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2017/10/28 10:59:18
Subject: Archons WW@?! Dark Eldar 8th Edition Tactics!
Putting them in a transport is a neat idea, you could take a Venom for them and if DSing would be better then just DS them, if not you have a -1 to hit 5++ vehicle for them, tho honestly i wish the Venom was better, i dont like poison in 8th and the Splinter cannons are WAY over costed. The Venom is just a lot cheaper and can go off at 16'+ a turn to get objectives, shut down other tanks, etc...
Amishprn86 wrote: Sadly, even with 80 poison shots, thats only 18 dead T3 5+ save guys, thats if all 80 are within 24" range.
Lets say you took 5 Raiders with 10 Kabals 1 with a SC, lets say your within 18" but not 12" (so you get 6 shots on the 5 SC's) thats 9x5 (45) and 6x5 (30) for 95 shots. Thats 21 dead Guardsman for a total of 1070pts. Yes you have 5 Lances, and you might kill a tank with them, the raider is really good, the point is that the guys are not.
DE Poison is NOT an Anti-Infantry weapon. SB's are better in every way.
Splinter Rifles NEEDS its Splinter Racks back, all Raiders should just come with them for free, and the Splinter cannon needs to be Assault 6 again, at 10pts.
Let's wait for the codex to have a fair response about DE. I agree that something should be more effective and/or cheaper.
But don't compare them or their weapons to AM or stormbolters since these things are overpowered stuff, something that should toned down.
But you need to report such things that underperform or need a bit tweaking. Otherwise it may not be touched. It is good idea to do summary of units and opinions after playtestinng, and then send them email. No whining, just solid data. It would be best to do it ASAP, because once codex is announced it will be to late.
1. „Stab the shoty, shot the staby”
2. „Who bails, fails.”
3. „Act to win yourself and not for your opponent to lose.”
4. „If in dilemma between damage and durability, chose third- speed.”
5. „Focus fire.”
2017/10/29 01:19:20
Subject: Archons WW@?! Dark Eldar 8th Edition Tactics!
I have to say, splinter fire is just the absolute worst option for any armies main spammable weapon that i've seen so far and it is pretty crippling. Wouldn't be such a problem if 2/3 of our units didn't have some kind of splinter weapon. As it stands, the poison mechanics are hot garbage and need rescued by a codex ASAP.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/10/29 01:20:37
2017/10/29 01:54:49
Subject: Archons WW@?! Dark Eldar 8th Edition Tactics!
Amishprn86 wrote: Sadly, even with 80 poison shots, thats only 18 dead T3 5+ save guys, thats if all 80 are within 24" range.
Lets say you took 5 Raiders with 10 Kabals 1 with a SC, lets say your within 18" but not 12" (so you get 6 shots on the 5 SC's) thats 9x5 (45) and 6x5 (30) for 95 shots. Thats 21 dead Guardsman for a total of 1070pts. Yes you have 5 Lances, and you might kill a tank with them, the raider is really good, the point is that the guys are not.
DE Poison is NOT an Anti-Infantry weapon. SB's are better in every way.
Splinter Rifles NEEDS its Splinter Racks back, all Raiders should just come with them for free, and the Splinter cannon needs to be Assault 6 again, at 10pts.
Let's wait for the codex to have a fair response about DE. I agree that something should be more effective and/or cheaper.
But don't compare them or their weapons to AM or stormbolters since these things are overpowered stuff, something that should toned down.
But you need to report such things that underperform or need a bit tweaking. Otherwise it may not be touched. It is good idea to do summary of units and opinions after playtestinng, and then send them email. No whining, just solid data. It would be best to do it ASAP, because once codex is announced it will be to late.
Thedarkcity.net did a really nice report of what is bad/good, showed numbers etc.. and gave it to GW, we went through the full codex and had something like 20 people working on it (it was short and more to the point, but in a nice respectful way), GW acknowledge they read it b.c they even mention something in the letter that the header didnt talk about, so we know they read it, its up to them if they feel the same way now.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/10/29 01:55:10
Amishprn86 wrote: Sadly, even with 80 poison shots, thats only 18 dead T3 5+ save guys, thats if all 80 are within 24" range.
