The Gathering Storm Part III: Rise of the Primarch -- twitch broadcast 3.3.17

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**OgreChubbs**

Chikout wrote:
OK here is what they said about the story in the live stream. Mild spoilers ahead.

Spoiler:

After the end of the first book when the imperium and Eldar, everyone heads back to Macragge for reasons. When they get there the find it under full blown assault by the black legion. Apparently the destruction of the pylons at Cabin has let chaos strike pretty much anywhere they like.
Some grey Knights tip up too, including the new guy.

Anyway the chaos invasion gets as far as the very chamber in which roboute is sleeping. He wakes up somehow, turns the tide on chaos and in no time at all wins the war for Macragge.
After this they need to go to Terra for reasons, but warp travel is a bit tricky. They end having to go through the maelstrom for reasons. They meet Cypher who says he will help them through the maelstrom if they take him to Terra.

there is apparently a lot of stuff about Rob dealing with the changes to the imperium in his absence. Celestial freaks him out a bit because she reminds him of Dad. He apparently also knows Cawl from way back.

Why would gillyman show up to help terra, he didn't bother the first time.

**GoatboyBeta**

Any body else feeling the urge to grab a copy of Tempest or BaC and start swinging?

**ImAGeek**

OgreChubbs wrote:
Chikout wrote:
OK here is what they said about the story in the live stream. Mild spoilers ahead.

Spoiler:

After the end of the first book when the imperium and Eldar, everyone heads back to Macragge for reasons. When they get there the find it under full blown assault by the black legion. Apparently the destruction of the pylons at Cabin has let chaos strike pretty much anywhere they like.
Some grey Knights tip up too, including the new guy.

Anyway the chaos invasion gets as far as the very chamber in which roboute is sleeping. He wakes up somehow, turns the tide on chaos and in no time at all wins the war for Macragge.
After this they need to go to Terra for reasons, but warp travel is a bit tricky. They end having to go through the maelstrom for reasons. They meet Cypher who says he will help them through the maelstrom if they take him to Terra.

there is apparently a lot of stuff about Rob dealing with the changes to the imperium in his absence. Celestial freaks him out a bit because she reminds him of Dad. He apparently also knows Cawl from way back.

Why would gillyman show up to help terra, he didn't bother the first time.

Is there an eye roll emoji?

**OgreChubbs**

ImAGeek wrote:
OgreChubbs wrote:
Chikout wrote:
OK here is what they said about the story in the live stream. Mild spoilers ahead.

Spoiler:

After the end of the first book when the imperium and Eldar, everyone heads back to Macragge for reasons. When they get there the find it under full blown assault by the black legion. Apparently the destruction of the pylons at Cabin has let chaos strike pretty much anywhere they like.
Some grey Knights tip up too, including the new guy.

Anyway the chaos invasion gets as far as the very chamber in which roboute is sleeping. He wakes up somehow, turns the tide on chaos and in no time at all wins the war for Macragge.
After this they need to go to Terra for reasons, but warp travel is a bit tricky. They end having to go through the maelstrom for reasons. They meet Cypher who says he will help them through the maelstrom if they take him to Terra.

there is apparently a lot of stuff about Rob dealing with the changes to the imperium in his absence. Celestial freaks him out a bit because she reminds him of Dad. He apparently also knows Cawl from way back.

Why would gillyman show up to help terra, he didn't bother the first time.

Is there an eye roll emoji?

I wish.... I wish he is the only and I mean only primarch I actually hate. Selfish ignorant self cannonizing. Didn't help save the Galaxy but made the rules when it was saved. God I hate him and his coward swarm legions.

I may be wrong in this but, I thought there was no new gene seeds being made so how did the ultramarine become like 2/3 the overall marines? Everyone else is trying to keep it pure and maintain what they got (which this may be from a older edition but) I remember them saying there is no gene seeds being made so any that is lost is tragic event. that's why the apoth gather them so feverly and if it is lost that's 1 less marine.

**ImAGeek**

Have you actually read the books?

**Skylifter1000**

OgreChubbs wrote:
ImAGeek wrote:
OgreChubbs wrote:
Chikout wrote:
OK here is what they said about the story in the live stream. Mild spoilers ahead.

