which I mean, you seem to think that these kinds of lists are gamebreaking, even though you omit the fact that your list will pretty much fold against anything Eldar/Necron/Flyrant/Knights and argueably Daemons.


Flyrants are probably the worst matchup, but the Flyrants are going to lose in any objective game. The knights I already covered.


Really? A Flyrant will kill about 3 marines a turn if they get lucky. All the marine player has to do is hide on Objectives and they win.

   
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Badass "Sister Sin"






Camas, WA

rollawaythestone wrote:
 pretre wrote:

 Zewrath wrote:
By which I mean, you seem to think that these kinds of lists are gamebreaking, even though you omit the fact that your list will pretty much fold against anything Eldar/Necron/Flyrant/Knights and argueably Daemons.


Flyrants are probably the worst matchup, but the Flyrants are going to lose in any objective game. The knights I already covered.


Really? A Flyrant will kill about 3 marines a turn if they get lucky. All the marine player has to do is hide on Objectives and they win.


This is true, but they can do it largely un-molested. I do think they will lose at the objective game pretty easily though. Too much obsec for a flyrant list to deal with.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
A big consideration is that it is illegal under ITC right now (2 of the same formation in a decurion).

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/06/11 19:11:14


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Fixture of Dakka





There's a "Tactics" forum for tactics discussions.

"'players must agree how they are going to select their armies, and if any restrictions apply to the number and type of models they can use."

This is an actual rule in the actual rulebook. Quit whining about how you can imagine someone's army touching you in a bad place and play by the actual rules.


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Camas, WA

 DarknessEternal wrote:
There's a "Tactics" forum for tactics discussions.

Oh boo. It's discussing the new release.

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Fixture of Dakka






 pretre wrote:
 DarknessEternal wrote:
There's a "Tactics" forum for tactics discussions.

Oh boo. It's discussing the new release.


Especially one where most people don't have the codex yet ^.^
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut





 Talys wrote:
 pretre wrote:
 DarknessEternal wrote:
There's a "Tactics" forum for tactics discussions.

Oh boo. It's discussing the new release.


Especially one where most people don't have the codex yet ^.^


Not sure if I am allowed to draw your attention to this, but a poster 15-20 pages back linked everyone to the spoiled codex in english...

All the important rules are already out there for all to see should you so chose.

I believe that people should still post here on the News & Rumors until the codex is officially released though.
   
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Blood-Drenched Death Company Marine




Little Rock, Arkansas

You know...pod spam is good. Using the 6e marines book, Julio Rodriguez is near the top rankings of the ITC, and he used ultramarine tactical drop pod spam. His list is now even better since he can throw in more bodies with free pods and get more usage of doctrines than normal. (Specifically, a UM gladius could spend ALL 7 turns of the game under the effect of doctrines.)

Yes marine damage output is kind of low, but when you start twinlinking most of the army on several turns and giving them more guys to fill the empty points that the pods used to take up, it starts hurting.

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 pretre wrote:
 Zewrath wrote:
I know what you meant and my point still stands. Furthermore, even with your 'Sternguard version' how will your list do anything against Knight formations? Even if you dedicated your entire 6/7 of available DP's to drop the tacticals with meltas, you still wouldn't realiably kill anything which only gets worse now that you spent your combi-weapons and effectively decreased your firepower by half.

I don't want to come off as rude but I don't really get the impression that you're very experienced with playing SM's. Your list and understanding of the army seems quite lackluster from a competetive POV.


Knight formation? Drop 2 Devs and 5 Tacs.

5 Tacs = 10 Melta. 80/9 Hits. So 8-9 Melta hits spread out over multiple facings. Probably around 8+ HP here after saves and full pens.
2 Devs = 24 Grav Shots. 168/9 Hits. 3 Immob and then rerolls for 2.5 More. 5 HP here. 3 after saves.
Edit: I didn't add in rerolls for 1's on Tac drop. That's more melta hits and Grav. Just fixed it. Maybe more with armorium cherub.

One to two dead knight on the drop probably, quite possibly more. Knights are certainly not my least favorite matchup. More importantly though you can use those seven drop pods to hem in the knights from moving (since they can't move past them) and have to assault them to get past anything (keeping your tacs/devs out of reach).




Will never happen. Any Knight player with half a brain will deploy his Knights in a corner, which means that the chance for you to ever reach melta range with 6 drop pods and squads in such a tiny clusterfeth of transports with such a huge footprint, is null and void. Futhermore, smart facing and positiong in such a corner makes it nearly impossible to face anything other than the front AV, which your meltas won't do jack against, especially with their 3++.
Furthermore, you can't immobilize a knight and you're quite the optimist if you think your 12" grav gruns can reach anything when you deployed 6 other drop pods in the way.
   
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Camas, WA

 Zewrath wrote:
Will never happen. Any Knight player with half a brain will deploy his Knights in a corner, which means that the chance for you to ever reach melta range with 6 drop pods and squads in such a tiny clusterfeth of transports with such a huge footprint, is null and void. Futhermore, smart facing and positiong in such a corner makes it nearly impossible to face anything other than the front AV, which your meltas won't do jack against, especially with their 3++.
Furthermore, you can't immobilize a knight and you're quite the optimist if you think your 12" grav gruns can reach anything when you deployed 6 other drop pods in the way.


If he deploys in the corner, then he is stuck there and I win on objectives. He'll have to assault through 3-6 drop pods to get out of there and that's if I don't deploy more next turn to hem him in more.