Lets say you took 5 Raiders with 10 Kabals 1 with a SC, lets say your within 18" but not 12" (so you get 6 shots on the 5 SC's) thats 9x5 (45) and 6x5 (30) for 95 shots. Thats 21 dead Guardsman for a total of 1070pts. Yes you have 5 Lances, and you might kill a tank with them, the raider is really good, the point is that the guys are not.
DE Poison is NOT an Anti-Infantry weapon. SB's are better in every way.
Splinter Rifles NEEDS its Splinter Racks back, all Raiders should just come with them for free, and the Splinter cannon needs to be Assault 6 again, at 10pts.
Let's wait for the codex to have a fair response about DE. I agree that something should be more effective and/or cheaper.
But don't compare them or their weapons to AM or stormbolters since these things are overpowered stuff, something that should toned down.
But you need to report such things that underperform or need a bit tweaking. Otherwise it may not be touched. It is good idea to do summary of units and opinions after playtestinng, and then send them email. No whining, just solid data. It would be best to do it ASAP, because once codex is announced it will be to late.
Thedarkcity.net did a really nice report of what is bad/good, showed numbers etc.. and gave it to GW, we went through the full codex and had something like 20 people working on it (it was short and more to the point, but in a nice respectful way), GW acknowledge they read it b.c they even mention something in the letter that the header didnt talk about, so we know they read it, its up to them if they feel the same way now.
Well done guys, that is why we CAN have nice things.
Am I the only one wondering how they are gonna work with <kabal> <cult> <coven> keywords. We have like 3 chapters in one army. If they do it this way me may strongly benefit from mixing, like almost no other army can. Basically "make your own chapter tactic, chose 3."
1. „Stab the shoty, shot the staby”
2. „Who bails, fails.”
3. „Act to win yourself and not for your opponent to lose.”
4. „If in dilemma between damage and durability, chose third- speed.”
5. „Focus fire.”
2017/10/29 11:22:59
Subject: Archons WW@?! Dark Eldar 8th Edition Tactics!
DE is for sure a large collective of sub factions.
I doubt, but who knows. I expect that they are more likely to get more special rules, but will not benefit from any "chapter tactics" same way as ratlings and ogryns don't benefit from regimental doctrines.
1. „Stab the shoty, shot the staby”
2. „Who bails, fails.”
3. „Act to win yourself and not for your opponent to lose.”
4. „If in dilemma between damage and durability, chose third- speed.”
5. „Focus fire.”
2017/10/29 18:46:12
Subject: Archons WW@?! Dark Eldar 8th Edition Tactics!
Amishprn86 wrote: Putting them in a transport is a neat idea, you could take a Venom for them and if DSing would be better then just DS them, if not you have a -1 to hit 5++ vehicle for them, tho honestly i wish the Venom was better, i dont like poison in 8th and the Splinter cannons are WAY over costed. The Venom is just a lot cheaper and can go off at 16'+ a turn to get objectives, shut down other tanks, etc...
I have thought in the past about putting blasterborn inside a venom till i realized it's far more cost effective to just take a flyer or ravager for much better results. Also if you fill up a raider with 2 blasterborn squads then you risk making the raider too big a threat so that people focus fire it down (somewhere over 330 pts for 2 units of 5 trueborn each in the same raider).
Flyer gets -1 to being hit like the venom, they cost about as much, flyer is faster, flyer can never be bogged down in melee (unless the enemy has flying units which will be slower than yours) unlike the venom forcing you to not shoot with passengers if you retreat and flyer is much more durable.
You could also go about this with ravagers. Sure ravagers degrade but they have better range, better toughness, more wounds, can't be bogged down to prevent passenger shooting and cost about as much. I suppose ravagers don't have -1 to hit and that's nice and all but their heavy weapons count as assault weapons anyway so you don't have to worry about moving with them.
I dunno personally i find blasterborn in venoms or even raiders to be a waste of time and effort. Transports are just way too expensive now to justify the cost unless it's a really effective and expensive melee unit like incubi or grotesques. I mean if i took warriors outside of raiders i could more than double my numbers of warriors. The only good boost really is the durability of the transport protecting them but in the case of melee units it just transports them from A to B faster. They sadly don't get to rely on the durability of the raiders when their preferred combat hits. So i dunno maybe transports can be worth it for some ranged warriors (durability) and higher tier melee units. I suppose my issue is just some units are far more cost effective than transporting infantry.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/10/29 18:50:44
Btw am i the only person giving Reavers a second look? Turns out if you take them with basic gear (bladevanes) and give them extra attacks or something from combat drugs and they can be ok for anti-horde in melee mostly. They don't need an expensive transport and they definitely have the speed to get there. The multiple wounds means they can also survive longer than some of the other units thrown at a horde.