Spoiler:

After the end of the first book when the imperium and Eldar, everyone heads back to Macragge for reasons. When they get there the find it under full blown assault by the black legion. Apparently the destruction of the pylons at Cabin has let chaos strike pretty much anywhere they like.
Some grey Knights tip up too, including the new guy.

Anyway the chaos invasion gets as far as the very chamber in which roboute is sleeping. He wakes up somehow, turns the tide on chaos and in no time at all wins the war for Macragge.
After this they need to go to Terra for reasons, but warp travel is a bit tricky. They end having to go through the maelstrom for reasons. They meet Cypher who says he will help them through the maelstrom if they take him to Terra.

there is apparently a lot of stuff about Rob dealing with the changes to the imperium in his absence. Celestial freaks him out a bit because she reminds him of Dad. He apparently also knows Cawl from way back.

Why would gillyman show up to help terra, he didn't bother the first time.

Is there an eye roll emoji?
I wish.... I wish he is the only and I mean only primarch I actually hate. Selfish ignorant self cannonizing. Didn't help save the Galaxy but made the rules when it was saved. God I hate him and his coward swarm legions.

Maybe you could stop hating him if you accepted some of the stories about him which show him as a benevolent tactically minded master of warcraft. Most stories about him actually do that.

Hating is not good for yourself, and in the end, it is a fictional universe. I get being passionate about it, I sometimes am, too, but if it hurts you so much, maybe you should try being a tad less passionate.

**OgreChubbs**

Skylifter1000 wrote:
OgreChubbs wrote:
ImAGeek wrote:
OgreChubbs wrote:
Chikout wrote:
OK here is what they said about the story in the live stream. Mild spoilers ahead.

Spoiler:

After the end of the first book when the imperium and Eldar, everyone heads back to Macragge for reasons. When they get there the find it under full blown assault by the black legion. Apparently the destruction of the pylons at Cabin has let chaos strike pretty much anywhere they like.
Some grey Knights tip up too, including the new guy.

Anyway the chaos invasion gets as far as the very chamber in which roboute is sleeping. He wakes up somehow, turns the tide on chaos and in no time at all wins the war for Macragge.
After this they need to go to Terra for reasons, but warp travel is a bit tricky. They end having to go through the maelstrom for reasons. They meet Cypher who says he will help them through the maelstrom if they take him to Terra.

there is apparently a lot of stuff about Rob dealing with the changes to the imperium in his absence. Celestial freaks him out a bit because she reminds him of Dad. He apparently also knows Cawl from way back.

Why would gillyman show up to help terra, he didn't bother the first time.

Is there an eye roll emoji?
I wish.... I wish he is the only and I mean only primarch I actually hate. Selfish ignorant self cannonizing. Didn't help save the Galaxy but made the rules when it was saved. God I hate him and his coward swarm legions.

Maybe you could stop hating him if you accepted some of the stories about him which show him as a benevolent tactically minded master of warcraft. Most stories about him actually do that.

Hating is not good for yourself, and in the end, it is a fictional universe. I get being passionate about it, I sometimes am, too, but if it hurts you so much, maybe you should try being a tad less passionate.

It doesn't hurt me to hate him I just hate him lol. Then my Scottish blood kicks in and people needs to see why I hate him. But at the end of the day I could care less if he not a demon primarch or dorn he is usless to me........ Poor dorm the Galaxy should of been yours my friend.

Btw less other primarchs more dorn hell they are doubling up on primarchs and I still don't have dorn.

**casvalremdeikun**

OgreChubbs wrote:

Btw less other primarchs more dorn hell they are doubling up on primarchs and I still don't have dorn.

That is, by far, the most irritating part of GW releasing Rowboat first. Dorn and the Lion don't already have FW models.

**ImAGeek**

casvalremdeikun wrote:
OgreChubbs wrote:

Btw less other primarchs more dorn hell they are doubling up on primarchs and I still don't have dorn.
That is, by far, the most irritating part of GW releasing Rowboat first. Dorn and the Lion don't already have FW models.

