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 Januine wrote:
Does the death masque fray cannon come with the ammo hopper backpack like the deathwatch: overkill guy above?

It does not.

 Januine wrote:
Ah well. Ugghhhh. Red barreled frag cannon - nonono. Looks like a bad Christmas prezzie!!! Hopefully my own box will arrive in the next day or 3

yeah, it does look a little bit off huh?

My box won't get here until the weekend (I will be gone too :(). I am going to start planning my Kill Teams though. My Squad Donatus is going to undergo some changes to make them a standard Kill Team (Combi-Melta becomes Boltgun, Space Wolf will have his Chainsword replaced with a grenade hand, Dark Angels will lose both arms to get a Boltgun and a Xenophase Blade). I am also going to start deciding the chapter make-ups of my Kill Teams.

 Januine wrote:
Ah well. Ugghhhh. Red barreled frag cannon - nonono. Looks like a bad Christmas prezzie!!! Hopefully my own box will arrive in the next day or 3

"Ho ho ho you ugly Xeno son of a....."

Lol!!!!

 casvalremdeikun wrote:

 Januine wrote:
Ah well. Ugghhhh. Red barreled frag cannon - nonono. Looks like a bad Christmas prezzie!!! Hopefully my own box will arrive in the next day or 3

yeah, it does look a little bit off huh?

My box won't get here until the weekend (I will be gone too :(). I am going to start planning my Kill Teams though. My Squad Donatus is going to undergo some changes to make them a standard Kill Team (Combi-Melta becomes Boltgun, Space Wolf will have his Chainsword replaced with a grenade hand, Dark Angels will lose both arms to get a Boltgun and a Xenophase Blade). I am also going to start deciding the chapter make-ups of my Kill Teams.

I hadn't considered the chainsword on redblade - you're right, technically that should go. OTOH I've replaced the dark angel in that squad with one of the old space marine veteran models with a bolt pistol and power sword, and deathwatch veterans don't have bolt pistols, so I'm not exactly running WYSIWYG anyway :/ .

I feel like the rule of cool overrides WYSISYG to a certain extent, as long as everyone is aware of what each model has.

 Wolfblade wrote:
I feel like the rule of cool overrides WYSISYG to a certain extent, as long as everyone is aware of what each model has.

Which is going to be hard with Deathwatch. There are so many options that many players(like me) will want to know exactly what a model has. It can get hard to remember X=Y in 2-4 hour games.

I'm still crossing my fingers there will be more types of upgrade sprues down the line.

 Selym wrote:

My Blohd Rehverns idea is now possible.

Spoiler:

Watch Commander Boreale w/Relic Blade, Artificer Armour, Bane Bolts of Eryxia [145 pts]

Blood Ravens Veterans w/4x Frag Cannon, Drop Pod [245 pts]

[390 points]

I'm afraid it is not possible. Inexplicably you cannot have a relic blade unless you have a terminator armour.

What is the issue with Redblade's chainsword? Does it not just replace his ccw for free?

Also the power sword and plasma pistol on Gydrael seems legal as well, though obviously stupidly expensive.

Though upon further reading Casvalremdeikun may just want his kill team to have a standard load out of bolter and ccw.

The weirdest thing for me is the paucity of Death Watch Kill team listings on ebay and the like. The Ven dread, Artemis, Vanguard and a flood of Harlequins are there but the basic Kill Team sprue is not...plenty of bits listings though.

I'm keeping things as WYSIWYG as possible, but I'm definitely subbing armor out for similar things.

Ex. Instead of normal missile launchers, I'm using 30k era Proteus Launchers as missile launchers, and I'll likely be using Xenos weapons in place of close combat weapons, if the model isn't holding a shotgun, which I feel almost all of my Veterans will be.

 Thraxas Of Turai wrote:
What is the issue with Redblade's chainsword? Does it not just replace his ccw for free?

Also the power sword and plasma pistol on Gydrael seems legal as well, though obviously stupidly expensive.

