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The novels expanded the lore past the series, right? Can someone spoil for me how the novel series ends? That will help me decide whether or not to read the Sentinels stuff and beyond.
My recollection (it has been decades since I read it) is that End of the Circle ends with:
Rem and Minmei in some pocket dimension. Minmei is pregnant with Rem's child who will be Zor.
The SDF-4 is being readied to travel to the Andromeda galaxy to see if the story of Protoculture played out there too. Rick and Lisa are going.
The Regis transcended to another plane or something.
Haydon IV was a giant transformer or something.
Scott and Marlene/Ariel eventually got together. Shadow Chronicles did this a lot better.
I think all the main characters and good guy secondary characters survive to the end.
The SDF-1's fold drives were recovered and used to get the SDF-3 home.
And blah, blah, blah, blah. That describes most of it.
I wouldn't recommend anyone read The Sentinels or End of the Circle, or any of the Jack McKinney books really. They're pretty dismally bad, and among some of the worst written stuff I've ever struggled through. They're barely above Star Wars fiction, and even that point is arguable.
Forar wrote: I unironically love the Jack McKinney novels, pistols at dawn, sir!
Then carry on unironically enjoying them, as long as I don't have to be involved!
I remember picking up some McKinney book published years later. I think it was Zentraedi Uprising or something like that. I read half of it on a flight to Houston and half of it on a flight back. I forget which leg of the trip I was on, but I got to a section of the story were it started going into General Leonard's sexual kinks. I seem to recall the book describing how he would cross-dress and have a Quadrono in leathers beat him with a whip.
It was at that moment that I knew I was reading high quality material. Truly the best way to expand the Robotech mythos!
The novels expanded the lore past the series, right? Can someone spoil for me how the novel series ends? That will help me decide whether or not to read the Sentinels stuff and beyond.
My recollection (it has been decades since I read it) is that End of the Circle ends with:
Rem and Minmei in some pocket dimension. Minmei is pregnant with Rem's child who will be Zor.
The SDF-4 is being readied to travel to the Andromeda galaxy to see if the story of Protoculture played out there too. Rick and Lisa are going.
The Regis transcended to another plane or something.
Haydon IV was a giant transformer or something.
Scott and Marlene/Ariel eventually got together. Shadow Chronicles did this a lot better.
I think all the main characters and good guy secondary characters survive to the end.
The SDF-1's fold drives were recovered and used to get the SDF-3 home.
And blah, blah, blah, blah. That describes most of it.
I wouldn't recommend anyone read The Sentinels or End of the Circle, or any of the Jack McKinney books really. They're pretty dismally bad, and among some of the worst written stuff I've ever struggled through. They're barely above Star Wars fiction, and even that point is arguable.
IIRC Breetai dies taking down the Regent, but not before becoming a father with a female Zentradi.
Agree it was not great, and IIRC it's no longer canon anyway.
Check out Macross some time, there are some subtle changes that really add a lot.
IE in Robotech the world is in the middle of the Global Civil War, an alien ship crashes and we unify to deal with it.
In Macross the alien ship crashes and a global war starts over who gets it.
Puts a new spin on a lot of the stuff that happens later with the Earth government.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Forar wrote: I unironically love the Jack McKinney novels, pistols at dawn, sir!
Dittos!
Granted I was in Junior High when I read most but still...
I think they continued until I was in college with Sentinels and End of the Circle.
Thinking about Macross/Robotech I actually remembered a line from them. Lisa Hayes is facing the Earth Government folks and realizes that more than half of them are in uniform and thinks "Is this what we're fighting for? Military rule?" adds a level of depth to a bunch of random background characters.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/04/04 03:15:35
The novels expanded the lore past the series, right? Can someone spoil for me how the novel series ends? That will help me decide whether or not to read the Sentinels stuff and beyond.
My recollection (it has been decades since I read it) is that End of the Circle ends with:
Rem and Minmei in some pocket dimension. Minmei is pregnant with Rem's child who will be Zor.
