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Has to be the AdMech Electropriests, right? Both flavours. T3 dudes with HoW and sticks and little hula hoop hands that fire AP- bolt pistols. What is the point of these dudes?

I know, I know - stick a GK Librarian in a full squad of Stick-Priests, give them Hammerhand and Gate them around so they smash everything with their WS3 S7 I3 ID-Sticks and 2++ saves.

Are these dudes the worst units in the game? If not, what is?

Related - is there some awesome-sauce combo you can do with the Priests that I'm missing? Why would you ever take them?

Vespid are pretty bad.
Mutilators but now might have a use.

Are vespid actually bad, or do they just get overshadowed by the rest of the codex and have ugly models to boot?

Bloodbrides are the worst by far
13 ppm for T3 6+ armor, no useful weapons, and a small gimmick where they get a 4+ invul in melee.
The next closedt contender is Wyches, which are the same but with 1 less attack and Ld, and are 3 ppm cheaper

It's the Tactical squad.
The master of none.

 Bookwrack wrote:
Are vespid actually bad, or do they just get overshadowed by the rest of the codex and have ugly models to boot?

They're worse in every possible way than Crisis suits, which is the reason nobody uses them. As for bad in the abstract the game has grown up around them and they haven't kept up; they're horrendously expensive (18pts/model), one shot each from BS3 models means they take a silly number of Markerlights to make relevant (even if that shot is S5/AP3), they're Jump rather than Jet Pack so with their short range they've got to leave their T4/4+ asses hanging out to do anything, and they've got Ld6 so they run away at the drop of a hat.

I'd like to nominate Ogryn; they're more expensive than a Terminator, they've got awful transports, they take half as much firepower to drop, and they don't have a tenth the damage output.

 wuestenfux wrote:
It's the Tactical squad.
The master of none.

They'll butcher Electropriests all day long though. Even Taccies aren't as bad as these skirt-wearing failures.


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 AnomanderRake wrote:
I'd like to nominate Ogryn; they're more expensive than a Terminator, they've got awful transports, they take half as much firepower to drop, and they don't have a tenth the damage output.

I always forget about Ogryns. For obvious reasons.

Even at that I'd still take them ahead of the Electropriests. They can at least take a bit of punishment.

 BBAP wrote:
Has to be the AdMech Electropriests, right? Both flavours. T3 dudes with HoW and sticks and little hula hoop hands that fire AP- bolt pistols. What is the point of these dudes?

I know, I know - stick a GK Librarian in a full squad of Stick-Priests, give them Hammerhand and Gate them around so they smash everything with their WS3 S7 I3 ID-Sticks and 2++ saves.

Are these dudes the worst units in the game? If not, what is?

Related - is there some awesome-sauce combo you can do with the Priests that I'm missing? Why would you ever take them?

Bolt Pistol? 12" Assault 2 Twin linked is bolt pistol? Regardless, they tend to do okay due to the Cult Mechanicus Canticles, wouldn't consider them the worst as a result.

Also they are WS4, they tend to drown things in high attack amounts.

Are the Jazz-Hands TL? I must've missed that, although it's still not great. I assumed bumping up the Canticle count was their only purpose if I'm honest, and their grotesque points cost was to set a soft limit on how much you could get without a WarCon.

Is using your Canticles to power the Jazz-Hands/ Poke-Sticks a good idea if the rest of your army is Kataphrons and Kastelans? Surely that just wastes a Canticle and makes them suck harder?

EDIT: WS4 BS3 for the stick-dudes, the Jazz Hands dudes are WS3 BS4. They're both I3 though; gonna struggle to drown stuff like GSC before they can drown you, I think.

there must be **something** I'm missing here.

 BBAP wrote:
Automatically Appended Next Post:

 AnomanderRake wrote:
I'd like to nominate Ogryn; they're more expensive than a Terminator, they've got awful transports, they take half as much firepower to drop, and they don't have a tenth the damage output.

I always forget about Ogryns. For obvious reasons.

Even at that I'd still take them ahead of the Electropriests. They can at least take a bit of punishment.

Pfft. Bet you Electropriests can take more bolters hits point for point than Ogryns can. (Not really, but closer than you'd think. 7.5 bolter hits to kill 40pts of Electropriests (averaging, I know that isn't a whole number of electropriests) versus 9 hits to kill 40pts of Ogryns.)

(Also 2 S5/AP4/ID on a 6 attacks per 18pt model on the Fulgrites makes them hit quite a bit harder too.)

(Electropriests are so expensive because of the potential of MSU-spam on the Canticles more so than raw capability. Also in raw capability they're still superior to Ogryn.)

