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JohnnyRotten wrote:
Usually you only face a TS detachment in forms of Ahriman + DP.

So you better flood the table with fearless cultists. Horrors are also sweet.
For a tournament you need to be tedious. Thinking of former tyrant + tyrant + tyrant + tyrant + 45 mucolid lists etc...

indeed, that's how Ts plays in tournaments, a supreme command and sometimes enlightened+shaman and/or a blob of tzaangors.

 blackmage wrote:

Brian888 wrote:

 blackmage wrote:
u can play Magnus maybe successfully if you play on decent table, with some Blos terrain then maybe you have a chance, honestly in high competitive matches i leave Magnus on the shelf, an average Ts list investing 445 pts on a single piece means if that piece die early you are in great troubles.

Given how big Magnus is on the table, that'd have to be some mighty impressive terrain to block LOS to him.

London Gt terrain would be enough.


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Unfortunately, the London GT terrain wasn't big enough, and was setup most commonly in a way which gave plenty of firing arcs around the sides of it.

If the central terrain had been half an inch taller, then it would possibly worked on some deployment maps, but, as it was, the tip of Magnus' wing was always visible

I hate that a feathertip can blow all your cover. You're better of with that tiny Mortarion then.

Is it worth it to bring Rubric Marines against Imperial Knights?They seem fairly useless unless taken in a maximum size to benefit from psyker powers and stratagems the most (+1 to wound and hit mostly), or MSU for getting a lot of psykers.
Or is it better to just plain run a cultist screen in front of some anti-tank?

Depends on what else you bring. Rubrics need to be supported by chaff. I’ve found that warptiming a rhino up with 10 warpflamers, popping smoke and putting the -1 to hit spell on it and then using dark matter crystal to transport 20 tzaangors right next to them so they can’t be surrounded works pretty well. At -2 to hit the rhino has a pretty good chance of surviving shooting and if they do decide to target it it will take a ton of firepower to pop firepower that’s not targeting your juicier targets. Which is all you want it to do anyway. It’s better to pick a flank and do this than to charge blindly up the middle though.

Turn 2 they now have 3+d6+5 inches of movement to get within 8 inches. your terminators drop and the rest of your army is there to support them. (I also like to take a unit of demon flamers with a herald and drop them near things as well.

 vaklor4 wrote:
Is it worth it to bring Rubric Marines against Imperial Knights?They seem fairly useless unless taken in a maximum size to benefit from psyker powers and stratagems the most (+1 to wound and hit mostly), or MSU for getting a lot of psykers.
Or is it better to just plain run a cultist screen in front of some anti-tank?

I mean, if you're looking to tailor against them then yeah, rubrics and tzaangors are going to be mostly deadweight and you just want to bring defilers, laspreds, psykers to buff them and cultists in front.

But if you're taking a TAC list and you wind up vs knights, you can make use of rubrics by targeting the Armiger class knights (wound on a 5, can be boosted to 4 with VOTLW and they have the optimal AP of -2 to hurt them).

I've taken on a knight heavy list before with my tsons/daemon mix (it was 3 big knights and admech screens/techpriests to repair 'em) and I basically fed them my rubrics and tzaangors as a distraction while I kept my Defiler buffed up and inconvenient to hurt. My opponent just assumed one of his knights with the sword would instagib the defiler, and I caught him by surprise with Daemonforge and the S16 dumpsterclaws and took the knight down from like 20 wounds in a single turn. He killed it the next turn but it was basically done at that point. I don't think I managed to kill either of the other two but by the end of the game the all-shooting one was fighting at 5+ bs and the other one was bogged down by Pinks and Screamers (Knights can move through infantry when falling back but not other unit types, so you can charge them with a ring of chaff and put other unit types nearby but not in the combat, so they cant hit them but they can't move through them to get out). I won pretty solidly on objectives.

So, adding some big guns as an "allied" force, "spire guard" renegades?

A single Rouge psyker coven seems ok, 15 wounds with 5++ for 100 points isn't all that bad, and they can do some neat tricks (like supercharging a crucial deny attempt), and it opens the path for some serious firepower with vanguard/spearhead/outrider detachments.

Any opinions on the worth of some heavy guns to bring in?
Basilisks? medusas? sentinals? heavy weapon teams?
Or even, RUSSES?!

Anything sounds valuable for us? anyone has any experience fielding allied renegades?

How often Gate of Infinity and Doombolt work for you? They're pretty hard to get, does it even make sense to cast them?

 ArtyomTrityak wrote:
How often Gate of Infinity and Doombolt work for you? They're pretty hard to get, does it even make sense to cast them?

If you're running Magnus, then, in my eyes they are 100% take on him. Their ability to do so much damage is incredible.