The SDF-4 is being readied to travel to the Andromeda galaxy to see if the story of Protoculture played out there too. Rick and Lisa are going.
The Regis transcended to another plane or something.
Haydon IV was a giant transformer or something.
Scott and Marlene/Ariel eventually got together. Shadow Chronicles did this a lot better.
I think all the main characters and good guy secondary characters survive to the end.
The SDF-1's fold drives were recovered and used to get the SDF-3 home.
And blah, blah, blah, blah. That describes most of it.
I wouldn't recommend anyone read The Sentinels or End of the Circle, or any of the Jack McKinney books really. They're pretty dismally bad, and among some of the worst written stuff I've ever struggled through. They're barely above Star Wars fiction, and even that point is arguable.
Thanks for the summary! I don't recognize some of those names, but others give me some closure. Does the time travel imply that protoculture or robotechnology were not invented but excreted from a causal loop like Terminator processors? Is Shadow Chronicles a cartoon?
And for the record, I enjoy reading the McKinney novels, although I usually only get through one or two hundred pages before my mecha itch is scratched. And Star Wars novels vary a lot in quality.
Wow, I just stumbled across the e-mail response from Kevin to my AG request back in 2015 (the response was Sept 28, 2015 A 12:45 PM) to be exact. Looking back, it's so condensating and full of crap. I'd thought I had deleted it, but I apparently kept the response that was mailed directly to me.
My initial letter:
Spoiler:
Stormonu wrote:
Dear Sirs
I am writing to you in the hope that you take action against Palladium Books.
Palladium Books, Inc.
39074 Webb Court
Westland, MI 48185 (Wayne County)
Phone: 734-721-2900
Palladium Books successfully completed their Robotech RPG Tactics Kickstarter on May 20, 2013. This kickstarter was aimed to produce a tabletop wargame with miniature figures based on a popular sci-fi cartoon series from the 80's known as "Robotech". The kickstarter raised $1,442,312 among 5,342 international backers. Additional funding was collected via the Kickstarter's "backerkit", which allowed backers to add additional copies or add-on purchases to their "rewards". There is, unfortunately, no public information on the amount of additional funds collected with the "backerkit".
At the time of completion, the original estimated shipping date was December of 2013. As of Dec 31, neither on their weekly update or the kickstarter site was ANY mention made that the shipping would be delayed. On January 30, 2014 - a month after the initial, original shipping date was missed - Palladium Books announced in both a weekly update and on the Kickstarter site that the items would be split into two waves, with a shipping date of May/June 2014. In the April 10, 2014 weekly update, Robotech Wave One was announced with an expected delivery date of Spring 2014. In their April 25, 2014 weekly update, Robotech Wave One was revised with an expected delivery date of Summer 2014. Robotech Wave One went "into manufacturing" on June 12, 2014 according to their weekly update, with an estimated delivery date still Summer 2014. As of the Palladium website weekly update on June 26, the estimated delivery date was September, 2014. On July 17, 2014 as noted in the weekly update, the first of at least 11 containers was loaded to depart China, with an estimated arrival date of August 8, 2014. The weekly update was also changed to reflect a Fall 2014 estimated release date. US shipping for Wave One was declared in the weekly update to began on August 28, 2014. However, due to a number of transport issues, the majority of shipping did not actually begin until October 2, 2014 (announced in the weekly update and on the Kickstarter website). Europe was shipped their Wave One products by sea on or around Jan 21, 2015 as noted in a Kickstarter website update. Australia was shipped their Wave One products by sea around Feb 8, 2015 as again noted in a Kickstarter website update. "Rest of the World" was shipped their Wave One products (by sea?) on May 13, 2015 (again, via Kickstarter Website update).
Since the shipping of Wave One items began, backers have been asking for information on the status of the Wave Two items. This information has been frustatingly sparse, with the last tangible update occuring on Feb 28, 2015. This update consisted of "incomplete" 3D renders of two of the twenty-eight miniature figures for Wave two. Finally, in a two-part Kickstarter update on June 6, 2015 we were given a tenative release date for Wave Two of "The end of 2015". Since that time, all information about Robotech Tactics has been for items NOT a part of the "rewards" and items purchased in the original Kickstarter, with continual promises of a forthcoming Wave Two update.