If you give them the extra attacks it's 30 str 4 ap -1 attacks with the rest of the stats you all should know. Also 5 points for those cluster caltrops or grav talons should you need em.
They should also have the speed to get out of trouble should you need it. I mean it's still 300 pts which is a lot but the multiple wounds seems to help for morale purposes and keeping the unit alive. Anyway i dunno it could be worth a look.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/10/29 20:38:06
The problem with 8 ed is the everything wounded everything. Drukhari always were glass cannon army that was hiding behind shenanigans to survive and have opportunity to deal damage.
That means reavers are to expensive for what they can bring. Yeah, almost everything is to expensive. Glass cannon will work only if its components are cheap enough that, you can lose few of them and in your turn reduce significantly your opponent firepower.
Hopefully we gone get many new toys, since there are things that isn't working as it was probably expected by designers (splinter weapons mainly). Not Markerlight-level of not working, but still something isn't right.
IMHO, I would just give all splinter weapons low S, but reroll to wound on everything that isn't vehicle. With no ap this should be balanced.
1. „Stab the shoty, shot the staby”
2. „Who bails, fails.”
3. „Act to win yourself and not for your opponent to lose.”
4. „If in dilemma between damage and durability, chose third- speed.”
5. „Focus fire.”
2017/10/29 21:58:02
Subject: Archons WW@?! Dark Eldar 8th Edition Tactics!
flamingkillamajig wrote: Btw am i the only person giving Reavers a second look? Turns out if you take them with basic gear (bladevanes) and give them extra attacks or something from combat drugs and they can be ok for anti-horde in melee mostly. They don't need an expensive transport and they definitely have the speed to get there. The multiple wounds means they can also survive longer than some of the other units thrown at a horde.
If you give them the extra attacks it's 30 str 4 ap -1 attacks with the rest of the stats you all should know. Also 5 points for those cluster caltrops or grav talons should you need em.
They should also have the speed to get out of trouble should you need it. I mean it's still 300 pts which is a lot but the multiple wounds seems to help for morale purposes and keeping the unit alive. Anyway i dunno it could be worth a look.
Here's the thing.
6 Reavers (including Arena Champion) with Grav Talon is 185 points. 10 Mandrakes are 190.
With the additional attack, the Reavers will do:
Shooting - 6 Splinter rifles in rapid fire range, kills 2.67 GEQ Melee - 19 total attacks of Bladevanes, kills 7.04 GEQ Total: 9.70 dead Guardsmen
Mandrakes:
Shooting - 10 Baleblasts kills 9.63 GEQ on the drop
Melee - 31 attacks (Mandrake sergeant gets 3, Mandrakes each get 2, they all get an additional 1 for a total of 31) of a Glimmersteel blade kills 9.19 GEQs If Mandrakes make the charge, total is 18.81
With just shooting the Mandrakes are as good as the Jetbikes are point for point. The Mandrakes can also guarantee first turn shooting, whereas the Jetbikes cannot guarantee shooting and charging.
It's no contest IMO.
2017/10/30 00:00:15
Subject: Archons WW@?! Dark Eldar 8th Edition Tactics!
flamingkillamajig wrote: Btw am i the only person giving Reavers a second look? Turns out if you take them with basic gear (bladevanes) and give them extra attacks or something from combat drugs and they can be ok for anti-horde in melee mostly. They don't need an expensive transport and they definitely have the speed to get there. The multiple wounds means they can also survive longer than some of the other units thrown at a horde.
If you give them the extra attacks it's 30 str 4 ap -1 attacks with the rest of the stats you all should know. Also 5 points for those cluster caltrops or grav talons should you need em.
They should also have the speed to get out of trouble should you need it. I mean it's still 300 pts which is a lot but the multiple wounds seems to help for morale purposes and keeping the unit alive. Anyway i dunno it could be worth a look.
Here's the thing.
