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so, I'm kind of constrained by the kits I have since I'm not going to go buying bits, so how does this look for making the best of what I've got (2 veteran boxes)

Squad A:
4 shotguns

Squad B:
2 frag launchers
2 infernus heavy bolters

not sure how I want to equip the sergeants. Probably going to just give them bolters and maybe lightning claws (from the vanguard veteran kit).
Or a lightning claw and a stormshield?

I don't advise mixing special weapons. Makes the squads less efficient.

If you want a cannon squad, do a cannon squad.

Same is true for heavy bolters, etc.

True, but unless I buy two more veteran kits, I'm not going to get more cannons or heavy bolters.

Unless, you're suggesting to just give 2 cannons/heavy bolters to a 5 man squad and leave the other 3 with just their bolters?

Not the worst possibility

Bolters and Cannons have different goals.

It very well MAY be better to not mix them. Personally, I'd just run Shotguns with Cannons because they want to be close.

Bolters with Bolters, etc.

How about..

Squad A:
2 Shotguns
2 Frag Cannons

Squad B:
2 Infernus heavy bolters
Put in a rhino. let the two IHBs shoot out of the top hatch.

Looks better than before.

I, personally, am not not using any sergeants and am doing my Frag Cannons squads as 4x + 1 Shotgun, but this is mostly because I'm banking a lot on Wall of Death for overwatch.

Couldn't get a chance to finish my thought on pg13

I'm pretty sure I'm gonna make a Dominatus Kill Team, with an attached Ordo Xenos Inquisitor with Rad Grenades. When combined with a Beacon Angelis from a Drop Pod, this unit can cross the map with a bevy of power weapons and starting wounding things like Wraithknights. No Heavy Thunder Hammer needed, but still nice to bring along. Maybe a Xenophase Blade might have a place in such a Kill Team, seeing at it wounds on a now modified toughness.

Do you think these are distinct enough to sub in as Stalker Bolters?


I have a bunch of them left over after deciding to build a bunch of my MK III dudes as Assault Marines in my 30k Word Bearers.

There's a cylindrical piece of sprue on the back of the Deathwatch upgrade sprue (near the center) that's a perfect size for the end of a stalker bolter. I trimmed the tips a bit of the bolters and put that on them, worked out pretty well.

 Eldarain wrote:
Do you think these are distinct enough to sub in as Stalker Bolters?


I have a bunch of them left over after deciding to build a bunch of my MK III dudes as Assault Marines in my 30k Word Bearers.

Some of the bolt pistols in the Scout Squad kit have a elongated barrel. I cut those off and glued them in the place of the bolter barrel. They seem to have worked pretty well.

So I am wondering, for a squad leader, which seems to be a better option, a Black Shield or a Watch Sergeant or neither?

That's a good call. I have a bunch of those left from Lost Patrol.

 Eldarain wrote:
That's a good call. I have a bunch of those left from Lost Patrol.

I was able to convert the Kill Team Cassius's Iron Hands marine's Combi-Melta into a Stalker Pattern Boltgun that way. Looks pretty good, if I do say so myself. I will post a picture later. I did have some issues when I cut away the Melta tank, but I glued a strip of Special Issue Ammunition shells in its place.

Anyone have any more various success stories? I'm having 3 games tomorrow that I'll come back and report on, one at 1000 pts, then at 1500, then a killteam match.

I'm excited to see how my new stalker + infernus + cml squad furor squad goes. The idea is for it to lay down so much troop killing firepower that my dropping frag cannon squads can hunt way more valuable and appropriate targets.

Keen as a bean and will report back soon.

Rihgu wrote:
True, but unless I buy two more veteran kits, I'm not going to get more cannons or heavy bolters.

Unless, you're suggesting to just give 2 cannons/heavy bolters to a 5 man squad and leave the other 3 with just their bolters?

Both Kromlech and Anvil have alternative frag cannon models available.

