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The IG was never anything more than Militia, I don't know why you think otherwise.

morgoth wrote:
The IG was never anything more than Militia

That's the PDF. The guard is a professional military.

While the doomsaying is currently strong.. I'm just more curious if these new Marines will just be one codex or if this is just going to be some fluff update for every other Space Marine codex.

morgoth wrote:
The IG was never anything more than Militia, I don't know why you think otherwise.

Its just the way he answered the question.



I read this as:

Q: So what are your plans for the future of the imperial guard?
A: Same as always. Meat grinder/just ignoring them.

Then goes on to say how we are getting more space marines because they sell well. Perhaps space marines sell well because they are the only faction that ever get released? Its not enough that Forgeworld has become solely focused on 30k/space marines? Its not enough that centurions are basically space marines inside space marines? Its not enough that despite IG outnumbering space marines in the setting a billion to 1, IG only has 4 heroes left in the codex while space marines have dozens? No. We need MORE SPACE MARINES. Remember that time you released Cannoness Veridyan GW and you were utterly shocked at how well she sold and had to change her status from limited edition to a permanent model?

Maybe its because people are WAITING for something to be released BESIDES SPACE MARINES.

Commissar Benny wrote:

morgoth wrote:
The IG was never anything more than Militia, I don't know why you think otherwise.

Its just the way he answered the question.



I read this as:

Q: So what are your plans for the future of the imperial guard?
A: Same as always. Meat grinder/just ignoring them.

Then goes on to say how we are getting more space marines because they sell well. Perhaps space marines sell well because they are the only faction that ever get released? Its not enough that Forgeworld has become solely focused on 30k/space marines? Its not enough that centurions are basically space marines inside space marines? Its not enough that despite IG outnumbering space marines in the setting a billion to 1, IG only has 4 heroes left in the codex while space marines have dozens? No. We need MORE SPACE MARINES. Remember that time you released Cannoness Veridyan GW and you were utterly shocked at how well she sold and had to change her status from limited edition to a permanent model?

Maybe its because people are WAITING for something to be released BESIDES SPACE MARINES.

I don't know, for an army not many people seem to play, the IG isn't half bad - you have a fuckton of FW stuff too.

I mean, think for a second, about the poor Dark Eldar.

I'm with Commissar Benny on this one. If the IG struggle to sell it's only because we're horribly neglected in our kits. I don't mean to whine but we deserve better than this.

EDIT:

Dark eldar too. Neglected armies of 40k unite.

morgoth wrote:
I don't know, for an army not many people seem to play, the IG isn't half bad - you have a fuckton of FW stuff too.

I mean, think for a second, about the poor Dark Eldar.

Absolutely. What GW has done to the Dark Eldar is appalling. Is it really any surprise they and sisters don't sell well when they essentially get no support from GW? GW's rationale towards sales is a self fulfilling prophecy.

Refuse to update/release models for armies a,b,c,d because they don't sell well.

Maybe they aren't selling well because you aren't updating them and releasing models for those armies?

Its common sense.

As a BA player, I'm saying that they focus way too much on marines.

FYI, common sense is a myth. That's why you are surprised by GW's actions. Their logic is completely different than yours. There is no common sense.

Martel732 wrote:
As a BA player, I'm saying that they focus way too much on marines.

FYI, common sense is a myth. That's why you are surprised by GW's actions. Their logic is completely different than yours. There is no common sense.

As the old saying goes, "Common sense is not common."

They're milking their cash cows because so many new/young gamers come in and see super humans winning battles across the galaxy against the evil aliens. I'd love to see more IG stuff. I started collecting IG models to create a combined CSM/renegades force and thought "I could easily build my own IG army with these models" but have decided to stick with R&H because I think they pack more punch for their cost.
I would love new regiments other than Cadians! Bring back Tallarn, Valhallan, Mordian. Something other than Spaceballs Cadia and Rambo Catachans.

Commissar Benny wrote:

morgoth wrote:
The IG was never anything more than Militia, I don't know why you think otherwise.

Its just the way he answered the question.



I read this as:

Q: So what are your plans for the future of the imperial guard?
A: Same as always. Meat grinder/just ignoring them.