It's a completely separate thing though. And judging by Guilliman, the GW models would look really out of place in 30k.

**LightKing**

People say Roboute is a genius

what are exactly his skills in that makes him a genius?

**Asherian Command**

Wow so much hate for Robute lol.

**Slayer-Fan123**

OgreChubbs wrote:
ImAGeek wrote:
OgreChubbs wrote:
Chikout wrote:
OK here is what they said about the story in the live stream. Mild spoilers ahead.

Spoiler:

After the end of the first book when the imperium and Eldar, everyone heads back to Macragge for reasons. When they get there the find it under full blown assault by the black legion. Apparently the destruction of the pylons at Cabin has let chaos strike pretty much anywhere they like.
Some grey Knights tip up too, including the new guy.

Anyway the chaos invasion gets as far as the very chamber in which roboute is sleeping. He wakes up somehow, turns the tide on chaos and in no time at all wins the war for Macragge.
After this they need to go to Terra for reasons, but warp travel is a bit tricky. They end having to go through the maelstrom for reasons. They meet Cypher who says he will help them through the maelstrom if they take him to Terra.

there is apparently a lot of stuff about Rob dealing with the changes to the imperium in his absence. Celestial freaks him out a bit because she reminds him of Dad. He apparently also knows Cawl from way back.

Why would gillyman show up to help terra, he didn't bother the first time.

Is there an eye roll emoji?
I wish.... I wish he is the only and I mean only primarch I actually hate. Selfish ignorant self cannonizing. Didn't help save the Galaxy but made the rules when it was saved. God I hate him and his coward swarm legions.

I may be wrong in this but, I thought there was no new gene seeds being made so how did the ultramarine become like 2/3 the overall marines? Everyone else is trying to keep it pure and maintain what they got (which this may be from a older edition but) I remember them saying there is no gene seeds being made so any that is lost is tragic event. that's why the apoth gather them so feverly and if it is lost that's 1 less marine.

Once again you're showing ignorance of the fluff just to flag your hate for the Ultramarines because they get more attention than other special snowflake chapters that nobody cares about.

As one with Scottish blood as well that's an insult to use that as an excuse, regarding another post you made.

**ImAGeek**

LightKing wrote:
People say Roboute is a genius

what are exactly his skills in that makes him a genius?

Tactical brilliance, logistics second to none, and contrary to popular belief he did a lot of work keeping the Imperium together after the Heresy. He gets a lot of hate for not much reason; a lot from people who obviously haven't actually read any of the books about him. All the Primarchs except the more damaged ones were geniuses.

**Bobthehero**

Perhaps he gets the hate for having seemingly no character flaws.

**Alpharius**

And remember, the Ultramarines were, I think, by far the largest Legion in 30K and the Traitors worked hard at destroying/limiting/delaying them from the get go - including working to make sure they couldn't get to Terra 'in time'.

The Ultras - and Guilliman - were a HUGE threat and Chaos attempted to take him off the board from the start.

He's back now - so here we go!

**Promethius**

Bobthehero wrote:
Perhaps he gets the hate for having seemingly no character flaws.

Him and his chapter, every character of which is the bestest at what they do, librarian, chapter master etc. It's like a whole faction of Wesley crushers. Ferrus manus has flaws, which makes him interesting.

**Mad Doc Grotsnik**

LightKing wrote:
People say Roboute is a genius

what are exactly his skills in that makes him a genius?

Have you seen the 500 Worlds of Macragge? He managed to get things arranged, pre-reunification to be pretty much the Emperor's ideal for humanity.

Betrayal at Calth? Caught completely with his pants down, struck from a corner he couldn't possibly have predicated at the time - still wiped the floor with his foe as soon as he got a bit of organisation going.

As for the other poster, and Guilliman 'not bothering' to turn up? Someone needs to read up on the Ruinstorm. What it was. Why it was. Here's a hint - the best way to stop the Ultramarine Legion deploying in strength.

Second Founding? A calculated risk. Arguably weaken the whole (no real overall commander for the most part), but preventing betrayal on the scale of the Heresy from ever happening again.

Seriously. Read the sodding background!