Kevin Siembieda has posted detail information in reflection about the Kickstarter from its inception to the delivery of Wave One in a two-part update on the Kickstarter site on June 6, 2015.
While the ever-shifting release dates are signs of bad customer service and not criminal actions, Palladium books has increasingly shown dwindling ability to produce products based on its primary business - roleplaying books. Based on the information available to me and other backers at this time, we do not believe that Palladium Books has the resources - or willpower - to complete Robotech RPG Tactics Wave Two. In his June 6, 2015 update Kevin mentions serveral costs. The initial outlay for the Kickstarter was $40,000. International shipping is mentioned to have cost $150,000 (no mention of domestic shipping). There is a mention in the same update that "make(ing) the game and expansion packs" would be "between $550,000 and $900,000". Based on these rough numbers, it is my beleif that the funds for Wave One have been depleted and Palladium lacks the remaining funds - or ability to secure funding to cover the cost of Wave Two.
Further, based on their inability to produce other products from their own line, it is my belief the company is incapable of admitting they cannot produce Wave Two.
As an example of the latter, I direct you to their projected book release schedule that was listed in their January 11, 2015 weekly update. The update listed the following books for release in 2015:
Robotech® RPG Tactics™ Advanced Rule Book
Splicers® Sourcebooks – several
Beyond the Supernatural™ – Tomes Grotesque™ Volume One
Beyond the Supernatural™ – Beyond Arcanum™
Palladium Fantasy® Land of the Damned 3: The Citadel (probably 2016)
Palladium Fantasy® Land of the South Winds
Heroes Unlimited™ sourcebooks
Dead Reign® sourcebooks
Rifts® Secrets of the Atlanteans™
Rifts® Heroes of Humanity™
Rifts® The Disavowed™
Rifts® Antarctica
Rifts® Sovietski
Rifts® New Navy™
Rifts® Delta Blues™
Rifts® Dark Woods™
Rifts® Voodoo
Of the books listed, I can only find that Palladium Fantasy RPG: Bizantium and the Northern Islands has been released so far. The only other book that they have released this year that I can discern is the Robotech Expeditionary Force (formerly UEEF Marines) book, which was released this month. This latter book was originally slated for release on April 10, 2014 with numerous dates shifts - many of which had emphasised promised hard release dates.
We urge you to act in the interests of the 5,342 backers to force the hand of Palladium to either produce information to its backers on the current state of all Wave Two items and the feasibility of producing Robotech RPG Tactics with a general statement of the company having the finacial resources to produce said wave or reasonable proof of intent to secure funds to pay for said Wave Two. We urge you, that should Palladium refuse to provide such information to pursue forcing the company to refund the monetary value of the unproduced items to the backers.
Kevin's Response to the AG
Spoiler:
Kevin Siembieda wrote:
We strongly disagree with the assertions put forward by Mr. Klauk in this complaint.
Mr. Klauk participated in backing a Kickstarter crowdfunding project. This entitles him to certain pre-determined rewards when the project is finished. We have kept all of our Kickstarter backers informed as to the progress of this project, which has suffered a number of delays from our original expectations. That said, there was never an exact release date (that's not how Kickstarter works; you back a project, not purchase a product), and we have never stopped working to achieve the goals of said Kickstarter-funded project.
As Mr. Klauk should know, Kickstarter projects often deliver promised rewards well after their initial estimated dates. Under the terms of Kickstarter, as long as we are actively making this product (which we are; Wave One items have already been delivered, and Wave Two is under active development), and communicating with the backers to let them know where things stand (we have posted 14 Updates in the last six months, in addition to our own weekly e-mailings which often include Kickstarter updates), we are in FULL COMPLIANCE with the Kickstarter rules.
Kickstarter is a platform where Project Creators run campaigns to fund creative projects by offering rewards to raise money from Backers.