6 Reavers (including Arena Champion) with Grav Talon is 185 points. 10 Mandrakes are 190.
With the additional attack, the Reavers will do:
Shooting - 6 Splinter rifles in rapid fire range, kills 2.67 GEQ Melee - 19 total attacks of Bladevanes, kills 7.04 GEQ Total: 9.70 dead Guardsmen
Mandrakes:
Shooting - 10 Baleblasts kills 9.63 GEQ on the drop
Melee - 31 attacks (Mandrake sergeant gets 3, Mandrakes each get 2, they all get an additional 1 for a total of 31) of a Glimmersteel blade kills 9.19 GEQs If Mandrakes make the charge, total is 18.81
With just shooting the Mandrakes are as good as the Jetbikes are point for point. The Mandrakes can also guarantee first turn shooting, whereas the Jetbikes cannot guarantee shooting and charging.
flamingkillamajig wrote: Btw am i the only person giving Reavers a second look? Turns out if you take them with basic gear (bladevanes) and give them extra attacks or something from combat drugs and they can be ok for anti-horde in melee mostly. They don't need an expensive transport and they definitely have the speed to get there. The multiple wounds means they can also survive longer than some of the other units thrown at a horde.
If you give them the extra attacks it's 30 str 4 ap -1 attacks with the rest of the stats you all should know. Also 5 points for those cluster caltrops or grav talons should you need em.
They should also have the speed to get out of trouble should you need it. I mean it's still 300 pts which is a lot but the multiple wounds seems to help for morale purposes and keeping the unit alive. Anyway i dunno it could be worth a look.
Here's the thing.
6 Reavers (including Arena Champion) with Grav Talon is 185 points. 10 Mandrakes are 190.
With the additional attack, the Reavers will do:
Shooting - 6 Splinter rifles in rapid fire range, kills 2.67 GEQ Melee - 19 total attacks of Bladevanes, kills 7.04 GEQ Total: 9.70 dead Guardsmen
Mandrakes:
Shooting - 10 Baleblasts kills 9.63 GEQ on the drop
Melee - 31 attacks (Mandrake sergeant gets 3, Mandrakes each get 2, they all get an additional 1 for a total of 31) of a Glimmersteel blade kills 9.19 GEQs If Mandrakes make the charge, total is 18.81
With just shooting the Mandrakes are as good as the Jetbikes are point for point. The Mandrakes can also guarantee first turn shooting, whereas the Jetbikes cannot guarantee shooting and charging.
It's no contest IMO.
Yeah and what about survival vs horde shooting. Let's say mandrakes take about 50 shots of str 4 ap - hits from termagaunts. The very thing i'm most worried about lately. I'd say it's about 200/27 for mandrakes so almost 8 dead and nearly over 150 points dead and that doesn't count morale which would murder them unless you take units of 5 (not counting turn 1 FnP). It's also about 4 dead from overwatch due to 6's always hitting (with 50 shots) provided you don't charge a venom or raider first. For reavers it's closer to 25/4 or about 6 wounds (90 pts) without the toughness boost and not considering FnP which kills just 3 reavers with t5 boost it kills 25/6 which is about 4 wounds and 2 reavers dead (60 points). Mandrakes are a lot more fragile. Sure you can get the shooting and the charge off but there will be other units there if the enemy decides to Fall Back and shoot with the rest of his termagaunts. Mandrakes can't survive that. One whole unit of 30 with the 10 upgraded guns and more gaunts being pooped out will kill that in one shooting phase. At least the reavers can fight again.
Considering i have to face at least 2 nid players at the local GW and this is something they legit do with termagaunts i think it's a legitimate concern for me.
-------
Btw i suppose you could get the shots and possibly melee first with mandrakes. You would get overwatched still. Also you have to make a 8-9" charge which is still a big gamble. I mean unless you hold back mandrakes till what turn 2 after your venoms and such get in place to tie down ranged squads after your mandrakes shoot, tie down with vehicles and then charge.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2017/10/30 01:09:45
27 Mandrakes drop down turn 2 THEY will shoot FIRST
They are A2, S4 -1 thats 54 attacks. Thats 24 dead gants without any 6's rolled (3 MW on average) so 27 dead gants out of 50.
You charge your 3 units, on turn 2 you get to re-rolls or you can also CP a dice. Lets say 2 units get into the charge.
23 Gants shooting in OW will only kill 1.5 Mandrakes, lets say 2.
Now you have 18 Mandrakes that charged, doing 3 attacks each (+2 from Nightfiends) for a total of 56 attacks, killing another 20 gants.