Qwerty2jam wrote:
Anyone have any more various success stories? I'm having 3 games tomorrow that I'll come back and report on, one at 1000 pts, then at 1500, then a killteam match.

I'm excited to see how my new stalker + infernus + cml squad furor squad goes. The idea is for it to lay down so much troop killing firepower that my dropping frag cannon squads can hunt way more valuable and appropriate targets.

Keen as a bean and will report back soon.

Sure - I've had a few more goes with deathwatch since my last posting.

Went to an RTT with a watch company Black spear strike force. My list remembering is kinda hazy, but the gist of it was I had an all-comers team, with shotguns, frag cannons, and melee vanguard and a TDA captain, and a chaplain. I had a melta-drop team with 5 combi meltas and 2 melta fists in a drop pod. I had a stalker bolter team with 7 snipers and a libby. And I had a heavy weapons team, 4 missile launchers and a cyclone terminator. I did 2-1 for the day, winning vs an unbound flyer ork list (6 blitza bommers, 45 stormboys, and a loota squad in a bunker). I won 1st turn vs that guy because he reserved everything except the lootas. My melta team dropped in and destroyed the bunker, then my stalker bolter team finished off the stragglers thanks to phase form and hellfire rounds. Plus the exploding building took a large chunk out of the unit as well. Game 2 i lost, vs dark tetrad daemons. I killed all but 1 daemon prince, but she was so far ahead on maelstrom objectives that i still lost the overall game. Game 3 was vs KDK, with tons of assault units. I won that one, but took the heaviest casualties of any of my 3 games that day. Melta team did great work once more there - they dropped in and destroyed his renegade knight on the first turn of the game, but were quickly swarmed with bloodletters and warp talons, so didn't stick around long after that.

Yesterday, i played 1500 points vs nurgle chaos. He had a unit of 10 CSM, mark of nurgle, in a rhino. A unit of 10 plague marines in a rhino, with 2 meltas and a combi-melta. 10 nurgle bikers, with 2 flamers. A lord on a bike, mark of nurgle. And a nurgle daemon prince with the burning brand of skalathrax, LVL 3 mastery. My list at 1500 was a BSSF, led by a captain with Jump pack, artificier, and xenophase blade. I had a venerable dreadnaught with a TLLC/HF. A stalker boltgun kill team, with 5 stalker bolters and a lvl2 librarian (geokinesis). My melta droppers - 5 combi meltas, 1 meltafist/heavy flamer, and a TDA captain. And my all-rounder team. 3 shotguns, 2 frag cannons, 2 LC/SS vanguard, and a chaplain. The last 2 teams were strategium command squads, each taking an aquila kill team and a leader. I also took a corvus blackstar, with a halo launcher and a TL hurricane bolter.

I won 13-3 on maelstrom points, but here are some highlights. Turn 1 I shot at his bikers who had moved up, killing 1 total thanks to some really good saves on his part. I assaulted with my all-rounder team, challenging his lord with my jump captain. After completely failing to wound, the lord instant-deathed my captain with his power fist. Luckily earlier in the turn my melta team had gotten first blood from one of his rhinos. His daemon prince came on and killed 3 of my 5 snipers, but they held morale. His lord had morphed into a daemon prince after killing my captain, so he charged into battle and my chaplain survived thanks to his rosarius. My turn 2 prettymuch sealed the game for me - my corvus blackstar entered play and because he chose not to jink with his daemon prince of nurgle, i was able to deal 5 unsaved wounds total after firing my assault cannons, hurricane bolter, and all 4 stormstrike missiles. My dreadnought charged into the daemon prince that was fighting my chaplain, and while my chaplain did die at initiative 8, the dreadnought instant-deathed the daemon prince with his power fist. The remainder of the game he was killing bikers who couldn't really hurt him back, and the melta team was whittling away at plague marines in melee (thanks to the captain's relic blade).