The Estimated Deliver Date listed on each reward is not a promise to fulfill by that date, but is merely an estimate of when the Project Creator hopes to fulfill by.
It's not uncommon for things to take longer than expected. Sometimes the execution of the project proves more difficult than the creator had anticipated. If a creator is making a good faith effort to complete their project and is transparent about it, backers shoud do their best to be patient and understanding while demanding continued accountability from the creator.
Kickstarter is not a store, and their fund-raising campaigns are not sales or merchanisms for taking pre-orders. There are always risks, and often unexpected delays and problems. Mr. Klauk pledged money to a project whose intention was to create a new product line. In exchange for that support, he is to recieve rewards as outlined during the Kickstarter campaign. He recieved Wave One of those rewards last year, and we are actively working towards the production of Wave Two.
Kickstarter does not offer refunds. A Project Creator is not required to grant a Backer's request for a refund unless the Project Creator is unable or unwilling to fulfill the reward.
Since his $250.00 total pledge, the rewards that Mr. Klauk has received thus far have a total retail value of $354.60. In terms of the sheer number of game pieces, he has received 69 so far (in addition to one copy of the full game rules, dice, and other accessories, everything he needs to play the game), and has only 40 additional game pieces remaining to be delivered in Wave Two.
In the 27 months since the funding period of this Kickstarter campaign ended, we have posted 89 Updates, an average of more than three per month. There have been 14 Updates in the last six months alone, at least one of them showing multiple pictures and breaking down exactly what the status of several game pieces was at the time. And both of these numbers are just those Updates posted on Kickstarter's website itself; they do not include our own weekly e-mailings which often contain Kickstarter campaign updates.
But Mr. Klauk already knows all of this, particularly because he and a small numbers of others, at the encouraging of another backer, have coordinated to file complaints with the Better Business Bureau as well as State Attorneys General, and continue to do so as they share our responses among themselves.
You have also received a complaint from another one of this small group of backers, Mr. Richard M. Steinberg (not including the AG case #). I apologize for referring to the other complaint here, but the fact that the text of the two complaints is largely identical makes it clear that this is a coordinated effort between the two individuals, and I believe the context of the other complaint is necessary to fairly consider both complaints.
From Mr. Steinberg's public comments in his efforts to encourage his fellow backers to file complaints against us with various agencies, he appears to care nothing about the completion and delivery of Wave Two products at all. In fact, his publicly stated intention is to destroy our business or damage it as much as possible.
On July 10, Mr. Steinberg posted the following comment:
...I'm not pissed off because of my brother messing with me, I'm pissed off that Kevin has proven him right, and right now your conversation is only make me more determined to make sure PB is destroyed as a company and Kevin no longer is allowed to do this to anyone ever again, so thank you for impressing upon me my desire to destroy PB..
On August 8, Mr. Steinberg posted:
...file with the BB (heck I just did) but doubt PB gives a rats ass what the BBB thinks and will ignore any complaints, especially since PB is not accredited thru them, but hey enough complaints and the BBB will give them an 'F" instead of the "A" they have.
It is our hope that both of these complaints will be seen for what they are, and treated appropriately. Mr. Steinberg is repeatedly making false and exaggerated claims (which are also used, word for word, in the complaint by Mr. Klauk) in an effort to damage us and get some sort of revenge for being late in delivering the rewards for this Kickstarter campaign. I'm sure you will agree that we cannot reveal confidential financial information to a person with such malicious intent toward our company, as they both insist we do.
We sympathize with the frustration expressed by some of our backers over how long it is taking to deliver the rest of the rewards; we're frustrated too. But there have been a number of unforeseen difficulties with engineering and production on this project, as we have explained to our backers a number of occasions.
Please note that Palladium Books has been in business for 34 years and plans to be around for many years to come. This is not a fly-by-night operation and we most certainly care about our backers, or fans and this exciting new game line.
We are working to fulfill our Kickstarter campaign and deliver all remaining rewards to our backers. By Kickstarter's Terms of Service, which Mr. Klauk agreed to when he created his Kickstarter account and backed our Kickstarter campaign, we are not obligated to grant him or anyone else a refund.