You just killed 43 gants in total to your 2 Mandrakes, if only 1 unit of 8 charged thats still 10 more gants.
IDK how you came up with your numbers, but you need to re-think it.
I suppose i was thinking based on all the other squads of gaunts you didn't shoot. My point was more there will be probably just over 30 gaunts per squad of 10 mandrakes you can set up. Provided you can't make the charge all they have to do with the ones that were charged is back out of combat and then have the less depleted squads that weren't charged shoot at you. Wouldn't help if tervigons were pumping out more gaunts either but i suppose we're not concentrating on that.
My point is a unit of the 30 gaunts with 50 shots costs 170 pts or so. Basically you will have to have each mandrake squad to be able to handle one unit of termagaunts on their own if you want to win the point battle. Then there's the issue of thinking about this separate from the full game as there's usually tervigon support spawning more. So yeah you'd have to murder that thing with other units.
Anyway i dunno man i was trying to figure out something for anti-horde. I still say though mandrakes will get to shoot first and possibly assault but once they start getting hit by concentrated horde fire they will go down. I'm willing to try anything at this point though to handle hordes. It sounds like DE aren't very anti-horde at the moment. I suppose your way works if you do a turn 2 DS with mandrakes and you have a venom or raider in place to tie up the termagaunts in melee once the shooting is done. That said that's just more points spent holding down the horde.
I would not be shocked if your way works better. It's just handling the hordes at all is pretty tough right now.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2017/10/30 04:47:18
It takes DE 2x longer (Literally) to kill hordes than almost every other army.
Since he is Nids, you can take the actual better AH, Khymerae's, if you DS in 2-3 5mans of Mandrakes and rush up 2 units of 12 Khymerae's you should do better than all Mandrakes.
IDK what GW was thinking about our poison weapons, thats DE problem honestly. Im so tired of Poison weapons being crap, it NEEDS to be Rifles: assault 2 SC: assault 6 Shardcarbine: assault 4
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/10/30 07:37:25
I consider reavers a tactical unit now, not a close combat one. They can be decent, but still overpriced, if you exploit their speed. Basically they're tarpits now, and not even particularly effective. I surely prefer them over to hellions though.
For 300 points you can take 4 grots in a raider, which are surely better against everything than reavers in melee. More durable than reavers and the transport can be useful even before and after deploying its cargo.
Mandrakes are amazing but awfully expensive in terms of money, I've never seen more than 10 actually and only a few times more than 5.
2017/10/30 08:08:19
Subject: Archons WW@?! Dark Eldar 8th Edition Tactics!
To be far i love the models and i got 3 units back in 5th when you could place Random tokens and you picked the one you wanted to spawn at, it was a silly tactic that force peoples movement/position into better spots for you.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/10/30 08:10:13
I made this list for lulz and friendly game. But I would like for this game to last more than my opponents second turn. Any thoughts ? Advices? I think I can manage to pilot it, but i haven't really use beast at all to this time.
1. „Stab the shoty, shot the staby”
2. „Who bails, fails.”
3. „Act to win yourself and not for your opponent to lose.”
4. „If in dilemma between damage and durability, chose third- speed.”
5. „Focus fire.”
2017/10/30 20:50:30
Subject: Archons WW@?! Dark Eldar 8th Edition Tactics!
Blackie wrote: I consider reavers a tactical unit now, not a close combat one. They can be decent, but still overpriced, if you exploit their speed. Basically they're tarpits now, and not even particularly effective. I surely prefer them over to hellions though.
For 300 points you can take 4 grots in a raider, which are surely better against everything than reavers in melee. More durable than reavers and the transport can be useful even before and after deploying its cargo.
Mandrakes are amazing but awfully expensive in terms of money, I've never seen more than 10 actually and only a few times more than 5.
Yeah the grotesques would probably be better esp. with the raider as something to hold down the hordes so you don't get shot up.
Mandrakes do sound good but i think they are very fragile overall.
Would it be possible to do a combo team with wyches/bloodbrides and possibly mandrakes or grotesques? That way you can prevent the enemy from leaving combat and they can't do anything about it. One units holds the enemy in place while the other tears through them. Could probably be good for multi-assaults too with wyches/bloodbrides as they'd need to roll off for every unit in base contact with the wyches/bloodbrides to leave combat.