**SeanDrake**

Magnus was less of a traitor than Girlyman. In fact until they retcon even more of it the only time girlyman and the UM nearly start a fight is against Dorn,Russ and Vulkan.

Turned Traitor and founded his own imperium at earliest opportunity after Horus rebels - Check

Tried talking other loyalists from heading to Terra - check

Did not turn up to Terra until after battle was finished - check

Threw a hissy fit when Russ called him out for hiding and then demanded the break up of all other legions all most causing another civil war - check

ensured that when his legion was broken up that they were all still subservient to Ultra's and as close to macrage as possible - check

Made sure he was named as a permanent member of the high lords of terra - check

Ensured that most new chapters founded were from UM geneseed - check

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
LightKing wrote:
People say Roboute is a genius

what are exactly his skills in that makes him a genius?

Have you seen the 500 Worlds of Macragge? He managed to get things arranged, pre-reunification to be pretty much the Emperor's ideal for humanity.

Betrayal at Calth? Caught completely with his pants down, struck from a corner he couldn't possibly have predicated at the time - still wiped the floor with his foe as soon as he got a bit of organisation going.

As for the other poster, and Guilliman 'not bothering' to turn up? Someone needs to read up on the Ruinstorm. What it was. Why it was. Here's a hint - the best way to stop the Ultramarine Legion deploying in strength.

Second Founding? A calculated risk. Arguably weaken the whole (no real overall commander for the most part), but preventing betrayal on the scale of the Heresy from ever happening again.

Seriously. Read the sodding background!

I did 2 decades ago sadly since then Girlyman has been getting crowbarred in evermore

**SarisKhan**

Hmm, Roboute's apparently gonna fight the Black Legion. Any chance we get some Abaddon vs. Guilliman action? That could be quite interesting.

**Mr Morden**

As far as I was aware there was always more suspicion about the Lion than RG.

The HH novels have done little to dispel this - if anything the opposite.

**angelofvengeance**

SarisKhan wrote:
Hmm, Roboute's apparently gonna fight the Black Legion. Any chance we get some Abaddon vs. Guilliman action? That could be quite interesting.

Considering Abaddon would be fighting a Primarch, I very much doubt that would end well for him. Daemon weapon or no. Plus we've yet to see how Abaddon does post injury. Sure, he's Astartes but it was hardly a flesh wound he took there lol.

**TheDraconicLord**

Mr Morden wrote:
As far as I was aware there was always more suspicion about the Lion than RG.

The HH novels have done little to dispel this - if anything the opposite.

'Angels of Darkness" by Gav Thorpe really shows how much of a potential heretic the Lion could have been.

**Asherian Command**

Bobthehero wrote:
Perhaps he gets the hate for having seemingly no character flaws.

He lacks a creative spark, he improves things, and all that, but he never comes p with things.

**ImAGeek**

Bobthehero wrote:
Perhaps he gets the hate for having seemingly no character flaws.

He does if you actually read the books he's in rather than just subscribing to the whole 'spiritual leige' bullcrap on the internet.

**SarisKhan**

angelofvengeance wrote:
SarisKhan wrote:
Hmm, Roboute's apparently gonna fight the Black Legion. Any chance we get some Abaddon vs. Guilliman action? That could be quite interesting.

Considering Abaddon would be fighting a Primarch, I very much doubt that would end well for him. Daemon weapon or no. Plus we've yet to see how Abaddon does post injury. Sure, he's Astartes but it was hardly a flesh wound he took there lol.

Well, Abaddon is a veteran Terminator with a Primarch-grade weapon, a Daemon sword and the combined favour of 4 Chaos Gods. Though you're right that wound could prove... inconvenient in a potential confrontation.

Anyway, I'm pretty hyped about all this stuff. Just keeping my standards at a medium setting and enjoying the story for what it is.

**GoatboyBeta**

Bobthehero wrote:
Perhaps he gets the hate for having seemingly no character flaws.

Thing is all his flaws like the rest of his character are rather "normal" for a Primarch. He's not a vampire angel/viking wolfman/super powered Rosarch/religious nutter/blood crazed Sparticus/paranoid maybe traitor/secret twin/easily led one eyed super psyker ect

**Crimson**

LightKing wrote:
People say Roboute is a genius

what are exactly his skills in that makes him a genius?