Though upon further reading Casvalremdeikun may just want his kill team to have a standard load out of bolter and ccw.

The weirdest thing for me is the paucity of Death Watch Kill team listings on ebay and the like. The Ven dread, Artemis, Vanguard and a flood of Harlequins are there but the basic Kill Team sprue is not...plenty of bits listings though.

Redblade can't have two CCWs and a Bolter. Heven has his knife sheath on his waist without a knife in it, so I don't want to remove that. Plus it looks cool. So the Chainsword has to go. The PS and Plasma Pistol is legal, but not a loadout I want on my any of my Veterans. I do like Gydrael otherwise (I customized him to have a hooded helmet instead of just a hood) so I will probably remove both of his arms. But then again, I might just paint him up as an actual Dark Angel(removing the left so he has his shoulder pauldrons on the correct arms for a regular Dark Angel) and find a different model for the Kill Team. Be it that I am probably going to get the Watch Captain kit, I will probably do that and make a different Dark Angel. I can't really decide.

 Thraxas Of Turai wrote:


The weirdest thing for me is the paucity of Death Watch Kill team listings on ebay and the like. The Ven dread, Artemis, Vanguard and a flood of Harlequins are there but the basic Kill Team sprue is not...plenty of bits listings though.

I suspect the vast majority who were jonesing for new Harlequins were like me and bought more than we could ever reasonably use when they released,

and a new plastic Eldrad while nice is not reason enough to buy the Death Masque set

most of the private sellers who are splitting a box on ebay are those who want the new deathwatch stuff and then are dumping the harlequins as a full army, or at worst as troupe/bikes/voidweaver

so all the listings on ebay will be from professional bits sellers who will have the time and energy to break things down completely to get more cash

Did I read that right? DW Veterans don't have bolt pistols??????

( looking at all his counts as DW/SG...with bolt pistols....)

Nope, bolter and CCW, which they can swap for all manner of things but not for bolt pistols. Vanguard vets do get them. It seems a bit derpy to me that you can swap your bolter for a plasma pistol or grav pistol but not for a humble bolt pistol, described in the codex as being "standard issue for all Deathwatch". Gotta love that GW consistency.

This is also why redblade with his knife, chainsword and bolter doesn't strictly work. The dark angel guy I don't think is too bad because his belt knife is so small you could pass it off as ornamental.

General Hobbs wrote:


Did I read that right? DW Veterans don't have bolt pistols??????

( looking at all his counts as DW/SG...with bolt pistols....)

This is correct. They do not, nor do they have any way of getting them. It also makes Rodricus Grytt's loadout (Frag Cannon and Bolt Pistol with an added CCW) illegal. Also, Drenn Redblade has an extra CCW. They appear to be the only ones that are wrong from Kill Team Cassius though. What does make things more hilarious is that GW is re-releasing Kill Team Cassius, despite it having illegal loadouts.

I'm not usually all that anal about making sure all my guys have CCWs on their belts or whatever but with Deathwatch, where they can swap them for other stuff, it feels more important, idk

 casvalremdeikun wrote:

General Hobbs wrote:


Did I read that right? DW Veterans don't have bolt pistols??????

( looking at all his counts as DW/SG...with bolt pistols....)

This is correct. They do not, nor do they have any way of getting them. It also makes Rodricus Grytt's loadout (Frag Cannon and Bolt Pistol with an added CCW) illegal. Also, Drenn Redblade has an extra CCW. They appear to be the only ones that are wrong from Kill Team Cassius though. What does make things more hilarious is that GW is re-releasing Kill Team Cassius, despite it having illegal loadouts.

Given that Kill Team Cassius is a named formation, who cares if the loadouts don't exactly match the codex?

They've been making it for quite some time that special characters have loadouts that others might not get access to; so is it really that much of a surprise that named formations(which are essentially special character versions of units) have loadouts that are not necessarily usable?

 Kanluwen wrote:

 casvalremdeikun wrote:

General Hobbs wrote:


Did I read that right? DW Veterans don't have bolt pistols??????