So far in every one my my deathwatch games (7 in total so far), I've had a blast. They're great at keying in on specific targets and removing them from the battlefield, for the most part. We don't use death from the skies, so my corvus is great air support when needed. That said, mobility isn't the greatest in the army. I'm a huge fan of running kill teams with every game, so if i want a rhino to carry my guys around a little faster in, I have to do a kill team that only incorporates a librarian.

Anyway that's my catch-up on how i've been doing. it's a bit stream-of-consciousness, and for that i apologize. Can't wait to read how your games went.

To be fair you were facing quite a garbage CSM list.

To be fair again, that would be basically all CSM lists.

Garbage, that is.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
To be fair you were facing quite a garbage CSM list.

No arguments here on that one. However, i'm still counting the battle amongst my victories.

I'd say the most hardcore player we have at our local store is the woman who plays chaos daemons. Her lists are always very tzeench-based with tons of summoning, and while very cheesy puts up the hardest battles vs me compared to anyone else i play.

So, the Beacon Angelis is interesting in that it doesn't require you to have it on the board at the start of the turn to work, like every other imperial beacon. That means for the low cost of an HQ and a vet squad in a DP, you can have a reliable beacon turn 1.

Using this with Skyhammer Annihilation force could be pretty fething brutal. Particularly if you run that formation as Ultramarines. You can do 2x10 man assault squads (To give you the ability to split into 4x5 if you're facing MSU backfield control), and 2x4 Grav cannons, with rerolls to 1 to hit for everyone from using tactical doctrine turn 1. That gives you 2x20 Grav shots at 24", firing from roughly 12" from the beacon holder. You've also go a reliable 7" charge (Ignoring intervening terrain and units) from 6" from the beacon holder.

While turn 1 assaults and use of the skyhammer are not new tactics, I feel that the Beacon gives the reliability for a very low cost (Basically no tax, as you can give it to a ML2 Libby who is a solid unit), allowing the skyhammer to overcome one of it's biggest weaknesses, which is reliable landings. It's still got a serious weakness to Tau interceptor list, that might keep it from becoming a viable Tier 1 combination. With smart building, you could probably bring two skyhammer forces

With that in mind, I'm planning on running the following list tomorrow or next week;

Black Spear
Command
-ML2 Libby
-- Beacon

Core
Aquilla Kill Team
-5x Vets
--5x Shotgun
--2x Combi-Flamer
-2x Terminators
--2x Heavy Flamer
---Drop Pod

Aquilla Kill Team
-5x Vets
--5x Shotgun
--2x Combi-Plasma
-2x Terminators
--2x Assault Cannon
---Drop Pod

Aquilla Kill Team
-5x Vets
--5x Shotgun
--2x Combi-Melta
-2x Terminators
--2x Meltafist
---Drop Pod

Aux
-Dreadnought
--Assault Cannon and HF
---Drop Pod

Skyhammer Annihilation Force (Black Templar)
-10x Assault Marines
--Vet Sarge with PS and MB
-10x Assault Marines
--Vet Sarge with PS and MB
-5x Devastators
--4x Multi-melta
---Drop Pod
-5x Devastators
--4x Lascannon
---Drop Pod

I'm not running UM because I play BT. I'm running PS/MB on the AM because I plan on using them to bully weaker units and/or vehicles, and rule of cool. I have MM and LC instead of GC because I don't own any grav, and because I don't want to be the guy to show up with a list that drops 2x20 grav shots turn 1. Aquilla teams are all 9 man so I can be flexible with who I drop first and where the libby goes.

Thoughts?

My thoughts are that you ought to abandon the Lascannons. The main advantage of the Skyhammer is that it enables you to get the shorter range Heavy Weapons into their effective range.

Yep, Skyhammer is basically grav or MM.

But yeah, I have been working on a list with ultra skyhammers combined with the beacon.

I would make sure to run at least two pods for the deathwatch so that way if you have skyhammer come in turn two then you can have your beacon come in later.

However, that being said considering the cost of the skyhammer(mine is around 750) you could get a lot of other things like centurions in a cad or something similar, getting access to additional cheap OS in the form of scouts or other related items. You could get the terminator captain that would allow you to get slow and purposeful for your devs, or attach him to a stalker squad etc. Tons of versatility.