SeanDrake wrote:
Magnus was less of a traitor than Girlyman. In fact until they retcon even more of it the only time girlyman and the UM nearly start a fight is against Dorn,Russ and Vulkan.

Turned Traitor and founded his own imperium at earliest opportunity after Horus rebels - Check

Tried talking other loyalists from heading to Terra - check

Did not turn up to Terra until after battle was finished - check

Threw a hissy fit when Russ called him out for hiding and then demanded the break up of all other legions all most causing another civil war - check

ensured that when his legion was broken up that they were all still subservient to Ultra's and as close to macrage as possible - check

Made sure he was named as a permanent member of the high lords of terra - check

Ensured that most new chapters founded were from UM geneseed - check

See, he obviously was a genius. Would make a perfect villian in fact. Too bad there's no way GW will go in that direction with the plot.

**Bobthehero**

ImAGeek wrote:
Bobthehero wrote:
Perhaps he gets the hate for having seemingly no character flaws.

He does if you actually read the books he's in rather than just subscribing to the whole 'spiritual leige' bullcrap on the internet.

What are they then? So far you've done nothing being reinforce the idea he's worthy of the Spiritual Liege mockery.

**ImAGeek**

Bobthehero wrote:
ImAGeek wrote:
Bobthehero wrote:
Perhaps he gets the hate for having seemingly no character flaws.

He does if you actually read the books he's in rather than just subscribing to the whole 'spiritual leige' bullcrap on the internet.

What are they then? So far you've done nothing being reinforce the idea he's worthy of the Spiritual Liege mockery.

Not really, I pointed out that all the Primarchs are geniuses. He's no better than the others (mostly, except a few obvious broken examples). He didn't get on well with most of his brothers (the reason why he wasn't in consideration for Warmaster, he had the skills, but not the personality or people skills), he wasn't as creative tactically as some of his brothers, which caused issues with people like Alpharius who's method of war he didn't agree with. He took ideas from his brothers such as the Fulmentarus terminators being based on the Tyrant Siege Terminators, and he created the Moritat idea after being beaten in simulation by Corax multiple times. While he could respond to new tactics used against him, it took a little time as he had a tendency to stick to tried and true methods of war, and his Legion had a very rigid chain of command which led to some problems.

**OgreChubbs**

SeanDrake wrote:
Magnus was less of a traitor than Girlyman. In fact until they retcon even more of it the only time girlyman and the UM nearly start a fight is against Dorn,Russ and Vulkan.

Turned Traitor and founded his own imperium at earliest opportunity after Horus rebels - Check

Tried talking other loyalists from heading to Terra - check

Did not turn up to Terra until after battle was finished - check

Threw a hissy fit when Russ called him out for hiding and then demanded the break up of all other legions all most causing another civil war - check

ensured that when his legion was broken up that they were all still subservient to Ultra's and as close to macrage as possible - check

Made sure he was named as a permanent member of the high lords of terra - check

Ensured that most new chapters founded were from UM geneseed - check

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
LightKing wrote:
People say Roboute is a genius

what are exactly his skills in that makes him a genius?

Have you seen the 500 Worlds of Macragge? He managed to get things arranged, pre-reunification to be pretty much the Emperor's ideal for humanity.

Betrayal at Calth? Caught completely with his pants down, struck from a corner he couldn't possibly have predicated at the time - still wiped the floor with his foe as soon as he got a bit of organisation going.

As for the other poster, and Guilliman 'not bothering' to turn up? Someone needs to read up on the Ruinstorm. What it was. Why it was. Here's a hint - the best way to stop the Ultramarine Legion deploying in strength.

Second Founding? A calculated risk. Arguably weaken the whole (no real overall commander for the most part), but preventing betrayal on the scale of the Heresy from ever happening again.

Seriously. Read the sodding background!

I did 2 decades ago sadly since then Girlyman has been getting crowbarred in evermore

Finally someone else who read the fluff about the near heretic emo coward gillyman. I never seen any fluff of him being anything other then that.