( looking at all his counts as DW/SG...with bolt pistols....)

This is correct. They do not, nor do they have any way of getting them. It also makes Rodricus Grytt's loadout (Frag Cannon and Bolt Pistol with an added CCW) illegal. Also, Drenn Redblade has an extra CCW. They appear to be the only ones that are wrong from Kill Team Cassius though. What does make things more hilarious is that GW is re-releasing Kill Team Cassius, despite it having illegal loadouts.

Given that Kill Team Cassius is a named formation, who cares if the loadouts don't exactly match the codex?

They've been making it for quite some time that special characters have loadouts that others might not get access to; so is it really that much of a surprise that named formations(which are essentially special character versions of units) have loadouts that are not necessarily usable?

That is certainly true. I just find it pretty funny. I hope they revamp the rules for Kill Team Cassius to be more in line with the codex though (give the units Mission Tactics, allow Kill Team Cassius to be used in a Black Spear Strike Force).

 casvalremdeikun wrote:

General Hobbs wrote:


Did I read that right? DW Veterans don't have bolt pistols??????

( looking at all his counts as DW/SG...with bolt pistols....)

This is correct. They do not, nor do they have any way of getting them. It also makes Rodricus Grytt's loadout (Frag Cannon and Bolt Pistol with an added CCW) illegal. Also, Drenn Redblade has an extra CCW. They appear to be the only ones that are wrong from Kill Team Cassius though. What does make things more hilarious is that GW is re-releasing Kill Team Cassius, despite it having illegal loadouts.

I'd be very, very surprised if anyone ever kicked up a fuss about Drenn's pair of CCW or the fact Grytt has a pistol; both are pretty inconsequential, and easily ignored. When it comes to 'impossible' loadouts like that, it's easy enough to work out the 'default' option that they're representing. If it ever does come up, it's easy enough to just point out that the respective CCW and pistol aren't there.

 casvalremdeikun wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

 casvalremdeikun wrote:

General Hobbs wrote:


Did I read that right? DW Veterans don't have bolt pistols??????

( looking at all his counts as DW/SG...with bolt pistols....)

This is correct. They do not, nor do they have any way of getting them. It also makes Rodricus Grytt's loadout (Frag Cannon and Bolt Pistol with an added CCW) illegal. Also, Drenn Redblade has an extra CCW. They appear to be the only ones that are wrong from Kill Team Cassius though. What does make things more hilarious is that GW is re-releasing Kill Team Cassius, despite it having illegal loadouts.

Given that Kill Team Cassius is a named formation, who cares if the loadouts don't exactly match the codex?

They've been making it for quite some time that special characters have loadouts that others might not get access to; so is it really that much of a surprise that named formations(which are essentially special character versions of units) have loadouts that are not necessarily usable?

That is certainly true. I just find it pretty funny. I hope they revamp the rules for Kill Team Cassius to be more in line with the codex though (give the units Mission Tactics, allow Kill Team Cassius to be used in a Black Spear Strike Force).

If they had wanted Kill Team Cassius to be in line with the Codex, they would have made it actually be present within the codex.

Watch Captain Artemis isn't in the book either, so unless they're seriously planning the "all free digital download for the bulk of the material with specific formations tied to campaign books" route like AoS for 8th edition, I would be surprised as hell to see KTC get updated.

 Bull0 wrote:
(...) humble bolt pistol (...).

Oh no. Read the codex again (Vanguard Veterans page):

All Vanguard Veterans use those weapons with which they are deadliest. Though many battle-brothers prefer the classic combination of flesh-ripping chainsword and brutal bolt pistol (...)

Such a weapon is nothing for mere tactical veterans. You need to be a highly trained assault specialist or a captain to wield it.

 Dryaktylus wrote:

 Bull0 wrote:
(...) humble bolt pistol (...).

Oh no. Read the codex again (Vanguard Veterans page):

All Vanguard Veterans use those weapons with which they are deadliest. Though many battle-brothers prefer the classic combination of flesh-ripping chainsword and brutal bolt pistol (...)

