Games Workshop - Shadow War Armageddon-cranes and new terrain pg 135

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**streetsamurai**

Starfarer wrote:
H.B.M.C. wrote:
Starfarer wrote:
Anyway, I'm not going to retype all that, but the GSC list has more options than come in their kit. There's no reason to assume Inquisition won't have more options than their current models.

Yeah, notice I was talking about this guy in their Codex, and how GW - in general, across all their games - are very much about only allowing the options that appear in the kits.

Again, Starfarer, the context was how this would compare to Inquisimunder, and how the above-mentioned behaviour of GW's makes the type of customisation Inquisimunder players are used to unlikely, and that it is far more likely that the only options available to Inquisitor kill teams will be those weapons modeled precisely on the miniatures because they do not have a plastic kit. It's amazing that I have to explain such a simple conversation between two people. Mr Kingsley completely understood what I was getting at. It appears that Fafnir knew what we were talking about as well. If you were perhaps more interested in reading what people wrote rather than trying to score cheap "You're just complaining again LOLZ!" points then you would have picked up on that.

Also, if we must talk about the Shadow War rules even though that wasn't the example I was using:

"... the GSC list has more options than come in their kit..."

Which options are available to them that aren't part of their kits? Genuine question, 'cause right now I see nothing but things on their kits.

They can take lasguns and laspistols, neither of which are in the Neophyte kit.

**Lockark**

GodDamUser wrote:
Lockark wrote:
Just got back from the hospital from heat stroke ironically.

But your Canadian.. you shouldn't even know what heat is

Clearly I'm not use to it.

**Starfarer**

GodDamUser wrote:
Starfarer wrote:

They can take lasguns and laspistols, neither of which are in the Neophyte kit.

Not in the miner kit sure..

But they are in the Other Neophyte kit

Ah, I forgot they did the box of cadians as genestealer cultists. I only have the standard Neophyte kits, so those don't have Las weapons in them.

**streetsamurai**

Am I missing something or are Tau drones able to gain experience and new skills?

**GodDamUser**

streetsamurai wrote:
Am I missing something or are Tau drones able to gain experience and new skills?

Edit...

Actually it just has trooper..

So yeah they can....

**H.B.M.C.**

It just says 'Drone' rather than "Trooper' there, so can they>

If they can a friend of mine will love that.

Starfarer wrote:
They can take lasguns and laspistols, neither of which are in the Neophyte kit.

I even put links to the kit with the Lasguns in my post. C'mon man...

**GodDamUser**

H.B.M.C. wrote:
It just says 'Drone' rather than "Trooper' there, so can they>

If they can a friend of mine will love that.

There it is..

So no

As they don't have a Experience Tree..

what I originally said.. but then couldn't see trooper on the regular guys =D

**H.B.M.C.**

Damned shame. Would'a been fun for a Drone to get Hurl Opponent, or Gunfighter.

**BrookM**

I'm already surprised Drones can somehow pack a knife.

**ImAGeek**

BrookM wrote:
I'm already surprised Drones can somehow pack a knife.

Yeah haha. Maybe the edge of the dome bit has been sharpened.

**BrookM**

Forge World is building another diorama for WHW, looks like they're eager to show off what can be done with the new terrain kits:

**rmeister0**

Starfarer wrote:

This is the type of game the people who've been around since second edition have been dreaming of for at least a decade, and here you are complaining that the free rules might not have all the weapon options it could. This is of course ignoring that you can just use other weapons as you like. You dont need GW to hold your hand, you can take an autogun on your acolyte if you want, even if the rules dont say so. Cant imagine anyone who would dispute that is worth playing a campaign with.

This is exactly the game I've wanted since second edition became third edition.

Having read through the rule book this weekend and having played plenty of Necromunda back in the day, adapting the existing gangs (from the core, not Outlanders) is not difficult at all. Heck, I wrote up an Eldar and Tyranid Cult list for two friends who wanted to play them, and it needed a bit of tweaking here and there but it worked well.

I suspect there will be thriving cottage industry of alternative lists. In addition to the Necromunda gangs, I'd love to see the police force again (can't remember what they were called off the top of my head). Plus I'm sure fan based alternate settings will also be thing; pretty easy, take any Imperial world besieged by fill-in-your-xeno-here.

Now if we'd just get a plastic Sisters troop box...

**streetsamurai**

Why did you wrote rules for a tyranid cult and Eldar?
They are already included in the rules

**rmeister0**

streetsamurai wrote:
Why did you wrote rules for a tyranid cult and Eldar?
They are already included in the rules

Ah, I was unclear. This was for Necromunda back when it was first released. At that time there was nothing from the general 40K setting in it, and before Necromunda was handled by Specialist Games which published several alternative lists.