If you're not running Magnus, then, it's a little more personal choice. Ahriman can still get them off with relative ease, but he might not always be in position to use them.

Doombolt however, i use more as a targetable smite, rather than for it's half movement utility.

u can cast with Magnus or Ahriman they have +2 or +1, dont forget cabalistic focus which give you another +2, i often use with Ahriman or with a Dp with high magister

So with the big stompy character robots stomping all over everything at the moment, I've been working on a way to hard counter them, and I'd like your opinion on its feasibility.

It revolves around

1) A Nightlords Supreme Command detachment, with a Murdersword Chaos Lord and 2 Sorcerers. Expensive but useful group who drop leadership by -3 on turn one (14"move and 6" advance often puts you in 6" of a knight.)

2) Either a LoC heading a horror batallion or a TS DP with the +1 cast WL trait, casting, of course, Treason of Tzeentch!

3) 2 Hellforged Contemptors, both with double Butcher Cannons, provide utility if I'm not facing a list where flipping a character will have such a big impact. -5 debuff to multiple morale tests is significant.

So yeah, pretty simple idea really. Dark matter crystal a 30-tzaangor flerd in for some havoc, hopefully screening my NL characters a little from counterfire. Zoom the bikes up to debuff the knight, buff the birds, smite and death-hex all and sundry, and then lay waste to my enemy with my enemy's best unit.

It's not pure TS, and it's a little niche, but the sheer amount of knights I'm seeing recently is making me consider it for my next local tournament. Thoughts?

If Treason doesn't go off or gets denied this tactic is a flop. Too many points invested into making it work imo. I also don't think this is worth it against a melee knight and anyone with a shooty knight will be deploying further back when they see your list if they weren't going to already.

Unfortunately I can't be overly constructive bc I haven't worked out what the best way to deal with knights is yet, but I don't think this is it. Getting Treason of Tzeentch to go off on a Castellan would be hilarious though

 grouchoben wrote:
So with the big stompy character robots stomping all over everything at the moment, I've been working on a way to hard counter them, and I'd like your opinion on its feasibility.

It revolves around

1) A Nightlords Supreme Command detachment, with a Murdersword Chaos Lord and 2 Sorcerers. Expensive but useful group who drop leadership by -3 on turn one (14"move and 6" advance often puts you in 6" of a knight.)

2) Either a LoC heading a horror batallion or a TS DP with the +1 cast WL trait, casting, of course, Treason of Tzeentch!

3) 2 Hellforged Contemptors, both with double Butcher Cannons, provide utility if I'm not facing a list where flipping a character will have such a big impact. -5 debuff to multiple morale tests is significant.

So yeah, pretty simple idea really. Dark matter crystal a 30-tzaangor flerd in for some havoc, hopefully screening my NL characters a little from counterfire. Zoom the bikes up to debuff the knight, buff the birds, smite and death-hex all and sundry, and then lay waste to my enemy with my enemy's best unit.

It's not pure TS, and it's a little niche, but the sheer amount of knights I'm seeing recently is making me consider it for my next local tournament. Thoughts?

This is a cool idea but don't forget you can't treason the warlord and the knight will only be a character if it has an heirloom (i think) and likely will ALSO be a walord (they can have multiple) - so very likely this might not work on the regular (?) but might work once in a few games

Thanks for the feedback guys. I agree it's a niche idea, and might not work in practice. I'm taking it for a spin next game, so I'll report back. Here's what I'd say to you so far...

The Exalted court strat doesn't actually make a knight a warlord, it just lets them select a WL trait, and take a relic. If my 3 bikers stop a knight list from taking traits and relics, job done, quite frankly! Likewise if they make a Gallant flee for a turn or two. If they go ahead anyway, their drops will mean I get to see their deployment and set up the nightlords in response. Even if I can't set up within 26" of a knight, the team can still get forward 20" and drop mortal wounds & death hex, and sit behind the 30-tzaangor blob. Turn 2 it's a pretty unavoidable -3 to leadership, barring a lucky shieldbreaker missile.

And I don't really think it's a challenge to get treason off in this setup - with a LoC you're talking a 6; with a WL DP with cabal, you're talking a 5. Both would be after gaze of fate for the reroll. At which point you need to roll higher than a 6 to take control of a knight for a round of shooting and fighting.

I'm thinking about what to do next.
I have this list so far:




It's 1700 points so far and i'm thinking how to fill the rest competitive.
What options i have:

1. More Pink horrors
2. Remove Daemons and add Renegade Knight (are they good?)
3. Add 3 Predators with autocanons (for killshot)
4. Any other ideas?

 grouchoben wrote:
Thanks for the feedback guys. I agree it's a niche idea, and might not work in practice. I'm taking it for a spin next game, so I'll report back. Here's what I'd say to you so far...