Such a weapon is nothing for mere tactical veterans. You need to be a highly trained assault specialist or a captain to wield it.

And I'm sat here looking at an imperial guard sergeant wielding one with pride, but my deathwatch sarge can't have one.

Maybe ask them on facebook?

 Bull0 wrote:

 Dryaktylus wrote:

 Bull0 wrote:
(...) humble bolt pistol (...).

Oh no. Read the codex again (Vanguard Veterans page):

All Vanguard Veterans use those weapons with which they are deadliest. Though many battle-brothers prefer the classic combination of flesh-ripping chainsword and brutal bolt pistol (...)

Such a weapon is nothing for mere tactical veterans. You need to be a highly trained assault specialist or a captain to wield it.

And I'm sat here looking at an imperial guard sergeant wielding one with pride, but my deathwatch sarge can't have one.

I will take a shotgun over a bolt pistol anyday as a tactical marine IMO

 Mr Morden wrote:
Maybe ask them on facebook?

I did that. I argued back and forth with Warhammer TV for about an hour, with them refusing to acknowledge they wrote the rule ambiguously, and then said they'd send my inquiry to the rules team.

Cephalobeard wrote:

 Mr Morden wrote:
Maybe ask them on facebook?

I did that. I argued back and forth with Warhammer TV for about an hour, with them refusing to acknowledge they wrote the rule ambiguously, and then said they'd send my inquiry to the rules team.

Was that fro the shotgun adn Bolter ting or why they don't have bolt pistols?

I was surprised that the Deathwatch named characters were not in the codex - is there any other codex without a single named character?

 Mr Morden wrote:

Cephalobeard wrote:

 Mr Morden wrote:
Maybe ask them on facebook?

I did that. I argued back and forth with Warhammer TV for about an hour, with them refusing to acknowledge they wrote the rule ambiguously, and then said they'd send my inquiry to the rules team.

Was that fro the shotgun adn Bolter ting or why they don't have bolt pistols?

I was surprised that the Deathwatch named characters were not in the codex - is there any other codex without a single named character?

Ah. Mine was in regards to Bolters/Shotguns.

 Mr Morden wrote:

Cephalobeard wrote:

 Mr Morden wrote:
Maybe ask them on facebook?

I did that. I argued back and forth with Warhammer TV for about an hour, with them refusing to acknowledge they wrote the rule ambiguously, and then said they'd send my inquiry to the rules team.

Was that fro the shotgun adn Bolter ting or why they don't have bolt pistols?

I was surprised that the Deathwatch named characters were not in the codex - is there any other codex without a single named character?

Harlequins... Skitarii... Admech... Imperial Knights...

 Crazyterran wrote:

 Mr Morden wrote:

Cephalobeard wrote:

 Mr Morden wrote:
Maybe ask them on facebook?

I did that. I argued back and forth with Warhammer TV for about an hour, with them refusing to acknowledge they wrote the rule ambiguously, and then said they'd send my inquiry to the rules team.

Was that fro the shotgun adn Bolter ting or why they don't have bolt pistols?

I was surprised that the Deathwatch named characters were not in the codex - is there any other codex without a single named character?

Harlequins... Skitarii... Admech... Imperial Knights...

Ah well - good point.

 Mr Morden wrote:

 Crazyterran wrote:

 Mr Morden wrote:

Cephalobeard wrote:

 Mr Morden wrote:
Maybe ask them on facebook?

I did that. I argued back and forth with Warhammer TV for about an hour, with them refusing to acknowledge they wrote the rule ambiguously, and then said they'd send my inquiry to the rules team.

Was that fro the shotgun adn Bolter ting or why they don't have bolt pistols?

I was surprised that the Deathwatch named characters were not in the codex - is there any other codex without a single named character?

Harlequins... Skitarii... Admech... Imperial Knights...

Ah well - good point.

I'd just be happy to have HQ's.