Point being, it is a relatively easy ruleset to home-brew lists for.

**notprop**

streetsamurai wrote:
H.B.M.C. wrote:
streetsamurai wrote:
Will buy then. This will give me 3 sets of terrains. Will be able to do a pretty cool table with this.
Hold up!

The box, and others could be different so please chime in if you got a different set of terrain, does not contain one of each terrain kit (of it did there'd be two double-barreled smoke stacks, and there aren't). I got the following sprues:

One of this.
One of this.
One of this.
One of this.
One of this (sadly, two of these would be amazing).
One of this.
Two of this.

ha ok, but still is a good deal @ 100 cad. What I meant is that this will be my third box of terrain since I already bought two boxes of SWA

I paid £40 the terrain from the box, so about $70CAN, albeit that's mates-rates, if you want a true comparison.

**Mad Doc Grotsnik**

So, who else is hassling GW to do more and more with this scale of game?

I am. I'd love to get it to the stage where we can run Rogue Trader type forces (era and background) - so perhaps your crew might contain a Kroot, an Eldar Corsair, couple of Bloodaxes etc.

Really open it up, let us explore the galaxy in a smaller, more intimate environment - especially as sadly the FFG roleplay books are no longer in production.

Imagine a head-honcho Rogue Trader squabbling over derelict space craft with his peers, all sending in their own explortator teams etc.

**Shuma-Gorath**

timetowaste85 wrote:
Well, enjoy guys. Glad you all got the book you wanted. Still not getting any part of it unless I get rules for daemons. And since people on here are saying that's unlikely...hope you guys all get to enjoy it for me.

Daemons are tricky, one way to do it would be make a daemon world army (like at the back of the 2nd edition chaos codex) the leader is a chaos champion (herald, warrior, beastman) , troopers are main daemons (plaguebearer,dameonette,bloodletter & horrors), new recruit use beastmen and specialist be the other daemon type (nurglings, flesh hounds, fiends & flamers)

Special operatives could be daemon on a steed (beast, juggernaut, steed or disc), troll, chaos spawn and maybe do a solitaire style thing with a greater daemon but have it cost two or three prometheum stashes?

Of course this team would most likely have very few customisation options.

**RevolverRossalot**

H.B.M.C. wrote:
It just says 'Drone' rather than "Trooper' there, so can they>

If they can a friend of mine will love that.

Then you can have a happy friend!

By the letter of the law it is New Recruits that are barred from receiving an Advance, rather than Leaders/Specialists/Troopers being able to. It isn't clear how you would actually resolve this were you to roll a Skill result, though, as the Drone role has access to no skill tables! This is likely to matter most for a Serious Injury roll of What Doesn't Kill You... conferring an Advance on the lucky drone

(I fully expect this to get clarified/removed eventually. I'd hope it is matched by the ability to simply recruit replacement drones with a Miss Next Game injury or that have been captured, though.)

**Kroem**

So is there much backround story in the current Shadow War book? Rules are great and all that but I would be disappointed if if that was all that was in there.

The fact that this stand alone book is an ad hoc thing to meet unexpected demand doesn't fill me with confidence that we will see any new fiction or art regarding the conflict on Armageddon, but perhaps we will see some of the old info back from Codex: Armageddon. Great to see the Orks taking centre stage again!

**Not-not-kenny**

MalusCalibur wrote:
What I've found most suprising is the apparent lack of ability to take loyalist Space Marines (beyond Scouts) with this ruleset - after severing all ties with GW some time ago I was almost tempted to use these rules as an excuse to pick up some of the (admittedly lovely) Horus Heresy Marines to use as a Shadow War squad...but the inability to do so has killed my enthusiasm.

Fortunately those lovely heresy era marines are perfect to represent some traitor legion chaos marines.

**notprop**

Kroem wrote:
So is there much backround story in the current Shadow War book? Rules are great and all that but I would be disappointed if if that was all that was in there.

The fact that this stand alone book is an ad hoc thing to meet unexpected demand doesn't fill me with confidence that we will see any new fiction or art regarding the conflict on Armageddon, but perhaps we will see some of the old info back from Codex: Armageddon. Great to see the Orks taking centre stage again!

He fluff is about the stalemate following the initial phase of the 3rd War for Armageddon. Veteran IG and SM Scouts (SpecFor) groups ranging campaigns against invading Ork Warbands in the hinterlands in and around the Static frontlines. This is described as Prometium Refineries and. Manufactories ergo the Promethium resource which is battled over.

Where all the add-on KillTeams fit into this - pass.