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I suppose one of my bigger questions lately is what to buy to add next to my dark eldar. I'm thinking wyches/bloodbrides could help significantly now. Pairing them with the grotesques i already have should work or at least that's the hope.
It's still going to cost 2 whole raiders to transport these things and that's about 200 pts total which is not always great. I really wish transports weren't so expensive in points these days. I tend to not want to transport anything just because of the massive points cost and it really does add up.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/10/30 20:55:50
Blackie wrote: I consider reavers a tactical unit now, not a close combat one. They can be decent, but still overpriced, if you exploit their speed. Basically they're tarpits now, and not even particularly effective. I surely prefer them over to hellions though.
For 300 points you can take 4 grots in a raider, which are surely better against everything than reavers in melee. More durable than reavers and the transport can be useful even before and after deploying its cargo.
Mandrakes are amazing but awfully expensive in terms of money, I've never seen more than 10 actually and only a few times more than 5.
Yeah the grotesques would probably be better esp. with the raider as something to hold down the hordes so you don't get shot up.
Mandrakes do sound good but i think they are very fragile overall.
Would it be possible to do a combo team with wyches/bloodbrides and possibly mandrakes or grotesques? That way you can prevent the enemy from leaving combat and they can't do anything about it. One units holds the enemy in place while the other tears through them. Could probably be good for multi-assaults too with wyches/bloodbrides as they'd need to roll off for every unit in base contact with the wyches/bloodbrides to leave combat.
-------
I suppose one of my bigger questions lately is what to buy to add next to my dark eldar. I'm thinking wyches/bloodbrides could help significantly now. Pairing them with the grotesques i already have should work or at least that's the hope.
It's still going to cost 2 whole raiders to transport these things and that's about 200 pts total which is not always great. I really wish transports weren't so expensive in points these days. I tend to not want to transport anything just because of the massive points cost and it really does add up.
Don't be fooled by mandrakes. They aren't fragile, not super tanky, but that -1 to hit one of best defensive tools in game. It's no accident that raven guard, alpha legion, Stygies 8 and Alitoc are favorites of many. Id say they are easy and sure thing to buy. I don't think that they gone be hit by nerf bat so they are safe bet.
Other models thou... well what do you have now? What do you have available? And what do you fancy? Nor grotesques nor bloodbrides are competitive right now but they will do okay in more casual games.
1. „Stab the shoty, shot the staby”
2. „Who bails, fails.”
3. „Act to win yourself and not for your opponent to lose.”
4. „If in dilemma between damage and durability, chose third- speed.”
5. „Focus fire.”
2017/10/31 19:32:36
Subject: Archons WW@?! Dark Eldar 8th Edition Tactics!
I'm looking at the 10 unused splinter cannon kabalites and 5 splinter cannon scourge I have and wondering...What would it take for splinter cannons to be worth taking? Do you think they will get a simple points cost reduction? or some other type of codexy bonus?
2017/10/31 20:53:23
Subject: Archons WW@?! Dark Eldar 8th Edition Tactics!
Trancefate wrote: I'm looking at the 10 unused splinter cannon kabalites and 5 splinter cannon scourge I have and wondering...What would it take for splinter cannons to be worth taking? Do you think they will get a simple points cost reduction? or some other type of codexy bonus?
They're worth taking now IMO, simply because once you hit enough Lances, there's really not much else to take. Granted they're not super efficient compared to other armies, but compared to our other options, it's kind of a no-brainer.
Leave the Cannons off the Scourge, since Scourge come stock with Shardcarbines. You're better off taking another dude in the squad.
Best use? Cannonborn gunboat. 5 Trueborn can take two cannons , and when you put them in a double cannon Venom, that's a fuckload of (27) shots at 18". For 170 points, that's the most efficient poison we can get right now.
2017/10/31 21:04:10
Subject: Archons WW@?! Dark Eldar 8th Edition Tactics!
Trancefate wrote: I'm looking at the 10 unused splinter cannon kabalites and 5 splinter cannon scourge I have and wondering...What would it take for splinter cannons to be worth taking? Do you think they will get a simple points cost reduction? or some other type of codexy bonus?
They're worth taking now IMO, simply because once you hit enough Lances, there's really not much else to take. Granted they're not super efficient compared to other armies, but compared to our other options, it's kind of a no-brainer.