Couple of things...
- I love how rewards was constantly re-iterated in italics. I'd be willing to bet that the items order off of the pledge manager don't follow the same rules; those clearly seem like pre-orders as you are selecting specific items.
- Enjoy how I should be dismissed because asking for a refund and asking others how they went about doing it is a conspiracy to destroy PB - Straight up lies about Wave Two being in production (as we know they WERE out of funds) to the AG as this was written up after Wave One had been out for about a year.
- Last sentence is a TL;DR: "You'll get refunds over our cold, dead bodies" - which they STILL seem think they don't NEED to do refunds.
- I love how rewards was constantly re-iterated in italics. I'd be willing to bet that the items order off of the pledge manager don't follow the same rules; those clearly seem like pre-orders as you are selecting specific items. - Enjoy how I should be dismissed because asking for a refund and asking others how they went about doing it is a conspiracy to destroy PB - Straight up lies about Wave Two being in production (as we know they WERE out of funds) to the AG as this was written up after Wave One had been out for about a year. - Last sentence is a TL;DR: "You'll get refunds over our cold, dead bodies" - which they STILL seem think they don't NEED to do refunds.
What a Snake Oil salesmen KS is.
From within the message from Kevin...
Kickstarter is not a store, and their fund-raising campaigns are not sales or merchanisms for taking pre-orders. There are always risks, and often unexpected delays and problems. Mr. Klauk pledged money to a project whose intention was to create a new product line. In exchange for that support, he is to recieve rewards as outlined during the Kickstarter campaign. He recieved Wave One of those rewards last year, and we are actively working towards the production of Wave Two.
Kickstarter does not offer refunds. A Project Creator is not required to grant a Backer's request for a refund unless the Project Creator is unable or unwilling to fulfill the reward.
So... he told the AG that Palladium isn't required to grant a Backer's refund request unless PB are unable or unwilling to fulfill the reward.
How is this NOT a slam dunk for the Michigan AG's office now? He told them the exact circumstances in which case they're required to do so, and those circumstances have exactly been met. I mean, he could say he was lying when he was talking to the average plebs like me, but I'd find it entertaining to see him use that excuse to the AG.
I mean, granted, he already lied by saying they were ACTIVELY working on Wave 2, when according to the first of the current batch of Updates, at that point they knew they were out of money. Unless he's lying to backers about that too (possibly misappropriating money over the last 3 years, rather than admitting failure and using that money for refunds). Cause the man is an inveterate liar and huckster and scumbag. He might not have set out to defraud backers, but that doesn't change that he appears to have done so regardless.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/04/04 13:21:50
Looks like with the latest RRT Update, they're pushing the deadline for backers to the end of the week. I assume they got permission to do so (and if not, I hope HG doink them hard), but it does show how desperate they are to lower their lawsuit liability.
It's mostly the normal spank, but I do find it funny that nearly all the metal exclusives are gone (Breetai left), and some trivial crap (both army specific token packs and the UEDF decals), but NONE of the boxed sets are even close to being limited.
So even with the "massive uptake" they've had in the exchange program, and the clearance level sale they had, they've still got so much excess stock, that nothing is in danger of running out.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/04/04 15:58:02
Morgan Vening wrote: Looks like with the latest RRT Update, they're pushing the deadline for backers to the end of the week. I assume they got permission to do so (and if not, I hope HG doink them hard), but it does show how desperate they are to lower their lawsuit liability.
It's mostly the normal spank, but I do find it funny that nearly all the metal exclusives are gone (Breetai left), and some trivial crap (both army specific token packs and the UEDF decals), but NONE of the boxed sets are even close to being limited.
So even with the "massive uptake" they've had in the exchange program, and the clearance level sale they had, they've still got so much excess stock, that nothing is in danger of running out.
I suspect there is even a small income in shipping.
Every dollar counts.
I think they are drawing this out as well to see if a lawsuit is a go.
If it looks like it will not happen THEN they will not care about the exchange much.
I really hope that found letter from Kevin to do with the AG is included in the lawsuit.