Then goes on to say how we are getting more space marines because they sell well. Perhaps space marines sell well because they are the only faction that ever get released? Its not enough that Forgeworld has become solely focused on 30k/space marines? Its not enough that centurions are basically space marines inside space marines? Its not enough that despite IG outnumbering space marines in the setting a billion to 1, IG only has 4 heroes left in the codex while space marines have dozens? No. We need MORE SPACE MARINES. Remember that time you released Cannoness Veridyan GW and you were utterly shocked at how well she sold and had to change her status from limited edition to a permanent model?

Maybe its because people are WAITING for something to be released BESIDES SPACE MARINES.

Wut?!

Ah well, back to watching mindless children drooling over the next Murene release whilst the rest of the lines wither away and the game slowly stagnates and chokes itself to death.

Yeap... now the xenos are probably next on the withering blocks as well. If we don't sell bazillions in the updates then support will dry up so they can launch Chaos NU-Marines. I'm just kind of shocked really. My IG friend will likely never buy anything again after that news. :(

He is a busy college student, but he was still trying to have hope for an IG update or something. He was almost done the IG stuff eh did have and was looking to expand his army or get a model or two to paint.

I honestly believe that the Imperial Guard will become the new Sisters of Battle. Yes, you 'can' technically still play them but they're never going to receive an update beyond a ebook (if we're lucky) and zero new models.

First they 'squat' the homeworld of the poster boys of the Imperial Guard.
Then they stick Creed as a prisoner of Trollzyn but not kill him 'just in case'.
Not a single Imperial Guard model in Fall of CADIA.
The Triumvirate of the Imperium doesn't feature Imperial Guard.
The next two books don't even mention the Imperial Guard.

I'd like to think I'm just being cynical, but after Age of Sigmar anything is possible.

 master of ordinance wrote:
Wut?!

Ah well, back to watching mindless children drooling over the next Murene release whilst the rest of the lines wither away and the game slowly stagnates and chokes itself to death.

Unfortunately, it won't choke itself to death. Space Marines just sell THAT well. There's just far, far too many Space Marine players that so long as they keep pumping out new variants of power armour they're going to be lapped up. We're going to be seeing even more (loyalist) Space Marine kits all the while people scream "golden age! golden age! gw has returned!11!" even whilst Xenos/Chaos/non-SM players awkwardly eye each other before leaving for other games. As the numbers of non-SM kits drop, GW will shrug their shoulders and only continue to produce Space Marines. Eventually they'll have achieved their wettest of dreams: 30k in the 40k setting, where in the Grimdarkness of the 42nd Millennium there are only Space Marines.

How many non-Sigmarine armies do you see in AoS? They managed to chase away just about every single WHFB player, but over time replaced them with 40k kids by shoving 'LOOK KIDS, BOLTER CROSSBOWS!' in their faces and creating a new generation of "lol fantasy was a dead game. gw are geniuses! if it wasnt selling why are they making so many new stormcast models?!"

Now you know why I hate Space Marine's. The sole exception is the DW because of the RPG, and the blood ravens because memes.

They are a cool concept, but he fanbase is simply... ugh. It's so self destructive to the greater game.

I feel dirty for buying my Deathwatch models as well. Granted I only want a very small kill squad. I feel DW are what space marines should be. Chapters should be training worlds or something, and then every space marine chapter or fighting force is composed of mixed units of space marines taught to work together. They would just be the regular marines in terms of effectiveness and rules, but the whole background would be different. They only gain their legendary fighting prowess when they all work together to share knowledge from the disparate training worlds ect.

Too much of a good thing these days. Even the space marine players in real life are crazy. I ask them if they would be okay if only marines got releases and if that meant all the other factions didn't they would be fine with it. Like 67% of them say this is fine. Which is insane. Why do they want to have fun at other peoples expense?

 Arbitrator wrote:
I think that Imperial Guard will become the new Sisters of Battle. Yes, you 'can' technically still play them but they're never going to receive an update beyond a ebook (if we're lucky) and zero new models.

First they 'squat' the homeworld of the poster boys of the Imperial Guard.
Then they stick Creed as a prisoner of Trollzyn but not kill him 'just in case'.
Not a single Imperial Guard model in Fall of CADIA.
The Triumvirate of the Imperium doesn't feature Imperial Guard.
The next took books don't even mention the Imperial Guard.

I'd like to think I'm just being cynical, but after Age of Sigmar anything is possible.

This is what makes my blood boil. They literally just DESTROYED the homeworld of the iconic IG regiment. Do you really think IG players are going to be compelled to buy a regiment that was turned into Tanith first & only? NO! This will cause a decline in sales. GW will interpret this as "Well I guess people just aren't interested in IG anymore." Cut off support for the line.