Hey, guys. I'm finishing up building all my guys this weekend and intend to hopefully do my first test games over the next two weeks. Wanted to post my list and gather some opinions before I do so.

-------------------------------


Aquilla Kill Team: Dominus Aegis
5 DW Veterans (4x Missile Launcher, 1x Stalker Bolter) 1 Librarian (Level 1, Specialty Ammo) 4 Terminators (CMS, Krakk) One veteran has a relic that gives the whole squad a 4++ if it doesn’t move.
This has 12 S8AP3 Shots at 48”, rerolling ones. Librarian rolls on Divination for Prescience.


Command Team:
Librarian ML2


Auxiliary:
One Corax Plane (Reroll Jink upgrade Rocket Launcher)


Core Aquilla kill teams
5x DW Veterans (4x Frag Cannon) 1 Librarian (Level 1, Specialty ammo) Drop Pod
5x DW Veterans (4x Frag Cannon) 1 Librarian (Level 1, Specialty ammo) Drop Pod
The above Librarians, like the other, rolls Divination for Prescience and the ability to ignore cover. Each of these squads, default, does 8 S9AP2 Shots at <12”


Three Simple Kill Teams
5x DW Veterans Shotgun/Bolter
One has a Drop Pod, not Embarked


Inquisitorial Detachment

Ordo Malleus Inquisitor
3 Servo Skulls

-------------------------------


Going for a bit of an Alpha Strike, dropping the two cannon squads turn 1, using the missile team from the back lines to take objectives.

I will add, I'm strongly considering DROPPING the level 1 Librarian from my missile aquilla team, and adding a bike for split fire.

Opinions?

BrianDavion wrote:
on a slightly related topic, can anyone suggest a good place to pick up peices to make a custom inqusitor?

The legs and torso from Tempestus Scions, combined with arms from Space Marines, would make convincing Power Armour for a custom Inquisitor, or just use the Scion parts and either Scion, SM Scout or IG arms for a Carapace Armoured Inquisitor.

This was my take on a 1850 competitive DE list with a Skyhammer. Ultramarines for the skyhammer, tactical doctrine turn 1, and if any devastators remain then devastator doctrine turn 2.
Use beacon Angelis to redeploy the dreadnought to the front lines since it has a Multi-Melta.

Thoughts?


Black Spear Strike Force

(Watch Commpander)
Watch Master
Beacon Angelis

(Watch Company)
Watch Captain Artemis

Aquila or Malleus Frag team
Terminator
2x vets w/ frag cannons
3x vets w/ boltgun shotgun
Drop pod

Aquila or Furor Frag team
Terminator
2x vets w/ frag cannons
3x vets w/ boltgun shotgun
Drop pod

Aquila or Furor Missile team
Terminator w/ cyclone missile launcher
5x vets stalker bolter shotgun

Aquila or Furor Missile team
Terminator w/ cyclone missile launcher
5x vets stalker bolter shotgun

(Ancient)
Dreadnought


Skyhammer Annihilation Force

Devastators
4x Grav Cannons w/ grav amps
Drop pod

Devastators
4x Mutli-melta
Drop pod

Assault Squad

Assault Squad

I would stick solely with Aquila for the most part.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
I would stick solely with Aquila for the most part.

That has been my thought as well. Initially, I thought the other variations might be good, but one could often end up with no benefit. Especially with FormationHammer allowing for things like Troops to be ignored.

Yeah, I was thinking all Aquila but a few people here were telling me to try out the other ones. Thin always rerolling 1's is better too.

Especially with all the gargs/SHVs aquila is the way to go.

Also baring certain situations you will usually be using the hellfire ammo anyway so re-roll ones is basically re-roll all lol.

Biggest thing I'm concerned about with the list is if I go second against an alpha strike. Only 5 marines, two terminators and a dreadnought starting on the board.