I am rather upset how Kevin treats people.
It was pretty clear in the quote that as a customer there was a want to spare others from PB's bad behavior.
Using the word "destroy" or not, some measure of public concern was expressed.
Their communications to our community / their customers can bring out the worst in people.
Nothing like being belittled to get the anger flowing.
Kevin is always happy to point out how "unreasonable" people are behaving when he is the one that got them all fired up.
Words kill don't you know, except his.
I am sure since we all have communicated in some traceable ways, all kinds of stuff they will be happy to dredge up.
I have kept my letters as well, his full commitment to make good on refunds if wave 2 could not be made are there in black and white.
I guess he figured he could string us along indefinitely to make that kind of commitment.
It really matters little what I have to say after that.
A revolution is an idea which has found its bayonets.
Napoleon Bonaparte
Talizvar wrote: So the long and the short of it is to get backers to trade for the minimum they can and still leave room to sell some product and hope they do not need to sell the remainder to some fan-friend to trickle out on ebay.
I am concerned with when the license "actually" expires, all sales methods seem to be still up: PB website and Drivethru.
What I am wondering is NOW they have managed to get a HUGE commitment to the exchange they make the decision: NOW put out refunds (angering many that made the exchange) or they simply go with the idea "you had your chance" and sweep anything still owed under the carpet as a game of chicken with litigation. I am surprised they did not expunge all they could to remove all current information on Robotech and PB. Every day the KS for RRT is open gives more chances for backers to organize who may be late to cluing in on the closure of the KS.
I am also curious if they will have any Robotech at Anime North (May 25th): I bet they could not help themselves if they have extra stock.
Ah well, good times.
As to use of the miniatures: it still looks pretty when done right.
There is some hope for me, my youngest son was watching Robotech on Netflix and seemed to enjoy it.
He enjoys Khyron more than is healthy, not sure how to customize his Glaug to befit "the backstabber".
He just got through Breetai going into space and beating up Veritechs in hand-to-hand so he is considered an official "Boss" character so I now have to get that model done.
I now have to make a blue VT since Max is the favored hero (too bad his hair is blue, my kid's is green), waiting to hear his opinion on Miriya.
He is confused why Rick has trouble choosing: "Lisa" is obviously the better woman for coming up with "the Daedalus maneuver", he figures she is a keeper for that alone (what are they doing? Ah, that... is... AWESOME!).
"Minmay is dumb." was the other observation (for not recognizing Rick could die in a battle and for mistaking a medal as jewelry).
I do admit it has been very funny watching this again and hearing his observations.
Just saw "Ready Player One" on the weekend and now he is asking to see more of "Gundam" after seeing one in action.
I do not like to indulge too much in nostalgia, but I feel negligent not exposing my kids to what was a ton of fun prior to their births.
Stuff like this is why I love reading this thread. I love robotech. I grew up with it as a kid and it's got a special place in my heart. I also like Macross, Superdimensional Calvary Southern Cross and Genesis Climber MOSPEADA as stand alone shows themselves. I mean transforming motorcycles.... whats not to love!!
When you are young you don't understand all the crap that goes on behind the scenes to bring something like this to life. As a Adult, I despise Harmony Gold for the flagrent abuse of the copyright laws and their 'liberal' interpretation of them. But the kid in me still loves Robotech and anything to do with it.
I love your kids perspective on the plot of Macross. Roy is awesome. Lisa is by far the better woman but Rick wasn't thinking with his big head. Minmay should of been shoved out a airlock at the first oppertunity... post haste.... Capt Glovel was the most epic space ship captain since Capt Avatar ( Starblazers ftw baby!). Max and Miria was a great sub plot and the trials they have to go through especially in the extended universe like the Malcontent uprisings.
I've tried to get my GF's Grandson into Robotech he's 9 and while he loves the fight scenes. Loves the SDF-1, the Zentradi ships and ofc the Veritech's but he can't get into the plot of the show... ( then again he likes logan and jake paul ... bangs head on the keyboard) maybe when he is a little older he will understand it a bit better and be into it.