NO ARSEHOLES, IG sales are in decline because you have systematically destroyed every regiment that exists in the setting! We only have like 4 heroes left in our entire codex. 4! Space marines have dozens, hell maybe even over a hundred between all chapters...

My regiment hasn't been updated in 15-17 f*cking years. ALMOST 2 DECADES! You cannot expect new players to invest in regiments that cannot be purchased from retail stores, have to be ordered online, are out of production, are not ever highlighted in White Dwarf or 40k events.

If IG does not get a MASSIVE release this year, its over folks. We are getting the SOB treatment. It seems irrational/impossible but we aren't dealing with a rational company here.

Jeez people.

For everyone complaining about Cadia falling, where the hell were you during the original 13th Black Crusade? Same thing happened then. The lore book they published even ended with a plaque of a speech that Creed made encouraging all the surviving Cadians to recruit.

To recruit and to train. Why? Because the Cadian Shock weren't dead. They've settled all over the galaxy, their descendants having founded new homes and continuing their martial traditions.

This isn't new fluff. This is, as mentioned, since the end of the original 13th Black Crusade event. We've even gotten bits of that fluff done now.

Wow, a lot of people are seeing IG as the next SOB. I assumed that the lack of Guard in the Fall of Cadia was more due to GW being lazy and incompetent with their rules writing than a beginning of the end for the army.

 Arbitrator wrote:

How many non-Sigmarine armies do you see in AoS?

A lot?

Tzeentch Arcanites have, since their release, been exceedingly popular.
Sylvaneth--I really don't need to say more than the fact for several weeks it was virtually impossible to get their basic infantry(the Tree-Revenant/Spite-Revenant kit).
Fyreslayers are hit or miss depending on your locality.
Flesh Eater Courts
Beastclaw Raiders(Ogres)
Greenskins of all flavors.
Seraphon
Stormcast and Khorne Bloodbound tend to be the "jumping off point" for new players(shocking! the two armies in the starter sets are things people use for starting?!). Khorne Bloodbound seems to be the one that people actually stick with though, as Stormcast can be visually exhausting to paint.

That's just off the top of my head, based off of my experience locally. When an army gets an actual dedicated book or a "big deal" set, there's a correlating spike of interest and usage.

They managed to chase away just about every single WHFB player, but over time replaced them with 40k kids by shoving 'LOOK KIDS, BOLTER CROSSBOWS!' in their faces and creating a new generation of "lol fantasy was a dead game. gw are geniuses! if it wasnt selling why are they making so many new stormcast models?!"

Oh please. Most of the WHFB players who got "chased away" didn't really play. I know the most vocal opponents of AoS locally also were vocal supporters of Mantic's fantasy game...yet as far as I've been told locally, that's dead in the water. You would see them maybe once in awhile playing WHFB, mostly with whatever new flavor of tournament list had showed up online and then quitting again after it got stomped by something unexpected.

As for your last bit? Most of the people who have two functioning brain cells to rub together know that Stormcast have gotten so many models because they're a brand new faction, with nothing that existed beforehand.

I would definitely voice my support the popularity of Sylvaneth at the time of release.

 Kanluwen wrote:

 Arbitrator wrote:

How many non-Sigmarine armies do you see in AoS?

A lot?

Tzeentch Arcanites have, since their release, been exceedingly popular.
Sylvaneth--I really don't need to say more than the fact for several weeks it was virtually impossible to get their basic infantry(the Tree-Revenant/Spite-Revenant kit).
Fyreslayers are hit or miss depending on your locality.
Flesh Eater Courts
Beastclaw Raiders(Ogres)
Greenskins of all flavors.
Seraphon
Stormcast and Khorne Bloodbound tend to be the "jumping off point" for new players(shocking! the two armies in the starter sets are things people use for starting?!). Khorne Bloodbound seems to be the one that people actually stick with though, as Stormcast can be visually exhausting to paint.

That's just off the top of my head, based off of my experience locally. When an army gets an actual dedicated book or a "big deal" set, there's a correlating spike of interest and usage.

They managed to chase away just about every single WHFB player, but over time replaced them with 40k kids by shoving 'LOOK KIDS, BOLTER CROSSBOWS!' in their faces and creating a new generation of "lol fantasy was a dead game. gw are geniuses! if it wasnt selling why are they making so many new stormcast models?!"

