FEARtheMoose wrote:

Martel732 wrote:

GodDamUser wrote:

Martel732 wrote:

I understand that's how GW says it would work, but falling back doesn't always work. You can't always hit a specific target and then get out. Things go wrong. 1K strong chapters not only can't get any coverage on a planet, they can't tolerate anything going wrong, either. I think the PC games and tabletop are actually closer to what it would be like than GW's fiction.

Well no.. for Guard maybe

But Marines are not a blunt instrument. They wouldn't attack something if they didn't have the advantage, they are not suicidal. While sometimes there are situations where they don't have the choice due to tactical importance, but normally in those cases they only send in a squad or two.

Also it is rare even in the stories where you see an entire Chapter deployed, normally at most you will see a Company.. and when they are mentioning multiple chapters being present.. you would still likely be look at a couple hundred marines

I can only think of maybe 5 Stories where an entire Chapter has taken the field (excluding Horus Herey era, but then again they are legions), and then normally they are desperate defensive hold at all cost actions in which they do take heavy losses and make it through by the skin of their teeth against superior forces

They might THINK they have the advantage, but end up not having the advantage. Those things happen. It's war. A squad or two means nothing to a planetary conflict. Logically, an entire chapter probably would make no difference at all. But that's not the fluff, I know. The fluff is wrong.

well logically [in the fluff since this is all fictional, and makes no sense to compare to real life in any way], when you have super human warriors, who heal like wolverine [almost] can fight without stopping for months at a time, have special organs and other biological upgrades that make them stronger, faster than master chief in halo, who can survive in the vacuum of space unprotected for x amount of time, are immortal and are all geniuses AND on top of that, they wear armour that is resistant to most weapons, and further enhances their speed, endurance and strength, it makes sense that just a 100 marines could take a planet over with the support of the Guard - Guard holds the ground/provides bodies and the marines take out HVT's. In the fluff the are so many instances of marines literally wading through enemies like they are just strolling through the surf at the beach. I just read a short story about 30 marines dropping onto a [human] planet that had been corrupted by chaos and them, plus the remaining Guard regiment, managed to hold back the entire planet for 6 months before the marines evacuated. [10 million men verses like 10,000 + 30] they lost all the Guard and half their number, but killed millions in return.

Also fictional fluff cant be wrong, because its not real. its not supposed to make "logical" sense. Thats like saying Harry potter cant be magic because magic isnt real and therefore JK is a liar........

 AnomanderRake wrote:

Martel732 wrote:
Then why aren't ba drop pods good? If pods are op for 35 pts. Pods are quite often a 35 pt suicide machine. A wave serpent gives you way more tactical options.

Electrodisplacement as the biggest cheese? Please. You have to roll the power ( which loth can't take btw) and then cast it and then not be denied. And against cheese eldar lists if 's a one way ticket to CC with a wk.

Again let me repeat that i'm talking about gimmickless marines. And that's definitely a gimmick.

Drop Pods are very good. You just don't like them.

(They may also be part of the reason the rest of your army is less good. Giving Eldar short-range D-weapons on Wraithguard is slightly balanced out by the expensiveness of the delivery mechanism (and by the relative ease of doing something about it), if they gave Space Marines infantry D-weapons the ability to plop them with zero risk anywhere on the table on turn one would make them horrendous and absurd.)

morgoth wrote:
Eldar hate is way too strong in this thread.

Remember the part about bullying?

That's what I see here.

Martel732 wrote:
...I don't like them for a reason. I'm not stupid. And you are giving gw way too much credit when skyhammer exists. Drop pods, like every marine unit, needs a special snowflake gimmick to compete with an eldar cad.

Come play a pod based ba list and see how well you do vs eldar. You know you are dropping into a slaughter so if course you wouldn't do that...

 kingbobbito wrote:

 Kain wrote:
The Necrons also got a similar treatment. After they got a solid codex after years of languishing in the bottom tiers they suddenly exploded in terms of in-universe prominence and in the number of goodies they got to themselves. And so they continued to receive more care and attention while they were on top of the heap only to once again seemingly fall out of GW's favor when 7e's extreme power creep cycle pushed even the "what even is dying anyway?" silliness of the Necron decurions to the merely good tiers instead of the god tiers.

So I need to patiently wait for them to make all lasguns hotshot and let vet squads take 5 free special weapons apiece before they show us some love? Honestly all I want is an upgrade sprue with 3 meltas and plasmas on it.

 Baldeagle91 wrote:

 kingbobbito wrote:

 Kain wrote:
The Necrons also got a similar treatment. After they got a solid codex after years of languishing in the bottom tiers they suddenly exploded in terms of in-universe prominence and in the number of goodies they got to themselves. And so they continued to receive more care and attention while they were on top of the heap only to once again seemingly fall out of GW's favor when 7e's extreme power creep cycle pushed even the "what even is dying anyway?" silliness of the Necron decurions to the merely good tiers instead of the god tiers.

So I need to patiently wait for them to make all lasguns hotshot and let vet squads take 5 free special weapons apiece before they show us some love? Honestly all I want is an upgrade sprue with 3 meltas and plasmas on it.

I'm trying not to be a jackass here.... but you do know you can get those in packs of 5? Ok they're metal but they're easily avaliable. Simply file to size or chop the SM hand off and use the balancing army from the grenade launcher/flamer and you have you melta's + plasma's right there.