FabricatorGeneralMike wrote: I love your kids perspective on the plot of Macross. Roy is awesome. Lisa is by far the better woman but Rick wasn't thinking with his big head.
If every character were perfectly rational, movies would be a lot shorter. Also, how do you explain to a kid when a man is letting the small head do all the thinking?
FabricatorGeneralMike wrote: I love your kids perspective on the plot of Macross. Roy is awesome. Lisa is by far the better woman but Rick wasn't thinking with his big head.
If every character were perfectly rational, movies would be a lot shorter. Also, how do you explain to a kid when a man is letting the small head do all the thinking?
Like with many things in life: the crazy people are fantastic entertainment but you typically do not want them as part of your life.
My son seems to understand that.
He seems to understand what makes Lisa outstanding is what she can do while Minmay is of interest for what she is which I suppose is enough for now (he is 12 so is getting there).
My eldest seems to be of more simple tastes "does it have guns?" seems to be enough.
Mixed feelings on the episodes coming up: how will Roy's death be received? (I think mine way back when was "Why did he not go to hospital? Is he an idiot?" a standard response for me when upset.) Stay tuned.
A revolution is an idea which has found its bayonets.
Napoleon Bonaparte
From my days of watching GI Joe, Roy’s death came as a shock. I saluted the animators for having the gumption to kill a main character - something I had never seen a cartoon do before up until then,
I notice that they changed Roy’s death in Do You Remember Love, and the lampshaded the hospital bit in Macross Frontier - I guess a lot of people asked that same question of why he didn’t go to the hospital.
Automatically Appended Next Post: *Sigh*
Well, as much as I hated to do it, I’m taking advantage of PB’s extension to cash out of this dumpster fire and get back something. At this point I don’t have faith that a lawsuit will ever manifest against these jokers, and even if it did, the backers wouldn’t see any compensation other than the satisfaction that PB goes bankrupt - which honestly, will happen with or without me.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/04/05 22:07:24
I wouldn't feel too bad. I sold my credit for about half price to someone, and doing the math based on what they paid me, what they got, and the fire sale prices, they were still ahead of the game, if not quite as much as they might have been otherwise.
It's not an ideal outcome, but I'll take 1/2-1/3 of what I'm owed over nothing, and will be spreading that cash with my friends who backed with me all those years ago.
At least it's something, even if it just becomes a couple of movie tickets or a dent in my next Dwarven Forge KS contribution.
And the lesson here is: never, ever trust Palladium again.
The Auld Grump
Kilkrazy wrote:When I was a young boy all my wargames were narratively based because I played with my toy soldiers and vehicles without the use of any rules.
The reason I bought rules and became a real wargamer was because I wanted a properly thought out structure to govern the action instead of just making things up as I went along.
At the very least, crowdfunding seems to be dead for them directly, and semi-indirectly. Yes, obviously Savage Worlds still succeeded, but between the board game fiasco, and this (finally) admitted cratering, I imagine they'll remain toxic for the rest of their days, even if just on crowdfunding platforms.
Oh, they might lumber on, zombie of the industry that they are, supported by fan friends who buy a dozen grab bags a year whether they need them or not, but hopefully this debacle removes their ability to take advantage of thousands of people at once.
And if they try again, I imagine there'll be a nice big spike of backers in for a buck to speak their mind. Without being ghoulish, I don't think Kevin has enough years left before retirement to have enough of the stink from this clusterfeth wash away. Even a casual association with PB seems to be verging on radioactive these days.
Forar wrote: At the very least, crowdfunding seems to be dead for them directly, and semi-indirectly.
I don't think so. I think they could still easily crowdfund a print run of a new book. I also think they could probably successfully fund "limited editions" of some books. I just don't think there's enough widespread knowledge of exactly how bad this was to truly quash their ability to get crowdfunding money.
They're probably dead in the water for any larger projects. They're definitely not going to be able to get a toehold in miniatures again. But for their business of printing RPG books and decks of playing cards, I don't think there's any true impediment.
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