 BBAP wrote:
Are the Jazz-Hands TL? I must've missed that, although it's still not great. I assumed bumping up the Canticle count was their only purpose if I'm honest, and their grotesque points cost was to set a soft limit on how much you could get without a WarCon.

Is using your Canticles to power the Jazz-Hands/ Poke-Sticks a good idea if the rest of your army is Kataphrons and Kastelans? Surely that just wastes a Canticle and makes them suck harder?

Depends on what you are doing that turn really, I can't really recommend it myself as I don't play the army personally but I've seen someone use them to a decent enough consistency.

I just wouldn't classify them as the worst unit ingame, they aren't exactly bad but I wouldn't call them good either. For note to your edit I've never actually seen GSC used personally, so they may just be straight up terrible against them.

 AnomanderRake wrote:
Electropriests are so expensive because of the potential of MSU-spam on the Canticles more so than raw capability.

I thought it was that. I just can't see any other reason for them to cost that much. They're dreadful units.

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:
I just wouldn't classify them as the worst unit ingame, they aren't exactly bad but I wouldn't call them good either. For note to your edit I've never actually seen GSC used personally, so they may just be straight up terrible against them.

It might be that, to be honest - I'm maybe comparing them to stuff from the GSC book, which is a bit unfair.

Does your buddy use the Jazz-Priest formation or is it just individual units?

Anyone care to nominate Flash Gitz? 22ppm, you get zero upgrade options, a 4+ Nob base, with a crappy gun that has to sit still if you even want to hit anything. They don't even synergize with anything or anyone. I'm not sure I've ever seen these guys on the board.

 BBAP wrote:

 AnomanderRake wrote:
Electropriests are so expensive because of the potential of MSU-spam on the Canticles more so than raw capability.

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:
I just wouldn't classify them as the worst unit ingame, they aren't exactly bad but I wouldn't call them good either. For note to your edit I've never actually seen GSC used personally, so they may just be straight up terrible against them.

It might be that, to be honest - I'm maybe comparing them to stuff from the GSC book, which is a bit unfair.

Does your buddy use the Jazz-Priest formation or is it just individual units?

Individual units, he's never taken more then two max. Even he saw that having 4+ units entirely of priests aint worth it. He's tried quite a few things with it, from running 20 strong to MSU, I can't exactly remember what worked and what didn't, it's been a while at this point

Waaaghpower wrote:
Anyone care to nominate Flash Gitz? 22ppm, you get zero upgrade options, a 4+ Nob base, with a crappy gun that has to sit still if you even want to hit anything. They don't even synergize with anything or anyone. I'm not sure I've ever seen these guys on the board.

I've never seen anyone use Flash Gitz ever, or even heard of them being fielded even in friendly games. I don't even know anything about them aside from the fact Ork players hate them.

We may have a winner here...

Flash Gitz make sense in their formation, but it has the misfortune of labeling everything as Master Crafted instead of TL. For practicality purposes it is the worst formation in the game despite being one that covers the weakness of a unit.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
Flash Gitz make sense in their formation, but it has the misfortune of labeling everything as Master Crafted instead of TL. For practicality purposes it is the worst formation in the game despite being one that covers the weakness of a unit.

I dunno about worst formation in the game. DEldar have the Kabalite Raiding party which has a ton of tax units for a tiny bonus

I can confirm that vespid are bad, not overshadowed. They're willingness to run, they're inability to shoot well without support, the fact they can't JSJ and are easy to kill, all just make them crap. At 18 points a model they're worthless. a 12 man maxed out squad of vespid is 216 points for 12 shots at bs 3. 6 will hit the marines, 3 will wound, and then they'll maybe get cover.

Compare this to plasma crisis suits. You can get 4 of them with two plasma rifles for 208 points. they can jump shoot jump, have leadership 8, 3+ armor, 24 inch range and rapid fire. For less points, I have 8 shots at 24 inches and 16 at 12 inches. Of those shots 8 will hit, 7~ will wound. Also, and here's the kicker, they're AP 2, not ap 3. This squad reliably brings down dreadknights, the vespid cost more and can barely force a morale check on a 10 man tac squad if they're lucky.

A squad of breachers will do the job better than vespid too and for less points, whilst not taking up a fast attack slot. Vespid are bad, and not needed. The models are expensive too and look bad. Put all this together, and you've a bad case of crappy model syndrome.

Flash gitz are worse than you think, they get an unupgradeable 6+ save. That said, my money is on the tyranid maleceptor

Flash gitz are not as bad as you'd think they're worse cause they have a trukk option. They can occasionally hurt something with their snazzguns and than finish off in melee with a bunch of s5 attacks cause they're still orks. Not saying they're good, just not completely worthless thanks to trukks.