Oh please. Most of the WHFB players who got "chased away" didn't really play. I know the most vocal opponents of AoS locally also were vocal supporters of Mantic's fantasy game...yet as far as I've been told locally, that's dead in the water. You would see them maybe once in awhile playing WHFB, mostly with whatever new flavor of tournament list had showed up online and then quitting again after it got stomped by something unexpected.

As for your last bit? Most of the people who have two functioning brain cells to rub together know that Stormcast have gotten so many models because they're a brand new faction, with nothing that existed beforehand.

Hey now, you can't bring logic and facts into this! But seriously, WHFB was hemorrhaging hard, AoS is a fresh new system now that the kinks are (mostly) ironed out. One can only hope the same rules system or something similar comes to 40k soon.

Commissar Benny wrote:
What does the future hold for IG? Well we just got our answer. Here is what GW thinks of the Imperial Guard:



You read that correctly. We are nothing more than militia. Forget Macharius's crusade which captured 1000 worlds in 7 years. Forget the fact that the imperium wouldn't exist without the Imperial Guard. Forget the fact that the Imperium exists to protect HUMANITY. Are space marines human? No. Is Guilliman human? No. They exist to protect HUMANITY. You know that thing that the Imperial Guard is? F them through right? What we need is MORE MARINES!!!



GW you want to know why space marines are your best selling army? BECAUSE 99% OF YOUR RELEASES ARE SPACE MARINES...

I seriously just need to walk away from this hobby for a few years. This sh*t isn't healthy.

Question:
Where did this conversation come from and how do we know they are GW employees with any kind of game designing clout?

Commissar Benny wrote:
Maybe its because people are WAITING for something to be released BESIDES SPACE MARINES.

From your lips... Anyhow, I completely agree that GW needs to release more, better Eldar (and Tau) stuff! More stuff like the Wraithknight, for example. Good model.

Commissar Benny wrote:
If IG does not get a MASSIVE release this year, its over folks. We are getting the SOB treatment. It seems irrational/impossible but we aren't dealing with a rational company here.

LOL, riiight.

IG don't need a massive release. They just need a new Codex, which this thread is already wishlisting like crazy.

Aside from the overemphasis on "fixing" units (i.e. RRs, Ogryns, Storms) that don't matter and nobody should really be taking.

But it's not like GW reads the ranting here. It's not like this is a Space Marines / Eldar / Tau thread.

Commissar Benny wrote:

 Arbitrator wrote:
I think that Imperial Guard will become the new Sisters of Battle. Yes, you 'can' technically still play them but they're never going to receive an update beyond a ebook (if we're lucky) and zero new models.

First they 'squat' the homeworld of the poster boys of the Imperial Guard.
Then they stick Creed as a prisoner of Trollzyn but not kill him 'just in case'.
Not a single Imperial Guard model in Fall of CADIA.
The Triumvirate of the Imperium doesn't feature Imperial Guard.
The next took books don't even mention the Imperial Guard.

I'd like to think I'm just being cynical, but after Age of Sigmar anything is possible.

This is what makes my blood boil. They literally just DESTROYED the homeworld of the iconic IG regiment. Do you really think IG players are going to be compelled to buy a regiment that was turned into Tanith first & only? NO! This will cause a decline in sales. GW will interpret this as "Well I guess people just aren't interested in IG anymore." Cut off support for the line.

NO ARSEHOLES, IG sales are in decline because you have systematically destroyed every regiment that exists in the setting! We only have like 4 heroes left in our entire codex. 4! Space marines have dozens, hell maybe even over a hundred between all chapters...

My regiment hasn't been updated in 15-17 f*cking years. ALMOST 2 DECADES! You cannot expect new players to invest in regiments that cannot be purchased from retail stores, have to be ordered online, are out of production, are not ever highlighted in White Dwarf or 40k events.

If IG does not get a MASSIVE release this year, its over folks. We are getting the SOB treatment. It seems irrational/impossible but we aren't dealing with a rational company here.

Have an exalt. As an IG player I frequently get stick at my club for proxying, but I really cannot see any real reason to purchase yet more infantry as well as overpriced vehicles when they A) perform so underwhelmingly and B) my entire army is basically being shafted from 40K.

 master of ordinance wrote:
I really cannot see any real reason to purchase yet more infantry as well as overpriced vehicles

I think most IG players are at/near that point. Recall that GW respun Made to Order IG metal not that long ago, so everybody should be flush with IG infantry. And any longer-term IG player should already have enough vehicles. Some of us, far more than necessary.