The Exalted court strat doesn't actually make a knight a warlord, it just lets them select a WL trait, and take a relic. If my 3 bikers stop a knight list from taking traits and relics, job done, quite frankly! Likewise if they make a Gallant flee for a turn or two. If they go ahead anyway, their drops will mean I get to see their deployment and set up the nightlords in response. Even if I can't set up within 26" of a knight, the team can still get forward 20" and drop mortal wounds & death hex, and sit behind the 30-tzaangor blob. Turn 2 it's a pretty unavoidable -3 to leadership, barring a lucky shieldbreaker missile.

And I don't really think it's a challenge to get treason off in this setup - with a LoC you're talking a 6; with a WL DP with cabal, you're talking a 5. Both would be after gaze of fate for the reroll. At which point you need to roll higher than a 6 to take control of a knight for a round of shooting and fighting.

yes but you need a 10+ then with 2d6 to take control of a knight, is not cast the power the problem is pass the D check.

But with a -3 leadership debuff, making 7+ (with a reroll, gaze of fate permitting). The odds are with you.

While that's pretty nice on a jumpcap, it can be devastating on a Crusader, Castellan, etc.

How to Enlightened perform? Do they worth 3x9 = 460 points? They're 5++ T4 so 460 pts is 54 wounds with 5++ save.

So potentially couple storm bolters can wreck them in 1 turn.

Does anyone tried 3x10 tzaangors in rhinos? Rhinos can screen + transport tzaangors. They can ride & charge & capture.

Hey guys,

Whats your opinion on the best way to spam cultists, is it good to do multiple sets of 10 or is it better to put them in blobs of x or more?

Depends what you want the cultists to do and if it's an ITC game etc.

In ITC running a couple of units at 19 strong gives you a decent, cheap, screen that doesn't hurt you too much on secondaries. If you just want them sitting at the back holding objectives, then you don't really need to go too "big", as they won't really be doing anything but trying to camp in cover and survive.

If you're going for something like 100-200 cultists you might as well just run them as Black Legion with Abbaddon, or Alpha Legion, as, they won't really be doing much for you as Thousand Sons.

Kdash wrote:
Depends what you want the cultists to do and if it's an ITC game etc.

In ITC running a couple of units at 19 strong gives you a decent, cheap, screen that doesn't hurt you too much on secondaries. If you just want them sitting at the back holding objectives, then you don't really need to go too "big", as they won't really be doing anything but trying to camp in cover and survive.

If you're going for something like 100-200 cultists you might as well just run them as Black Legion with Abbaddon, or Alpha Legion, as, they won't really be doing much for you as Thousand Sons.

Yea mostly want them to cap objectives while the better units go on killing stuff. Ill try something in the middle and adjust
Thank you!

Anyone have any opinions on Chaos Spawn in a Thousand Sons detachment?

I have mixed feelings, I worry the just aren't durable enough.

They are pretty meh.
Not durable enough, and don't mesh well with the army in general.

Fated mutation is nice and all, but you can't really afford to waste CPs on it.

They do make an excellent distraction carnifexes. I have taken 5 and they get shot at pretty quick because they are pretty squishy but they also are pretty devastating if you get a full squad to hit something head on. And price wise 33 pts a model isnt bad.

I absolutely recommend playing a fun game against another psyker army using CA's 'empyric storms' extra rules. I had a game against some CSM that ran psykers. We both ended up tabled with 3 greater demons fighting it out to see the winner (only just lost). We dialed it up by rolling for 3 at the start of each game, and boy was it chaos, but boy was it fun.

Really recommend using them. A far better game than a normal matched play slugfest.



(Number 63: unreality reigns: any roll of a 6 counts as a 1, and any roll of a 1 counts as a 6. Confusing, does nothing and hilarious.)

Have anyone tried multiple units of tzaangors in rhinos?

I'm thinking about Ahriman + 3 DP, 6x10 Tzaangors, 6 rhinos, 2 x shaman, Magnus.

Main idea smite everything heavy, tzaangors and rhinos screen character and advance + pop smoke, then charge.

It's also 13 CP.

Any downsides i do not see?

I dont like tzaangors in rhinos

They are cheap enough it feels more effective to just bring more units of them rather than invest in rhinos.

Rhinos give additional screen for our characters and can move very fast to deliver traangors. Plus they have -1 to hit.

If your going to do the rhino tzaangor stuff i would suggest doing 4x10 tzaangors in rhinos and a big blob of 20 tzaangors to dmc up the field. But otherwise its not a bad idea, they are cheap enough to be useful. Not bad.

I find the issue with that tactic is that a rhino is just...Real expensive for what is inside of it. To me, the stuff inside should be double the cost of the rhino, otherwise it just seems like too much of an investment. I've found Rubric Marines to be much better in Rhinos, especially kitted with flamers.