Possessed are really bad but got some good buffs with the new traitor legions. And even before that i had some limited success with daemonkin possessed (have to take a tax squad for the decurion) due to them having daemon of khorne rule there and some free buffs from formation like fnp or extra attacks.

I run Flash Gitz a fair amount of the time and they do work for me. They rely on the Battlewagon to be protected but their firepower is a MEQ melter. Ive seen entire marine squads melt to a single round of shooting from them and they are decently durable to vehicle explosions due to being 2 wound models. But like much of the Ork codex whoever wrote it have no idea what they where doing and removed their 4+ armor and gave each of them a bosspole because reasons?

The Flash Gitz formation would be good but the logistics of rolling 20 assault 3 master crafted weapons is a nightmare to do properly and I'm almost willing to bet money nobody at GW even play tested it.

shortymcnostrill wrote:
Flash gitz are worse than you think, they get an unupgradeable 6+ save. That said, my money is on the tyranid maleceptor

I was about to question how neither Thousand Sons, Defilers nor Warp Talons had recieved a mention yet but I think we've found a winner here with the maleceptor. That thing is absolutely terrible. Even a pyrovore has a place coming out of a tyrannocyte, albeit a very nice one that's not really needed in a 'Nid army, but the maleceptor IIRC is about as likely to do a wound to itself as it is to the enemy all the while sucking up precious warp charge that you could be casting catalyst or paroxysm with. Yeah, maleceptor hands down, even over flash gits.

The FW kroot options sold so little that they went OOP. And they were pretty bad.

But I think those flamey Tyranids things get the prize. Pyrovores!

Mutilators.
CC specialists without any special rules to help them in CC, SnP, have to change their weapons every turn. Possessed and Warp Talons might be overcosted but at least they aren't that bad in the one job they are supposed to do.

Nobody on GW even played the actual ork codex in general. Is the only explanation to such absurd codex full of random stuff, overcosted units.
No mention the lack of elemental wargear for HQ: no invulnerable save option for only cc characters. Also not even a 3+ option. And the 2+ option still lacks of invulnerable and obey you to carry a power claw... so is not strange that any melee HQ from the game kill you first xDD

And lack of basic weapon choices among the army (like true decent antitank range weapons like melta or lasscanons). And specialist units usually have 6+ with l7.

Also lot of overcosted units as well vehicles (maybe the only more or less not overcosted is the trukk)



So yeah, choose any ork unit but the tankbustas and the mekk cannons and there you have the worst unit in the game xDD



From csm, the mutilators and the possesed are strong candidates too. The warp talons and their lack of assault grenades are interesting too hahaha

Sgt. Cortez wrote:
Mutilators.
CC specialists without any special rules to help them in CC, SnP, have to change their weapons every turn. Possessed and Warp Talons might be overcosted but at least they aren't that bad in the one job they are supposed to do.

i've had success with solo mutilators. They're in no way amazing but can be used as deepstrikers to disrupt the enemy backfield and create threat buffers. Funnily enough, in my 6 mutilator, 4 obliterator list, muties did better than obliterators. In all 4 games that i ran them. 3 games were a win, 4-th was a loss. Not too bad. They do compliment a spawnstar well enough. But i need to say that i used daemon allies for banners to get reduced deepstrike scatters. If they scattered less or were faster - at least not snp, they'd be a decent unit with a place in many lists.

 Vector Strike wrote:
The FW kroot options sold so little that they went OOP. And they were pretty bad.

But I think those flamey Tyranids things get the prize. Pyrovores!

Not sure I agree on the FW Kroot. Knarloc Riders weren't impressive, but the Great Knarloc is a staggeringly cheap MC (51 (!)pts for a 5-Wound T5 MC with Stealth (Forests), though he does have a mandatory pack of 4-8 6pt Kroot following him around, being ablative wounds, and preventing him from running away).

Interesting question. I'm going to throw Kommandos out there as a pretty terrible unit but perhaps not the worst. Elite slot, 10 points each for a slugga boy with Stealth and the ability to take two big shootas, rokkits or a 15 point flamer/power weapon pointless hybrid. Almost certainly worse than even Flash Gitz, if you exclude the huge Snikrot formation.

Ratlings would rate pretty highly on a list of worst units. A handful of BS4 sniper shots on a fragile platform. Wooo. Rough Riders as well for being expensive, slightly faster guardsmen that want to charge, but aren't even particularly good at it. And then they're more or less useless after a single charge.

I remember Kommandos from 4th/5th Edition. Everyone feared and loathed them. Are they bad now?

Rough Riders were always terrible. How did I forget about them?