**Bottle**

The other factions aren't meant to fit into the Armageddon setting. The White Dwarf states:

The Shadow War for Armageddon has raged for many years, though it is not the only covert war taking place within the Imperium. On thousands of worlds, teams of desperate warriors from different factions clash, vying for supremacy in an uncaring galaxy.

This little fluff snippet actually sold me on the game in many ways, as I realised that all the factions weren't being shoe-horned into a setting together. Instead when players make a campaign you should devise your own setting specifically tailored for the players' factions you have.

**kodos**

Shuma-Gorath wrote:

Daemons are tricky, one way to do it would be make a daemon world army (like at the back of the 2nd edition chaos codex) the leader is a chaos champion (herald, warrior, beastman) , troopers are main daemons (plaguebearer,dameonette,bloodletter & horrors), new recruit use beastmen and specialist be the other daemon type (nurglings, flesh hounds, fiends & flamers)

Special operatives could be daemon on a steed (beast, juggernaut, steed or disc), troll, chaos spawn and maybe do a solitaire style thing with a greater daemon but have it cost two or three prometheum stashes?

Of course this team would most likely have very few customisation options.

Sounds not bad, lets modify this a Little bit:

choose an alignment (one of the 4 gods)
leader is a Herald of that God (no steed)
troopers are the basic daemons of that god (plaguebearer,dameonette,bloodletter & horrors)
new recruit are Beastman/Gors of that god (tzaangors etc)
specialist are hounds, screamers, nurglings, seekers

special operatives are daemons from a different alignment and some of the missing units (fiends, juggernaut, flamers, drones)

**H.B.M.C.**

kodos wrote:
new recruit are Beastman/Gors of that god (tzaangors etc)

Great idea, 'cept "No model, no rules". There aren't any Beastmen for 40k outside of Tzaangors, so that wouldn't fly.

Maybe when the Death Guard come out we'll get stuff for their Zombies/Mutants.

**Matt.Kingsley**

Furies could work for New Recruits?

Or maybe they could just not have New Recruits like GKs.

**AndrewGPaul**

Examples of theatres of battle where the other Kill Teams could be used ...

Boarding actions against Space Hulks - Space Marine Scouts, Orks, Eldar, Harlequins, Dark Eldar and Skitarii boarding a hulk occupied by Genestealer Cults, Chaos Cults or other Orks.

Boarding actions against Tyranid Hive Ships - pretty much any faction, against Tyranid and Genestealer Cult Kill teams.

Harlequins and Dark Eldar (and escaped slaves from other races) in the alleys and tunnels of Comorragh - tie it in with Gangs of Comorragh if you want.

Skitarii investigators on a Necron Tombworld.

Imperial forces (or anyone else, I suppose) raiding the wreckage of a Craftworld. Or small actions during the Tyranid invasion of Iyanden (perhaps boarding actions on the ships in the defensive fleet?)

Imperial forces fighting their way into the stronghold of a Genestealer or Chaos cult - think Dredd or The Raid, broken up into a series of missions.

**Dravis**

Inquisimunda has a Chaos coven that's able to summon demons, so a similar kill team would be cultists + demons? No leader options unless CSM or herald though.
Just allowing the current Chaos band to summon demon specialist or have psychers would be nice.

A path to glory style kill team would be awesome though, but limited model options currently though. Tzeenich could almost do it, mixing CSM, cultists, beastmen and demons.

**tneva82**

frozenwastes wrote:
[.

I'm guessing from GW's improving sales figures and their maintenance of their really impressive margins that they do indeed know how to figure out how many products to produce.

Don't know why it's so hard to accept they got blindsided here but that their general approach to figuring out how much to make is based on their own internal data and has been working for them. That they made the right call with what they could have known and that hindsight is 20/20.

You realize they are systematically under producing? Not working that well...

**Kroem**

Thanks notprop, that sounds really cool then.

I realised that all the factions weren't being shoe-horned into a setting together.

Yea I was afraid they would spoil the Armageddon setting by doing this too. I think Medusa V showed how that quickly descends into an nonsensical farce!

That is pretty cool that they included the other factions so that you can battles elsewhere in the galaxy, you could even change the resource to soul gems for Eldar etc.

**Shuma-Gorath**

H.B.M.C. wrote:
kodos wrote:
new recruit are Beastman/Gors of that god (tzaangors etc)

Great idea, 'cept "No model, no rules". There aren't any Beastmen for 40k outside of Tzaangors, so that wouldn't fly.

Maybe when the Death Guard come out we'll get stuff for their Zombies/Mutants.

Plenty of Beastmen minis in Age of Sigmar, quick conversion to give them basic guns and off you go. (They existed in 2nd edition take the rules from the old codex and you have beastmen in 40k).