OTOH, Knights are a great choice as Allies, and IKR made them fairly affordable. I actually added one to my collection, and he was not especially overpriced.

 JohnHwangDD wrote:
Aside from the overemphasis on "fixing" units (i.e. RRs, Ogryns, Storms) that don't matter and nobody should really be taking.

Why shouldn't anyone be taking them?

 JohnHwangDD wrote:

 master of ordinance wrote:
I really cannot see any real reason to purchase yet more infantry as well as overpriced vehicles

I think most IG players are at/near that point. Recall that GW respun Made to Order IG metal not that long ago, so everybody should be flush with IG infantry. And any longer-term IG player should already have enough vehicles. Some of us, far more than necessary.

OTOH, Knights are a great choice as Allies, and IKR made them fairly affordable. I actually added one to my collection, and he was not especially overpriced.

I have 50 Veterans, two Chimeras and a pair of Sentinels supporting a Stormsword, with a Company Command Squad, three Rapiers and some other bits (Rough Riders, Ogryns, etc). At least that is my GW official model count. I tend to proxy when I can these days. Ironically it is only now as I finally have a means to really start building my army up that I have just about given up on ever taking it anywhere, given the heinous pricing of the models with the laughably bad codex.

CplPunishment wrote:
Question:Where did this conversation come from and how do we know they are GW employees with any kind of game designing clout?

Conversation can be found here:

https://war-of-sigmar.herokuapp.com/bloggings/1777#disqus_thread

Conversations with 75hastings69 & Lady Atia etc. They are essentially prophets within our community. They know whats going on behind the scenes. If something was coming down the line for guard they would know. Their prediction accuracy can be found here:

https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/448304.page

They mention how Orks will be getting a new buggy for example. If something was planned for guard, they would have mentioned it.

 Future War Cultist wrote:

 JohnHwangDD wrote:
Aside from the overemphasis on "fixing" units (i.e. RRs, Ogryns, Storms) that don't matter and nobody should really be taking.

Why shouldn't anyone be taking them?

They're not really IG per se - they're adjuncts / auxiliaries.

They are the freshly ground pepper on your salad, and I'm saying people should focus on the salad, not the pepper. If those auxliiaries become the focus of the army, that's probably not the sort of army we should be concentrating on when we have much more important things to focus on.

____

 master of ordinance wrote:

 JohnHwangDD wrote:
I think most IG players are at/near that point. Recall that GW respun Made to Order IG metal not that long ago, so everybody should be flush with IG infantry. And any longer-term IG player should already have enough vehicles. Some of us, far more than necessary.

OTOH, Knights are a great choice as Allies, and IKR made them fairly affordable. I actually added one to my collection, and he was not especially overpriced.

I have 50 Veterans, two Chimeras and a pair of Sentinels supporting a Stormsword, with a Company Command Squad, three Rapiers and some other bits (Rough Riders, Ogryns, etc). At least that is my GW official model count. I tend to proxy when I can these days. Ironically it is only now as I finally have a means to really start building my army up that I have just about given up on ever taking it anywhere, given the heinous pricing of the models with the laughably bad codex.

That's a nice little army. Right now, I kinda wish I had stopped at that point. That would have saved me quite a fair bit of coin.

I stopped because of lack of funds and then failed to start again because of a lack of faith in GW.
Proxying will do for me for now, until GW book their ideas up (or just squat/Sisters us entirely in which case I have lost nothing)

 JohnHwangDD wrote:
They're not really IG per se - they're adjuncts / auxiliaries.

They are the freshly ground pepper on your salad, and I'm saying people should focus on the salad, not the pepper. If those auxliiaries become the focus of the army, that's probably not the sort of army we should be concentrating on when we have much more important things to focus on.

I've never touched a salad in my life.

I know what you mean, but these units are still a part of the IG. They wouldn't be in the codex otherwise. Yes, the main focus should be on the regular human infantry and the tanks but these units deserve recognition too. The only reason I don't take Ogyrns and/or Ratlings is because they're not currently effective for their cost. I am dead set against removing this units or reducing their roles.

Sure they would be in the codex. Guard get the copy/paste job and then it gets called quits.

This isn't anything new.