Against a 3++, it is still 22/3 Hull points, also known as a dead knight. Melta will still be within 6" and double dice against 13 is just as good as double dice against 12. You can't immobilize a knight, but they still lose HP against grav when they take the result. You deploy the pods right up against the knights (1" away) and then disembark slightly behind the front fins (so you can't be assaulted unless the pod is dead). You'll have plenty of range on your guns.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
And I just did this same thing with less pods against a triple knight list last weekend, he deployed in the corner to avoid my drop and I hemmed him in. I trapped two pods in the corner and one got left out because it was going to try to assault me and I wanted it to. He didn't get out of it for a full turn (and that was with far less pods).

This message was edited 5 times. Last update was at 2015/06/11 19:50:07


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Infiltrating Prowler






 pretre wrote:
 Zewrath wrote:
Will never happen. Any Knight player with half a brain will deploy his Knights in a corner, which means that the chance for you to ever reach melta range with 6 drop pods and squads in such a tiny clusterfeth of transports with such a huge footprint, is null and void. Futhermore, smart facing and positiong in such a corner makes it nearly impossible to face anything other than the front AV, which your meltas won't do jack against, especially with their 3++.
Furthermore, you can't immobilize a knight and you're quite the optimist if you think your 12" grav gruns can reach anything when you deployed 6 other drop pods in the way.


If he deploys in the corner, then he is stuck there and I win on objectives. He'll have to assault through 3-6 drop pods to get out of there and that's if I don't deploy more next turn to hem him in more.

Against a 3++, it is still 22/3 Hull points, also known as a dead knight. Melta will still be within 6" and double dice against 13 is just as good as double dice against 12. You can't immobilize a knight, but they still lose HP against grav when they take the result. You deploy the pods right up against the knights (1" away) and then disembark slightly behind the front fins (so you can't be assaulted unless the pod is dead). You'll have plenty of range on your guns.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
And I just did this same thing with less pods against a triple knight list last weekend, he deployed in the corner to avoid my drop and I hemmed him in. I trapped two pods in the corner and one got left out because it was going to try to assault me and I wanted it to. He didn't get out of it for a full turn (and that was with far less pods).


Assuming 100% perfect scatter and 10 melta guns in range, you're barely dropping 1 knight. Do enlighten me what happens to 5-6 open-topped vehicles that gets automatically hit in CC by S: D weapons in multiple combat. The pods will be mere speed bumps and will only serve to grant your marines 5+ Cover, after they die a horrible death to the multiple barrage of low AP weapons they have.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/06/11 20:02:00


 
   
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Badass "Sister Sin"






Camas, WA

 Zewrath wrote:
Assuming 100% perfect scatter and 10 melta guns in range, you're barely dropping 1 knight. Do enlighten me what happens to 5-6 open-topped vehicles that gets automatically hit in CC by S: D weapons in multiple combat. The pods will be mere speed bumps and will only serve to grant your marines 5+, after they die a horrible death to the multiple barrage of low AP weapons they have.

You can only charge one pod at a time with each of your knights (ITC). Those two or if your third knight lived three pods die.

And it doesn't assume perfect scatter. It assumes, 2 of them are perfect (1/3) and 4 of them scatter some amount. You have a 6" disembark though. Those two perfect ones hem you in at minimum, the 4 others deploy their units behind the two blockers.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/06/11 20:06:08


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Blood-Drenched Death Company Marine




Little Rock, Arkansas

If a bunch of knights squeeze in a corner, there's a very good chance the one knight dying will severely injure the other knights.

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Camas, WA


Getting first blood off a knight and keeping you trapped is a fine result for turn 1. Gives me run of the board for turn 2.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
niv-mizzet wrote:
If a bunch of knights squeeze in a corner, there's a very good chance the one knight dying will severely injure the other knights.

Well, maybe. I don't rely on that though. Equal chance it will blow up some pods.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I'd bet Zewrath doesn't think my SOB would do too well against a big knight list either. I love getting first blood off knights.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/06/11 20:07:58


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Made in dk
Infiltrating Prowler






 pretre wrote:
 Zewrath wrote:
Assuming 100% perfect scatter and 10 melta guns in range, you're barely dropping 1 knight. Do enlighten me what happens to 5-6 open-topped vehicles that gets automatically hit in CC by S: D weapons in multiple combat. The pods will be mere speed bumps and will only serve to grant your marines 5+, after they die a horrible death to the multiple barrage of low AP weapons they have.

You can only charge one pod at a time with each of your knights (ITC). Those two or if your third knight lived three pods die.

And it doesn't assume perfect scatter. It assumes, 2 of them are perfect (1/3) and 4 of them scatter some amount. You have a 6" disembark though. Those two perfect ones hem you in at minimum, the 4 others deploy their units behind the two blockers.



That's still outrageously optimistic to assume that over half your melta will be in optimal range on a regular basis. I'm not up to date on ITC but most Knights have several stubbers or flamers or a combination of both and you're allowed to assault anything you shot at, so unless ITC explicitly forbids that, then no it's quite easy for the Knights to wipe most of your pods.

Furthermore why only 3 Knights? You can easily fit 5 Knights in a 1850 list, all with 3++.
If you're talking about 3 Knights only, then you'll face a list that most definitely have a bubblewrap for those 3 Knights, in which case your melta fantasy is quite irrelevant.

And why would I care about your SOB list vs Knights? My IG list can trash most SOB lists and they wouldn't hold a candle to Eldar/Knights or what have you. The game is rock scissor paper to the extreme.

   
Made in us
Badass "Sister Sin"






Camas, WA

ITC says a single model can only assault one unit.

If they're bubble wrapped in a corner, they are still stuck and I still win on objectives.

Also, I'm glad that you can beat anything. I'll keep that in mind.

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Made in gb
Sinewy Scourge




Base rules agree their, check the rules for assaulting, no multi alone.
   
 
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