Leave the Cannons off the Scourge, since Scourge come stock with Shardcarbines. You're better off taking another dude in the squad.
Best use? Cannonborn gunboat. 5 Trueborn can take two cannons , and when you put them in a double cannon Venom, that's a fuckload of (27) shots at 18". For 170 points, that's the most efficient poison we can get right now.
Thats a decent option, im trying to work on my first list (a mono shooting army i got most the stuff from ebay). Right now im at 16 dark lances, 4 disintegrators, 8 blasters, 7 splinter cannons, and 27 splinter rifles in 2,000 points spread acrouss a couple of archons, 3x 10 man kab squad, 5 squads of trueborn, a scourge squad, a jet fighter, 2 ravagers, 2 raiders, and a venom.
I'm most curious about how the best vehicle setup would work...
Right now i'm using an 8man 2darklance trueborn squad with both archons in a raider,
2x double darklance trueborn squad in other raider,
2x triple blaster squads in venoms ( i only have 6 blasters or i'd run 4 each )
then 3 footslogging kab squads and a triple lance scourge squad.
Is this enough fire? I mostly play MEQ types so maybe thats why I'm having bad luck with splinters.
2017/11/01 01:36:51
Subject: Archons WW@?! Dark Eldar 8th Edition Tactics!
It's enough Lances, maybe. In general, Raiders are much less efficient for shooting squads as they're more expensive, not as tough to kill, and there's rarely a benefit for a shooting squad rolling 10 strong. If you want Lances, best bet are Ravagers/Flyers/Scourge. Stick your 5 man Kab/Trueborn squads in double cannon venoms.
2017/11/01 02:57:11
Subject: Archons WW@?! Dark Eldar 8th Edition Tactics!
Chippen wrote: It's enough Lances, maybe. In general, Raiders are much less efficient for shooting squads as they're more expensive, not as tough to kill, and there's rarely a benefit for a shooting squad rolling 10 strong. If you want Lances, best bet are Ravagers/Flyers/Scourge. Stick your 5 man Kab/Trueborn squads in double cannon venoms.
Actually i'm of the exact same mindset and i only would put trueborn in a venom with double splinter cannons (4 total with 2 on venom and 2 on trueborn). They're rapid fire and they can move pretty fast and have ok range. Park in some terrain for boosted saves from cover if possible. I might even add a couple shredders to the trueborn for extra firepower but the 12" range isn't flattering and would restrict the squad and force me to close in a bit.
As far as blasterborn in venoms go i still think ravagers are the better way to go for it.
Blackie wrote: I surely prefer them over to hellions though.
Man, am I the only one who doesn't hate Hellions? Last 4 games I've played, my hellions have gone one of two ways, either people ignored them because they didn't think they were a threat, and then found out just how bad 30 splinter shots followed by 31 cc attacks (especially with a Succubus backing them up) were when even TEQs will die to a single unlucky save roll, or else, having seen how badly my Hellions had wrecked other players, they wasted way too much dakka wiping them out, while my Blasterborn and Scourges were left free to knock out every big gun they had. I freaking love Hellions. I mean, I'm not saying I wouldn't mind a points reduction, but that's true of almost anything. But still, I love a big squad of hellions, and depending what kind of drugs you give them, they can fill all sorts of roles.
"But If the Earth isn't flat, then how did Jabba chakka wookiee no Solo ho ho ho hoooooooo?"
2017/11/01 05:13:02
Subject: Archons WW@?! Dark Eldar 8th Edition Tactics!
Blackie wrote: I surely prefer them over to hellions though.
Man, am I the only one who doesn't hate Hellions? Last 4 games I've played, my hellions have gone one of two ways, either people ignored them because they didn't think they were a threat, and then found out just how bad 30 splinter shots followed by 31 cc attacks (especially with a Succubus backing them up) were when even TEQs will die to a single unlucky save roll, or else, having seen how badly my Hellions had wrecked other players, they wasted way too much dakka wiping them out, while my Blasterborn and Scourges were left free to knock out every big gun they had. I freaking love Hellions. I mean, I'm not saying I wouldn't mind a points reduction, but that's true of almost anything. But still, I love a big squad of hellions, and depending what kind of drugs you give them, they can fill all sorts of roles.
They seem a bit fragile to me and they need to get there first. You'd have to duck in and out of cover almost constantly. Even with the toughness boost they sound kinda fragile.
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